WHY NO KNOCK OUTS IN THE INTERNATIONAL AMATEUR GAME?

Deserter · Post by **Deserter** » 01 Sep 2004, 08:29

I was amazed to read somewhere that Amir Khan's stoppage of his Korean opponent in the quarters was pretty much the only genuine TKO of the entire tournament.
Now I obviously know about headguards, larger gloves, adapted styles for better point scoring etc, but even given all these factors I still find it surprising that there aren't more KOs at this level, particularly as you can find experienced, talented boxers from the likes of Cuba and Russia drawn against inexperienced fighters from places like Nepal?
Can anyone shed light on this for me?

adamiw · Post by **adamiw** » 01 Sep 2004, 08:32

yeah i was surprised also...you usually get a few in the super heavweight division. I remember seeing some KOs at the commonwealths.

Maybe it's something to do with the standard at the Olympics which is very high...they just dont allow themselves to be hit flush on the chin with a huge haymaker.

bugs · Post by **bugs** » 01 Sep 2004, 08:54

I thought the bigger gloves meant that the chin cannot be caught fully, some on the shoulder, some on the helmet. But in the higher divisions you would still expect more than you get, even body stoppages.

Dynamite Dean Phillips · Post by **Dynamite Dean Phillips** » 01 Sep 2004, 08:56

Or it could be the fact that the majority of amateurs can't hit hard enough to pull off a knockout. I'd go for that theory.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 01 Sep 2004, 09:39

I think it is more to do with the fact that referees in the amateur game these days intervene very quickly if a fighter looks in trouble. The Korean who Amir stopped for instance, was not really in desperate trouble at that point. Also the fact that he received a standing 8 when he did possible prevented a genuine knockout.

I think referees do everything possible to avoid a fighter getting knocked cold, and the emphasis has moved away from power shots seeing as you don't score any more points for a knockdown that you would have anyway.

Chambers · Post by **Chambers** » 01 Sep 2004, 10:14

the fact that there are only 4 rounds of 2 minutes will also have an effect on the number of KO's. The time in the ring is less than 3 rounds of pro boxing, this combined with gloves, headguards, point scoring system etc.

Also the boxers know that they are going to have to fight again in 2 days time, so why bother tiring yourself out trying to KO your opponent when you can breeze past him using your skills

Matchfixer · Post by **Matchfixer** » 01 Sep 2004, 10:36

Dynamite Dean Phillips wrote:Or it could be the fact that the majority of amateurs can't hit hard enough to pull off a knockout. I'd go for that theory.

Assuming lightweight at amateur is the same weight at pro (I don't know so feel free to correct me) how do you think you'd fare in a fight with Amir Khan (amatuer or pro)?

Deserter · Post by **Deserter** » 01 Sep 2004, 10:43

Thanks for the feedback guys, some interesting points there which go some way to explaining the situation.
However, I just still feel that 'natural' punchers should still be evident, even placed within the limited contexts we've talked about (length of fights, 'saving yourself' etc), especially in the heavier weight divisions, and am at a loss to explain why.
One pet theory I've considered is that amateur boxing is becoming more like fencing in that it encourages 'arm' punching and clear jabs etc rather than the type of punching that is likely to lead to a KO.

Chambers · Post by **Chambers** » 01 Sep 2004, 11:06

Deserter wrote:Thanks for the feedback guys, some interesting points there which go some way to explaining the situation.
However, I just still feel that 'natural' punchers should still be evident, even placed within the limited contexts we've talked about (length of fights, 'saving yourself' etc), especially in the heavier weight divisions, and am at a loss to explain why.
One pet theory I've considered is that amateur boxing is becoming more like fencing in that it encourages 'arm' punching and clear jabs etc rather than the type of punching that is likely to lead to a KO.

Agreed. A tap on the chin scores the same as a haymaker

Freiheit · Post by **Freiheit** » 01 Sep 2004, 12:09

In the 2000 olympics german Cengiz Koc was knocked out cold by a cuban.
The reason, IMO, that there is not more knockouts in the olympics is that you have to qualify to go there now.

Southpaw Stylist · Post by **Southpaw Stylist** » 01 Sep 2004, 13:22

Exactly. the level of fighter is similar.

Dynamite Dean Phillips · Post by **Dynamite Dean Phillips** » 01 Sep 2004, 14:17

Matchfixer wrote:
Dynamite Dean Phillips wrote:Or it could be the fact that the majority of amateurs can't hit hard enough to pull off a knockout. I'd go for that theory.
Assuming lightweight at amateur is the same weight at pro (I don't know so feel free to correct me) how do you think you'd fare in a fight with Amir Khan (amatuer or pro)?

Well, pro is a whole new ballgame to that of the amateurs. When I was amateur I couldn't wait to turn pro as I was always training at pro gyms and sparring with pros anyway so my style was more suited to the pro game before I even turned pro. Amir Khan is successful as an amateur because his style is well suited for it. Should he turn pro, he would need to adapt his style considerably, and it would be some years before he could even contemplate mixing it at 12 round championship level. 4x2 mins are a world apart from 12x3 minutes in a boxing ring. So, asking me how I would fare against a novice pro that would be Amir Khan is not a realistic question. If and when he decides to turn professional, ask me in 2-3 years time.

Matchfixer · Post by **Matchfixer** » 01 Sep 2004, 16:20

Dynamite Dean Phillips wrote:
Matchfixer wrote:
Dynamite Dean Phillips wrote:Or it could be the fact that the majority of amateurs can't hit hard enough to pull off a knockout. I'd go for that theory.
Assuming lightweight at amateur is the same weight at pro (I don't know so feel free to correct me) how do you think you'd fare in a fight with Amir Khan (amatuer or pro)?
Well, pro is a whole new ballgame to that of the amateurs. When I was amateur I couldn't wait to turn pro as I was always training at pro gyms and sparring with pros anyway so my style was more suited to the pro game before I even turned pro. Amir Khan is successful as an amateur because his style is well suited for it. Should he turn pro, he would need to adapt his style considerably, and it would be some years before he could even contemplate mixing it at 12 round championship level. 4x2 mins are a world apart from 12x3 minutes in a boxing ring. So, asking me how I would fare against a novice pro that would be Amir Khan is not a realistic question. If and when he decides to turn professional, ask me in 2-3 years time.

Thanks for the detailed response. I was expecting a "I'd beat him easily" response.

Good to get a viewpoint from a professional.