Classic American West Coast Boxing

[THEHAMMER321]

Kiki thank you for the list,but I Have a question about some of the guys on the list for example the Ducuson brothers Maxie and Bernard,my father was from New Orleans and knew both of them so as long as you fought in California you could possibly qualify

[kikibalt]

Kiki thank you for the list,but I Have a question about some of the guys on the list for example the Ducuson brothers Maxie and Bernard,my father was from New Orleans and knew both of them so as long as you fought in California you could possibly qualify

Yes, you don't have to be from Calif. to qualify, our rules say that you had to have fought at least once in Calif. to qualify.

[telboy66]

Does a fighter have to be American to qualify if not how come ruby Bob never made the list

[kikibalt]

Does a fighter have to be American to qualify if not how come ruby Bob never made the list

Why?, because nobody brought his name up, and who would you mail the letter of induction to?, who would pick up his award at the luncheon?

[telboy66]

Does a fighter have to be American to qualify if not how come ruby Bob never made the list

Why?, because nobody brought his name up, and who would you mail the letter of induction to?, who would pick up his award at the luncheon?

I have an answer to the last part mate fly me over & I will be honored to pick it up on Bob's behalf

[kikibalt]

Does a fighter have to be American to qualify if not how come ruby Bob never made the list

Why?, because nobody brought his name up, and who would you mail the letter of induction to?, who would pick up his award at the luncheon?

I have an answer to the last part mate fly me over & I will be honored to pick it up on Bob's behalf

We don't fly anybody in and or put anybody up in hotels, you would have to come on your own dime...dude!

[bennie]

Walking the dogs in an old cemetery last Autumn. Here's the other dog.

[kikibalt]

Walking the dogs in an old cemetery last Autumn. Here's the other dog.

Great pics. Ben, thanks

[kikibalt]

Abel Fernandez on the right went on to have an acting career after his boxing days were over, you might remember him as part of "The Untouchable's" on TV.

Fernandez played Agent William Youngfellow

[scartissue]

Just read a Ring Magazine article on how Floyd Mayweather would have fared against 10 of the all-time great welterweights. And all I can say is, "Wow!" I didn't know Floyd was that good (please check the sarcasm). In this article they have Floyd losing a close 15 rounder to Sugar Ray Robinson, beating both Henry Armstrong and Kid Gavilan over 15, losing to Ray Leonard and Charley Burley over the same distance, stopping Jose Napoles in 14, beating Carmen Basilio and Emile Griffith over 15, getting himself stopped by Tommy Hearns in 13 and finally stopping Mickey Walker in 10. I sit here and think what these guys did at welterweight and compare it to all those fights Mayweather had at 147. Yep, all 5 of his fights (plus one at jr. middle but let's roll it in since he only weighed 150), 6 fights at welter and above. In that many fights they were able to determine this outcome. They do mention those 6 fights but do not mention who he fought. So let's do it now since the writer went into great detail about his opponents. Floyd won a decision over 34 year old DeLaHoya who hadn't fought in a year. He beat 2 - 35 year olds in Sharmba Mitchell and Carlos Baldomir. He beat jr. welterweight Ricky Hatton. He beat the great Zab Judah who had just lost to the equally great Carlos Baldomir. And finally, 36 year old blown up featherweight Juan Manuel Marquez. A brilliant resume when comparing to the all-time greats.

Scartissue

[kikibalt]

Just read a Ring Magazine article on how Floyd Mayweather would have fared against 10 of the all-time great welterweights. And all I can say is, "Wow!" I didn't know Floyd was that good (please check the sarcasm). In this article they have Floyd losing a close 15 rounder to Sugar Ray Robinson, beating both Henry Armstrong and Kid Gavilan over 15, losing to Ray Leonard and Charley Burley over the same distance, stopping Jose Napoles in 14, beating Carmen Basilio and Emile Griffith over 15, getting himself stopped by Tommy Hearns in 13 and finally stopping Mickey Walker in 10. I sit here and think what these guys did at welterweight and compare it to all those fights Mayweather had at 147. Yep, all 5 of his fights (plus one at jr. middle but let's roll it in since he only weighed 150), 6 fights at welter and above. In that many fights they were able to determine this outcome. They do mention those 6 fights but do not mention who he fought. So let's do it now since the writer went into great detail about his opponents. Floyd won a decision over 34 year old DeLaHoya who hadn't fought in a year. He beat 2 - 35 year olds in Sharmba Mitchell and Carlos Baldomir. He beat jr. welterweight Ricky Hatton. He beat the great Zab Judah who had just lost to the equally great Carlos Baldomir. And finally, 36 year old blown up featherweight Juan Manuel Marquez. A brilliant resume when comparing to the all-time greats.

Scartissue

All I can do after reading this is

[Rick Farris]

Abel Fernandez

birth date 1930-07-14
division light heavyweight
nationality United States
Los Angeles, California, United States
birth place Los Angeles, CA
won 12 (KO 6) + lost 11 (KO 3) + drawn 1 = 24
rounds boxed 143 KO% 25



1953-03-17 196 Leonard Morrow 192 25-7-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L TKO 8 10
~ time: 2:52 | 34-33 ~
Morrow was knocked down in the 2nd for a five-count, and again in the 3rd round. According to the Los Angeles Times, a blow to Fernandez's Adam's apple, left him unable to continue.

1953-01-27 190½ Freddie Beshore 196 33-14-1
Auditorium, Portland, Oregon, United States L UD 10 10
~ referee: Ralph Gruman | judge: Eddie Volk | judge: Freddie Steele ~

1953-01-06 195 Sonny Andrews 179 12-5-0
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W UD 10 10
~ referee: Joe Stone 56½-53½ | judge: Jack McDonald 58-52 | judge: Lee Grossman 57-53 ~
Andrews was knocked down once in the 1st and 2nd round.

1952-10-21 194 Freddie Beshore 196½ 31-14-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L UD 10 10
~ referee: Joe Stone 52-57 | judge: Frankie Van 52-57 | judge: Dynamite Jackson 52-57 ~

1952-09-20 194 Jack Nelson 185 20-3-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L UD 10 10
~ referee: Joe Stone 52½-57½ | judge: Dynamite Jackson 52½-57½ | judge: Frank Holborow 53½-56½ ~
Nelson was knocked down for a nine-count in the 4th round.

1952-07-05 183 John McFalls 183 11-1-3
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 10 10
~ time: 1:25 | referee: Joe Stone ~
According to the Los Angeles Times, McFalls was knocked down in the 2nd, Fernandez was knocked down in the 4th round, in the 10th Fernandez behind on the scorecards, knocked McFalls down for an eight-count with a right hand. The referee stopped it as McFalls rose.

1952-04-26 187 Babe Edwards 186½ 30-12-5
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W UD 10 10
~ referee: Abe Roth 59-51 | judge: Dynamite Jackson 56½-53½ | judge: Frank Holborow 56-54 ~

1952-04-05 175 Tommy Harrison 172 13-5-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L UD 12 12
~ referee: Abe Roth 63½-68½ | judge: Tommy Herman 61-71 | judge: Tommy Hart 62½-69½ ~
~ vacant USA California State light heavyweight title ~

1952-03-18 182 Eddie Cotton 171 16-5-1
Seattle, Washington, United States L KO 4 10
~ time: 2:10 ~

1952-01-29 180 Sammy Saunders 175¼ 2-1-3
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W TKO 5 6
Fernandez came back from a 2nd round knockdown, to floor Saunders in the 5th round.

1951-12-11 180¼ Tommy Harrison 171 11-3-0
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W KO 2 6
Harrison was knocked down once in both the 1st and 2nd round.

1951-11-23 179 Tommy Harrison 172½ 10-3-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L PTS 6 6
Fernandez was knocked down for a nine-count in the 3rd round.

1951-10-30 176 Bob Couch 170½ 1-1-0
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W PTS 4 4
1951-10-23 177¼ Mike Angustain 165½ 17-5-5
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L UD 6 6
1951-10-12 177 Bob Couch 171 1-0-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W PTS 4 4
1951-09-28 175 Walter Landry 170 5-2-1
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 2 4
1950-12-19 174½ Watson Jones 173¾ 41-29-8
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L KO 4 6
1950-07-11 175 Lonnie Malone 170 14-1-3
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L PTS 6 6
Malone was knocked down in the 3rd round.

1950-06-06 175 Lonnie Malone 171 12-1-3
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L PTS 4 4
1950-05-16 175 Lonnie Malone 171 11-1-2
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States D PTS 4 4
1950-05-12 174¾ Monte Clark 174½ 3-5-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 3 4
Clark was knocked down twice.

1950-05-05 175½ Joe Cardenas 168 9-5-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 1 4
1950-04-25 174 Al Hernandez 165 11-22-5
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W UD 4 4
Hernandez was knocked down in the 2nd round.

1950-04-18 173½ Al Hernandez 163½ 11-21-5
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W PTS 4 4
Pro debut for Fernandez, according to the Los Angeles Times

[Rick Farris]

Looks like Abel Fernandez was matched by Hap Navarro at the Hollywood Legion.


-Rick Farris

[Rick Farris]

Kiki thank you for the list,but I Have a question about some of the guys on the list for example the Ducuson brothers Maxie and Bernard,my father was from New Orleans and knew both of them so as long as you fought in California you could possibly qualify

Yes, you don't have to be from Calif. to qualify, our rules say that you had to have fought at least once in Calif. to qualify.

Hammer . . . You might be interested to know that I have nominated Bernard Docusen for induction into the WBHOF this year.

[raylawpc]

Does a fighter have to be American to qualify if not how come ruby Bob never made the list

Why?, because nobody brought his name up, and who would you mail the letter of induction to?, who would pick up his award at the luncheon?

He has a great-great nephew in New Zealand who follows Fitz' career and has an extensive collection of Fitz memorabilia. His name is David Jack. You could send the induction letter to him. I have met him and correspond with him occasionally. If you want to induct Fitz, I'll supply you with David's personal mailing address. If you do it this year, I might come out and accept it for Fitz on David's behalf if David can't come in from New Zealand.

Fitz would be a worthy addition to the CBHOF since he began his American career in California after arriving from Australia. Fitz also won the world light-heavyweight title in San Francisco against George Gardiner in 1903.

[kikibalt]

Does a fighter have to be American to qualify if not how come ruby Bob never made the list

Why?, because nobody brought his name up, and who would you mail the letter of induction to?, who would pick up his award at the luncheon?

He has a great-great nephew in New Zealand who follows Fitz' career and has an extensive collection of Fitz memorabilia. His name is David Jack. You could send the induction letter to him. I have met him and correspond with him occasionally. If you want to induct Fitz, I'll supply you with David's personal mailing address. If you do it this year, I might come out and accept it for Fitz on David's behalf if David can't come in from New Zealand.

Fitz would be a worthy addition to the CBHOF since he began his American career in California after arriving from California. Fitz also won the world light-heavyweight title in San Francisco against George Gardiner in 1903.

Its really to late for Fitz for this year, we're pretty much settle on our inductees for 2010.

Btw Tom, what's the deal with O'Grady, did you talk to him?

[telboy66]

Does a fighter have to be American to qualify if not how come ruby Bob never made the list

Why?, because nobody brought his name up, and who would you mail the letter of induction to?, who would pick up his award at the luncheon?

He has a great-great nephew in New Zealand who follows Fitz' career and has an extensive collection of Fitz memorabilia. His name is David Jack. You could send the induction letter to him. I have met him and correspond with him occasionally. If you want to induct Fitz, I'll supply you with David's personal mailing address. If you do it this year, I might come out and accept it for Fitz on David's behalf if David can't come in from New Zealand.

Fitz would be a worthy addition to the CBHOF since he began his American career in California after arriving from California. Fitz also won the world light-heavyweight title in San Francisco against George Gardiner in 1903.

Well done mate Fitz of all boxers should be in there & if you could collect his award it will save me going into bankruptcy to get there

[Rick Farris]

Just read a Ring Magazine article on how Floyd Mayweather would have fared against 10 of the all-time great welterweights. And all I can say is, "Wow!" I didn't know Floyd was that good (please check the sarcasm). In this article they have Floyd losing a close 15 rounder to Sugar Ray Robinson, beating both Henry Armstrong and Kid Gavilan over 15, losing to Ray Leonard and Charley Burley over the same distance, stopping Jose Napoles in 14, beating Carmen Basilio and Emile Griffith over 15, getting himself stopped by Tommy Hearns in 13 and finally stopping Mickey Walker in 10. I sit here and think what these guys did at welterweight and compare it to all those fights Mayweather had at 147. Yep, all 5 of his fights (plus one at jr. middle but let's roll it in since he only weighed 150), 6 fights at welter and above. In that many fights they were able to determine this outcome. They do mention those 6 fights but do not mention who he fought. So let's do it now since the writer went into great detail about his opponents. Floyd won a decision over 34 year old DeLaHoya who hadn't fought in a year. He beat 2 - 35 year olds in Sharmba Mitchell and Carlos Baldomir. He beat jr. welterweight Ricky Hatton. He beat the great Zab Judah who had just lost to the equally great Carlos Baldomir. And finally, 36 year old blown up featherweight Juan Manuel Marquez. A brilliant resume when comparing to the all-time greats.

Scartissue

Scar . . . The part about him "stopping" Mickey Walker in ten?
The rest is equally stupid, but I'm curious what they think Floyd would stop Mickey with?

[Rick Farris]

Why?, because nobody brought his name up, and who would you mail the letter of induction to?, who would pick up his award at the luncheon?

He has a great-great nephew in New Zealand who follows Fitz' career and has an extensive collection of Fitz memorabilia. His name is David Jack. You could send the induction letter to him. I have met him and correspond with him occasionally. If you want to induct Fitz, I'll supply you with David's personal mailing address. If you do it this year, I might come out and accept it for Fitz on David's behalf if David can't come in from New Zealand.

Fitz would be a worthy addition to the CBHOF since he began his American career in California after arriving from California. Fitz also won the world light-heavyweight title in San Francisco against George Gardiner in 1903.

Well done mate Fitz of all boxers should be in there & if you could collect his award it will save me going into bankruptcy to get there

I think tellboy has come up with a great idea. Tom's idea compliments it. I think Fitz should be in the CBHOF.
Too bad it's too late this year. He's already in the WBHOF and the IBHOF.

[kikibalt]

He has a great-great nephew in New Zealand who follows Fitz' career and has an extensive collection of Fitz memorabilia. His name is David Jack. You could send the induction letter to him. I have met him and correspond with him occasionally. If you want to induct Fitz, I'll supply you with David's personal mailing address. If you do it this year, I might come out and accept it for Fitz on David's behalf if David can't come in from New Zealand.

Fitz would be a worthy addition to the CBHOF since he began his American career in California after arriving from California. Fitz also won the world light-heavyweight title in San Francisco against George Gardiner in 1903.

Well done mate Fitz of all boxers should be in there & if you could collect his award it will save me going into bankruptcy to get there

I think tellboy has come up with a great idea. Tom's idea compliments it. I think Fitz should be in the CBHOF.

Maybe next year, we'll see...

[kikibalt]

Los Angeles in the glory days of boxing...1951



1951: Looking west. The structure with the spire is the Richfield Building, and just to the right of it is steelwork for the new Statler Hotel, now the Wilshire Grand.



1951: Looking toward Hollywood. The four-level interchange, with the new Hollywood Freeway leading away from it, can be seen. The large building in the background at left center is Queen of Angels Hospital. The Hollywood sign is on the hill at center background.

[kikibalt]

Spent two day at the "Hall"



1951: Looking north. The building in the foreground is the Hall of Justice. Chinatown is at right.

[georgem]

Just awesome pictures Kiki........thank you so much! Great memories.......

[Rick Farris]

Los Angeles in the glory days of boxing...1951



1951: Looking west. The structure with the spire is the Richfield Building, and just to the right of it is steelwork for the new Statler Hotel, now the Wilshire Grand.



1951: Looking toward Hollywood. The four-level interchange, with the new Hollywood Freeway leading away from it, can be seen. The large building in the background at left center is Queen of Angels Hospital. The Hollywood sign is on the hill at center background.

L.A. ...

Frank . . . I love these photos, and I remember L.A. like that when I was a very small kid. I remember that Angelino Heights area near the 4-level interchange. How it was once wealthy at the turn of the century. It was on it's way out when this photo was taken. It fell into a darkness in the last half of century. That area across the 110 Fwy. from Angel's Flight. Where homes had been torn down, foundations remained, gangs came in, a homeless community took over those vacant blocks. Drugs and drug dealing within the homeless enclave. However, the new century changed things. The area has been redeveloped, a new high school in the neighborhood. Prime real estate wasted for years. Downtown was usually deserted at night and on weekends, nobody but transients resided downtown, in flop house hotels, on the streets. When the sun went down on Skid Row, things came to life. The night always yielded a dead body or two, often times more. OD's, knives and firearms the norm. We saw it for years as we worked daily in places like the Main Street Gym, etc. However, as yuppies moved in and began to revitalize the old office buildings, transforming them into high end lofts, the area east of Alameda is now an Arts community. People live downtown, there is a night life again for the first time in decades. I stand in front of what was once the Main Street Gym and don't recognize what I see across the street, or down the street, in either direction. "There's the Rosslyn", an early 20th Century Hotel/Landmark that was a roach infested flop house when I began coming to the area in the mid-60's. Today the Rosslyn is still a dump, as are most the hotels. The Alexandria is a regular film industry shooting location, so I have set lights or laid cable thruout nearly every inch of the structure during the past 30 years. It's a rat hole today. In the 60's when I trained and fought in the Alexandria, it was in pretty bad shape. They refurbished it in 1970-71, which forced Parnassus to move his office to the Elks Club. It is today a residence hotel, pretty nasty in some of those rooms.
Thanks for the photos, FRank.


-Rick Farris

[raylawpc]

Why?, because nobody brought his name up, and who would you mail the letter of induction to?, who would pick up his award at the luncheon?

He has a great-great nephew in New Zealand who follows Fitz' career and has an extensive collection of Fitz memorabilia. His name is David Jack. You could send the induction letter to him. I have met him and correspond with him occasionally. If you want to induct Fitz, I'll supply you with David's personal mailing address. If you do it this year, I might come out and accept it for Fitz on David's behalf if David can't come in from New Zealand.

Fitz would be a worthy addition to the CBHOF since he began his American career in California after arriving from California. Fitz also won the world light-heavyweight title in San Francisco against George Gardiner in 1903.

Its really to late for Fitz for this year, we're pretty much settle on our inductees for 2010.

Btw Tom, what's the deal with O'Grady, did you talk to him?

I emailed him but he hasn't e-mailed me back yet. I'll call him next week.