Now that BritishB0xing.net seems to have gone forever can...

[stujones]

I guess a problem could be, not sure if this applies to BBN though, that some of the writers who contributed were aspiring journo's. If this was the case then not only have they lost the work, also hard to show their work has been published.

[Spud]

I did not show a huge amount of sympathy when the UKBP site went down, so am not in a position to moan,

Yes!!!!

I remember that you scruffy shaggy like creature - you stuck the boot in!!!

[steve689]

I sincerely hope that the BBN articles are not lost forever as I also built up a decent list of articles and reports while attempting to breathe some life into the Irish scene. When Ian mentions the fact that he "brought some writers on" during his time at BBN I would certainly class myself in that list.

I travelled the darkest depths of the Emerald Isle- Belfast, Dublin, Donegal and even across to Mayo and down to Cork (which is pretty far I can assure you). Plus, the money spent ringing fighters' for interviews should not be ignored, especially the ones in the Republic which costs a lot more on a mobile! Anyway, like I said hopefully we can retrieve the lost work and find something else to do with ourselves.

[Lightsoot]

Listen chaps I'm genuinely sorry for all of you and there's no gloating from me. I originally pulled the UKBP site in sheer frustration which was selfish at the time, I just didn't stop and think. I felt extremely bad afterwards though and fortunately Wordpress we're able to do their bit to restore the site. UKBP remains dorment but I've left the site online just so the wrtiers always have access to their work should they need to.

I had some dialogue with Kevin about a month ago. He told me he personally had a back-up of the site up to 12 months ago. If that's still the case then Terry and the rest of the lads may be able to salvage a large percentage of their work. It's not much consolation for the work you've written lately but at least it's something.

I agree with the consensus that Kevin needs to communicate, even if its bad news, otherwise frustration builds and relationships are soured. I can speak from experience on this. I hope everything gets sorted out amicably. I'm rubbish at IT but in today's technological world I find it hard to accept that an entire site's content can be lost forever in a big, cyber black hole.

[steve689]

.....anyone recommend an outlet for my dubious writing skills.

Check your e-mails

[dondada]

I'm not going to jump onto my desk and do a 'teacher, my teacher', don't want to break my neck, and he also looks nothing like Robin Williams, but you get me drift.

Thanks a lot, Terry. Steve too. Rather like Tom P, you all showed the nous to look after your own patch, build contacts and take a bit of guidance without taking it personally. When I came to email people about leaving several weeks ago, I was surprised by how many writers I had to contact. And it was great to get some nice replies too.

As David and Ben have alluded to, things move on.

By the way, last time someone jumped on a desk in my class was a few years ago when a huge-breasted Iranian year 10 girl punched the hell out of a strapping 6ft black lad who had been 'joking' with her. Had to give her a fireman's lift out of the classroom.

[David S]

I'm not going to jump onto my desk and do a 'teacher, my teacher', don't want to break my neck, and he also looks nothing like Robin Williams, but you get me drift.

Thanks a lot, Terry. Steve too. Rather like Tom P, you all showed the nous to look after your own patch, build contacts and take a bit of guidance without taking it personally. When I came to email people about leaving several weeks ago, I was surprised by how many writers I had to contact. And it was great to get some nice replies too.

As David and Ben have alluded to, things move on.

By the way, last time someone jumped on a desk in my class was a few years ago when a huge-breasted Iranian year 10 girl punched the hell out of a strapping 6ft black lad who had been 'joking' with her. Had to give her a fireman's lift out of the classroom.

As i said in the email to Ian when he told us he was leaving BBN, it was a pleasure working with/for him. And Kevin for that matter.

Couldn't have done much of the work without his support and encouragement.

David Statham

[oliverfennell]

I guess a problem could be, not sure if this applies to BBN though, that some of the writers who contributed were aspiring journo's. If this was the case then not only have they lost the work, also hard to show their work has been published.

That is by far the biggest point. It's the lack of proof that they were ever published. Anybody can type up something on Word, but that's not going to impress a future potential publisher or employer.

I'm fortunate enough to be beyond the "aspiring" stage and always made a point of keeping a copy or at least a photocopy of anything I've had in print, but admittedly I've not been quite so diligent with web work. Well, of course I have the originals .docs and/or emails, but it's not the same as having a live site or archive for the reasons above.

There are certainly a significant number of people who have done more and worked harder than I did for BBN, and while I'm pretty put-out for myself, it's pretty heartbreaking to think of Terry's body of work in particular, and of course all the fruits of Ian's labours. However those two seem surprisingly pragmatic about it and I suppose them having very respectable print outlets does take away some of the sting. Steve's story, though, is a good example of the sort of casualties experienced by the "aspiring" journos who ultimately have lost much more in personal terms than the likes of Terry, Ian and myself.

By the way, this is more a general lament than sticking the boot into Kevin further. He did email me today to say he's been away on hols and maintaining that the site crash was the host's fault, and that he is intending on taking legal action if it is indeed irretrievable. I do hope this is true and I hope also that he sees from this thread that keeping everyone concerned updated will be key to him saving face from all this.

[whiskey]

If you fish around you should be able to find all your articles folks.

I've found a few pages on archive sites, but it takes ages.

[oliverfennell]

Listen chaps I'm genuinely sorry for all of you and there's no gloating from me. I originally pulled the UKBP site in sheer frustration which was selfish at the time, I just didn't stop and think. I felt extremely bad afterwards though and fortunately Wordpress we're able to do their bit to restore the site. UKBP remains dorment but I've left the site online just so the wrtiers always have access to their work should they need to.

I had some dialogue with Kevin about a month ago. He told me he personally had a back-up of the site up to 12 months ago. If that's still the case then Terry and the rest of the lads may be able to salvage a large percentage of their work. It's not much consolation for the work you've written lately but at least it's something.

I agree with the consensus that Kevin needs to communicate, even if its bad news, otherwise frustration builds and relationships are soured. I can speak from experience on this. I hope everything gets sorted out amicably. I'm rubbish at IT but in today's technological world I find it hard to accept that an entire site's content can be lost forever in a big, cyber black hole.

Ben, you were indeed a bit "naughty" and you know how I felt at the time, but you rectified matters admirably and ultimately retained my respect for you.

The point is, all people can make mistakes, and certainly IT disasters can happen to anyone - the key lies in how people respond to such circumstances, and how well they learn from their mistakes. Ultimately what happened at UKBP has no bearing on you and I now, and hell, I'm even on reasonable terms with Spud! ;) I hope the BBN situation can be resolved satisfactorily for all - and that includes Kevin.

[Spud]

Oliver - Yep we all learn eventually - however dont you dare allow Carey to persuade you I was to blame for the demise of UK whatever it was!!!

I agree - we learn and we move on - however it seems there are some who simply will not allow themselves to do that and they prefer to take the moral high ground with regards the "blame game" - its always easy to target someone if that deflects the sh*t off you!!!

My comments are NOT directed at Ben Carey as I hold him in the highest regard and always will - my comments are directed at individuals who took the moral high ground and used to laugh and gossip at myself and Ben failing - yet they have failed to learn off the mistakes of where we went wrong which wasn't always down to us.

I am going to have the b*llocks to stick my neck on the line here - BBN - it annoys the f*cking life out of me what has happened there!! - that site provided a truly fantastic service and yet it has folded without explanation - people have walked away and I appreciate they may have had very good reason to do so - I truly do not want to open up a can of worms - but dont tell me the likes of Podmore, "The Smoggie" and "Shaggy" simply all go together!!! - and its all a simple coincidence!!!

For a truly fantastic site like BBN to fold completely - suggests to me something somewhere has gone wrong big time and its yet another massive blow to the service that was provided to the boxing fan!!!

Some may feel that I am exagerating the importance I am placing on BBN and boxing - I do not feel I am - there was many a breaking story that BBN broke that National newspapers quoted and some even stole claiming an exclusive - teletext even quoted BBN on a number of occasions and to the boxing family - people who boxed, worked or were even just fans - I can bet everyone of us visited BBN yet its just simply gone with the ever lasting comment - it will be back soon.

Sorry not good enough!!! - the impact "The Smoggie" and "Shaggy" had on that site was f*cking immense and for me Kevin Taylor needs to explain what the f*ck is going on and what is happening to such a bloody good outlet for the boxing family.

Kevin - this is not a dig at you fella - I wear my heart on my sleeve and I grew to like BBN despite our spats of the past - DO NOT LET THE PLACE DIE!!!

Rant over!!

[oliverfennell]

Speaking of which, whatever did happen to Suzanne Nield?

[Russ L]

If anyone cares - probably not - i've just started a little Midlands Boxing blog, which will see me do the same Midlands-based stuff i did for BBN (interviews, previews, reports, etc) on there. I know Boxrec are against people spamming but i'm not i'm just informing, putting it into the public domain that my site is: http://midlandsboxing.blogspot.com/

Blimey - I have that in my RSS reader already, but didn't realise it was you writing it.

Lovely stuff, whichever way up.

[rhino222]

Speaking of which, whatever did happen to Suzanne Nield?

oh my god, we are not going to dig up the corpse of bens old site FFS, we have all moved on now i hope. that all got a bit childish but we all had our bit to say, some right and some wrong.

[oliverfennell]

Speaking of which, whatever did happen to Suzanne Nield?

oh my god, we are not going to dig up the corpse of bens old site FFS, we have all moved on now i hope. that all got a bit childish but we all had our bit to say, some right and some wrong.

Well, I have wondered this before. She obviously did not have much in the way of scruples but was undeniably a very talented writer and seemingly on the bring of big things, having been published by BN and getting a spot with Maloney. Then she disappeared overnight. Weird.

[REAL_DEAL]

she probably had a kid.

[stujones]

Did she actually exist?

[Spud]

Did she actually exist?

UMmmmmmm - Carey says she did !!!

[Lightsoot]

Did she actually exist?

Course she existed . Did you ever get round to re-laying your patio, Spud? I need to get the pressure washer on my cellar.

Suzannne had a daughter who will probably be about 13 now. She lives up north somewhere but she is Scottish. Undeniably she contributed a great deal to the site but (like most women) was high maintenance. Within a week of the fracas she started contributing to Frank Maloney's site but this didn't last long. I know she also wrote a solitary piece for BBN then disappeared into the sunset.

I received an email from her instructing me to remove all mention of her from the site, including deleting all of her articles as she no longer wished to give me permission to publish her work and "as i knew, she withdrew her services voluntarily" which wasn't in fact the case. It was a bizaare email and I think Suzanne's attempt at establishing some kind of legal stance between us. I didn't consider this to be necessary, indeed it all seemed ridiculous. Everyone was angry and there was a lot of things said and done in the heat of the moment. C'est la vie.

I never did delete her work because I wasn't prepared to cooperate on any level with her. It would also have been a time-consuming job to wipe her stuff and I'm glad I didn't. She put an an awful lot into it and as Oliver has previously said, it's vital for any aspiring writer to have a record of their published work. Whatever my personal opinion of her, she should have dusted herself down and kept at it because she definitely had a flair for it.

[Wake up call]

Sorry never read these forums or Suzanne's work (except for the odd freelance she had in Boxing News) back then so please excuse my nosyiness but what exactly did this Suzanne Nield lady do that got her the boot?

[dondada]

Sorry never read these forums or read Suzanne's work (except for the odd freelance she had in Boxing News) back then so please excuse my nosyines but what exactly did this Suzanne Nield lady do exactly that got her the boot?

I vaguely remember her being some kind of Helen of Troy figure who launched a thousand bile-filled emails. I think she had literally covered two or three shows when she pulled a Diva style 'Don't you know who I am?' tirade when unhappy with her seat at a show. Happy to be corrected.

There was lots more to it - I think we should be reminded of everything, particularly as that bastard Emerz locked the bennie v flexen thread and spoiled the fun.

[Captain Hook]

I did not show a huge amount of sympathy when the UKBP site went down, so am not in a position to moan,

Yes!!!!

I remember that you scruffy shaggy like creature - you stuck the boot in!!!

Yeah, you reap what you sow, and all that, so I can hardly complain, but I have done, so I am a hypocrite.

Ben got your work back online fairly quickly, fair play, ours has been gone for over five weeks, you cannot find it using the cache search, it is not on pagehistory sites, you get the odd working link, but nothing after the start of 2008.

I am thankful to Danny and Rick for offering me a lifeline (and to Boxrec poster Asterix for all his IT advice). I did plan to jack it all in until those two offered to take stuff from me, wish I'd contributed more to BS over the years. Ah well, time to catch the tennis.

Agree with Steve also, Ian is a top bloke, and was a big help, still is, put a lot of work into me personally over the years, a lot of advice also. I'm not going to jump onto my desk and do a 'teacher, my teacher', don't want to break my neck, and he also looks nothing like Robin Williams, but you get me drift.

Yeah gutted myself got some good stuff up on there, god knows where it is but it was becoming an outlet for Welsh amateur material.......gave us another platform up here. Shame

[stujones]

Wasn't there some ironic thing that the promoter she moaned about she later worked for? (Maloney) or is this completely wrong.

[Captain Hook]

Wasn't there some ironic thing that the promoter she moaned about she later worked for? (Maloney) or is this completely wrong.

Yeah something like that, I do remember getting a few emails from her when she was finding her feet and then she seemed to take on a God-like status in some peoples' eyes.....

Strange....did some decent stuff in fairness but nothing mind blowing as far as I can remember. TBH I can't recall all of the details but it involved an email or two and had something to do with seating arrangements :)

Women ...

Monkey tennis......

[Lightsoot]

Andrew,

Suzanne was very good for the site, she worked tirelessly and had a flair about her which made her articles a very entertaining read. She’d been putting in a lot of hours in and as a reward for her efforts I said she could pick any show she wanted to cover and I’d try and sort her out with a ringside cred. We had other reporters in London at the time but Suzaane asked to cover Haye-Bonin which was fine by me.

We’d been granted ringside access for some recent Maloney shows and Frank has always been pretty generous at allocating press creds for websites. I submitted an application for Suzanne via email but didn’t receive a reply so I emailed a few days later and again didn’t hear back. Suzanne was travelling down to London by train and was planning an overnight stay so she was eager to know if she’d been accepted so she could get sorted with a hotel.

Though there was likely to be a large press contingent to watch Haye I still didn’t forsee a problem with Suzanne’s cred. On the morning of the show I dropped Frank a reminder text “hope its ok blah blah, good luck with the show etc” and he rang me straight back but wasn’t happy. His language was industrial and he essentially accused me of being a pain in the backside. Granted, I’m sure he had far more things to worry about but I was just trying to cover all bases and ensure Suzanne was sorted. His tone was off with me and I thought it was unwarranted.

I got home from work on the Friday night and Suzanne called, as she often did in an evening of late. She was in the arena early but said she was given attitude on the press desk and was directed to a seat in the stalls which was a fair distance from the ring. She wasn’t happy and my immediate reaction was that this was linked to my conversation with Frank earlier in the day. I should have held fire but I’m hot-headed at times and rang Spud and sounded off to him. We mutually agreed that Suzanne’s wasn’t being treated fairly and that we’d try and get her moved to ringside. Spud rang up Maloney’s PR man James Russell and, correct me if I’m wrong Spud, you guys ended up having words.

Communication is a wonderful thing and so is hindsight. If James had acknowledged my emails re: Suzanne’s cred we would have known without having to contact Frank. If I’d have given the show to one of my London reporters there wouldn’t have been as much pressure on me to make sure Suzanne wasn’t enduring a wasted journey and expense. Also, had we waited before calling James Russell, we would have seen that other ‘lesser’ members of the press were seated on the same row as Suzanne – so whilst she wasn’t at ringside with the Daily’s she wasn’t been singled out either.

We had our own internet forum on UKBP and (again wrongly) elected to make the evening’s incidents public. A sub-plot emerged that Rhino and his young lad were sat either ringside or close to the ring which we didn’t consider to be fair. We’d had various fallings out with Rhino in the weeks prior so inevitably it kicked off again. Things got heated, the usual forum tantrums manifested. Without wishing to open another can of worms, I think Rhino may have paid for the tickets (Rhino, feel free to qualify) but if he didn’t in truth it’s Maloney and Russell’s call as to where they decide to seat people.

Suzanne got home and filed her report of the show but as she’d had a frustrating evening she elected to pen a second article focusing on the press’s treatment of the show. She did that off her own back and it provided an interesting insight. I read it but asked Suzanne to reconsider whether she wished me to publish it because the tone was likely to incur Maloney’s rath, which wouldn’t have done her any good or the site. We agreed she’d sit on it for the weekend. While this was going on the fallout thread on the forum was still going strong.

After some kip, Suzanne decided that she didn’t want me to publish the second article and that she’d contact James Russell directly and address some of the weekend’s events. She had become aware of the forum thread and I think she was embarrassed (understandably) and bemused by the fall-out it had generated. I asked her if she’d copy me in to her email but she didn’t. I then got a call from Suzanne a day later at work saying that Maloney had published her email on UKBP forum and she was very annoyed by this. She demanded that I delete the thread.

I have to say at this point that Maloney played a blinder. Suzanne’s email was basically nice and almost apologetic about any problems that Maloney had been caused. She didn’t agree with how me and Spud had attempted to deal with things, she didn’t consider it to be professional and this wasn’t the way she worked. She looked forward to a long relationship with Maloney and hoped this incident hadn’t soured things between them. Do you know what? She had a point. WE didn’t handle things professionally but our intentions were always with her best intentions. I saw Suzanne’s email as a I real kick in the balls to me and essentially she was making sure she protected herself and not the site going forward.

I should clarify that Suzanne did initially want to carry on as normal but I told her that I was disappointed with her email to Maloney, couldn’t trust her anymore and decided it was for the best that we went our separate ways. I wished her well.

In the immediate aftermath Maloney came out swinging after the flack me and Spud had given him and insisted that Suzanne had never had a problem with her treatment. Some leapt to Frank’s and Suzanne’s defence which incensed me. I told Maloney that Suzanne had written a second article which totally contradicted her email and Maloney’s argument. He responded by calling me and saying he had Suzanne on tape denying there was ever a problem and that if I published her article he would respond in the firmest possible way.

Everything just spiralled out of control and my handling of the situation left much to be desired. I felt totally betrayed though. In temper I pulled the site and walked away. A week later Suzanne appeared as a writer on Frankmaloney.com but it proved short lived. If you haven’t fallen asleep, here is Suzanne’s unpublished article. She didn’t seem a happy bunny to me.

I Just Don’t Understand It
By Suzanne Nield

There should be an association for the prevention of rudeness to journalists. It should have a word with certain promoters. I mean the ones whose own publicity fails to fill half an arena, whose main event doesn’t get a mention on sports radio the day of the fight, and who still feel it appropriate to disrespect the free press who give their fighters top-quality previews for zip.

It wasn’t only internet reporters who were consigned to the cheap seats at the Wembley Arena last night, despite the fact that there was plenty of room ringside. Mysteriously, Maloney Promotions separated the Boxing News team also, allowing only editor Claude Abrams his rightful place. If there was an explanation for this, no-one got the memo. We asked questions only to be faced-off by hostile minions. It was shameful.

My guess is that the writers were being dotted around to make the audience look bigger. The Arena was curtained in half and still the crowd looked like it might be there to see ageing popsters Wet Wet Wet, as advertised on the posters outside.

Some boxing promoters, for example Hennessy Sports, have entered the 21st century. They recognise the simple fact that the internet is where people look for boxing information. Also, that professional courtesy is a valuable commodity and really all that’s required to make the world run smoothly. They are the future for the sport, and the future can’t come soon enough.

Web journalists labour for unpaid swathes of time to do justice to fighters’ performances. We don’t sit ringside with a beer in one hand and a burger in the other. We do our research, write a preview, spend time and money getting to venues and organising accommodation. Then we take notes for four hours during the action before allocating further chunks of our weekend to typing up - often done overnight after a thirteen-hour day, or on a train. This is purely for love of the sport. All we ask is a vantage point close enough to see who’s fighting, and a polite response to our editors’ requests for clarification when e-mails go unanswered. It could be such a beneficial, undemanding relationship. Why on earth would anyone want to spoil it?

It’s like cop Frances McDormand says in the movie Fargo, when she arrests the guy who spread his buddy in little pieces all over the snow, ‘And it’s such a beautiful day. I just don’t understand it.’