Carl Froch is FINISHED!

[thepocketrocket]

Yeah, but when he opened up he brutalised Taylor, verging on torturing him! He isnt explosive and he needs the odd breather but he is the kind of fighter that HURTS you, he is like something from the Spanish inquisition, hurting you at his own pace!!

[Asterix]

Spud, AA is going to put a world of hurt on Froch, I think the best he can hope for is that he has anything left after Kessler and AA have mauled him

i doubt that. AA was almost as negative as dirrell last night.

Is that a joke? Abraham was walking forwards, Dirrell was running backwards. I don't see the comparison.

[Syntax Error]

Having not seen the fight and having to go by the testimony of posters here, as a massive Froch fan I'm gutted by two particular things:

1) It was pretty unanimous on here before the fight that he needed to jump on Dirrell from the 'get-go' and that's not some incredible insight from us, it was just common sense. So I'm struggling to understand why he didn't even attempt to do that.

2) I remember as far back as the Adamu fight most of us saying needed to bring the left hand up as he didn't have the reflexes to carry off that style. Some close to him argued that he'd either be able to get away with it at world level or would tighten up accordingly as he moved up, but clearly neither has happened.

I guess what I'm gutted about is that there's zero evidence that he's learnt from the Pascal and Taylor fights. The latter in particular should have acted as perfect prep for the Dirrell bout, but it seems as if any 'learning curvel has gone straight out of the window.

I'm really looking foward to seeing what he and his camp have to say in the wake of this one...

I pretty much concur with what you are saying.

I, too, hoped that Froch would have learnt from his last 2 fights, but alas, it looks like he's never going to learn.

It's plain to see that Froch has a reached a ceiling in his ability & now that he has stepped up in class, he is using his heart, determination & chin to see him through fights.

Those are admirable qualities in any fighter, but he's going to need to sort the basics out if he is to have any type of success against the likes of Kessler.

[opticald]

Having not seen the fight and having to go by the testimony of posters here, as a massive Froch fan I'm gutted by two particular things:

1) It was pretty unanimous on here before the fight that he needed to jump on Dirrell from the 'get-go' and that's not some incredible insight from us, it was just common sense. So I'm struggling to understand why he didn't even attempt to do that.

2) I remember as far back as the Adamu fight most of us saying needed to bring the left hand up as he didn't have the reflexes to carry off that style. Some close to him argued that he'd either be able to get away with it at world level or would tighten up accordingly as he moved up, but clearly neither has happened.

I guess what I'm gutted about is that there's zero evidence that he's learnt from the Pascal and Taylor fights. The latter in particular should have acted as perfect prep for the Dirrell bout, but it seems as if any 'learning curvel has gone straight out of the window.

I'm really looking foward to seeing what he and his camp have to say in the wake of this one...

how can you make that kind of assessment when you haven't even seen the fight?

This is what Deserter does. He doesn't watch the fights but likes to make arguments and judgements on the fights. Hasn't watched Valuev vs Holyfield but engaged in a long discussion about the fight. Seemingly he can't see the idiocy of that.

[jBacca]

Opticald, Deserter doesn't try to provoke anyone though. You really are a tit.

[opticald]

Opticald, Deserter doesn't try to provoke anyone though. You really are a tit.

mate, I'm making a point and you are the one getting personal. The chap made a thread with his thoughts on a fight he hasn't seen. When I questioned him on the Holyfield Valuev fight he replied, "Well, some people thought it was a fair decision". that is what he based his thoughts on the fight on. As people have rightly pointed out, it's ridiculous. Watch the fights then comment mate.

[jBacca]

Opticald, Deserter doesn't try to provoke anyone though. You really are a tit.

mate, I'm making a point and you are the one getting personal. The chap made a thread with his thoughts on a fight he hasn't seen. When I questioned him on the Holyfield Valuev fight he replied, "Well, some people thought it was a fair decision". that is what he based his thoughts on the fight on. As people have rightly pointed out, it's ridiculous. Watch the fights then comment mate.

I know, but your post was there as a dig and nothing else. It was one of them that could have easily been held back.

Apologies for calling you a tit.

[stujones]

I very much disagree with the notion that cause he is "one of ours" and "one of our best" we should say "phew" got away with that one... onwards and upwards. Froch lost, I don't care how many times we

I've been jobbed in the past - two wrongs don't make a right.

Also, its happening more and more here. Glen Johnson, Tim Bradley only awarded a SD, Injin Chi. Infact last time a Brit was abroad in a close fight he got the decision.

We are getting as bad as Germany.

[gemmell]

Kessler will beat Froch use his reach and jab to keep Froch off and win a wide UD as for AA his defence would take all Froch's on the gloves then come back with his own and get Froch and win on points widely

But he's not finished

froch has a bigger reach then kessler. mikkel was hurt by calzaghe to the body.froch has better stamina and is genuinlly the harder man.froch by close ud.aa vs froch will be a war..the maker of this thread are you an idiot? froch is finished? every super middeweight would look bad against dirrell who held more then b-hop and ran more then amir khan

[tyson]

Wat was Froch & Robs game plan last night in corner rob asking carl not to rush in then carl comes out swinging seemed not to have a game plan and just relied on carls brute power

[Bomber 1]

To answer the thread question.. Simply!! CARL FROCH IS NOT FINISHED BY ANY MEANS

I don't think he'll win either of his next 2 fights BUT he is far from finished!! He is still a world class supermiddleweight!!

[tonyevs]

froch has a bigger reach then kessler. mikkel was hurt by calzaghe to the body.froch has better stamina and is genuinlly the harder man.froch by close ud.aa vs froch will be a war..the maker of this thread are you an idiot? froch is finished? every super middeweight would look bad against dirrell who held more then b-hop and ran more then amir khan

I too aren`t ruling out Froch beating kessler. Kessler seems very over-rated by many on here I think.

But The worry for Froch is that he is simply relying on brute strength and heart. His chin, punch and skills are now seriously being questioned.
he was knocked down heavilly by Taylor, and wobbled a couple times by Dirrell. How long can his tactics heavilly rely on his chin?

[Autobarn]

Spud, AA is going to put a world of hurt on Froch, I think the best he can hope for is that he has anything left after Kessler and AA have mauled him

i doubt that. AA was almost as negative as dirrell last night.

was he 'eck. that's just how he fights. methodically and patiently and in spurts. and he hurt his man badly twice, the latter being a massive KO punch.

it made me laugh reading the RBR on ESB, ppl panicking and jumping to conclusions as they were. one bloke wrote: "round 1 - ALREADY Taylor is dominating - AA in big trouble."

[Autobarn]

Froch has never been fast enough to get away with the silly Naz-like hands down style he has. He is a slow fighter. Taylor would have won by scores of 117-111 if he had any stamina and Dirrell beat Froch last night.

Froch is world class, but not No.1

i was just about to write that. it seems like froch will never change. jim watt once said about him being too stubborn to change, saying his chin's too high, "his defenses are a disgrace" etc etc. while that singe-mindedness worked in the punishing pascal and taylor fights, he's got to start doing something different.

anyway, this is one reason i like the pressure fighters like jamie moore so much. cos they cut the ring down and batter ppl of different styles with a varied array of power shots - for a living.

hopefully froch can rough up kessler and be in some memorable fights. he's had his narrow escape. he has an axcuse - the opponent wouldn't fight. next time the pressure is really on to deliver. if he gets it wrong he could really get beaten up by kessler. maybe this pressure will inspire the career-best performance he undoubtedly needs.

[Deserter]

Having not seen the fight and having to go by the testimony of posters here, as a massive Froch fan I'm gutted by two particular things:

1) It was pretty unanimous on here before the fight that he needed to jump on Dirrell from the 'get-go' and that's not some incredible insight from us, it was just common sense. So I'm struggling to understand why he didn't even attempt to do that.

2) I remember as far back as the Adamu fight most of us saying needed to bring the left hand up as he didn't have the reflexes to carry off that style. Some close to him argued that he'd either be able to get away with it at world level or would tighten up accordingly as he moved up, but clearly neither has happened.

I guess what I'm gutted about is that there's zero evidence that he's learnt from the Pascal and Taylor fights. The latter in particular should have acted as perfect prep for the Dirrell bout, but it seems as if any 'learning curvel has gone straight out of the window.

I'm really looking foward to seeing what he and his camp have to say in the wake of this one...

how can you make that kind of assessment when you haven't even seen the fight?

This is what Deserter does. He doesn't watch the fights but likes to make arguments and judgements on the fights. Hasn't watched Valuev vs Holyfield but engaged in a long discussion about the fight. Seemingly he can't see the idiocy of that.

Cue yawn... as you failed to grasp at any point during the Valuev/Holyfield debate, I wasn't discussing the fight, I was discussing Holyfield's merit as a potential challenger to Haye should Haye beat Valuev. At no point was your limited intellect able to grasp that, though to be fair you were probably busy making up more false user names eh Lirva? Or maybe, you were busy placing your high-roller bets that leave everyone in awe of you

Lowersmiths, in answer to your reasonable question, I have a really simple answer:
All of us, without exception, will at times form opinion based on third party information - newspaper readers do it every single day. You know that only too well.
The determining factor when forming those opinions are whether the sources are reliable ones. In terms of this forum, I trust and believe in the reports I hear from the majority of posters on here. And if there is a scenario like this morning where pretty much 100% of posters are saying that Carl started tentatively and got tagged because of his hands-down style, then call me crazy, but I'll tend to believe them.
Surely as a fellow expat who suffers a similar lack of access to live fights you are forced on occasion to form views of a fight based on second-hand knowledge, whether that comes in the printed form like Boxing News and Boxing Monthly, or through digital content like www.fightnews.com and this forum?
I should also add that I prefaced the whole thing by clearly saying that I was going by the testimony of posters on this site, so I fail to see what the whole drama is?

[Deserter]

Opticald, Deserter doesn't try to provoke anyone though. You really are a tit.

mate, I'm making a point and you are the one getting personal. The chap made a thread with his thoughts on a fight he hasn't seen. When I questioned him on the Holyfield Valuev fight he replied, "Well, some people thought it was a fair decision". that is what he based his thoughts on the fight on. As people have rightly pointed out, it's ridiculous. Watch the fights then comment mate.

Absolute rubbish - as anyone who will take the time to read the relevant Holyfield/Valuev thread will see. I simply pointed out your flawed logic - you said Holyfield definitely won that fight. Fact. I pointed out that given others felt Valuev had done enough to win it clearly wasn't fact, but was instead an opinion.
It's increasingly embarrassing that you can't grasp this distinction.

[tonyevs]

hopefully froch can rough up kessler and be in some memorable fights. he's had his narrow escape. he has an axcuse - the opponent wouldn't fight. next time the pressure is really on to deliver. if he gets it wrong he could really get beaten up by kessler. maybe this pressure will inspire the career-best performance he undoubtedly needs.

The thing is though. Its always an excuse why he didn`t perform like we are always being told he can.

The truth is clear now. He has been very fortunate in his last two fights. And how good were the opponents really?
Much has ben credited to his win over Pascal since Pascal later picked up a title at lightheavy .. but who did pascal have to beat to get it

[opticald]

Opticald, Deserter doesn't try to provoke anyone though. You really are a tit.

mate, I'm making a point and you are the one getting personal. The chap made a thread with his thoughts on a fight he hasn't seen. When I questioned him on the Holyfield Valuev fight he replied, "Well, some people thought it was a fair decision". that is what he based his thoughts on the fight on. As people have rightly pointed out, it's ridiculous. Watch the fights then comment mate.

Absolute rubbish - as anyone who will take the time to read the relevant Holyfield/Valuev thread will see. I simply pointed out your flawed logic - you said Holyfield definitely won that fight. Fact. I pointed out that given others felt Valuev had done enough to win it clearly wasn't fact, but was instead an opinion.
It's increasingly embarrassing that you can't grasp this distinction.

You are using other peoples testimony to form an opinion. You haven't even watched Holyfield Valuev yourself. Mate, are you intentionally being thick here or can you genuinely not see the point being made? Can you not the the absolute ridiculous idea that you can comment on fights without seeing them and then say "well other people thought it was fair" as a way to strengthen your position?

[rhino222]

i had dirrell by 2 points, but i agree it was close. it was not froch who made the decision for the judges.

[whiskey]

Dirrell is a very skillfull fighter, but his negativity cost him tonight.

The 12th round should have been the 1st round.

Dirrell brought the weirdest tactic i've ever seen - do absolutely nothing for 6 rounds, then hit and run for 6 rounds.

Oh - whinge, fart and complain to the referee then clinch like mad.

[Autobarn]

hopefully froch can rough up kessler and be in some memorable fights. he's had his narrow escape. he has an axcuse - the opponent wouldn't fight. next time the pressure is really on to deliver. if he gets it wrong he could really get beaten up by kessler. maybe this pressure will inspire the career-best performance he undoubtedly needs.

The thing is though. Its always an excuse why he didn`t perform like we are always being told he can.

The truth is clear now. He has been very fortunate in his last two fights. And how good were the opponents really?
Much has ben credited to his win over Pascal since Pascal later picked up a title at lightheavy .. but who did pascal have to beat to get it

anyway, different fight, different day. froch might be "finished" now, but he won't be if he beats kessler.

honestly, i'm not impressed by froch last night. however, how many fights like this did eubank have, vs domestic or lesser opponents? where eubank won close fights from landing almost nothing, etc.

well, pascal had one hell of a fight at litght heavy to win the belt. i actually rate diaconu. in fact, on recent performances, pascal would probably be favoured to beat froch.

i wish pascal was in the super 6 instead of dirrell! if pascal could have stayed strong at super middle. got the impression he was a bit tight bs froch. props to him for picking up, dusting himself off and starting to carve out a memorable career.

[whiskey]

Anyway, Froch won.

I think Taylor is finished though, he got badly hurt last night and is in hospital.

[Autobarn]

regardless. froch has given british boxing 2 great nights, so whatever happens next, he should make the british boxing history books, he deserves a chapter on him and his memorable achivements.

the biggest worry from last night - really, a non fight. dirrel negative, froch unable to really get in there. super 6 is a way to establish some fighters to the mainstream, to really put 168-pounds on the map. it is pretty landmark stuff given the drawn out title reigns of cazlaghe, ottke, eubank, mundine, beyer, which have given many an ordinary or subdued night of boxing. i think we need a bit more given that talented fighters are coming together.

i wonder if dirrell will get aggressive v AA and then have his head nearly knocked off?

[whiskey]

i wonder if dirrell will get aggressive v AA and then have his head nearly knocked off?

Well his tactics didn't work for him last night, thus he'll need to mix it up in the Abraham fight.

[Autobarn]

i wonder if dirrell will get aggressive v AA and then have his head nearly knocked off?

Well his tactics didn't work for him last night, thus he'll need to mix it up in the Abraham fight.

exactly. when he fails to get through that guard, he could make an error, may be tempted to step in closer to try to land properly and hopefulyl get decked. hopefully he doesn't want to make another stalemate.