Evander Holyfield vs Rocky Marciano, primes....

[Goodnight, Irene]

Yes, because, in addition to being a no-talent get-lucky who won his Heavyweight title out of a cereal box, Jack Dempsey wasn't tough.

He's well-known to fans & historians alike as a bit of a wimp, who couldn't take the heat when it got tough. What a sad joke.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Yes, because, in addition to being a no-talent get-lucky who won his Heavyweight title out of a cereal box, Jack Dempsey wasn't tough.

He's well-known to fans & historians alike as a bit of a wimp, who couldn't take the heat when it got tough. What a sad joke.

You don't have to be a wimp to get your ass kicked by Joe Frazier. It's so wonderful how upset you get over this. Not sure why you feel the need to make things up, but you are amusing in small doses.

Dempsey was a paper champion. Talented guy who didn't accomplish much and had one of the weaker title reigns in Heavyweight history.

That doesn't mean he was a wimp or talentless. he just couldn't hang with a Frazier. Not in a million fights.

[raylawpc]

Define "paper champion," please.

[Goodnight, Irene]

Define "paper champion," please.

Jack Dempsey, apparently

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Define "paper champion," please.

Weak title reign, didn't face the best contenders, took a 3 yr vacation with the belt. Just a real weak resume. Blasphemous as it is around here, Dempsey is the epitome of a guy who is rated off of popularity and what he could have done. Not what he did.

I wouldn't have much issue with him at the back end of the top 20. But that's probably still too high.

Dempsey/Qawi would be a much closer fight than Dempsey/frazier.

[raylawpc]

Define "paper champion," please.

Weak title reign, didn't face the best contenders, took a 3 yr vacation with the belt. Just a real weak resume. Blasphemous as it is around here, Dempsey is the epitome of a guy who is rated off of popularity and what he could have done. Not what he did.

I wouldn't have much issue with him at the back end of the top 20. But that's probably still too high.

Dempsey/Qawi would be a much closer fight than Dempsey/frazier.

Who were the "best contenders" he should have faced aside from Wills - which has been discussed ad nauseum? Who do you think he ducked?

Do you know the circumstances of his three year "vacation"?

[SaadOffTheDeck]

An old Langford would have been better than Billy Miske on his death bed. Circumstances, different times, I get all that. But it doesn't make his pathetic title reign smell any better.

Not to mention the loaded gloves he won the title with.

[raylawpc]

An old Langford would have been better than Billy Miske on his death bed. Circumstances, different times, I get all that. But it doesn't make his pathetic title reign smell any better.

Not to mention the loaded gloves he won the title with.

Old Sam would have been tickled to death that somebody in 2009 believes he was still a contender in 1920. Too bad nobody in 1920 did. Can you name anybody else?

[SaadOffTheDeck]

An old Langford would have been better than Billy Miske on his death bed. Circumstances, different times, I get all that. But it doesn't make his pathetic title reign smell any better.

Not to mention the loaded gloves he won the title with.

Old Sam would have been tickled to death that somebody in 2009 believes he was still a contender in 1920. Too bad nobody in 1920 did. Can you name anybody else?

what does it matter who I name? He didn't do anything of note in his entire reign. It was as weak as any in history and by far the worst of any highly ranked fighter in any division.

[raylawpc]

An old Langford would have been better than Billy Miske on his death bed. Circumstances, different times, I get all that. But it doesn't make his pathetic title reign smell any better.

Not to mention the loaded gloves he won the title with.

Old Sam would have been tickled to death that somebody in 2009 believes he was still a contender in 1920. Too bad nobody in 1920 did. Can you name anybody else?

what does it matter who I name? He didn't do anything of note in his entire reign. It was as weak as any in history and by far the worst of any highly ranked fighter in any division.

It matters because you stated that he didn't fight the "best contenders." You have essentially accused him of ducking the top guys during his reign. Who were these top guys that he ducked?

[SaadOffTheDeck]

LOL

[Robinson]

Fighting anyone in 3 years is better than no one.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Exactly, it was a weak era. I suppose I should have singled out Wills instead of making it plural. But just sitting around collecting money for doing nothing is a paper champion.

[Goodnight, Irene]

"It matters because you stated that he didn't fight the "best contenders." You have essentially accused him of ducking the top guys during his reign. Who were these top guys that he ducked?" - RayLaw

Your very reasonable questions aren't likely to find legitimate answers, but notice he is moving gently away from his initial contention that, quite apart from Dempsey's title reign (Not a peep from Saad on the way Dempsey cleaned house pre-title, that'd be too objective --- or is that objectionable --- to make mention of), he was also a lousy fighter, who would be cannon-fodder, head-to-head, for the great Heavies.

I'm not upset, Saad. Quite the contrary. I have always subscribed to the notion unintentional comedy is the best brand of humour

[Goodnight, Irene]

"...Not to mention the loaded gloves he won the title with." - Saad

Oh, dear.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

That's ok, I never hear a peep from you about anything except for stupid little comments and demands that Dempsey was a god. You've never backed up one thing you say about him. I asked you to educate me, but you can't because I'm 100% correct.

I say he can't beat Frazier and you blabber about me calling him a wimp. Dempsey is and will probably forever be the most overrated fighter in history. I've seen the same film and read the same stuff you have. I just have a mind of my own.

[Goodnight, Irene]

Indeed, you do. That much is patently clear. You're all on your own, in fact, in regards to Dempsey. Historians, fans, contemporaries of the man, analysts, other fighters through history --- it truly is you against the World, fella.

That mind is definitely yours, & yours, alone. No need to put a patent on it, me-thinks.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

And there is your typical rebuttal, not a shred of anything. Well done, again.

[Goodnight, Irene]

I suppose if someone asked you what colour the sky was, you'd delve deep into an explanation?

Some things are so self-explanatory, if someone who (as you claimed) has been following the sport for years & years & years can't see them of their own accord, how arrogant would I need be to think I could change your thinking?

He's rubbish, & will always be so, to you. Just concede that much, & that I'd be wasting my time explaining the colour of the sky.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

I never said he was rubbish, one thing you could really work on is actually looking at the sky. Why do you always feel the need to twist words and create statements that nobody ever said? Do you think it's funny? It isn't at all.

I say Frazier walks over Dempsey, you accuse me of calling him a wimp.

I say he is overrated, you say i called him rubbish.

It's on and on like that with you. I'd love to hear your opinion why i'm wrong. What does it matter how long I've watched the sport? Though I certainly wouldn't be out of my element discussing anything with you. Not that you discuss anything.

Whatever, i did throw this out there and I knew you would bite. No need to hijack the thread any longer and I certainly wont try and squeeze an opinion or insight out of a man that has none to offer.

[Goodnight, Irene]

Sorry, didn't you just falsely accuse me of demanding Dempsey be referred to as, "a God?"

Pretty hypocritical.

[hhaehre]

And there is your typical rebuttal, not a shred of anything. Well done, again.

Unlike you, backing up your claim that Dempsey did not fight the best contenders with a comprehensive list of fighters he ducked.

[Goodnight, Irene]

"Unlike you, backing up your claim that Dempsey did not fight the best contenders with a comprehensive list of fighters he ducked." - Hhaehre

See the last line of my above posting.

[Martin Sosa Cameron]

:)


Of course, as in his second fight against Ezzard Charles, Rocky WKO before the 9 over Evander


DD

[Goodnight, Irene]

:)


Of course, as in his second fight against Ezzard Charles, Rocky WKO before the 9 over Evander


DD

You, Sir, I am tempted to accuse of trolling --- were I not so familiar with your usually impressive handiwork. Still, I want to see your homework for arriving at a first-round KO for Marciano over Norton, if you please