Ingemar Johansson/Biggest Right Hand in HW History(?)

[Brutu]

I have not really paid too much attention to the boxing career of Ingemar Johansson in the past,
other then he had fought Floyd Patterson 3 times.
However in looking at some of the clips on youtube of some of his other bouts.
He really did appear to have a tremendous right hand.
Those clips are 50 years old and look to be in kinescope,but the sheer power from it is amazing.
How did Johansson rate as far as his right hand to the top two HW fighters
voted Max Baer and Earnie Shavers?
is it possible Johansson had a bigger harder right hand then either one?

[Controversial]

I have not really paid too much attention to the boxing career of Ingemar Johansson in the past,
other then he had fought Floyd Patterson 3 times.
However in looking at some of the clips on youtube of some of his other bouts.
He really did appear to have a tremendous right hand.
Those clips are 50 years old and look to be in kinescope,but the sheer power from it is amazing.
How did Johansson rate as far as his right hand to the top two HW fighters
voted Max Baer and Earnie Shavers?
is it possible Johansson had a bigger harder right hand then either one?

Patterson had a very average chin remember. Ingo was a very good puncher but not in the same league as Shavers or Baer.

[Brutu]

This is one of Johansson's post-hw champion fights in 1962 against Dick Richardson

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MecEKGw6LTc

[Brutu]

Here is one of Johansson's pre-HW champion fights against Eddie Machen September 1958.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezLbrjlyTuQ

[Brutu]

Here is the final for the Gold Medal in the 1952 Olympics .
where unfortunately he didnt get a chance to land his big right.
I guess the ref was probably still P.O'd because Anita Ekberg refused to go out with him.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A21Mh46RURU

[Robinson]

I do not thing he has the hardest right hand in history.
It definetly worked welll for him though.

I have never really been fond of Ingo's style, but the
man could box well. He was always up right on his
toes alot, and when he jabbed a lot he seemed to
lift his chin up just that little bit.

His KO over Machen and Patterson were definitive and
impressive all the same though.

[dempseyfire]

I have not really paid too much attention to the boxing career of Ingemar Johansson in the past,
other then he had fought Floyd Patterson 3 times.
However in looking at some of the clips on youtube of some of his other bouts.
He really did appear to have a tremendous right hand.
Those clips are 50 years old and look to be in kinescope,but the sheer power from it is amazing.
How did Johansson rate as far as his right hand to the top two HW fighters
voted Max Baer and Earnie Shavers?
is it possible Johansson had a bigger harder right hand then either one?

Patterson had a very average chin remember. Ingo was a very good puncher but not in the same league as Shavers or Baer.

I don't know how one can claim he wasn't in the league of Baer or Shavers. The guy was able to hurt everyone he fought Machen who he knocked into next week had an excellent chin. One of the best right hands ever, up with the best.

[Brutu]

Johannson went into the first Patterson fight undefeated with 20 wins 13 by KO.
How many of those fights were televised or filmed?
Perhaps because there is so few of his fights filmed, his right hand was under estimated
by the future boxing historians.

[Goodnight, Irene]

He most certainly did not.

[Controversial]

What is being overlooked is that many of the 'names' that Ingo stopped were good european fighters, not world class fighters. His best ko win was over Machen. A good win over Patterson, however Pattersons chin was fairly fragile and he too was stopped and dropped on a regular basis. All the others 'names' Ingo stopped had been stopped several times in their careers by other fighters.

Shavers on the other hand is named by virtually every opponent he faced as being the hardest puncher they ever fought, even ones that beat him. His record speaks volumes on his power, 74 wins (68 ko's) is phenomenal. Compared that to Ingos 26 wins (17 ko's).

Shavers gave Ali hell and flattened Holmes, an absolute monster in punching terms, Ingo is not in the same league imo.

[Brutu]

Floyd Patterson may have been down more times then any other champion,but he still got up off the canvas more then any other champion.How many times was he counted out while down on the canvas?
Also the first punch that Ingo landed to floor Patterson didnt look to be on the chin but on the side of his face/head.
It didnt seem that he could land a flush shot but hard enough to knock Patterson down,which may have been why
he wasnt able to land a straight knock out punch if Patterson had been up and wobbly instead of going down.

[Brutu]

Sometimes they get back up too.
Ron Lyle got off the canvas to KNOCK OUT Shavers.
Larry Holmes got off the canvas to TKO Shavers,
and Bernardo Mercado got off the canvas to TKO Shavers.
also James Quick Tillis got up from a apparently devastating knockdown to go on and win on points is fight against Shavers.

[Controversial]

Sometimes they get back up too.
Ron Lyle got off the canvas to KNOCK OUT Shavers.
Larry Holmes got off the canvas to TKO Shavers,
and Bernardo Mercado got off the canvas to TKO Shavers.
also James Quick Tillis got up from a apparently devastating knockdown to go on and win hon points is fight against Shavers.

If Shavers hit Patterson flush he wouldn't have got up once, let alone 7 times.

Your not seriously suggesting Johansson hit harder than Shavers?

[Brutu]

No, just the right hand when it was able to land flush.
Johansson said that his right hand had a mind of its own and could never tell when it was going to launch itself.
I think I read were Shavers said his best punch was the right uppercut.

Anyway due to the seemingly lack of fight films available of Johansson's
professional fights its of course harder to judge compared to the number of filmed fights of Shavers or Max Baer.

[Brutu]

Anyone here have any idea how many of Johansson's opponents from his professional fights
are still around?
Perhaps they can be interviewed for a first hand account on how it was being clocked by
"Ingo's Bingo".

[Goodnight, Irene]

"If Shavers hit Patterson flush he wouldn't have got up once, let alone 7 times.

Your not seriously suggesting Johansson hit harder than Shavers?" - Contro

Quite possible, but don't bet on it. Dude got up three times against Liston in their rematch. Not a great power difference between Liston & Shavers, & Liston was a lot better at delivering his punches.

[Controversial]

No, just the right hand when it was able to land flush.
Johansson said that his right hand had a mind of its own and could never tell when it was going to launch itself.
I think I read were Shavers said his best punch was the right uppercut.

Anyway due to the seemingly lack of fight films available of Johansson's
professional fights its of course harder to judge compared to the number of filmed fights of Shavers or Max Baer.

Obviously ingo was talking nonsense, of course it didn't have a mind of its own and he knew exactly when he was going to throw it !!

Shavers best punch was the right cross / overhand right. He was a fairly limited fighter, didn't have a great chin and his stamina wasn't great. He lost to some average fighters, which just goes to prove that punch power isn't always enough.

I would argue that Lennox Lewis hit harder than Ingo with his right, he knocked out bigger and better fighters than Ingo managed.

[ThatOne]

No, just the right hand when it was able to land flush.
Johansson said that his right hand had a mind of its own and could never tell when it was going to launch itself.
I think I read were Shavers said his best punch was the right uppercut.

Anyway due to the seemingly lack of fight films available of Johansson's
professional fights its of course harder to judge compared to the number of filmed fights of Shavers or Max Baer.

Obviously ingo was talking nonsense, of course it didn't have a mind of its own and he knew exactly when he was going to throw it !!

Shavers best punch was the right cross / overhand right. He was a fairly limited fighter, didn't have a great chin and his stamina wasn't great. He lost to some average fighters, which just goes to prove that punch power isn't always enough.

I would argue that Lennox Lewis hit harder than Ingo with his right, he knocked out bigger and better fighters than Ingo managed.

This gentleman would agree:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8QSbNQobYw

[HomicideHenry]

I'm hearing alot of crap about Patterson being a meaningless kayo win for Ingo, which I think is complete bullshit. A reporter once made a stab at Patterson saying 'You've went down more times than any other heavyweight champion in history', but Floyd shot back 'But I've also got up more times than any other heavyweight champion in history'. Of all the times Patterson got knocked down, I can only recall one or two men who ever kayoed him and that was Ingo and Liston; Ali won on a TKO in what was to be Patterson's last bout but that hardly qualifies.

Patterson may of had a shaky chin, but Machen sure as hell didn't, the man went the limit with Liston and others, only a few times did he ever eat canvas. Johansson's right hand, when landed flush was a weapon of mass destruction. Would I say it had the frightening power of Shaver's and Baer's right hands?

Probably not, but it wasn't too far behind. Baer's right hand haymaker's didn't always land, and Earnie had conditioning issues that were problematic throughout his career---Baer was sloppy, Earnie couldn't follow up big punch attacks alot of times when it really counted---so, imo, Johansson may not have had the single most powerful right hand, but his was more effective than Baer's and Shavers because his landed more often than their's did in fights that counted.

Johansson was a better fighter than Baer and Shavers, for Baer was wild and sloppy and engaged in alot of illegal tactics and Shavers was just limited---Johansson could actually fight, and make use of that right hand more so than either of those men put together.

[raylawpc]

I'm hearing alot of crap about Patterson being a meaningless kayo win for Ingo, which I think is complete bullshit. A reporter once made a stab at Patterson saying 'You've went down more times than any other heavyweight champion in history', but Floyd shot back 'But I've also got up more times than any other heavyweight champion in history'. Of all the times Patterson got knocked down, I can only recall one or two men who ever kayoed him and that was Ingo and Liston; Ali won on a TKO in what was to be Patterson's last bout but that hardly qualifies.

Patterson may of had a shaky chin, but Machen sure as hell didn't, the man went the limit with Liston and others, only a few times did he ever eat canvas. Johansson's right hand, when landed flush was a weapon of mass destruction. Would I say it had the frightening power of Shaver's and Baer's right hands?

Probably not, but it wasn't too far behind. Baer's right hand haymaker's didn't always land, and Earnie had conditioning issues that were problematic throughout his career---Baer was sloppy, Earnie couldn't follow up big punch attacks alot of times when it really counted---so, imo, Johansson may not have had the single most powerful right hand, but his was more effective than Baer's and Shavers because his landed more often than their's did in fights that counted.

Johansson was a better fighter than Baer and Shavers, for Baer was wild and sloppy and engaged in alot of illegal tactics and Shavers was just limited---Johansson could actually fight, and make use of that right hand more so than either of those men put together.

Well said.

[ThatOne]

Ring Magazine's 100 Greatest Punchers


1. Joe Louis
2. Sam Langford
3. Jimmy Wilde
4. Archie Moore
5. Sandy Saddler
6. Stanley Ketchell

7. Jack Dempsey
8. Bob Fitzsimmons
9. George Foreman
10. Earnie Shavers
11. Sugar Ray Robinson
12. Ruben Olivares
13. Wilfredo Gomez
14. Rocky Marciano
15. Sonny Liston
16. Mike Tyson
17. Bob Foster
18. Thomas Hearns
19. Khaosai Galaxy
20. Alexis Arguello
21. Carlos Zarate
22. Max Baer
23. Rocky Graziano
24. Matthew Saad Muhammad
25. Julian Jackson
26. Danny Lopez
27. Gerald McClellan
28. Roberto Duran
29. Rodrigo Valdez

30. Felix Trinidad
31. Pipino Cuevas
32. Jim Jefferies
33. Lennox Lewis
34. Bennie Briscoe
35. Marvin Hagler
36. Edwin Rosario
37. Tommy Ryan
38. John Mugabi
39. Joe Frazier
40. Carlos Monzon
41. Tony Zale
42. Michael Spinks
43. Joe Gans
44. Elmer Ray
45. George Godfrey
46. Naseem Hamed
47. Alfonso Zamora
48. David Tua
49. Cleveland Williams
50. Julio Cesar Chavez
51. Tiger Jack Fox
52. Joe Walcott
53. Gerry Cooney
54. Al (Bummy) Davis
55. Max Schmeling
56. Florentino Fernandez
57. Henry Armstrong
58. Bob Satterfield
59. Al Hostak
60. Jesus Pimentel
61. Eugene (Cyclone) Hart
62. Lew Jenkins
63. Harry Wills
64. Tom Sharkey
65. Terry McGovern
66. Jersey Joe Walcott
67. Kostya Tszyu
68. Leotis Martin
69. Buddy Baer
70. Donovan (Razor) Ruddock

71. Jose Luis Ramirez
72. Tommy Gomez
73. Jose Napoles
74. Kid McCoy
75. Antonio Esparragoza
76. Ricardo Moreno
77. Evander Holyfield
78. Ike Williams
79. Luis Firpo
80. Ricardo Lopez
81. Humberto Gonzalez
82. Bobby Chacon
83. Jock McAvoy
84. Eduardo Lausse
85. Eder Jofre
86. Charley Burley
87. Mike McCallum
88. Salvador Sanchez
89. Roy Jones Jr.
90. Rodolfo Gonzalez
91. Nigel Benn
92. (Irish) Bob Murphy
93. Paul Berlenbach
94. Battling Torres
95. Chalky Wright
96. George (K.O.) Chaney
97. Andy Ganigan
98. Fred Fulton
99. Ingemar Johansson
100. Charley White


http://boxing.about.com/od/history/a/ring_punchers.htm

[ThatOne]

The hardest hitters in heavyweight history

Graham Houston is the American editor of Boxing Monthly and writes for FightWriter.com.

1 Mike Tyson
2 Sonny Liston
3 Joe Louis
4 George Foreman
5 Rocky Marciano
6 Earnie Shavers
7 Jack Dempsey
8 Joe Frazier
9 Lennox Lewis
10 Max Baer

http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/boxing ... id=3168817

[HomicideHenry]

Ring Magazine's 100 Greatest Punchers


1. Joe Louis
2. Sam Langford
3. Jimmy Wilde
4. Archie Moore
5. Sandy Saddler
6. Stanley Ketchell

7. Jack Dempsey
8. Bob Fitzsimmons
9. George Foreman
10. Earnie Shavers
11. Sugar Ray Robinson
12. Ruben Olivares
13. Wilfredo Gomez
14. Rocky Marciano
15. Sonny Liston
16. Mike Tyson
17. Bob Foster
18. Thomas Hearns
19. Khaosai Galaxy
20. Alexis Arguello
21. Carlos Zarate
22. Max Baer
23. Rocky Graziano
24. Matthew Saad Muhammad
25. Julian Jackson
26. Danny Lopez
27. Gerald McClellan
28. Roberto Duran
29. Rodrigo Valdez

30. Felix Trinidad
31. Pipino Cuevas
32. Jim Jefferies
33. Lennox Lewis
34. Bennie Briscoe
35. Marvin Hagler
36. Edwin Rosario
37. Tommy Ryan
38. John Mugabi
39. Joe Frazier
40. Carlos Monzon
41. Tony Zale
42. Michael Spinks
43. Joe Gans
44. Elmer Ray
45. George Godfrey
46. Naseem Hamed
47. Alfonso Zamora
48. David Tua
49. Cleveland Williams
50. Julio Cesar Chavez
51. Tiger Jack Fox
52. Joe Walcott
53. Gerry Cooney
54. Al (Bummy) Davis
55. Max Schmeling
56. Florentino Fernandez
57. Henry Armstrong
58. Bob Satterfield
59. Al Hostak
60. Jesus Pimentel
61. Eugene (Cyclone) Hart
62. Lew Jenkins
63. Harry Wills
64. Tom Sharkey
65. Terry McGovern
66. Jersey Joe Walcott
67. Kostya Tszyu
68. Leotis Martin
69. Buddy Baer
70. Donovan (Razor) Ruddock

71. Jose Luis Ramirez
72. Tommy Gomez
73. Jose Napoles
74. Kid McCoy
75. Antonio Esparragoza
76. Ricardo Moreno
77. Evander Holyfield
78. Ike Williams
79. Luis Firpo
80. Ricardo Lopez
81. Humberto Gonzalez
82. Bobby Chacon
83. Jock McAvoy
84. Eduardo Lausse
85. Eder Jofre
86. Charley Burley
87. Mike McCallum
88. Salvador Sanchez
89. Roy Jones Jr.
90. Rodolfo Gonzalez
91. Nigel Benn
92. (Irish) Bob Murphy
93. Paul Berlenbach
94. Battling Torres
95. Chalky Wright
96. George (K.O.) Chaney
97. Andy Ganigan
98. Fred Fulton
99. Ingemar Johansson
100. Charley White


http://boxing.about.com/od/history/a/ring_punchers.htm

I actually have this issue. But when I read the "one trick pony" part, I couldn't buy into it. Johansson, imo, was superior to weak chinned Fred Fulton, more effective than Firpo, certainly beat better men by kayo than Tommy Gomez, etc.

And btw, since when have we really held RING magazine to such regard? Only Nat Fleischer had any damn sense about himself, for ever since its become a rag sheet that's expensive and full of cheap puns. The only thing RING magazine has right is the RING title, that the best of each division must face eachother in order to get that damn belt. The way fighting ought to be, otherwise its crap.

[Syntax Error]

It's hard to measure for sure, but Tim Witherspoon had a beast of an overhand Right & Donavan Razor Ruddock also perfected an uppercut/hook hybrid Right hand that could fell trees. :P

[Controversial]

I'm hearing alot of crap about Patterson being a meaningless kayo win for Ingo, which I think is complete bullshit. A reporter once made a stab at Patterson saying 'You've went down more times than any other heavyweight champion in history', but Floyd shot back 'But I've also got up more times than any other heavyweight champion in history'. Of all the times Patterson got knocked down, I can only recall one or two men who ever kayoed him and that was Ingo and Liston; Ali won on a TKO in what was to be Patterson's last bout but that hardly qualifies.

Patterson may of had a shaky chin, but Machen sure as hell didn't, the man went the limit with Liston and others, only a few times did he ever eat canvas. Johansson's right hand, when landed flush was a weapon of mass destruction. Would I say it had the frightening power of Shaver's and Baer's right hands?

Probably not, but it wasn't too far behind. Baer's right hand haymaker's didn't always land, and Earnie had conditioning issues that were problematic throughout his career---Baer was sloppy, Earnie couldn't follow up big punch attacks alot of times when it really counted---so, imo, Johansson may not have had the single most powerful right hand, but his was more effective than Baer's and Shavers because his landed more often than their's did in fights that counted.

Johansson was a better fighter than Baer and Shavers, for Baer was wild and sloppy and engaged in alot of illegal tactics and Shavers was just limited---Johansson could actually fight, and make use of that right hand more so than either of those men put together.

At the end of the day Johansson's win over Patterson is comparable to Rahman knocking Lewis out. There seems to be lots of stuff being written about Ingo on this forum recently however lets get things into perspective. Ingo won against a fighter not known for having a great chin. He lost twice in the rematches. Did he get lucky, possibly, punchers sometimes do, Rahman being a classic example of what happens when a puncher lands cleanly.

Any puncher is dangerous and capable of beating better fighters with one shot. Thats boxing. Ingo, like Lewis beat everyone he fought however he didn't face the same levels of opposition and Lewis or Patterson.

Ingo was a dangerous puncher, not much more to say about him really. Plenty of fighters can claim that accolade.