Haye V Valuev (merged)

GlobalBox
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 2036
Joined: 10 Jun 2007, 02:57

Re: Haye V Valuev (merged)

Post by GlobalBox »

Asterix wrote:Raff The Frenchman reckoned Valuev wasn't "up" for the Holyfield fight, because he was fighting one of his boxing idols. Interesting take.
That was said at the time, he apparently tried everything to dodge the fight as he was said to be mortified that he had to go in and supposedly beat up one of the all time greats and someone who he grew up watching.

To clarify I had been told this 6 weeks before the fight that he really did not want it but was being pressurised into it, think King was involved if memory serves with the US angle.

He was not himself that night that is for sure, it was by far and away the worst he has ever performed.

People need to watch the Ruiz x 2 and Chagaev fights with the blinkers off and forget the downer everyone has on him because of his size.

They were very close fights particularly the first one but Valuev won the second fight in my mind clearly and thats if memory serves only about 15 months ago or so, thought he looked ok in that one.

Had Chagaev by a round personally and whilst many will disagree and say it was wider the second half of the fight was largely the Russian's on my card.

I thought he was troubled by Chagaev's speed early doors and it was only as Chagaev slowed the fight became more even down the stretch.

Booth said something interesting about Haye having a certain body make up which makes him more of a sprinter type than a distance man (in athletic parlance) he said it was something they could not change so perhaps he will be true to his word and go out for the ko for six rounds, knowing how Valuev fights and stays on late so to speak.

Hope he wins but still fancy Valuev ko around the half way point.

:box:
JC
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 4571
Joined: 07 Jan 2004, 13:04

Re: Haye V Valuev (merged)

Post by JC »

Asterix wrote:Raff The Frenchman reckoned Valuev wasn't "up" for the Holyfield fight, because he was fighting one of his boxing idols. Interesting take.
Problem with that excuse is that many, many fighters have had to beat up their ageing idols at some point. They have all hated it but the good ones have always got the job done, Valuev did not.
Old bones Ian
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 11806
Joined: 13 Jul 2004, 07:33

Re: Haye V Valuev (merged)

Post by Old bones Ian »

Saw in the news today that Haye has changed hotel, saying that the first one he was put in was a sh*thole.

If you were Haye's manager wouldn't you of checked the hotel and the room you were going to get before the team arrived from UK.

Not ideal preperation, Haye seems to be blaming the german promoter for the hotel, but these sort of things go on all the time, surley he should of got someone to check beforehand, i mean its only Germany not the other side of the world.
MightyWarrior
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 13313
Joined: 23 Jan 2003, 14:01

Re: Haye V Valuev (merged)

Post by MightyWarrior »

The flea pit hotel Haye wasn't happy with, apparently, was actually the Hilton hotel. Not too shabby you'd think.
What, he's turning into Naz now!?
cagray
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 13
Joined: 18 Apr 2009, 11:31

Re: Haye V Valuev (merged)

Post by cagray »

Have to say for me there is only one outcome from this fight and that is a KO for Haye and probably within 6. Valuez has nothing. Haye has speed and power and will hit him at will. The whole chin/stamina things about Haye I think are greatly over hyped. Haye got tired against Thompson early in his career and that was a very long time ago. Since then he has had tough as well as quick fights such as fragomeni (spelling?) where he had a terrible cut and finished it late (think round 9 or 10), Mormeck when he was down and then finished it in 2nd half of fight (think 7th), Enzo obviously a quick finish (round 2).

Each knockdown I have seen for Haye has always been a mixture of balance and punch. Against Mormeck he was off balance so the punch made him fall, same with Monte. I think his wide stance and the way he throws means he can be caught off balance but in none of these knockdowns has he seemed in trouble and always got up and finished it.

Roach backs Haye heavily and I totally agree with him. I think people forget just how slow and average these heavyweights are.

Anyone know the actual fight time? I suspect it is 9pm given the sky sports show starts at 8...
doctorboxing
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 951
Joined: 14 Aug 2008, 11:23

Re: Haye V Valuev (merged)

Post by doctorboxing »

cagray wrote: Anyone know the actual fight time? I suspect it is 9pm given the sky sports show starts at 8...
Ring walks are 9.45pm. It starts after 9.30 so as not to clash with John and Edward on X-factor
cagray
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 13
Joined: 18 Apr 2009, 11:31

Re: Haye V Valuev (merged)

Post by cagray »

doctorboxing wrote:
cagray wrote: Anyone know the actual fight time? I suspect it is 9pm given the sky sports show starts at 8...
Ring walks are 9.45pm. It starts after 9.30 so as not to clash with John and Edward on X-factor
OMG! are you serious?? What is sky going to show for 1 1/2 hours before the fight... I really thought they would do their normal for british ppv and show the main fight first and undercards after it.
leforge
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 7790
Joined: 04 Mar 2005, 12:44

Re: Haye V Valuev (merged)

Post by leforge »

The undecard which got George Groves. Ruiz who the winner will have to fight.
Poncey
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 7525
Joined: 21 May 2007, 07:48

Who Are The Officials For Haye Valuev

Post by Poncey »

:??
Chambers2
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 6499
Joined: 24 Feb 2004, 07:24

Re: "Dave, you won't listen to me then listen to the Marley!"

Post by Chambers2 »

Terry D wrote:Haye can win this with help from Bob Marley, Cuba Gooding Junior and the ring ring walk music :box:

http://www.BS.com/?m=show&id=23258

Going for Haye in the 8th, or 7th, maybe the 6th.
Good article Tel

If you are the big tree,
We are the small axe.
Sharpened to cut you down,
Ready to cut you down.

:OhYes:
REAL_DEAL
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 5030
Joined: 09 Jul 2003, 06:42

Re: Haye V Valuev (merged)

Post by REAL_DEAL »

sounds like a swingers party
U.F.O
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 279
Joined: 20 Dec 2008, 19:38

Re: Haye V Valuev (merged)

Post by U.F.O »

Valuev's three best wins are against a Shot Holyfield and one of the poorest Hw champs ever John ruiz,
And imo he lost to both of them

Sky's hype of Haye vs Valuev seems to be working judging by what i am hearing from causual boxing fans, most however have never seen Valuev fight and will be shocked to see how very very poor he really is.

If Haye can not win this it's over for him and rightly so, it would also imo be very bad news for boxing

Come on the Haye :bag:
cagray
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 13
Joined: 18 Apr 2009, 11:31

Re: Haye V Valuev (merged)

Post by cagray »

[quote="U.F.O"]
If Haye can not win this it's over for him and rightly so, it would also imo be very bad news for boxing

quote]

Totally agree. Haye is the only exciting heavyweight around. All the others are very boring to watch such as Eddie 'Fast but can't punch' Chambers or Povetkin 'Dull as mud to watch'. The Klitschko's are terrible for boxing as they fight to simply have a win on their record and don't care if it is dull and boring. Wlad is shocking to watch due to his incredibly negative attitude in the ring (should have been disqualified against Sultan due to illegal use of his gloves constantly patting Sultan's hands away).

Thankfully I do think both Klitchsko's are there for the taking now (or at least in the near future) as they are both in decline I believe. Vitall is obviously due to his age and Wlad I think will be quite injury prone from here on in and it only takes one big punch to finish him. Plus fighting the junk they have been (not through any fault of their own) your standards do drop.
MightyWarrior
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 13313
Joined: 23 Jan 2003, 14:01

Re: "Dave, you won't listen to me then listen to the Marley!"

Post by MightyWarrior »

Good article Terry, really hope you're right. While I've thought all along that Haye is far too vunerable to have a real chance with the big guys, I'm starting to wonder, if he does plant a good one of Valuev's chin, what will happen. I read someone say Valuev was rocked in an early fight?

I've not see much of him to be honest, a few fights only, he's just too boring to watch - but he does look like a rock, from what I have seen - pretty sturdy, unlike Haye.

Last night in the pub there was a big crowd of women at the bar, all talking about what time they'd meet for the fight - never seen that before!

My god, if he wins this, the world really is his oyster. The Klit bothers will come running, apologising for any earlier disrespect, and begging for the fight - because in this desert like HW division, David Haye as a HW champ, will be the only game in town.

I still think this could play out like Bowe/Hide, but if DH lands first and hurts him ( his only chance I reckon ) well....who knows.

And I hope he comes out to Aint no stopping us now, Larry Holmes style.
jamesmcdonnell
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 45235
Joined: 12 Nov 2003, 06:11

Re: Haye V Valuev (merged)

Post by jamesmcdonnell »

cagray wrote:Have to say for me there is only one outcome from this fight and that is a KO for Haye and probably within 6. Valuez has nothing. Haye has speed and power and will hit him at will. The whole chin/stamina things about Haye I think are greatly over hyped. Haye got tired against Thompson early in his career and that was a very long time ago. Since then he has had tough as well as quick fights such as fragomeni (spelling?) where he had a terrible cut and finished it late (think round 9 or 10), Mormeck when he was down and then finished it in 2nd half of fight (think 7th), Enzo obviously a quick finish (round 2).

Each knockdown I have seen for Haye has always been a mixture of balance and punch. Against Mormeck he was off balance so the punch made him fall, same with Monte. I think his wide stance and the way he throws means he can be caught off balance but in none of these knockdowns has he seemed in trouble and always got up and finished it.

Roach backs Haye heavily and I totally agree with him. I think people forget just how slow and average these heavyweights are.

Anyone know the actual fight time? I suspect it is 9pm given the sky sports show starts at 8...
You've obviously not seen the Lolenga Mock knockdown then. Haye recovered well, but he was definitely on queer street and went down twice from the effect of the shot.
boxerbob
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 1041
Joined: 30 Oct 2005, 18:11

Re: 2 questions about the haye vs valuev fight

Post by boxerbob »

anyone??????????????
DG.
Heavyweight
Heavyweight

Re: "Dave, you won't listen to me then listen to the Marley!"

Post by DG. »

Terry D wrote:
Chambers2 wrote:
Terry D wrote:Haye can win this with help from Bob Marley, Cuba Gooding Junior and the ring ring walk music :box:

http://www.BS.com/?m=show&id=23258

Going for Haye in the 8th, or 7th, maybe the 6th.
Good article Tel

If you are the big tree,
We are the small axe.
Sharpened to cut you down,
Ready to cut you down.

:OhYes:
Yes! It was inspired by Der Gibbs' love of all things Jamaican. The article, not the proverb :OhYes:
Yes people - the Prophet is here!

Gwann David - make Haye!



:OhYes:
housesecond
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 474
Joined: 16 Nov 2008, 10:00

Re: 2 questions about the haye vs valuev fight

Post by housesecond »

Just hijacking this thread to see if anyone can save me 20 minutes on the phone to sky.

Does anyone know if I can order Box office if i don't have a sky account? By that I mean I pay them £ 10 a month for sky + but don't subscribe to any channels.

????
Autobarn
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 16093
Joined: 05 Jul 2005, 13:01

Re: "Dave, you won't listen to me then listen to the Marley!"

Post by Autobarn »

Terry D wrote:
MightyWarrior wrote:Good article Terry, really hope you're right. While I've thought all along that Haye is far too vunerable to have a real chance with the big guys, I'm starting to wonder, if he does plant a good one of Valuev's chin, what will happen. I read someone say Valuev was rocked in an early fight?

I've not see much of him to be honest, a few fights only, he's just too boring to watch - but he does look like a rock, from what I have seen - pretty sturdy, unlike Haye.

Last night in the pub there was a big crowd of women at the bar, all talking about what time they'd meet for the fight - never seen that before!

My god, if he wins this, the world really is his oyster. The Klit bothers will come running, apologising for any earlier disrespect, and begging for the fight - because in this desert like HW division, David Haye as a HW champ, will be the only game in town.

I still think this could play out like Bowe/Hide, but if DH lands first and hurts him ( his only chance I reckon ) well....who knows.

And I hope he comes out to Aint no stopping us now, Larry Holmes style.
I think Haye might Ok in this one. The shots won't be super fast and he should be able to see them coming, I hope! My girlfriend said that all her mates are talking the fight up so it has caught the people eye. Unfortunately a lot of people wan tto see Haye come unstuck, they just don't see the funny side to his pre-fight antics.

Haye is the smaller man, maybe he's built himself into this larger-than-life caricature to build himself up and make a mockery of the size issue.

I heard that Brendan Ingle compared it to Baer Carnera. I think it could do like Dempsey-Williard with the speed and aggression of the smaller man causing a lot of damage to the big guy.

Haye should be able to land 20-30 good shot per round and steadily break his body down and close the show when Valuev has had enough. If he tones down the celebrations the German's will acknowledge him and they might call for a renewed Haye-Klit rivalry.

Haye is no Lewis though. Lennox did this type of thing routinely and many people took him for granted.
lewis was a lot bigger, though. if haye pulls this off, it will be a nice achievement with him being a former proper world champ down at cruiser, when the division was pretty exciting.

looking back, i loved those friday fight nights where haye won and defended the european title. he really learned his trade in some hard fights, did things properly. hope to see him end a frustrating period, and perhaps bring some popularity back to UK boxing.

and also to shut up the normally solid doug fischer, who called him "Jeremey Williams with a British accent."
Mimmy
Heavyweight
Heavyweight

My nightmare (Haye fight)

Post by Mimmy »

I had a very vivid dream last night. Haye entered the ring all confident but was brutilly knocked out in the first round. I was going to put a bet on this but have read that the Russian does not have a ko punch.

Anyhow, i might still have a couple of quid on Haye getting creamed in the first.

just checked william hill and its 40/1 for haye getting ko-ed in the 1st.
Bard of Boxrec
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 13114
Joined: 22 Feb 2002, 20:00

Re: My nightmare (Haye fight)

Post by Bard of Boxrec »

I got Valuev KO1 at 80/1.

Valuetown.
stujones
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 27512
Joined: 29 Aug 2003, 15:08

Re: "Dave, you won't listen to me then listen to the Marley!"

Post by stujones »

If Haye smashes Valuev he is made..... US TV will DEMAND him vs Klitchsko's. US TV want the Klitchsko's out of the scene and they will see Haye as the person more likely to do it.
crusader
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 16875
Joined: 19 Jan 2009, 20:14

Re: Haye V Valuev (merged)

Post by crusader »

jamesmcdonnell wrote:
cagray wrote:Have to say for me there is only one outcome from this fight and that is a KO for Haye and probably within 6. Valuez has nothing. Haye has speed and power and will hit him at will. The whole chin/stamina things about Haye I think are greatly over hyped. Haye got tired against Thompson early in his career and that was a very long time ago. Since then he has had tough as well as quick fights such as fragomeni (spelling?) where he had a terrible cut and finished it late (think round 9 or 10), Mormeck when he was down and then finished it in 2nd half of fight (think 7th), Enzo obviously a quick finish (round 2).

Each knockdown I have seen for Haye has always been a mixture of balance and punch. Against Mormeck he was off balance so the punch made him fall, same with Monte. I think his wide stance and the way he throws means he can be caught off balance but in none of these knockdowns has he seemed in trouble and always got up and finished it.

Roach backs Haye heavily and I totally agree with him. I think people forget just how slow and average these heavyweights are.

Anyone know the actual fight time? I suspect it is 9pm given the sky sports show starts at 8...
You've obviously not seen the Lolenga Mock knockdown then. Haye recovered well, but he was definitely on queer street and went down twice from the effect of the shot.
He obviously hasn't seen the Mormeck knockdown either. His legs were clearly gone when Mormecck and hit him and he was out of it for a bit even after rising. If you get hit than your legs go wobbly and you crash to the canvas your lack of balance is due to the damage of the punch, and thus the " off balance" excuse doesn't apply.
Asterix
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 7128
Joined: 02 Nov 2007, 10:42

Re: Haye V Valuev (merged)

Post by Asterix »

crusader wrote:He obviously hasn't seen the Mormeck knockdown either. His legs were clearly gone when Mormecck and hit him and he was out of it for a bit even after rising. If you get hit than your legs go wobbly and you crash to the canvas your lack of balance is due to the damage of the punch, and thus the " off balance" excuse doesn't apply.
I'll throw a bit of evidence into the pot to further confirm what you're saying.

1:24 onwards: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRT-oXu9 ... re=related

Haye takes some big shots and his head clears very quickly. In hindsight, I'm impressed with that.
Goz
Heavyweight
Heavyweight
Posts: 3490
Joined: 29 Aug 2003, 12:17

Re: Haye V Valuev (merged)

Post by Goz »

I'm really swinging towards Valuev at the moment.

Thinking of small Heavies who toppled or competed with bigger guys, Toney, Roy Jones, Spinks (Michael) all had exceptional defensive skills David doesn't appear to be very hard to hit. Tyson was fairly unique I feel and his offense was his defence and Holyfield was 'cute' and not that small anyway as time went on.

I'm thinking David might be more Herbie Hide than the list above. I know the Ruski isn't a peak Riddick Bowe or upcoming Vitali Klitschko either but the way Hide got his brain scrambled by their often glancing blows is strong in my mind here.

I really hope I'm wrong - it's possible Haye hits harder than any of the above bar Tyson which could be what gives him a chance but I just can't get over the size thing. I mean the weight difference could be like Haye at Cruiser fighting a Flyweight!!

I can see Haye going down several times but giving some moments of excitement in return before getting stopped in 6/7 rounds.

But I will be holldering for Haye come 9.45pm tomorrow, I'm just being honest!
Post Reply