Rick Farris wrote:I remember you writing about Wayne heath sh*tting in his trunks from a body shot . . . but I guess having the picture of that in my head made me forget the little gesture. What was it?
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Tom . . . After Liston had literally knocked the crap out of Wayne Heath and finshed his workout, I followed him and his company back to the dressing room. My gear was in Johnny Flores room, which was across from the one Sonny was using. Liston didn't have seconds wrap his hands with gauze, he did it himself. I sat down on a bench in the middle of the dressing area, right outside where Sonny was sitting on a rubbing table and pulling off the taped gauze. I guess I was staring quite intently, I was fifteen, but looked about twelve. Liston glanced up and looked me in the eyes. I wasn't trying to be rude, but I just looked him in his eyes, deliberatly not looking away. I guess he found that amusing, that some kid who didn't smile would not break a stare. His somber look turned to a big smile. I then began to smile and he nodded at me. I nodded back. No words, nothing. I felt very good. Liston hadn't changed his expression all afternoon he was on the gym floor. In my own teenage mind, I'd been validated. Go figure?
-Rick Farris
Great story, Rick.
I knew Wayne Heath back in Oklahoma when he ran a camp for amateur boxers out of Midwest City. He used to tell everyone that he had been Sonny Liston's sparring partner - but for some reason he always left out the part about crapping in his trunks . . .
anybody remember Irleis ''cubanito'' Perez I thought he was a real good lightweight he fought Hector Camacho on T.V back before Hector became a ''track star'' and he gave him a good fight he moved out to Vegas and had a shot at Jimmy Pauls title but lost a close decision after that had a few more fights then retired anybody heard anything about him where is at
Local Fighters Allegedly Denied a Forum to Display Their Talents
November 25, 1991|EARL GUSTKEY
The Times' investigation of alleged expense-check kickbacks at Forum boxing shows also turned up something else about Forum boxing--a smoldering resentment in Southland gyms.
Many say the Forum favors out-of-town or foreign fighters over local boxers. If you are good and you are from Los Angeles, some say, you are a longshot to fight at the Forum.
That opinion is shared by many, among them two of the most respected local boxing people, Bill Slayton of the Broadway Gym and Johnny Flores of the old Lincoln Heights Jail gym.
"There are kids in my gym right now who are good enough to fight in Forum main events, but the Forum would have to pay them $3,500 or $4,000," Slayton said.
"But the Forum people would rather bring in a kid from Mexico, Puerto Rico or someplace because they can get them for $2,500. Also, they write foreign kids those big expense checks.
"Look at 1984. You had two Olympic gold medalists in this town, Henry Tillman and Paul Gonzales. Their first 10 pro fights should have been at the Forum. Go ask them how hard the Forum tried to sign them when they turned pro."
Tillman and Gonzales said they never were contacted by anyone from the Forum in the months after the 1984 Olympics.
"That's a damn lie," said John Jackson, president for Forum boxing. "Tillman and his manager, Mercer Smith, sat in my office in 1984 and demanded $75,000 for his first pro fight. I told them it was out of the question.
"We talked to Gonzales' people, too. It was the same thing--they simply wanted more than we were prepared to pay."
As it turned out, Tillman and Gonzales had disappointing pro careers. But in 1984, no one could have foreseen that. It seems that the Forum easily could have developed the two gold medalists into box-office hits in Los Angeles, at least in the early stages of their careers.
Tillman was paid $20,000 for his first pro fight, in Houston. Gonzales also earned $20,000 for his first pro fight, at the Hollywood Palladium.
Gonzales has fought in recent years at the Forum, but only after his career had declined. Tillman has never boxed at the Forum.
Flores, a widely known boxing figure here since the late 1940s, also says the Forum favors out-of-towners. He says that if a local boxer does wind up on a Forum card, he almost always is matched against a tougher out-of-towner.
"The Forum could care less about developing local talent," he said.
I don't put to much stock on those numbers, especially the ones from the Olympic, the Aragon/Carter title fight for instance list 7,251 fans and $74,462 gate, I was there that night and the place was pack to the rafters, over 10,400 fans for sure, there were people outside that couldn't get in, the reason that those low numbers were put out was that the fighters were working on a % of the gate, so the lower the numbers, the less they had to pay the fighters.
I know it happened to us!!...... :x
Didn't know that they phony the numbers up so they can cheat the fighters another interesting thing I learned on here
I don't put to much stock on those numbers, especially the ones from the Olympic, the Aragon/Carter title fight for instance list 7,251 fans and $74,462 gate, I was there that night and the place was pack to the rafters, over 10,400 fans for sure, there were people outside that couldn't get in, the reason that those low numbers were put out was that the fighters were working on a % of the gate, so the lower the numbers, the less they had to pay the fighters.
I know it happened to us!!...... :x
Didn't know that they phony the numbers up so they can cheat the fighters another interesting thing I learned on here
Yes Paulino, thats the way it was done back when the fighters were working on a % of the gate, like I said it happened to us....
THEHAMMER321 wrote:anybody remember Irleis ''cubanito'' Perez I thought he was a real good lightweight he fought Hector Camacho on T.V back before Hector became a ''track star'' and he gave him a good fight he moved out to Vegas and had a shot at Jimmy Pauls title but lost a close decision after that had a few more fights then retired anybody heard anything about him where is at
Paulino, I remember Perez real good, he was fighting here in LA at the same time Tony and Frankie were, he has a brother that also fought pro, Tomas Perez. Last I heard Cubanito was living in L.V.
Btw Tony and Cubanito fought in the GG with with Perez winning.
Rick Farris wrote:I remember you writing about Wayne heath sh*tting in his trunks from a body shot . . . but I guess having the picture of that in my head made me forget the little gesture. What was it?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom . . . After Liston had literally knocked the crap out of Wayne Heath and finshed his workout, I followed him and his company back to the dressing room. My gear was in Johnny Flores room, which was across from the one Sonny was using. Liston didn't have seconds wrap his hands with gauze, he did it himself. I sat down on a bench in the middle of the dressing area, right outside where Sonny was sitting on a rubbing table and pulling off the taped gauze. I guess I was staring quite intently, I was fifteen, but looked about twelve. Liston glanced up and looked me in the eyes. I wasn't trying to be rude, but I just looked him in his eyes, deliberatly not looking away. I guess he found that amusing, that some kid who didn't smile would not break a stare. His somber look turned to a big smile. I then began to smile and he nodded at me. I nodded back. No words, nothing. I felt very good. Liston hadn't changed his expression all afternoon he was on the gym floor. In my own teenage mind, I'd been validated. Go figure?
-Rick Farris
Great story, Rick.
I knew Wayne Heath back in Oklahoma when he ran a camp for amateur boxers out of Midwest City. He used to tell everyone that he had been Sonny Liston's sparring partner - but for some reason he always left out the part about crapping in his trunks . . .
I don't blame him, Tom. I heard that hook thud as it slammed into his side, watched Heath drop to a knee, and then .
I'd never seen or considered anything like that. It left a permanent impression on me, one that motivated me to always make sure my stomach was clear before gearing up for a fight. When the crap rolled down Wayne's leg, the spectators at ringside let out a howl, adding insult to injury for the fighter.
I don't put to much stock on those numbers, especially the ones from the Olympic, the Aragon/Carter title fight for instance list 7,251 fans and $74,462 gate, I was there that night and the place was pack to the rafters, over 10,400 fans for sure, there were people outside that couldn't get in, the reason that those low numbers were put out was that the fighters were working on a % of the gate, so the lower the numbers, the less they had to pay the fighters.
I know it happened to us!!...... :x
Didn't know that they phony the numbers up so they can cheat the fighters another interesting thing I learned on here
Yes Paulino, thats the way it was done back when the fighters were working on a % of the gate, like I said it happened to us....
Frank . . . Armando Muniz tll of a fight he had at the Olympic that was a sellout. The entire balcony was filled to the rafters. When Vic Weiss handed Mando his check for the fight, he was shocked. Aileen claimed there were less than 7000 in attendence (The Olympic held 10,400 in those days). Jackie McCoy had similar problems over the years. Not much that coud be done about it. Aileen was totally connected. She had mob ties, political ties and, worse of all, her son, Gene LeBell. How do you beat that?
Rick Farris wrote:I remember you writing about Wayne heath sh*tting in his trunks from a body shot . . . but I guess having the picture of that in my head made me forget the little gesture. What was it?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom . . . After Liston had literally knocked the crap out of Wayne Heath and finshed his workout, I followed him and his company back to the dressing room. My gear was in Johnny Flores room, which was across from the one Sonny was using. Liston didn't have seconds wrap his hands with gauze, he did it himself. I sat down on a bench in the middle of the dressing area, right outside where Sonny was sitting on a rubbing table and pulling off the taped gauze. I guess I was staring quite intently, I was fifteen, but looked about twelve. Liston glanced up and looked me in the eyes. I wasn't trying to be rude, but I just looked him in his eyes, deliberatly not looking away. I guess he found that amusing, that some kid who didn't smile would not break a stare. His somber look turned to a big smile. I then began to smile and he nodded at me. I nodded back. No words, nothing. I felt very good. Liston hadn't changed his expression all afternoon he was on the gym floor. In my own teenage mind, I'd been validated. Go figure?
-Rick Farris
Great story, Rick.
I knew Wayne Heath back in Oklahoma when he ran a camp for amateur boxers out of Midwest City. He used to tell everyone that he had been Sonny Liston's sparring partner - but for some reason he always left out the part about crapping in his trunks . . .
I don't blame him, Tom. I heard that hook thud as it slammed into his side, watched Heath drop to a knee, and then .
I'd never seen or considered anything like that. It left a permanent impression on me, one that motivated me to always make sure my stomach was clear before gearing up for a fight. When the crap rolled down Wayne's leg, the spectators at ringside let out a howl, adding insult to injury for the fighter.
I know I'm not being kind . . . but if you knew him when I knew him, . . . well . . . let's just say that I find it an extremely funny story under the circumstances . . .
This comes from the "Rumor" department. In other words, it may be nothing but crap, however, I got this from Joe Goossen a few years back.
In the erly 90's, when Dan Goossen was beginning to make a name for himself as a major promoter, he hooked up with Roberto Duran.
Dan told Duran he'd be interested in promoting any major Panamanian talent that Roberto might discover when in his home country.
Duran allegedly told Goossen why he said "No Mas" in the Leonard rematch.
Joe told me that Duran told his brother that he was having stomach problems before the fight, and had crapped his trunks during the fight, thus resulting him in saying "No Mas".
Now I can't validate the authenticity of the story, but I have never known Joe to make things up like that.
Maybe Duran made it up? Maybe it happened? Or maybe it's nothing but crap?
I apologize for such a sh*tty story.
Charlie is my kind of dog. He's got that look in his eye, "Don't mess with me or my hena."
By the way, looks like SC has the big new recruit from Minnesota. A behemoth running back with lightning speed.
Pete Carroll, Adios. USC will be back in due course. Charlie & I are Trojan homies!
Aye, great picture Randy.
Happy St. Paddys lads.
Mickey Walker was truly a guy who loved to fight I think.
Most boxers will say they do. Im not so sure.
This guy however could start a brawl in an empty room!
kikibalt wrote:Thought you would all like to know that Alex Ramos is out of the hospital, and is walking with a cane, although he has a ways to go. He is blown away by all of the email and phone calls and cards. It is hard for me to believe that one week ago this minute, he was coming out of a 48 hour coma!!! He will be getting home health assistance (nursing) and he will also have home physical therapy. He got amazing care at Simi Valley Adventist Hospital and the nurses were sad to see him go. Alex thanks you all for your love, prayers and support, and asks that you continue through his recovery. His feet are still very painful when he walks, but that does not stop him!
Alex IS a fighter and we are all grateful for his miraculous recovery. Like I said, he's too mean to die and he is to determined to beat this thing, and I believe he will. As you would expect, he wants to run but he has to walk, first.
I would also like to thank you all for the moral support. We could not have gone through this alone. We needed to multiply our own
prayers and you were there for us. THANK YOU!
If you want to call Alex, feel free to call him on his cell phone at (805) 390-7334.
Love and hugs,
Jacquie Richardson
Executive Director
RETIRED BOXERS FOUNDATION
This comes from the "Rumor" department. In other words, it may be nothing but crap, however, I got this from Joe Goossen a few years back.
In the erly 90's, when Dan Goossen was beginning to make a name for himself as a major promoter, he hooked up with Roberto Duran.
Dan told Duran he'd be interested in promoting any major Panamanian talent that Roberto might discover when in his home country.
Duran allegedly told Goossen why he said "No Mas" in the Leonard rematch.
Joe told me that Duran told his brother that he was having stomach problems before the fight, and had crapped his trunks during the fight, thus resulting him in saying "No Mas".
Now I can't validate the authenticity of the story, but I have never known Joe to make things up like that.
Maybe Duran made it up? Maybe it happened? Or maybe it's nothing but crap?
I apologize for such a sh*tty story.
-Ricardo
I heard something similar, but I don't remember the source. The way I heard it, Duran started suffering craps during the fight and quit because he couldn't hold it any more . . . But, whatever, its a pretty shitty reason to quit like that in the middle of a fight.
kikibalt wrote:Thought you would all like to know that Alex Ramos is out of the hospital, and is walking with a cane, although he has a ways to go. He is blown away by all of the email and phone calls and cards. It is hard for me to believe that one week ago this minute, he was coming out of a 48 hour coma!!! He will be getting home health assistance (nursing) and he will also have home physical therapy. He got amazing care at Simi Valley Adventist Hospital and the nurses were sad to see him go. Alex thanks you all for your love, prayers and support, and asks that you continue through his recovery. His feet are still very painful when he walks, but that does not stop him!
Alex IS a fighter and we are all grateful for his miraculous recovery. Like I said, he's too mean to die and he is to determined to beat this thing, and I believe he will. As you would expect, he wants to run but he has to walk, first.
I would also like to thank you all for the moral support. We could not have gone through this alone. We needed to multiply our own
prayers and you were there for us. THANK YOU!
If you want to call Alex, feel free to call him on his cell phone at (805) 390-7334.
Love and hugs,
Jacquie Richardson
Executive Director
RETIRED BOXERS FOUNDATION
Good News
Frank what happened to Alex Ramos
I don't know what was wrong with him, but he seem to be okay now.....
Sailor Tom Sharkey wishes a Happy St. Patrick's Day to all his fellow Californians on the Classic American West Coast Boxing
thread!!
Frank O'Baltazar
Randy O'de la O
Roger O'Espy
Rick O'Farris
. . . today, everybody is IRISH
Thank you Mr. O'Ray. By the way, to Scar, Pops & Pug . . . as I tilt me glass of Jameson's on this fine day, I wish all of you be in Heaven at least a half hour before the devil knows you're dead!
Great photo, Randy. I have a picture that Hap Navarro sent me that was taken in 1950. It's a group shot taken of several boxing personalities. The two kids in the photo were a very young Hap & Don Chargin, sitting with them were Tom Kennedy, Mickey Walker, Fidel LaBarba and a couple others. Again, happy St. Patrick's day, the Irish Cinco De Mayo. I think I best have a second shot of Jameson's, out of respect for Mickey Walker, and maybe another for Jerry Quarry, and maybe one for Sean O'Grady (another 2010 CBHOF Inductee), and one for Mickey Davies, and Frankie Crawford, Dan & Pop Hanley, and Brian Higgins. . .
damn, I'm going to need another bottle.
.
