Classic American West Coast Boxing

[dagosd2000]

THE MOST BRUTAL THRILLING FIGHTER WHO EVER ENTERED THE RING

Going to paint Jack Dempsey today. Give it a shot. Never really have a clear idea of how I want to do it. When we were living in Chicago my dad would have lunch with Dempsey when he was in town.My father was on the in. So was Dempsey. Probably that's why they knew each other. My dad would have lunch with Grange and Hornsby too once in a while. All insiders. I wish I could have been on the inside.

One time my father took my mother to New York City. They said that they had lunch at Dempsy's place on Broadway. My dad introduced my mother to Jack. My mother said that he was a class act. A gentleman who exuded style.Humility with a toughness. You could tell. Hell,Jack Dempsey was a tough guy. But he didn't have to punctuate it anywhere but inside the squared circle.

My mother didn't follow the fights. Oh,she had heard of Jack Dempsey. He was up there with Ruth at that time when she was a kid.

So this afternoon I'm going to paint "the most brutal thrilling fighter who ever entered the ring."By the way,that was Tracy Callis's quote when he wrote his mini bio of the Champ for the CBZ.

I wish some of these athletes could seperate that brutality when they leave the arena today. I'm sure if my parents were alive still,my dad would be carefull about taking my mother out to lunch.

[Expug]

Great stuff about Jack Rog.
It reminds me of a quote from Dempsey.
"A fighter can always afford to be a gentleman".
One of the toughest guys in history sure was.

[Chuck1052]

According to Bob Buttitta's article in today's edition of the Ventura County Star, Victor Ortiz claims that he sustained a torn cartilage and a ruptured tendon in his right wrist while landing a right hook in a sparring session a week before his bout with Marcos Maidana. Ortiz also said that he went to the emergency room on the Wednesday before fight and received an injection of cortisone. The damage reportedly was so severe that Ortiz had to get the wrist surgically repaired after the fight.

Ortiz said that he had previous success when fighting with his hands broken, which is one reason why he led him to decide to go through with the fight with Maidana. He also stated that his sense of loyalty to Golden Boy Productions also had influenced his decision.

In other parts of the article, Ortiz talks about events surrounding the fight with Maidana, the post-fight interview with Max Kellerman and his plans for the future. Danny Garcia, Ortiz's trainer, said that he doesn't have any doubt that his charge will do well after his last bout.

- Chuck Johnston

[Rick Farris]

THE MOST BRUTAL THRILLING FIGHTER WHO EVER ENTERED THE RING

Going to paint Jack Dempsey today. Give it a shot. Never really have a clear idea of how I want to do it. When we were living in Chicago my dad would have lunch with Dempsey when he was in town.My father was on the in. So was Dempsey. Probably that's why they knew each other. My dad would have lunch with Grange and Hornsby too once in a while. All insiders. I wish I could have been on the inside.

One time my father took my mother to New York City. They said that they had lunch at Dempsy's place on Broadway. My dad introduced my mother to Jack. My mother said that he was a class act. A gentleman who exuded style.Humility with a toughness. You could tell. Hell,Jack Dempsey was a tough guy. But he didn't have to punctuate it anywhere but inside the squared circle.

My mother didn't follow the fights. Oh,she had heard of Jack Dempsey. He was up there with Ruth at that time when she was a kid.

So this afternoon I'm going to paint "the most brutal thrilling fighter who ever entered the ring."By the way,that was Tracy Callis's quote when he wrote his mini bio of the Champ for the CBZ.

I wish some of these athletes could seperate that brutality when they leave the arena today. I'm sure if my parents were alive still,my dad would be carefull about taking my mother out to lunch.

Rog . . . I just was just exchanging E-mail this morning with John Bardelli relating to Dempsey. "The most brutal fighter to ever enter the ring" is so appropriate!


-Rick Farris

[Randyman]

Happy Thanksgiving to all my pals here. Enjoy your day and the turkey (with all the trimmings). I am thankful to know you guys and call you my friends.

Randy

[kikibalt]

Happy Thanksgiving to all my pals here. Enjoy your day and the turkey (with all the trimmings). I am thankful to know you guys and call you my friends.

Randy

Thank you, Randy, and the feeling is mutual....

[Randyman]

THE MOST BRUTAL THRILLING FIGHTER WHO EVER ENTERED THE RING

Going to paint Jack Dempsey today. Give it a shot. Never really have a clear idea of how I want to do it. When we were living in Chicago my dad would have lunch with Dempsey when he was in town.My father was on the in. So was Dempsey. Probably that's why they knew each other. My dad would have lunch with Grange and Hornsby too once in a while. All insiders. I wish I could have been on the inside.

One time my father took my mother to New York City. They said that they had lunch at Dempsy's place on Broadway. My dad introduced my mother to Jack. My mother said that he was a class act. A gentleman who exuded style.Humility with a toughness. You could tell. Hell,Jack Dempsey was a tough guy. But he didn't have to punctuate it anywhere but inside the squared circle.

My mother didn't follow the fights. Oh,she had heard of Jack Dempsey. He was up there with Ruth at that time when she was a kid.

So this afternoon I'm going to paint "the most brutal thrilling fighter who ever entered the ring."By the way,that was Tracy Callis's quote when he wrote his mini bio of the Champ for the CBZ.

I wish some of these athletes could seperate that brutality when they leave the arena today. I'm sure if my parents were alive still,my dad would be carefull about taking my mother out to lunch.

The really tough fighters have nothing to prove outside the ring. Dempsey was my boyhood idol.

Randy

[Rick Farris]

According to Bob Buttitta's article in today's edition of the Ventura County Star, Victor Ortiz claims that he sustained a torn cartilage and a ruptured tendon in his right wrist while landing a right hook in a sparring session a week before his bout with Marcos Maidana. Ortiz also said that he went to the emergency room on the Wednesday before fight and received an injection of cortisone. The damage reportedly was so severe that Ortiz had to get the wrist surgically repaired after the fight.

Ortiz said that he had previous success when fighting with his hands broken, which is one reason why he led him to decide to go through with the fight with Maidana. He also stated that his sense of loyalty to Golden Boy Productions also had influenced his decision.

In other parts of the article, Ortiz talks about events surrounding the fight with Maidana, the post-fight interview with Max Kellerman and his plans for the future. Danny Garcia, Ortiz's trainer, said that he doesn't have any doubt that his charge will do well after his last bout.

- Chuck Johnston

Chuck . . .

Victor Ortiz suffers from a condition far more destructive to a boxer than a bad wrist. He is a eunuch .
No balls, a quitter.

[Randyman]

Happy Thanksgiving to all my pals here. Enjoy your day and the turkey (with all the trimmings). I am thankful to know you guys and call you my friends.

Randy

Thank you, Randy, and the feeling is mutual....

Thanks, Frank.

[Randyman]

According to Bob Buttitta's article in today's edition of the Ventura County Star, Victor Ortiz claims that he sustained a torn cartilage and a ruptured tendon in his right wrist while landing a right hook in a sparring session a week before his bout with Marcos Maidana. Ortiz also said that he went to the emergency room on the Wednesday before fight and received an injection of cortisone. The damage reportedly was so severe that Ortiz had to get the wrist surgically repaired after the fight.

Ortiz said that he had previous success when fighting with his hands broken, which is one reason why he led him to decide to go through with the fight with Maidana. He also stated that his sense of loyalty to Golden Boy Productions also had influenced his decision.

In other parts of the article, Ortiz talks about events surrounding the fight with Maidana, the post-fight interview with Max Kellerman and his plans for the future. Danny Garcia, Ortiz's trainer, said that he doesn't have any doubt that his charge will do well after his last bout.

- Chuck Johnston

Chuck . . .

Victor Ortiz suffers from a condition far more destructive to a boxer than a bad wrist. He is a eunuch .
No balls, a quitter.

I absolutely agree.

Randy

[Rick Farris]

Happy Thanksgiving to all my pals here. Enjoy your day and the turkey (with all the trimmings). I am thankful to know you guys and call you my friends.

Randy

Randy . . . Best Holiday wishes to you, Jeri and the family. Thanks to all my Boxrec buddies. I value all of you so much. Great friends.

-Rick

[Randyman]

THE MOST BRUTAL THRILLING FIGHTER WHO EVER ENTERED THE RING

Going to paint Jack Dempsey today. Give it a shot. Never really have a clear idea of how I want to do it. When we were living in Chicago my dad would have lunch with Dempsey when he was in town.My father was on the in. So was Dempsey. Probably that's why they knew each other. My dad would have lunch with Grange and Hornsby too once in a while. All insiders. I wish I could have been on the inside.

One time my father took my mother to New York City. They said that they had lunch at Dempsy's place on Broadway. My dad introduced my mother to Jack. My mother said that he was a class act. A gentleman who exuded style.Humility with a toughness. You could tell. Hell,Jack Dempsey was a tough guy. But he didn't have to punctuate it anywhere but inside the squared circle.

My mother didn't follow the fights. Oh,she had heard of Jack Dempsey. He was up there with Ruth at that time when she was a kid.

So this afternoon I'm going to paint "the most brutal thrilling fighter who ever entered the ring."By the way,that was Tracy Callis's quote when he wrote his mini bio of the Champ for the CBZ.

I wish some of these athletes could seperate that brutality when they leave the arena today. I'm sure if my parents were alive still,my dad would be carefull about taking my mother out to lunch.

Rog . . . I just was just exchanging E-mail this morning with John Bardelli relating to Dempsey. "The most brutal fighter to ever enter the ring" is so appropriate!


-Rick Farris

I still dream about a fight between Jack Dempsey and Rocky Marciano. Can you imagine?

Randy

[Rick Farris]

THE MOST BRUTAL THRILLING FIGHTER WHO EVER ENTERED THE RING

Going to paint Jack Dempsey today. Give it a shot. Never really have a clear idea of how I want to do it. When we were living in Chicago my dad would have lunch with Dempsey when he was in town.My father was on the in. So was Dempsey. Probably that's why they knew each other. My dad would have lunch with Grange and Hornsby too once in a while. All insiders. I wish I could have been on the inside.

One time my father took my mother to New York City. They said that they had lunch at Dempsy's place on Broadway. My dad introduced my mother to Jack. My mother said that he was a class act. A gentleman who exuded style.Humility with a toughness. You could tell. Hell,Jack Dempsey was a tough guy. But he didn't have to punctuate it anywhere but inside the squared circle.

My mother didn't follow the fights. Oh,she had heard of Jack Dempsey. He was up there with Ruth at that time when she was a kid.

So this afternoon I'm going to paint "the most brutal thrilling fighter who ever entered the ring."By the way,that was Tracy Callis's quote when he wrote his mini bio of the Champ for the CBZ.

I wish some of these athletes could seperate that brutality when they leave the arena today. I'm sure if my parents were alive still,my dad would be carefull about taking my mother out to lunch.

Rog . . . I just was just exchanging E-mail this morning with John Bardelli relating to Dempsey. "The most brutal fighter to ever enter the ring" is so appropriate!


-Rick Farris

I still dream about a fight between Jack Dempsey and Rocky Marciano. Can you imagine?

Randy

[Randyman]

Dempsey vs Firpo


Marciano vs Walcott

[Randyman]

San Diego,
April 1969 . . .


I was a junior in high school. My heavyweight team mate and friend, Kit Boursse', was in his first year of junior college.
Kit was taking police science classes at Valley College, just in case he didn't reach his goal of a world heavyweight title one day. Kit didn't win the title, but he did become a cop.
We'd both won regional AAU championships at El Monte Legion Stadium the previous week, and were in San Diego with the rest of the L.A. team for the Nationals.

We had two heavyweights on our team. Kit Boursse' had earned his spot by winning the Southern Pacific regional title like the rest of us on the team.
Walter Moore, our other heavyweight, had won the National Golden Gloves title in Kansas City the previous month, automatically guaranteeing a trip to the AAU Nationals.
I'd been on the Golden Gloves team that went to Kansas City with Moore, Mike Quarry, Petey Vital Jr., Rudy Acuna, Florentino Ramirez and a few others just a month previous.

We drove down to San Diego the day before the four day tournament started at the new International Sports Arena.
Our coaches were Jake Horn, Ernie DeFrance, Sonny Ray and Memo Soto.
Manuel Diaz, Kit's and my coach at the Johnny Flores Gym, drove us down to S.D. in his new Buick Riviera.
On the drive down, all Diaz would let us listen to on the stereo was his new Jose Feliciano tape. It was the one that featured "Light My Fire."
After that three hour drive, I never wanted to hear the song again. Manny and Feliciano ruined it for me. I used to like the DOORS and still do, but not that song.

All of nearly 500 fighters plus coaches were lodged at the LeBaron Hotel on Hotel Circle. I was happy to find that not everybody on our team would be in just one room.
That's what it was like in the juniors when you fought out of town. You would have two, sometimes three kids in one bed, on the floor, wherever?
That was fun when your a kid, but in San Diego I'd share a two-bed room with my stablemate.

After we'd settled into our rooms, we went looking for some of the other guys on our team.
There was Rudy Acuna, who we called "Porky". Porky was the nephew of my professional stablemate, Ruben Navarro. Porky was our team's Lightweight rep.
Our bantam was a sharp little fighter from Santa Paula in Ventura County, Florentino Ramirez. Tino was trained by light-heavy headliner, Ray "Windmill" White.
Middleweight Bobby Torrance was on the team, as was featherweight Spike Sanborne, 130 pounder Henry Verastique and Tommy Coulson at welter.
Two of our regional winners, Mike Quarry and Petey Vital decided to skip the national tournament in favor of staying home and making their pro debuts.
Both Quarry and Vital were offered matches on the undercard of the first Curtis Cokes vs. Jose Napoles welter title fight, which was held at the Forum that same week.

The big name of the tournament was heavyweight Jim Elder of the Navy.
Elder had upset L.A. amateur legend, Clay Hodges, twice the previous year and was favored to win.
There was also Walter Moore, himself a recent National champ. It was pretty much determined that Elder or Moore were the favored heavyweight candidates.
Nobody had much interest in a big fighter from Cincinnati. His name was Earnie Shavers.

Despite the two heavyweight favorites, one boxer stood above the rest when considering the best of the best, and that was the Army's welterweight, Armando Muniz.
Muniz was a defending Nat'l AAU Champ, and an Olympian in the Mexico City Games just months earlier. He was also the All-Army and Inter-Service champ.
With the exception of the Olympics, Muniz never lost as an amateur after joining the Army's boxing team. The Army's coach was the best of the era, Pat Nappi.
We would soon discover that the Army had the best boxing team in the tournament.

I had the not so great pleasure of discovering that the Army certainly had the best flyweight in the tourney, 23-year-old Spec. 4, Caleb Long.
Caleb Long would be my second bout of the day, having won a close decision over a kid from Cinncinati in the afternoon.

At the Nationals, you have three days of eliminations, Wed-Thur-Fri, with the final championship matches held on Saturday.
I had a bye the first day, the second day I fought twice, winning the first match by a close decision in the afternoon. Later in the evening, I fought a great amateur fighter.
I say this not because he was the only boxer to stop me in the amateurs, but because his 173 bout career validated it.
I was down twice in the opening round and today they'd have stopped it.
I hung in, and actually had a fair second round, but in the third I caught a punch high on the forehead that did not hurt me, but it caught me off-balance and I reeled backwards.
It looked like he'd knocked me across the ring, and I was trying to keep my feet under me. As I say, I was not at all hurt but it looked as if I was, I guess. The ref called it.

Caleb Long went on to win the Nationals. Armando Muniz told me before the fight that this guy was good, and that I was "in deep." That was an understatement.
I was only knocked down twice as an amateur, and both knockdowns took place in that opening round.
I finished on my feet, unhurt at the end, but he really rang my bell in round one.

I asked Mando whatever happened to Caleb Long. The former welter contender told me that Long had been discharged from the Army a few months after the tournament.
He said he'd heard that he was involved with an armed robbery and had been shot and killed. I need to investigate and see if what Muniz had heard was correct?

I can't speak for all boxers, but I never forgot a guy who hurt me. If I fought them a second time, they never hurt me again.
A solid punch gets your attention, to say the least, and you take it seriously. It will make you fight better, at least more aware.
Of course, if you are a dog it will make you quit. I may have had a few fleas, but I never quit.
Caleb Long hit me so hard that night, I can still feel it more than four decades later.

In the heavyweight division, my buddy Kit Boursse' was also eliminated in his second fight. The guy who beat him lost to Earnie Shavers.
Walter Moore? Well Walter seems to have come down with a stomach problem.
When he discovered he'd be fighting Jim Elder in the opening round of the eliminations, he came down with a stomach ailment, and pulled out.

Elder was cocky, a kind of soft bellied white fighter with good basic skills and an inflated ego. He walked thru everybody right up to the final match, the championship bout.
He was actually intimidating most of his competition. They were scared, you could see it in a couple.

The guy who looked most scared was the big, hard punching kid from Cincinnati, Earnie Shavers.
When they met in the center of the ring, you could see Elder smirk at his wide-eyed opponent.

The bells rings and Shavers runs right across the ring and begins to throw bombs with both hands. One clips Elder on the chin and he reels back into the ropes.
He must have taken a dozen solid shots, a couple as he fell to the canvas. Elder struggled to push himself up but he couldn't. He was counted out.
The biggest upset of the tournament.

That was the final match of the tournament. The Champions were crowned, and the Fighter of the Tournament was announced . . . Armando Muniz of the U.S. Army!
That was no suprise, Mando was surely the man that year.

The year was 1969 . . . a few months later a man walked on the moon for the first time, Rocky Marciano was killed in a plane crash, Viet Nam was going hot & heavy, Ruben Olivares flattened Lionel Rose to win the bantam title, and a guy named Charles Manson orchestrated two bloody mass murders in Southern California.
It was quite a year.


-Rick Farris

A great memory Rick, thanks for sharing it.

Randy

[Rick Farris]

Bells, Buzzers & Horns . . .


One Arena, three rings, nearly 500 fighters.

That was the '69 AAU National Boxing Championships.
During the first three days of eliminations, boxing took place in three rings, side-by-side from 10am-to-10pm. continuously.
Ring #1 used a bell to start & finish each round, Ring #2 used a buzzer, and Ring #3 a horn.

Now this is where things could become confusing, espcially if you were a little woozy from battle.
For example, my first bout took place in the early afternoon in ring #1. I was used to the bell and that's what ring #1 had.
The bouts in the three different rings didn't start at the same time.
The bell ending a round in ring #1 might sound 30 seconds before the buzzer starting a round of a bout in ring #2.
When I fought later in the evening, my match was in Ring #3. So I had to listen only for a horn to mark the rounds, but that can slip one's mind in a tough fight.

There was a kid from Detroit who got confused. We were fighting three minute rounds. He was in Ring #2 and forgot that ring had the buzzer.
A couple minutes into his bout he heard the bell for ring #1. He automatically thought his fights round had ended.
He dropped his hands and turned toward his corner. There was still a minute left in the round of his fight.
His opponent jumped on the opening and KOed the kid with a hard punch as he dropped his hands and turned his head.

It could be confusing and our coach, Jake Horn, drilled it into our heads before each fight . . . "Remember, in this fight you listen only for the horn, or buzzer, etc."
After visiting the canvas twice in round one of my second fight, I heard bells, buzzers and probabaly even saw a bird or two fly by.
However, I was never happier than to hear that horn, ending the round. I was real careful to keep my hands up when it sounded, just in case.


-Rick Farris

[dagosd2000]

The Most Brutal Thrilling Fighter Who Ever Entered The Ring

[kikibalt]

Roger, you out-did youself, again!!.....

[dagosd2000]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gn-X0EucLT0

Bing Crosby

I've Got Plenty To Be Thankfull For

For my Boxrec Pals and their families. Happy Thanksgiving

[dagosd2000]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxPgplMujzQ

From Swing Time

Fred and Ginger(We won't see the likes of that again)

[Rick Farris]

Roger, you out-did youself, again!!.....

Ditto! That's Dempsey! I'd like to say that your other version of Dempsey was great, as well. You've got Dempsey pegged.

[Randyman]

The Most Brutal Thrilling Fighter Who Ever Entered The Ring

You nailed him, Rog!

[Rick Farris]

The Most Brutal Thrilling Fighter Who Ever Entered The Ring

You nailed him, Rog!

Dempsey today . . .

Randy . . . You, Rog and I were all raised on Dempsey stories, John Bardelli was also.
None of us were even born when the Manassa Mauler was fighting.
That's the hallmark of a great fighter. His power tanscends time.
What an impression he made. Guys like Dempsey and Louis really defined boxing during that Golden era.
True heros and legends, what America was all about.
We were raised by men who were familiar with William Harrison Dempsey.
Those who saw him up close are all pretty much gone today.
My thoughts are, "Who's going to know about Jack Dempsey in the future? Who will tell his story?
I guess those who might be interested could read a book.
For the record, the best Dempsey book I ever read was a present from John Bardelli a few years back: "Jack Dempsey-A Flame of Pure Fire."
The book is a literal history of boxing and America. When you read about guys like Dempsey, you are taken back into that time.
It was a time when Rog's grandfather ran Chicago. When my Grandfather got his start in the film business. When Dempsey was on the West Coast.
But it's that Broadway bar he ran for decades that I most wish I could have visted.
I wrote this before, but when I was twelve, I wrote Dempsey a letter.
I didn't have an address, so my Grandfather suggested, just address it: Jack Dempsey, World Heavyweight Champ, New York City.
I told him he was my favorite fighter, that I was about to start boxing and could I have an autograph?
Two weeks later, an autographed and personalized 8x10 B&W photo arrived in the mail.
On the photo Dempsey wrote . . . "To Rick, lots of luck pal, Jack Dempsey - 1964"
I still have the picture, and I'll scan it eventually and post it here. You've seen the pose, but having that signature brings it too life for me (and I don't collect autographs.)


-Rick Farris

[Rick Farris]

QUESTION . . .

As mentioned in a previous post, I was able to get a letter to Jack Dempsey simply by addressing the envelope: Jack Dempsey, World Heavyweight Champ, New York City.
This was nearly four decades after he had retired.

Does anybody believe that in forty years from now a 12-year-old will attempt to reach Vitali Klitschko as I did Dempsey?
If so, do you think a letter would reach the current World Champ if addressed: Vitali Klitschko. World Heavyweight Champ, Marina Del Rey, California?

Vitali who?
RETURN TO SENDER!


-Rick Farris

[Chuck1052]

Hope that everyone had a nice Thanksgiving.

Rick and Randy- Based on what I have seen so far, it is my feeling that Victor Ortiz doesn't have the mental makeup to be a fighter, which means I tend to agree with both of you.

- Chuck Johnston