Status of the Commonwealth belt

[winkveron]

I was thinking last night, and after reading Rhino222's post about Tony Bellew's opponent last night, and wondering why the Commonwealth belt is held in so low esteem. It almost has become a joke, the fights are almost always predictable and one sided. Most people would agree that it is the first on the ladder of titles, after which comes British, European then World honours. But why?

The Commonwealth title SHOULD be more prestigious than the British, Lonsdale stuff aside, because it should be competed for by the best of British, then the best of the rest of the Empire, ie Canada, Australia, a few African countries etc. And then maybe on par with the European. You'd think the bigger pool of fighters available would make it worthwhile but nowadays it seems worthless.

What do you guys think?

[Spud]

I was thinking last night, and after reading Rhino222's post about Tony Bellew's opponent last night, and wondering why the Commonwealth belt is held in so low esteem. It almost has become a joke, the fights are almost always predictable and one sided. Most people would agree that it is the first on the ladder of titles, after which comes British, European then World honours. But why?

The Commonwealth title SHOULD be more prestigious than the British, Lonsdale stuff aside, because it should be competed for by the best of British, then the best of the rest of the Empire, ie Canada, Australia, a few African countries etc. And then maybe on par with the European. You'd think the bigger pool of fighters available would make it worthwhile but nowadays it seems worthless.

What do you guys think?

Just posted something on another thread - its sad but true - the people who pay the money do not give a toss about the Commonwealth title - it is merely a belt that is put up for grabs to entice the fans through the turnstiles to pay for the tickets at show - a reasonable undercard filler and thats about it.

What I have wrote is harsh but true - for the money the commonwealth title is meaningless - however I concede there are plenty of decent potential match ups that could be made - but what promoter is going to risk a potential star in his stable with a massive fight merely for the commonwealth??

I remember Froch fighting Charles Adamu for the Super Middleweight title I think - remember the fight and up until the 8th round or something like that Carl was behind on everyones scorecards!!!

Promoters do not like potential "banana skins" which will ruin a decent tv deal for his rising star.

[el_grande_mauro_mina]

Historically - the Commonwealth (British Empire) title is one of the most important titles in world boxing, more important than any of the world title belts hanging around these days - in fact, there have been times where the Empire/Commonwealth title was won and lost in world title bouts - Toweel vs Carruthers and Rose vs Rudkin if I can recall two.

Whats basically happened is that the toothless bias of the Commonwealth council towards British fighters and promoters has caught up with them - this goes back to George Chuvalo and beyond by the way - it has now been relegated to a second tier domestic belt - simply put - there are many decent Canadian and Australian challengers being sidelined.

And let nobody say that interest in these titles in these countries was non existent - most top class international boxing in Australia was around the commonwealth titles for decades and in Canada - the commonwealth title was only second in prestige to a world title - thats why George Chuvalo wanted to fight for it so badly. I could produce Canadian and Australian news reports where a commonwealth title fight held the back page.

[neil hibbert]

its been devalued recently partly due to the fact there always seems to be an afrobum fighting for it

[winkveron]

I saw Trevor Berbick's record and he once won the Commonwealth, but now it seems to always be a FW fighter VS. an unknown African. It should be a gateway to world class for fringe contenders. Like Darren Barker VS. Lemieux for the Middleweight belt for example!

[rhino222]

its a sad sad state of affairs. the fact is that commenwealth belt sanctioning costs are low (compared to other belts). african 'no bodies' command lower purses than other fighters.

therefore you have a belt that people recognise by name, a fighter no one has heard of with a 'massaged and manipulated' record.

and you have a low cost credit crunch match up.

load of bollocks but money makes the world go round.

it would be interesting to know bellows purse from last night, and the purse of bellows opponent. is anyone in the know brave enough to post it on here?

[rhino222]

im guessing bellow got 18k and his opponent got about 7k

[Spud]

im guessing bellow got 18k and his opponent got about 7k

Reckon you are quite close Rhino!!!

[TerribleTerry]

Relatively recently both Henry Wharton and Richie Woodhall utilised the Commonwealth belt effectively to gain experience in good, learning fights.

Neither man was blowing out over matched Africans with dubious records.
That said, Tony Bellew fights the men put in front of him - it is up to the Tipton tango man to get him quality opposition that he can learn from.

[hurlock]

the title has been devalued of recent times, how british promoters easily sanction fights for this title & nominate uneligable fighters.
when you look how big the commonwealth is & what it covers its nearlly as big as the european :!:

end of the day the fighter makes the belt.

[mickey1975]

Relatively recently both Henry Wharton and Richie Woodhall utilised the Commonwealth belt effectively to gain experience in good, learning fights.

Neither man was blowing out over matched Africans with dubious records.
That said, Tony Bellew fights the men put in front of him - it is up to the Tipton tango man to get him quality opposition that he can learn from.

Henry v Rod Carr was FOTY.Rod was as hard as nails and came to win

[rhino222]

its the fault of the BBB of C and the matchmaker !! .... not the fault of any fighter at all !!

[El Raincoat]

I saw Trevor Berbick's record and he once won the Commonwealth, but now it seems to always be a FW fighter VS. an unknown African. It should be a gateway to world class for fringe contenders. Like Darren Barker VS. Lemieux for the Middleweight belt for example!

Well put, i completely agree, shame that they as you say tend to be very predicatable. I guess we all just wonder if one of those African guys may pull a surprise and be the new Azumah Nelson.

[whicker]

As I mentioned elsewhere, it might be the case that Rob Norton isn't even going to travel to Australia to defend his title for financial reasons (although this might be untrue).

It shows just what an absurdity the concept of the "Champion of the Commonwealth" is , when it isn't even economical for "Champions" to travel to Commonwealth nations to defend their titles.

The haste with which they are vacated is also somewhat depressing.

[whicker]

its been devalued recently partly due to the fact there always seems to be an afrobum fighting for it

Yeah, "opponents" seemingly appear at random.

[TerribleTerry]

Relatively recently both Henry Wharton and Richie Woodhall utilised the Commonwealth belt effectively to gain experience in good, learning fights.

Neither man was blowing out over matched Africans with dubious records.
That said, Tony Bellew fights the men put in front of him - it is up to the Tipton tango man to get him quality opposition that he can learn from.

Henry v Rod Carr was FOTY.Rod was as hard as nails and came to win

Remember it well mate - those fights were all on the beeb and I loved em. Carr was a tough man alright.

Wharton stopped Carr in a rematch if I remember rightly?

Wharton was one of my favourite fighters growing up.

[jonp]

Relatively recently both Henry Wharton and Richie Woodhall utilised the Commonwealth belt effectively to gain experience in good, learning fights.

Neither man was blowing out over matched Africans with dubious records.
That said, Tony Bellew fights the men put in front of him - it is up to the Tipton tango man to get him quality opposition that he can learn from.

Lol Terry Ritchy beat an australian in one round for his but i know what you mean.

[Spud]

its the fault of the BBB of C and the matchmaker !! .... not the fault of any fighter at all !!

I do not blame the matchmaker one little bit - its his job to find an opponent at the least possible risk and maximum possible gain for the promoter as well as the fighter.

Its the BBBofC's responsibility to ensure the matchmaker and the promoter do not bring in "weak" opponents - I would also like to add what about the TV Executives who allow the fights as well - but I go back to the matchmaker - not his problem - the BBBofC should not allow certain fights - time and time again they seem to be strict with certain promoters and that "blind eye" comes to the fore with others.

[TerribleTerry]

its the fault of the BBB of C and the matchmaker !! .... not the fault of any fighter at all !!

I do not blame the matchmaker one little bit - its his job to find an opponent at the least possible risk and maximum possible gain for the promoter as well as the fighter.

Its the BBBofC's responsibility to ensure the matchmaker and the promoter do not bring in "weak" opponents - I would also like to add what about the TV Executives who allow the fights as well - but I go back to the matchmaker - not his problem - the BBBofC should not allow certain fights - time and time again they seem to be strict with certain promoters and that "blind eye" comes to the fore with others.

Double post

[TerribleTerry]

its the fault of the BBB of C and the matchmaker !! .... not the fault of any fighter at all !!

I do not blame the matchmaker one little bit - its his job to find an opponent at the least possible risk and maximum possible gain for the promoter as well as the fighter.

Its the BBBofC's responsibility to ensure the matchmaker and the promoter do not bring in "weak" opponents - I would also like to add what about the TV Executives who allow the fights as well - but I go back to the matchmaker - not his problem - the BBBofC should not allow certain fights - time and time again they seem to be strict with certain promoters and that "blind eye" comes to the fore with others.

Disagree Squd re: match makers.

Whilst the Board / Commonwealth need to operate strict quality control measures to ensure competitive matches, the match maker has his part to play in this process.

Its not about getting away with the 'least risk for greatest reward' with a prospect, it is about getting them the right learning fights at the right time in their careers. They have done a great job matching Frankie Gavin so far imo, but I think now that Bellew has a belt he needs rounds and learning fights that will bring him on so he can move up the levels.

It is also about providing the paying public with a decent quality product - blows outs dressed up as title fights dont provide value for money.

[stujones]

Could you imagine Tua vs Peter for the Commonwealth title.

Afolabi vs Troy Ross at Cruiserweight

There are some good fighters in the Commonwealth still.

[rhino222]

its the fault of the BBB of C and the matchmaker !! .... not the fault of any fighter at all !!

I do not blame the matchmaker one little bit - its his job to find an opponent at the least possible risk and maximum possible gain for the promoter as well as the fighter.

Its the BBBofC's responsibility to ensure the matchmaker and the promoter do not bring in "weak" opponents - I would also like to add what about the TV Executives who allow the fights as well - but I go back to the matchmaker - not his problem - the BBBofC should not allow certain fights - time and time again they seem to be strict with certain promoters and that "blind eye" comes to the fore with others.

surely a contradiction there spudly, if its the BBB of C's responsibility to ensure the matchmaker and the promoter do not bring in "weak" opponents, then surely you are admitting that weak opponents are partly the matchmakers fault, as you are stating that he needs 'quality controlling' by the BBB of C. !!

[Adamj1987]

commonwealth belt is bellow the britt in my opinion as people seem to use the belt as a stepping stone to the Brittish belt

[Old bones Ian]

Ok Bit bored on a Sunday, had a look at the recent titles.
amazingly the Heavyweight title hasn't been fought for outside of the UK since 1984!!

Cruiser 2007
L/Heavy 1991
S/Middle 2007
Middle 2004
L/Middle 2002
Welter 2005
L/Welter 1997
Light 2003
S/Feather 1993
Feather 1994
S/Bantam 2000
Bantam 2004
S/Fly never outside of UK
Fly 1989
L/Fly 1987 (only ever 1 fight for title)

[Adamj1987]

Ok Bit bored on a Sunday, had a look at the recent titles.
amazingly the Heavyweight title hasn't been fought for outside of the UK since 1984!!

Cruiser 2007
L/Heavy 1991
S/Middle 2007
Middle 2004
L/Middle 2002
Welter 2005
L/Welter 1997
Light 2003
S/Feather 1993
Feather 1994
S/Bantam 2000
Bantam 2004
S/Fly never outside of UK
Fly 1989
L/Fly 1987 (only ever 1 fight for title)

thats insane