KOTV

[THEBUTCH]

Does anyone watch KOTV on channel 4 ?

On the last show they showed highlights of Manny Pacquiao's last fight. He looked absolutely awesome. He literally lifted his opponent off of his feet with his finishing punch.

Would anyone fancy any of our leading three leading featherweights Scott Harrison, Michael Brodie and Nicky Cook to give Manny an argument ?

[Old bones Ian]

I wouldn't rate Cook's chances that highly, hasn't got the punch or skill to hold him off.
Brodie might push him a little, if he can get through the first few rounds, big if. i would still pick him to be stopped
Harrison has the best chance, but needs to work on his mobility, and head movement.

all in all, no i don't think any of them could beat Pacman

[nickd]

Pac would hammer Harrison to pieces.

[jamesmcdonnell]

Does anyone watch KOTV on channel 4 ?

On the last show they showed highlights of Manny Pacquiao's last fight. He looked absolutely awesome. He literally lifted his opponent off of his feet with his finishing punch.

Would anyone fancy any of our leading three leading featherweights Scott Harrison, Michael Brodie and Nicky Cook to give Manny an argument ?

Not a chance in hell, Pacquaio is too fast and hits way too hard. Harrison would be a sitting duck, Brodie might last a while by staying on the back foot, and cook is way too inexperienced to deal with a murdered like Pacquaio.

Marquez is superior to all three, and look how Manny ambushed him. Marquez had the skills to survive and turn the fight around, none of our fighters do.

[KOJOE90]

Does anyone watch KOTV on channel 4 ?

Yes, I often forget to tape it but I remembered this week. Really enjoyed the interview with Marvelous Marvin Hagler. Can't believe he is now 50!!! the bloke looks great and still looks as hard as nails.

It's always good to see a former great fighter looking so happy and healthy.

[jamesmcdonnell]

He looks very different to how he did in his fighting days, but unlike many former fighters, hasn't blown up like a baloon.

I remember when someone asked him regarding the current middleweight champions (before Hopkins unified the belts), who was the real champion. Without a moment's hesitation Hagler replied.

"I am..."

When Dempsey started asking him who he really thought, Hagler was all over it, and made it quite clear that he was still champ, 'because as far as I am concerned, I never lost it in the ring.'

It was clear that despite all the intervening years, Marvin still hadn't completely buried the pain of that loss, and the fact that he never got a rematch from a Ray Leonard who realised he would not be able to pull the same trick a second time.

I always hated Leonard because of that. He basically told Hagler he would only give him a rematch, if he admitted he lost the previous fight fair and square, knowing full well Hagler would never concede defeat.

Whilst Leonard is an all time great fighter, he sure was shrewd in picking opponents. He knew damned well Duran was partying hard when he offered him the return fight, and said that if Duran didn't accept terms, he wouldn't bother fighting him at all, and there was nowhere else Duran could get that sort of payday.

[KOJOE90]

He looks very different to how he did in his fighting days, but unlike many former fighters, hasn't blown up like a baloon.

I remember when someone asked him regarding the current middleweight champions (before Hopkins unified the belts), who was the real champion. Without a moment's hesitation Hagler replied.

"I am..."

When Dempsey started asking him who he really thought, Hagler was all over it, and made it quite clear that he was still champ, 'because as far as I am concerned, I never lost it in the ring.'

It was clear that despite all the intervening years, Marvin still hadn't completely buried the pain of that loss, and the fact that he never got a rematch from a Ray Leonard who realised he would not be able to pull the same trick a second time.

I always hated Leonard because of that. He basically told Hagler he would only give him a rematch, if he admitted he lost the previous fight fair and square, knowing full well Hagler would never concede defeat.

Whilst Leonard is an all time great fighter, he sure was shrewd in picking opponents. He knew damned well Duran was partying hard when he offered him the return fight, and said that if Duran didn't accept terms, he wouldn't bother fighting him at all, and there was nowhere else Duran could get that sort of payday.

Leonard also managed to convince Lalonde a full blown Light-Heavyweight to come down to 168lbs. A very clever move on Leonards part.

I could never understand how Leonard managed to pick up the 175lbs title in that fight as well as the 168lbs. How can a fight at the then new Super-Middleweight limit end in the winner also being a Light-Heavyweight Champion as well?

Taking that logic if Tyson had starved himself down to below 8 stone and took a beating and lost to Ricardo Lopez would Lopez be declared Heavyweight Champion of the World? It just doesn't make much sense to me.

[stujones]

With Vince McMahon has promoter anything could have happend, he makes Don King look like Jesus if half the rumours about his business are true.

As for Leonard vs Hagler, I watched this fight for about the 100th time the other day and Hagler clearly says there that he probably going to retire because he thought he was jobbed. So I don't know if Leonard refused a rematch - I know Hagler was still ranked in Ring and KO into 1988 because he didn't formally retire untill that year (infact, I think he might have still held a version of the title).

However, I'm not sure if there was ever negotiations between Leonard and Hagler again, Bob Arum said that his immediate plan was for Leonard vs Hearns II and for Hagler to fight the winner.

[THEBUTCH]

Yes indeed KOJOE90, Haglar still looked in fanstastic shape.


Out of our three top featherweight contenders, despite his lack of top level experience I wouldn't be surprised to see Cook last the longest and give Manny the stiffest test.

Ok, Cook is badly neglecting his jab lately, but I feel his youth and hunger would keep him in the bout longer than the other two.

But i agree with the general opinion that Manny would beat the lot of them.

[J]

its cooks hands that are the problem I think, he busts em up everytime he fights.

[jamesmcdonnell]

He looks very different to how he did in his fighting days, but unlike many former fighters, hasn't blown up like a baloon.

I remember when someone asked him regarding the current middleweight champions (before Hopkins unified the belts), who was the real champion. Without a moment's hesitation Hagler replied.

"I am..."

When Dempsey started asking him who he really thought, Hagler was all over it, and made it quite clear that he was still champ, 'because as far as I am concerned, I never lost it in the ring.'

It was clear that despite all the intervening years, Marvin still hadn't completely buried the pain of that loss, and the fact that he never got a rematch from a Ray Leonard who realised he would not be able to pull the same trick a second time.

I always hated Leonard because of that. He basically told Hagler he would only give him a rematch, if he admitted he lost the previous fight fair and square, knowing full well Hagler would never concede defeat.

Whilst Leonard is an all time great fighter, he sure was shrewd in picking opponents. He knew damned well Duran was partying hard when he offered him the return fight, and said that if Duran didn't accept terms, he wouldn't bother fighting him at all, and there was nowhere else Duran could get that sort of payday.

Leonard also managed to convince Lalonde a full blown Light-Heavyweight to come down to 168lbs. A very clever move on Leonards part.

I could never understand how Leonard managed to pick up the 175lbs title in that fight as well as the 168lbs. How can a fight at the then new Super-Middleweight limit end in the winner also being a Light-Heavyweight Champion as well?

Taking that logic if Tyson had starved himself down to below 8 stone and took a beating and lost to Ricardo Lopez would Lopez be declared Heavyweight Champion of the World? It just doesn't make much sense to me.

Lalonde bascially agreed to come in at a weight amenable to Leonard, whilst still putting his belt on the line, and the 168lb title was created for that occasion, a perfect example of the greed of the sanctioning bodies. Was still a pretty good performance from Leonard though, got off the deck to give Lalonde a pasting.

Leonard sure was a shyster, he changed the sport of boxing really. He was the first one to make title hopping popular.

[Old bones Ian]

Henry Armstrong hopped between titles alot.
But i agree in the modern times, Leonard was the one who wanted to keep jumping weights, I remember it was a race between him and Hearns who could get 5 different wieghts first

[KOJOE90]

Donny Lalonde a few days before he fought Leonard.

"I'm not just fighting an old Welterweight, I'm fighting a fat old Welterweight".

[Old bones Ian]

LaLonde ended up getting a brutal KO loss.

LaLonde was a nice guy as well, if my memory serves me right he was badly abused as a kid , and used to do alot of work to highlight child abuse, he certainly earned his payoff for the leonard fight.

he also had major surgery on one of his shoulders , so that gave him a limited use of that arm, can't remember if it was the left or right, Leonard certainly picked his oponents well

[KOJOE90]

he also had major surgery on one of his shoulders , so that gave him a limited use of that arm, can't remember if it was the left or right, Leonard certainly picked his oponents well

I think that was due to an ice-hockey injury, if I recall correctly.

[lirva33]

Brodie has the best chance of beating Pacman of all the british fighters IMO.

i like pacman late, but brodie can outbox him.

[MightyWarrior]

On again tonight BTW.

[THEBUTCH]

19/05/2005

KOTV - 3.20am Channel

KOTV Classics - 3.50am Channel 4