Vinny Mitchell??

[Deserter]

I think as long as Mitchell follows the same template against Katsidis i.e. doesn't get drawn into a brawl and uses his boxing skills, I can see him winning the fight quite comfortably. Haven't had a chance to watch Saturday's fight yet (going to check it out on Youtube tonight), but if, as it seems, he's packing a punch up at lightweight, I could even see him stopping Katsidis late.

I mentioned on an another thread that Mitchell could do with a good test before stepping in with Katsidis. Did you see Katsidis fight with Vicente Escobedo? Katsidis just walked through everything Escobedo threw and outmuscled and outworked him. I'd like Mitchell to have a good test against a faded pressure fighter (Jesus Chavez would fit the bill perfectly) before stepping in with Katsidis. Right now I tend to agree with whicker that Mitchell is somewhat an unknown quantity with regards to being world-class (I mean Khan fight aside what has Prescott done aside lose to a journeyman?) but I believe he may be world-class. A win against Katsidis would prove it.

Good post. I haven't seen the Katsidis fight with Escobedo and I must admit part of me envisioning a Mitchell win is because I'd thought Kadsidis had already peaked and with his type of style the decline can be quite rapid. It's also why I made the point about Mitchell carrying a decent dig at lightweight as that could hopefully act as a deterrent to Kadsidis attempting to wade through him.

[reggaereggae]

Vinny is very chinny unfortunately. He should really look for another career. He's not even a poor man's matthew Hatton....

How? Thats the first time he's been beat, he's been put down once before Sat night and got up to win, anyone who's "very chinny" wouldn't be getting up at all and even Sat night he was on his feet when the fight was stopped. You get hit correctly had your not fully prepared theres a good chance your going over, its those who dont/cant get up that are more likely to be "very chinny"

The modest punching Akaash Bhatia put him out in the first round in the ABAs

[mickey1975]

Whatever people say about Kotelnik,he was proven world class.

[Des1]

Whicker says that Khan is borderline World class, if thats the case how can he say that Mitchell is way off World class? Khan has not boxed anyone more capable than what Mitchell has. Whicker does not justify his statement

I say Mitchell is way off world class (as explained above) because he hasn't fought any opponents even close to world class level.

I justify this by looking at the level of opposition Mitchell has fought.

You introduced the comparison with Khan, which was unnecessary.

As for "Khan has not boxed anyone more capable than what Mitchell has"- Well, Salita WAS an unbeaten prospect- not world class, no, but a decent unbeaten fighter none the less. Kotelnik is significantly better than anyone Mitchell has faced, as is Marco Antonio Barrera.

Like I said earlier , thre comparison with Khan is not unnecessary as Im sure it will be compared in any build up if the two are to meet, and like I also said earlier people will always compare Khans fight v Prescott and Mitchells fight v Precott so again I ask you : Please tell me why it is unnecessary to introduce the comparison with Khan as you have failed to answer mer from when I asked before? Also Vasquez is no journeyman.

[whicker]

Whicker says that Khan is borderline World class, if thats the case how can he say that Mitchell is way off World class? Khan has not boxed anyone more capable than what Mitchell has. Whicker does not justify his statement

I say Mitchell is way off world class (as explained above) because he hasn't fought any opponents even close to world class level.

I justify this by looking at the level of opposition Mitchell has fought.

You introduced the comparison with Khan, which was unnecessary.

As for "Khan has not boxed anyone more capable than what Mitchell has"- Well, Salita WAS an unbeaten prospect- not world class, no, but a decent unbeaten fighter none the less. Kotelnik is significantly better than anyone Mitchell has faced, as is Marco Antonio Barrera.

Like I said earlier , thre comparison with Khan is not unnecessary as Im sure it will be compared in any build up if the two are to meet, and like I also said earlier people will always compare Khans fight v Prescott and Mitchells fight v Precott so again I ask you : Please tell me why it is unnecessary to introduce the comparison with Khan as you have failed to answer mer from when I asked before? Also Vasquez is no journeyman.

My point was that Mitchell hasn't yet fought anyone close to true world class level, and as such can't be considered world class level himself, in my opinion.

"Is Mitchell better than Khan" is a totally valid topic, but wasn't of relevance to my point. IE, it's a different discussion. More to the point, they will never fight, so it's always going to by hypothetical.

[Des1]

Vinny is very chinny unfortunately. He should really look for another career. He's not even a poor man's matthew Hatton....

How? Thats the first time he's been beat, he's been put down once before Sat night and got up to win, anyone who's "very chinny" wouldn't be getting up at all and even Sat night he was on his feet when the fight was stopped. You get hit correctly had your not fully prepared theres a good chance your going over, its those who dont/cant get up that are more likely to be "very chinny"

The modest punching Akaash Bhatia put him out in the first round in the ABAs

Come on! He was 17 at the time, a kid ! Bhatia was a man in his 20's How can you use that as a comparison??.

[Des1]

I say Mitchell is way off world class (as explained above) because he hasn't fought any opponents even close to world class level.

I justify this by looking at the level of opposition Mitchell has fought.

You introduced the comparison with Khan, which was unnecessary.

As for "Khan has not boxed anyone more capable than what Mitchell has"- Well, Salita WAS an unbeaten prospect- not world class, no, but a decent unbeaten fighter none the less. Kotelnik is significantly better than anyone Mitchell has faced, as is Marco Antonio Barrera.

Like I said earlier , thre comparison with Khan is not unnecessary as Im sure it will be compared in any build up if the two are to meet, and like I also said earlier people will always compare Khans fight v Prescott and Mitchells fight v Precott so again I ask you : Please tell me why it is unnecessary to introduce the comparison with Khan as you have failed to answer mer from when I asked before? Also Vasquez is no journeyman.

My point was that Mitchell hasn't yet fought anyone close to true world class level, and as such can't be considered world class level himself, in my opinion.

"Is Mitchell better than Khan" is a totally valid topic, but wasn't of relevance to my point. IE, it's a different discussion. More to the point, they will never fight, so it's always going to by hypothetical.

The old Barrera isn't World class anymore, that is obvious. Look who beat Ali in his final days, would you really say they beat a 'great'? And Kolelnik although decent, def would not have been a 'World champ' in a different time. There is no denying he was the weaker of the Champions Khan hasn't proved no more than Mitchell to belong in World class.

[leforge]

Vinny Mitchell could get to British title level if he is managed very well but no further than that.

[mickey1975]

Vinny Mitchell could get to British title level if he is managed very well but no further than that.

Its often said on here "could get to British title level" as if its some sort of consolation for boxers who dont quite make it.The truth is,in most divisions(feather and above) even getting a shot is a brilliant achievement.The Lonsdale belt is the pinnacle for the lucky few who are good enough to win it.
By the way,whoever manages Vinny,i cant see him getting to Enghlish title level.Have you seen the top ten?

[leforge]

Vinny Mitchell could get to British title level if he is managed very well but no further than that.

Its often said on here "could get to British title level" as if its some sort of consolation for boxers who dont quite make it.The truth is,in most divisions(feather and above) even getting a shot is a brilliant achievement.The Lonsdale belt is the pinnacle for the lucky few who are good enough to win it.
By the way,whoever manages Vinny,i cant see him getting to Enghlish title level.Have you seen the top ten?

Yes he not top 15 in his division but I think he be managed very carefully now.

[mickey1975]

Vinny Mitchell could get to British title level if he is managed very well but no further than that.

Its often said on here "could get to British title level" as if its some sort of consolation for boxers who dont quite make it.The truth is,in most divisions(feather and above) even getting a shot is a brilliant achievement.The Lonsdale belt is the pinnacle for the lucky few who are good enough to win it.
By the way,whoever manages Vinny,i cant see him getting to Enghlish title level.Have you seen the top ten?

Yes he not top 15 in his division but I think he be managed very carefully now.

Look at that 15 though.I just dont see a way through from him.His manager cant fight them for him...

[leforge]

He could wait for his chance in a few years time.

[TerribleTerry]

Vinny Mitchell could get to British title level if he is managed very well but no further than that.

Its often said on here "could get to British title level" as if its some sort of consolation for boxers who dont quite make it.The truth is,in most divisions(feather and above) even getting a shot is a brilliant achievement.The Lonsdale belt is the pinnacle for the lucky few who are good enough to win it.
By the way,whoever manages Vinny,i cant see him getting to Enghlish title level.Have you seen the top ten?

Good point Mickey.
Being national champion in a country with the breadth and depth of talent that traditionally Britain has, is a great achievement in its own right.

[whicker]

By the way,whoever manages Vinny,i cant see him getting to Enghlish title level.Have you seen the top ten?

cough cough--- Commonwealth route...

There could always be a "mystery African" round the corner...

[leforge]

By the way,whoever manages Vinny,i cant see him getting to Enghlish title level.Have you seen the top ten?

cough cough--- Commonwealth route...

There could always be a "mystery African" round the corner...

Or the WBU. Or a inter continental title they making a comeback recently.

[reggaereggae]

How? Thats the first time he's been beat, he's been put down once before Sat night and got up to win, anyone who's "very chinny" wouldn't be getting up at all and even Sat night he was on his feet when the fight was stopped. You get hit correctly had your not fully prepared theres a good chance your going over, its those who dont/cant get up that are more likely to be "very chinny"

The modest punching Akaash Bhatia put him out in the first round in the ABAs

Come on! He was 17 at the time, a kid ! Bhatia was a man in his 20's How can you use that as a comparison??.

You're clearly dreaming. Vinny would be lucky to be southern area champion. he's chinny and not that talented.

Unlike Kevin whose chin is granite and has a future (I think) at world class. Sorry but he doesn't cut the mustard just because he's Kevin's brother.

[rhino222]

Vinny Mitchell could get to British title level if he is managed very well but no further than that.

no chance, you cant manage a chin like that.

[SOUTHPAW]

Lets not forget the hero of the hour JON BAGULEY

[boxing12]

oh please you people make me laugh how can you call being beaten once in his pro career out of 12 fights chinny go learn something bout boxing. any one on here who does know about boxing will know how much guts it takes for any boxer to get in the ring so why sit here putting fighters down all the time. plenty of boxers have been beat and come back from it so i think you all need to calm down abit. yea vinny has boxed a few people twice but that aint his fault it aint any boxers fault when that happens its the management so why use that as another reason to slate people they just take the fights they are given . any one who has seen vinny since an amatuer will know he is talented but is still growing into a man he is only 22 remember and has also improved alot since changing trainers and it also does not help having to go through the nerves of watching your older brother boxing for a world title decider just a little while before you then being thrown on at 11 at night thats draining in its self surely. I also think its unfair that people compare him to his brother all the time as they are 2 different people.

[Deserter]

oh please you people make me laugh how can you call being beaten once in his pro career out of 12 fights chinny go learn something bout boxing.

Fella, you make some fair points later on but do yourself no favours with this type of comment. It's perfectly reasonable to question his durability given:
1) This defeat and the nature of the opponent
2) His defeat in the amateurs
3) The way he's been matched in his career to date

Now before you label me a 'hater', you should look earlier in the thread and see that I've said it's too premature to write him off. However, equally, accusing people of knowing nothing about boxing just because they raise valid questions is just immature and showing your own bias.

[boxing12]

////////////////

This is not bias as i do not know him personally I am trying to point out that there is no good reaon to be calling this boy a bad boxer over 1 loss when he got beat in the amateurs he was a boy boxing a man so how does this even come into the conversation. if its immature then so be it. as for how he has been matched if you take time to look back he has boxed fighters on his 6th fight that the likes of some other boxers including kevin mitchell were not given quite a bit later in their careers. I am not here to row with anyone i just feel it is being over reacted he was not knocked out he was still on his feet when the fight was stopped and completely fine and word of mouth is that he was unwell before the fight so maybey that had something to do with it and the sudden loss of energy as he was winning every round before that.

[Des1]

oh please you people make me laugh how can you call being beaten once in his pro career out of 12 fights chinny go learn something bout boxing. any one on here who does know about boxing will know how much guts it takes for any boxer to get in the ring so why sit here putting fighters down all the time. plenty of boxers have been beat and come back from it so i think you all need to calm down abit. yea vinny has boxed a few people twice but that aint his fault it aint any boxers fault when that happens its the management so why use that as another reason to slate people they just take the fights they are given . any one who has seen vinny since an amatuer will know he is talented but is still growing into a man he is only 22 remember and has also improved alot since changing trainers and it also does not help having to go through the nerves of watching your older brother boxing for a world title decider just a little while before you then being thrown on at 11 at night thats draining in its self surely. I also think its unfair that people compare him to his brother all the time as they are 2 different people.

Exactly, well said

[Des1]

The modest punching Akaash Bhatia put him out in the first round in the ABAs

Come on! He was 17 at the time, a kid ! Bhatia was a man in his 20's How can you use that as a comparison??.

You're clearly dreaming. Vinny would be lucky to be southern area champion. he's chinny and not that talented.

Unlike Kevin whose chin is granite and has a future (I think) at world class. Sorry but he doesn't cut the mustard just because he's Kevin's brother.

But you haven't acknowledged what I said.... Dont you agree that you cant go by a kid of 17 being stopped by a man in his 20's?..... And I'm not dreaming, he really was 17...

[Lightsoot]

Great win for John Baguley. Good luck to Vinny Mitchell on the comeback trail. It doesn't mean he's finished but similarly the fact that he was stopped by Bhatia in the amateurs, dropped by Robin Deaken and now stopped by Baguley - hardly dynamite hitters - would clearly suggest that Vinny's punch resistance is his weakness. He's going to have to work on his defence and, understandably, be matched with caution for the foreseeable future.

It doesn't mean he isn't a good fighter, or can't necessarily regroup, but the refusal of Vinny's most ardent supporters to acknowledge this is what is getting on some people's tits.

[Des1]

Great win for John Baguley. Good luck to Vinny Mitchell on the comeback trail. It doesn't mean he's finished but similarly the fact that he was stopped by Bhatia in the amateurs, dropped by Robin Deaken and now stopped by Baguley - hardly dynamite hitters - would clearly suggest that Vinny's punch resistance is his weakness. He's going to have to work on his defence and, understandably, be matched with caution for the foreseeable future.

It doesn't mean he isn't a good fighter, or can't necessarily regroup, but the refusal of Vinny's most ardent supporters to acknowledge this is what is getting on some people's tits.

Not at all, its not a refusal of anything. What gets on some tits is people trying to go on any chance to unreasonably discredit someone. Why bring up a fight from a fighters AM days when they are pro now? Infact, Vinny had the flu in that AM contest but he took the fight so no excuses. Yes he walked on to one v Deakin...But showed recovery powers to get up and win. And his last fight, he took although he was unwell (although he has not used as an excuse) knowing he had beat him before. There is more that goes on behind the actual results. If Calzague didn't pull out of certain fights when he was ill no doubt he'd have some defeats on his record. If Vinny didn't take that AM fight, or his last would he be being questioned?