whats the difference between unlicensed and white collar?

[rhino222]

give him a clip round the ear billy, that should stop him sticking his nose into your business.

[Coco]

Technically there is nothing between them, but in practice in white collar bouts fighters tend to wear sparring gloves, head gear and fights get stopped before folk get bashed up. Also medical back up tends to be better.
However of course this is not regulated at all and varies hugely depending on the promoter.
For you Billy I would emphasise how you regulate your bouts.

[jamesmcdonnell]

Technically there is nothing between them, but in practice in white collar bouts fighters tend to wear sparring gloves, head gear and fights get stopped before folk get bashed up. Also medical back up tends to be better.
However of course this is not regulated at all and varies hugely depending on the promoter.
For you Billy I would emphasise how you regulate your bouts.

White collar fights are usually between city boys who have paid through the nose to train for the chance to be a fighter - but usually have little or no amateur experience.

Unlicensed bouts tend to be either former amateurs who were refused a licence - or former pros who lost their licence.

[Coco]

Clearly the answer is to challenge this muppet to a white collar bout!

[DavidPayne]

Surely the fellas at City Boxer would know this wouldn't they?

[DavidPayne]

Personally, I don't think there is a difference, its all about the quality of the participants isn't it?

[SDHammer]

Clearly the answer is to challenge this muppet to a white collar bout!

yes but would it be white collar or would it be unlicensed?

Fight him on one of his cards and then according to him its white collar, once you make him see the error of his ways I'm sure he'll be all sweetness and light.

[slider]

I go to ones in doncaster,barnsley,hull and its classed as white collar. Its the prize fighter format (quarter,semi,final) 3 x 2 mins and the winner gets £3500. All the boxers have limited experience and no pro or x pro`s. all the boxers wear 14oz gloves and headguards, they are paramedics and doctor on site to. Also all boxers are insured as well as disclaimers. A good night and most of the bouts are very even.

[hurlock]

they are both shite, exept one thinks they are really hard??

[m1kee50]

i know what has already been said already but cheers for that i get the novices to wear 16oz gloves and the experienced 12oz headguard and vest is optional(which is the same as on hes shows) but he is going around telling everyone to only fight on hes shows cos there white collar and all of mine are unlicensed and are illegal. and its scared some of the lads off because he is so convincing and i dont wanna challenge him on this to end up looking a tit but it seems that nobody actually knows what the difference except him so he thinks

unlicensed is NOT illegal Bill, its just not under the auspices of the BBBofC... This bloke is trying a very shady trick IMO, I reckon you need to stick to your guns, call it white collar if that is whats selling, have a look about but I dont think there is any legal definition of white collar boxing so just go ahead and call it.

[demolitiondaley]

i know what has already been said already but cheers for that i get the novices to wear 16oz gloves and the experienced 12oz headguard and vest is optional(which is the same as on hes shows) but he is going around telling everyone to only fight on hes shows cos there white collar and all of mine are unlicensed and are illegal. and its scared some of the lads off because he is so convincing and i dont wanna challenge him on this to end up looking a tit but it seems that nobody actually knows what the difference except him so he thinks

unlicensed is NOT illegal Bill, its just not under the auspices of the BBBofC... This bloke is trying a very shady trick IMO, I reckon you need to stick to your guns, call it white collar if that is whats selling, have a look about but I dont think there is any legal definition of white collar boxing so just go ahead and call it.

Matthew is right pal, unlicensed isn't illegal at all. Any boxing that isn't sanctioned by the BBBofC or the ABA is regarded by both those bodies and by people in general as unlicensed. White collar sounds more fluffy but there is no white collar governing body so it is still technically unlicensed. This guy is talking a load of rubbish and I bet some of his "white collar" boxers are ex am and pro. He is just using dirty tactics to try and take business of you mate. I bet he tells everyone that all profits go to save the children or something like that! If you have lads who are getting paid and are experienced lads then you could call those bouts semi-pro and then the debutants white collar. Call them what you want Bill, you aren't doing anything wrong.

[Boxingmad]

[quote="billy bessey"]i have recently run a show claiming it to be white collar but i have been informed(or rather the venue has) by a nob jockey that it wasnt white collar it was unlicensed can anyone tell me what can make a show white collar instead of unlicensed or is it just the same thing? the venue has a license to hols boxing events and i got all the fighters to sign a disclaimer the bloke who tried to stop it runs a white collar outfit himself but im wondering if theres such a thing or is it just a word to make it sound regulated? can anyone help me on this please? and can i just have answers that are facts and not i think this i think that cos id fookin love to shut this bloke up cheers in advance [/quote

I think it all depends on a point of view. Some will say that as it's not licensed by the BBBoC or the ABA then that counts as unlicensed. Originally the term "white-collar" meant people such as bankers, lawyers, doctors etc but now you get just about anybody doing it.

There's nothing to prevent you holding a show and if anyone comes up and tells you otherwise, ignore them. As long as you have stringent medical assistance ready, then you're fine. The BBBoC & ABA are self-appointed bodies last time I checked, and the only white-collar governing body I've heard of is the International White-Collar Boxing Association. Of course, if there are others please put me straight as I'm keen to know myself.

[Boxingmad]

I'd like to know myself though - if you receive money for boxing, even with headguard, vests etc, doesn't that count as being a professional?

[pompeybob]

Billy, is the 'bloke' down our way? RB? from what I'm aware none of the white collar shows down here have been 'white collar'. There is an association in London that puts on shows under the white collar banner, as far as I'm aware he isn't affiliated to that although I could be totally wrong with that. The strictly white collar shows that I have seen have boxers with no experiance at all other than in other white collar shows, they box with 16oz gloves, vests and headguards usually over 3x2's they also don't recieve any payment.

Unlicensed on the other hand, which is not illegal, is a more open affair where the boxers have various degrees of ability and experiance and which some more unscrupulos coaches may tuck up opponents, unlicenced boxers recieve cash for appearing how much depends on who is putting on the show. So long as the boxers are told up front on what the score is then it is up to them. I've noticed that a few unlicensed shows are calling it white collar, maybe they think it is less provocative for the venue owners.

[hurlock]

of the subject i remember billy bessey throwing a hayemaker dismantling mighty joe young!! D
what a NIGHT it was like roy chubby brown,the chants of you fat b a s ta rd
whats chris bessey doing these days,the modern day john lyons??

[ERIC GUY]

of the subject i remember billy bessey throwing a hayemaker dismantling mighty joe young!! D
what a NIGHT it was like roy chubby brown,the chants of you fat b a s ta rd

I was watching that fight a few weeks ago, funny as fk.........

[hurlock]

not often you see tony burns raise his eyebrows!! DD

[ERIC GUY]

Alan Lacey runs the Real Fight club, which is 'White Collar Boxing''
Bruce Silverglades who ran Gleasons gym, used to hold Boxing shows called 'White Collar nights' and the boxers were Lawyers Doctors, Accountants, Architechs etc, and thats how the White Collar Boxing was formed, Alan Lacey Boxed in NY at one of these events, and wanted to bring it to the UK, which he did succesfully, The boxers are City Workers again!, they wear 16oz gloves, vests, and headguards, both boxers hands get raised at the end, unless a title fight happens, even Manny Steward was in the corner at one of these shows, it was at the Marriott Hotel in Park Lane. they have a doctor and medical team at these events!!
Unlicensed is completely different........

[pompeybob]

That's handy Bill, seeing as I get on with you both!

Basically both 'White collar' and Unlicensed are err unlicensed! as neither are regulated by the BBBofC or ABAE / AIBA, you can call your shows what ever you like you can even set up your own sanctioning body and bill your next show as a world title fight! (Couldn't be any worse than some of the sanctioning bodies) That would shut him up!

You are doing nothing illegal, (and from the feedback I've had from your shows nothing wrong either), do a google search on the actual aspects of the law and threaten to legal for liable / slander on him.

[Boxingmad]

It might be worth joining one of the organisations such as the IWCBA, as that way you come under a white-collar boxing banner, plus you'll have more contacts, put fighters on other shows etc.

[bridportboxer]

Billy that bloke is a tit, and anyone I spoke to on your show last week agreed. 11 fights and no KO's - all 50/50 fights, means your doing something right.
For the record my defination of white collar is that it is aimed at 'white collar' workers who want to have a go, and train for 8-12 weeks then battle with someone of the same level (mostly as exhibitions with no winner announced).
I think that this has now evolved and I would call any novice semi pro boxer a white collar boxer, until they've had 4 or 5 fights, then call them semi pro (because they are getting paid).
The way you are doing things is the right way mate, safety first, 16oz gloves, headgear if boxers wanna wear it, very good referee.
Just ignore that tit, as I said to you before if he is that worried about it his own shows probably aint working out to well and he has a lot of spare time on his hands. What did you he say when you challenged them to an open explanation? He ignored it and deleted the question - says it all really mate.

[jamesmcdonnell]

so nobody actually knows if you can or cant call it what you like? plus if you do call it white collar or unlicensed nobody has the right to tell people you cant call it one or the other. and what the proper definition of white collar boxing id just what they think it is. my boys get a small purse and a ticket deal just as they do on the other blokes shows. me and my friend are starting up an organisation is there anyway we can copyright it so that it comes under white collar?

bob no its not rob i get on with him

You can call it whatever the frigg you like, 'White collar' is not a brand covered under the trade descriptions act, so if yuou want to call it that, call it that.

Cityboxer, now that is a brand, if you tried to call it that, they could haul you into court, but you're free to call it unlicensed, white collar, or just make up your own name for it, it's up to you Billy.

[Shirow]

It's pretty much all been said. Any boxing which isn't licensed by the BBBoC or the ABA is by definition unlicensed. White collar boxing is included in this and the main difference is that unlicensed boxers get paid and white collar boxers don't and they are more looked after as they may have put on gloves for the first time 3 months earlier.

The so called white collar licensing bodies are set up by the white collar boxing clubs themselves (Cityboxer has their own, the Real Fight club have their own etc). So you can either set up your own one and list your rules and regs or go under anothe clubs licensing body and then you can co-operate on shows and your match your fighters up together.
Either way you then have something you can use to 'prove' you are white collar rather than unlicensed to anyone who is concerned.


Just make sure the disclaimers get signed and you have a ring doctor and St John's if possible.

[m1kee50]

so nobody actually knows if you can or cant call it what you like? plus if you do call it white collar or unlicensed nobody has the right to tell people you cant call it one or the other. and what the proper definition of white collar boxing id just what they think it is. my boys get a small purse and a ticket deal just as they do on the other blokes shows. me and my friend are starting up an organisation is there anyway we can copyright it so that it comes under white collar?

bob no its not rob i get on with him

Bill you could try to get in touch with Alan Mortlock, does/did unlicensed boxing - IBA - at the Circus Tavern in Essex, maybe some other places too. Might be able to get some business done there.

[MeanMachine.biz]

This argument goes back to the 70's when roy Shaw came out of prison and tried to get his BBBofC license back. The board refused him because of his criminal record which was more to do with what the board called his 'criminal contacts' as through the years there has been plenty of boxers with some kind of shady backgrounds.
Anyway Roy with some friends decided to box outside the legislation of the BBBofC, the board in a newspaper article called it an 'unlicensed boxing event' which was very cheeky of them as they are not a government body but a limited company.
what they should have said is the event was not licensed by them and that there is nothing stopping anyone else forming their own board of boxing.
We run events and we still to this day get asked by venues if the show is unlicensed which makes it sound illegal.
White collar has recieved some coverage mainly from the celebrity BBC shows which makes it look like its legit but any form of boxing is legal as long as it is staged with gloves and has a referee.
As for the medical supervision being superior at white collar, thats rubbish and an impossible thing to say as it depends on the promoter.
At our shows we have the same medical procedure as the pro's, paramedics and doctors present and pre fight medical.
Billy if you want call your show professional boxing, we do, if someone is getting paid then thats professional boxing.