Commentary on Tyson vs HolyfieldI

[SaadOffTheDeck]

LOL, I insulted you by questioning your scorecard?

No,you insulted me cos you called me mr.Bobby something.
I have nothing to do with that guy.However,he didn't say anything special about Tyson just that he was strong and quick.
Is that a lie??
In the second fight he bashed Tyson pretty bad and he never said anything about holyfield head butts or low blows.
Now,when we have Teddy Atlas who hates Tyson, saying that Tyson was just a good puncher after Rooney /prison and that his technique, speed and defense became pretty bad we have our answer, even Freddie Pacheco
who hates Tyson said that we never saw Tyson again after prison.
Hell,Holyfield said that Tyson was easy to hit after prison.
It is delusional, ludicrous and pathetic to say that Tyson was fighting like before.

It's no secret that Holyfield headbutts guys. The biggest headbutt in the first fight was initiated by tyson and then he cowered away hoping for some help from the ref. It's plain as day, watch the fight.

I agree with this,but i still agree with the other 2 judges about the first 5 rounds,regardless you can't use examples of bad judges like the one who had Tyson ahead Douglas.

Tyson has quit on more than one occasion and tried to several others, just the facts man.

When?

Bobby Czyz is the point of the thread. His biased commentary and terrible scorecard. If that's an insult, again you need to get thicker skin. Every harmless joke sends you into a frenzy of rage on the internet? And others are pathetic?

Nobody ever said it was the same Tyson, you keep acting like it was the same Holyfield. You're the one continuously hurling insults, you're the one that is pathetic and you're the one that is wrong. If you even noticed, I said Czyz had Tyson up after EIGHT rds, 50-45 Tyson after five was too ridiculous even for Bobby. I insulted him comparing him to you.

Not one judge gave Tyson the first 5 rds, you must have seen that in a dream. Why can't I use examples of bad judging? You're using them to back up your obviously biased scorecard. I mean you're going on and on about these two scorecards like they're the only competent cards to ever be rendered. You remind me of these retards that insist Vitali beat Lennox.

Tyson quit against holyfield, McBride, Williams & he tried to quit against Botha but landed a lucky punch instead. He was very tough physically but weak as school girl between the ears.

[Goodnight, Irene]

Tyson won the first 5 rounds then he lost all the others.
The judges also had Tyson ahead after the first 5 rounds.

I just saw a judge give Escobedo 8rds on Saturday. It's usually better to use your eyes. He won the first five rds? Ladies and gentlemen, Mr. Bobby Czyz!

Ladies and gentlemen, Mr.pathetic Holyfield fanboy.
By the way, are you talking about Holyfield with or without steroids?
Next you will say that the head butts were also accidental.
After the first fight against Holyfield,Lennox said:"...now i know why Holyfield was bitten by Tyson, the man fights with his head.."Another Tyson fanatic
Regardless, in my opinion, Holyfield was the better man,period.
Two of the three judges had Tyson ahead but hey you a mr.nobody holyfield fanatic without any professional knowledge about boxing is right just because there are bad judges out there.
it is funny your dumb generalization of boxing judges when they disagree with you.
why the hell holyfield fans are always so worried about Tyson.
Tyson was so bad,why talk about a effing overrated bum?

Chiricahua, you will find, is a Tyson fanatic.

Me and a lot of legendary trainers and boxing historians,all of them are Tyson maniacs.
lol why don't you STFU with this brainless garbage.
Just,because i had the opportunity to work with Kevin Rooney and learn Cus's style i'm a fanatic. I also had the opportunity to speak several times with Teddy Atlas and i learned a lot,but hey some nerds on the web who never trained anybody know more about boxing than people who are in this sport for decades.
So next time,look at yourself in the mirror boy, before doing dumb unsupported comments.
Teddy atlas is right about some idiots on the web.
http://www.doghouseboxing.com/David_Tyl ... g20_09.htm

Another Tyson fanatic.
Look what the great historian herb said about mike tyson:http://www.cyberboxingzone.com/boxing/w42x-kd.htm
Another man-- a shame what’s happened to him, and I’d say the only man who could have beaten him eventually did beat him, and that was himself—Mike Tyson. Now Mike Tyson’s style—talking about a boxer learning from boxers of the past—and it’s amazing that more has not been made of this. Mike Tyson’s style is Jack Dempsey, completely. The way he comes in quickly with a bob and weave, ducks down low and comes up with a smashing left hook to the larger man’s head and face, that’s Jack Dempsey. When Tyson turned pro he even came into the ring with the sides of his head shaven in emulation of Jack Dempsey. There is no doubt about this. No socks, low shoes, black trunks. This was a young man who studied old fight films like crazy. And he found that the style of Jack Dempsey was more conducive to his own abilities than any other style. And that’s what he developed.

KD -- I always felt that Tyson was a small heavyweight and he was often misunderstood and under-rated in terms of the level of genuine skill that he brought into the ring.

HG -- That’s right. A lot of people did not understand what they were watching when they saw Mike Tyson. He was not some slugger as such.

KD -- He was not a super-power in terms of his physical strength

HG -- Oh no. One thing about Mike Tyson that I don’t think a lot of people understand because of, let’s say his psychological-social problems, a lot of people think he’s some kind of stupid brute. He’s not. He happens to be, as far as I can see-- and I don’t know the man but I have had a couple of conversations with him-- an intelligent young man. He’s probably one of the most intelligent fighters, certainly in terms of boxing, that we’ve seen. His emulation of the Jack Dempsey’s style. His knowledge of boxing history is considerable, by the way, and when you listen to him, this is not a stupid man. He’s a very misunderstood boxer, and people also do not understand that his skills eroded after a certain period. People will say Ah he was never anything,. They start to question him all the way back. No. He peaked when he knocked out Michael Spinks in the first round. But beginning about a year after that he really started to go down hill.

KD -- That was a period when he had separated from Rooney, his remaining D’Amato trainer, and he no longer had a real trainer who understood his style.

HG -- Right. Tyson was a fighter who needed a certain edge. He needed to be on edge. And when he lost that he lost a tremendous amount. He still has too much power and over-all ability for ninety or ninety-five percent of all the fighters out there. There’s no question about that. But at his peak I can’t imagine—and I say this with all respect and deference for Evander Holyfield—but at his peak I can’t imagine Tyson being defeated by Holyfield. At his peak he would have been a terrific fight even for the peak Muhammad Ali.

You are indeed a Tyson fanatic, &, what's more --- your age is showing.

[hhaehre]

Tyson quit against holyfield, McBride, Williams & he tried to quit against Botha but landed a lucky punch instead. He was very tough physically but weak as school girl between the ears.

What a pile of absolute rubbish. In the fights Tyson lost he took huge beatings. If he was so weak between the ears why did he take those beatings for so many rounds, why did he come out for 8 rounds against Lewis ? It takes a pretty big pair to criticize Tyson for not getting up against McBride but somehow I doubt you have ever laced up a pair of gloves and stepped into of the squared ring.
To suggest that Tyson didn't take his lumps is beyond insane.

And why is it that Tyson is defined by the fights he lost and especially after he came out from prison an absolute wreck. Lets define Holmes' career by his fight with Tyson and Ali by the Holmes fight or how he handled Norton shall we.

[chiricahua]

Nobody ever said it was the same Tyson, you keep acting like it was the same Holyfield.

Who is that great Holyfield ?
The one who get knocked the fornicate out by Bowe and lost 2 times against Bowe? Or the one who got decked by the all time great Bert Cooper?
Tyson spent almost 4 years on a prison Holyfield remained active,not comparable and you speak about BS,you are a joke.
Man, you know shit about boxing or conditioning.Holyfield pushed his body to the limits in those 2 fights,he was in the best shape of his life,it is not hard to notice except in your dream biased world.
Even Holyfield says that in several documentaries,but you missed them.
Mr.Lee Haney(former mr.Olympia 8 times) trained Holyfield and gave him the vitamins to help him and this is a fact.

You're the one continuously hurling insults, you're the one that is pathetic and you're the one that is wrong. If you even noticed, I said Czyz had Tyson up after EIGHT rds, 50-45 Tyson after five was too ridiculous even for Bobby. I insulted him comparing him to you.

I was just talking about the first 5 rounds ,nothing related after the 5 round.

Not one judge gave Tyson the first 5 rds, you must have seen that in a dream.

No,no!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!You are in a dream not me,Holyfield, Tyson, Ron Borges and another guy
in an interview discussed the fact that 2 judges had Tyson ahead after the first 5 rounds and if Tyson's corner had asked for a Technical decision,cos he suffered a cut,Tyson would have won the fight.
This is a fact,i guess you are so delusional that you didn't see this interview.
Official scorecards:
Tyson -Holyfield
Roth Shirley Vollmer
Round 1-10-9 10-9 10-10
round 2-10-9 10-9 10-9
round 3-10-9 10-9 10-10

Round 4-10-9 10-9 10-10
round5-10-9 10-9 10-10

Everyone had Tyson ahead after the first 5 rounds,oh yes you are extremely biased,a real fanatic to say otherwise.
And Holyfield was trying to head butt Mike the whole fight and this is another fact,eventually he accomplished that goal.
i agree,however that Mike should have had the discipline to stay mentally in the fight,but he didn't.

You're using them to back up your obviously biased scorecard. I mean you're going on and on about these two scorecards like they're the only competent cards to ever be rendered. You remind me of these retards that insist Vitali beat Lennox.

They are the official cards and i have the fornicating right to agree with them,you are the almighty
idiot who thinks that anyone who disagrees with you is biased.
About Lennox and Vitali you are out of luck,cos i always supported Lennox on this one.

Tyson quit against holyfield, McBride, Williams & he tried to quit against Botha but landed a lucky punch instead. He was very tough physically but weak as school girl between the ears.

Boy, i missed that against Holyfield,i mean the guy wanted a fornicating street fight and he had a street fight.
Since when a fighter is forced to fight clean against a guy who is using head butts and throwing low blows??Botha? wow you are the first person who says that Tyson wanted to quit,mr.BS in action again.
Mcbride??Tyson was old and he didn't want to fight anymore how can you compare?
Against williams, he hurted his knee,but hey let's ignore the fact that Tyson was under powerful drugs like Zoloft to keep his anger under control.

You are indeed a Tyson fanatic, &, what's more --- your age is showing.

My age is showing??lol
You are clueless mate.You are indeed a Tyson hater .
You should let your wrong assumptions about my age aside.
if you think an adult person has to take dumb accusations on the web without reacting, you are delusional.
Hey,i guess Teddy Atlas was showing his age when he reacted bad against the arm chair experts like you.

[Goodnight, Irene]

It makes you look worse to claim adulthood, given your posts.

You'd get more slack if you conceded being a kid.

[Collins2000]

Is boxing the only sport where the so-called fans spend most of their timing ridiculing the greats of the past?

[Robinson]

Collins

I think its not the only one...but it is most likely the worse for it.

[Collins2000]

Collins

I think its not the only one...but it is most likely the worse for it.

Makes me puke.

granberry is the worst. Closely followed by BRR, that mad bitch Irene and funny old "yancey".

[Robinson]

Lets score another fight !
As proactive fight fans :)

[Collins2000]

Lets score another fight !
As proactive fight fans :)

Yeah, I grabbed a pile of good ones when I was up in QLD.

Let's enjoy some good fights / fighters and leave the haters to roll around in their own filth.

[Goodnight, Irene]

Only third place for me? What? I haven't put in the hard yards? How could you, Collette!?

[Goodnight, Irene]

Have you ever scored the contentious De La Hoya-Mosley II, Robinson? I'd be interested to know your card for that one. Have you done it?

[Robinson]

No..... BUT I shall ! :)

[Ezzard]

Any of the post prison fights Tyson had could've been ruled NC/ND because he was certified off the rails from as soon as he got tangled up with Givens and King and really didn't want to be training much less fighting.

Seeing as you just ignored the post I made and soap-boxed on the gospel according to Saint Mike...

If I accept that you are right.

Berbick claimed to have been poisoned in his hotel room prior to being decapitated by Tyson. Can we apply these rules and say that should be a NC/ND? Can we say that because Pinklon Thomas was ravaged by addiction that the fight should also become a NC/ND? Because Tucker broke his hand... Because Holmes was 38 and had a spare tyre around his waist... Because Spinks had a knee in a brace and was obviously intimidated... Because Tony Tubbs was a stodgy pudding with arms and legs...

I'm interested in how you apply your logic across the board.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Tyson quit against holyfield, McBride, Williams & he tried to quit against Botha but landed a lucky punch instead. He was very tough physically but weak as school girl between the ears.

What a pile of absolute rubbish. In the fights Tyson lost he took huge beatings. If he was so weak between the ears why did he take those beatings for so many rounds, why did he come out for 8 rounds against Lewis ? It takes a pretty big pair to criticize Tyson for not getting up against McBride but somehow I doubt you have ever laced up a pair of gloves and stepped into of the squared ring.
To suggest that Tyson didn't take his lumps is beyond insane.

And why is it that Tyson is defined by the fights he lost and especially after he came out from prison an absolute wreck. Lets define Holmes' career by his fight with Tyson and Ali by the Holmes fight or how he handled Norton shall we.

You're obviously weak between the ears as well. I said he was very tough physically. How does that translate to not taking his lumps?

Who is defining him by the fights he lost? This is a fr3eaking thread about one of them. Should I open a thread about Holyfield/Tyson and so on in great detail about the tremendous combination he starched Pinklon Thomas with?

Tyson fans would prefer you to rape their mother than to offer any legitimate criticism about their God.

I had a couple amateur fights as a kid. Not that I need to have entered a ring to know Holyfield was Tyson's daddy. Anyone with eyes knows that.

[hhaehre]

You're obviously weak between the ears as well. I said he was very tough physically. How does that translate to not taking his lumps?

I'm sorry, I must have mistaken you for the dolt who said Tyson was "weak as school girl between the ears" and who claimed Tyson "tried to quit against Botha". My mistake, I apologize.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

He definitely tried to quit against Botha. He was getting embarrassed and he put Frans in an arm bard and later admitted to trying to break his arm. It aint the WWE, but I'm sure you don't recall that.

As for the rest of it, it's a comprehension issue. He was weak of mind and strong of body. I don't know how to make it any simpler for you. It has nothing to do with his ability to take punishment, which was strong. Whatever, I doubt you would ever get it.

[hhaehre]

He definitely tried to quit against Botha. He was getting embarrassed and he put Frans in an arm bard and later admitted to trying to break his arm. It aint the WWE, but I'm sure you don't recall that.

I see, so the arm bar vs. Botha is trying to quit. I am sure the biting of Holyfield was his way of quitting too. Tyson after prison was a nut job but don't twist everything he did into fitting the armchair psychologist "he wanted to quit" theory. He was no quitter in the ring, plain and simple.

As for the rest of it, it's a comprehension issue. He was weak of mind and strong of body. I don't know how to make it any simpler for you. It has nothing to do with his ability to take punishment, which was strong. Whatever, I doubt you would ever get it.

So he was able and willing to take punishment yet a mentally weak quitter. Perhaps he was also "the great white hope" of his generation ?

[Ezzard]

You don't need to be a chartered psychologist to appreciate that the bite was a way of quitting whilst keeping all of the suburban fans on side.

A great fighter whose achilles heel was in his head.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

He definitely tried to quit against Botha. He was getting embarrassed and he put Frans in an arm bard and later admitted to trying to break his arm. It aint the WWE, but I'm sure you don't recall that.

I see, so the arm bar vs. Botha is trying to quit. I am sure the biting of Holyfield was his way of quitting too. Tyson after prison was a nut job but don't twist everything he did into fitting the armchair psychologist "he wanted to quit" theory. He was no quitter in the ring, plain and simple.

As for the rest of it, it's a comprehension issue. He was weak of mind and strong of body. I don't know how to make it any simpler for you. It has nothing to do with his ability to take punishment, which was strong. Whatever, I doubt you would ever get it.

So he was able and willing to take punishment yet a mentally weak quitter. Perhaps he was also "the great white hope" of his generation ?

Like I said, you obviously are incapable of distinguishing between the physical and mental aspects of the sport. You should really stop trying, it's embarrassing to read.

[hhaehre]

He definitely tried to quit against Botha. He was getting embarrassed and he put Frans in an arm bard and later admitted to trying to break his arm. It aint the WWE, but I'm sure you don't recall that.

I see, so the arm bar vs. Botha is trying to quit. I am sure the biting of Holyfield was his way of quitting too. Tyson after prison was a nut job but don't twist everything he did into fitting the armchair psychologist "he wanted to quit" theory. He was no quitter in the ring, plain and simple.

As for the rest of it, it's a comprehension issue. He was weak of mind and strong of body. I don't know how to make it any simpler for you. It has nothing to do with his ability to take punishment, which was strong. Whatever, I doubt you would ever get it.

So he was able and willing to take punishment yet a mentally weak quitter. Perhaps he was also "the great white hope" of his generation ?

Like I said, you obviously are incapable of distinguishing between the physical and mental aspects of the sport. You should really stop trying, it's embarrassing to read.

Well, I just don't see a quitter so no need for me to psychoanalyze anything but you just keep at it.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

I'm not the one that started misquoting statements. That would be you. Ignorance is bliss.

[prodigious1]

Tyson tried to quit against Botha. I don't even know how anyone could think anything else.