More competitions - Mulitple U.S. National Teams round robin

[Dennis]

I think the USA should do something similar to what Cuba does. They recently held their "Cuban National Team Championships" in November 2009. They have 6 national teams that compete round robin against each other. It is not a single elimination tournament so the boxers on each team will box on each day of competition so they box 5 times in 7 days.

They also have extra boxers on each team to fill in if a boxer is injured, sick or can't compete for some other reason.

Olympian Osmay Acosta boxed 3 times and went 2-1.
Olympian Robert Alfonso boxed 4 times and went 3-1.
Erislandy Savon boxed 3 times and went 2-1.
Olympian Yampier Hernandez boxed 3 times and went 2-1.
Olympian Yankiel Leon boxed 3 times and went 2-1.
Olympian Idel Torriente boxed 3 times and went 3-0.
Olympian Rosniel Iglesias boxed 3 times and went 2-1.
Olympian Carlos Banteur boxed 3 times and went 3-0.

I think this would be a great idea. I don't think all of our tournaments should be single elimination. By having boxers continue to box even if they lose, they get a lot more experience.

[Dennis]

If we made 6 national teams and had them compete in a round robin tournament, the top boxers in each weight class would get to compete against each other.

The teams could be:
Regions 1-2
Regions 3-4
Regions 5-6
Regions 7-8
Regions 9-10 & 12
Regions 11, 13 & 14
Military boxers can compete for the LBC in which their base is located.

[NYboxing]

Dennis, I wish you were running USA boxing with couple of guys/girls on the board.

Look at the recent trip to Russia by team USA - there were a lot of one and done, and guys could have used the experience fighting again especially with high expense of the trip and distance.

But I also find it is amazing how little USA boxing competes against each other other than Nationals/PALs etc and saddens me how many guys are turning pro rather than stay amateur.

2009 Golden gloves 141-pound champ Jose Benavides is turning pro at 17 later this month.

[Dennis]

Dennis, I wish you were running USA boxing with couple of guys/girls on the board.

Look at the recent trip to Russia by team USA - there were a lot of one and done, and guys could have used the experience fighting again especially with high expense of the trip and distance.

But I also find it is amazing how little USA boxing competes against each other other than Nationals/PALs etc and saddens me how many guys are turning pro rather than stay amateur.

2009 Golden gloves 141-pound champ Jose Benavides is turning pro at 17 later this month.

Thanks. I would definitely make some changes. I talked to Andrew Madigan after my son lost his bout in Russia and he told me that he was going to try to get my son and the other Team USA boxers sparring against boxers from other countries while they were in Russia. He asked me what I thought and I said that I thought it was a great idea. I thought that our boxers need all the experience they can get to compete or spar against boxers from European and Asian countries. Alas, the head coach on the trip nixed the idea.

It is a shame that so many of our talented young boxers turn pro before age 20. Benavides gave Frankie Gomez a good bout in Denver. He would be in the mix each year and that is exactly what we need. If our boxers can have tough domestic competition, they will stand a better chance at winning international tournaments.

[hbomb2]

I think the USA should do something similar to what Cuba does. They recently held their "Cuban National Team Championships" in November 2009. They have 6 national teams that compete round robin against each other. It is not a single elimination tournament so the boxers on each team will box on each day of competition so they box 5 times in 7 days.

They also have extra boxers on each team to fill in if a boxer is injured, sick or can't compete for some other reason.

Olympian Osmay Acosta boxed 3 times and went 2-1.
Olympian Robert Alfonso boxed 4 times and went 3-1.
Erislandy Savon boxed 3 times and went 2-1.
Olympian Yampier Hernandez boxed 3 times and went 2-1.
Olympian Yankiel Leon boxed 3 times and went 2-1.
Olympian Idel Torriente boxed 3 times and went 3-0.
Olympian Rosniel Iglesias boxed 3 times and went 2-1.
Olympian Carlos Banteur boxed 3 times and went 3-0.

I think this would be a great idea. I don't think all of our tournaments should be single elimination. By having boxers continue to box even if they lose, they get a lot more experience.

Dennis I disagree with you in copying Cuba's way of doing things. I am happy that you thought about the military athletes in your other statement as USA Boxing has totally disregarded them. I wanted to attend the meeting in NY on the 8th, I e-mailed Mike Martino, Dr.Virgets, Angel Bovee and members of the USOC requesting to allow me to attend at my own expense. Not one member of USA Boxing responded to my request. Rachel Isaacs of the sports partnership did respond and stated that only USA Boxing BOD and the ED would attend as they are sure that many of the members would like to attend. I personally do not feel that we are represented well as I feel the entire BOD need to be replaced. That is just my opinion.

[Dennis]

Ron - I understand your concerns about the meeting. I didn't say we needed to copy the way Cuba does everything, but I do like the idea of round robin tournaments and double-elimination tournaments. Our guys need to get more experience and by spending lots of money going to national tournaments only to be elminated after the first bout seems a waste. Why not allow those boxers to continue to compete? They can all box 4 or 5 times during the week. You would truly see who are the best boxers (barring injuries) as the luck of the draw would not be as big of a factor. In regard to the round robin tournament, what exactly don't you like about it?

[hbomb2]

Dennis, I read wrong and I do understand what you are saying. I think that our whole system is screwed up. Our U.S. National Championships should be held in February at the beginning of the year as we are losing a lot of funding for the athletes from the USOC as the stipend end the last of December. The Golden Gloves tournament should be held 3-4 months later and then the National PAL another 3-4 months later. Some other tournament should be formed for Nov-Dec timeframe and each of them shall be ranking tournaments according to how one finished. For each tournament the #3 will train hard to catch the #2 and #1's and so on. The problem with our guys concerning multi-bouts per tournament, many of them will pull out and say they are injured as they no longer have a chance to win. We also need a HPP committee instead of a single person. There need to be a chairperson for that committee but no one person will be successful in such a demanding and knowledge based task. We also need to have a week long camp for coaches only so that we may all understand where we are going and what we are doing. If I had the finances I would would do it. We all do need to make some noise in advising the USA Boxing BOD to move the Nationals back to the beginning of the year, I figure that they are losing $90,000 towards athlete support holding it where it is now.

[Dennis]

Ron - it doesn't matter when the nationals are held. The USOC can provide funding for the athletes. The 2010 HPP can include funding for the current top 4 through June or July and then the top 4 from the 2010 USA Boxing National Championships can be funded from then until the end of the year. They would then get funding from the 2011 HPP until the 2011 USA Boxing Nationals.

I agree with you that the USA's should be held early in the year, but for different reasons. The boxers have a lot of competition starting in March going through July 2010 with no breaks. If the USA's were in February, it is spread out a little better with the LBC tournaments starting in early December, regionals in January and Nationals in February. The GG then starts in March and continue until the Nationals in May. That is 6 months for the two tournaments as compared to starting the GG in early March and having the USA Nationals in June or July which is 4 or 5 months for the two tournaments. That just seems like it is too compressed.

The USA's being in the summer does have the advantage of being easier for some boxers as the school year is over for High Schools and Colleges.

[Dennis]

My last post was correct. The USOC is providing elite athlete funding for the current top 2 men in each weight class through June 2010 and then the top 2 from the 2010 USA Nationals from July through December. The 2011 Budget will have to cover the remaining 6 months for the 2010 winners and runner-ups.

[Dennis]

These round robin tournaments would eliminate the disincentive for losing boxers to drop out as they often do with a consolation bracket. These would basically be duals between the various teams and it wouldn't matter if a boxer lost in one as he would still be competing against a different boxer & team in the next dual. I really like this idea and it could really help sort out who the top boxers are in the USA. A lucky draw (easy side of the bracket) for a boxer to end up in the top 5 in the country just won't cut it here. They will have to prove they are top 5 material.