You sure do make a lot of excuses for a 24 year old in his 'prime', ...excuses...excuses...excuses....that's all you ever hear from Tyson fanatics...so what's the excuse for losing the undisputed heavyweight title at 24 and never regaining it? The great fighters all came back from defeat...Tyson didn't....computer wrote:Look prime tyson ended after the spinks fight when rooney left , tyson abbandoned his peek a boo style for a brawaler style and thats why he lost to douglas because he didnt train and his boxing technique went out the window . Douglas wasent anything special in that fight , If mike fought the way he fought against douglas in the eighties he would of lost to all the guys he beat from berbick to williams , he really was that bad against douglas , he didnt throw any punches for peats sake , he just stood there and let douglas hit him , he was no way aggressive and didnt put any pressure on douglas which he had done in all his previous fights , if tyson did nothing in that fight but work the body he would of got douglas out of there in 3 rounds , his corner was a joke using a condom to treat his cuts .
Holmes Vs Spinks II
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Sweet Scientist
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 815
- Joined: 13 Oct 2003, 18:19
I have to agree with computer.. a prime tyson knocked out larry holmes.. larry holmes 4 years later only just lost to holyfield on points.. Larry holmes also beat ray mercer.. So larry holmes was still good at 40.. Larry holes was a great yes.. but the way mike tyson made him look that night.. just shows that a prime tyson would have beaten a prime holmes.. On larry homes website he states that he was out of condition.. but he also says that he has not diteriated with age as a fighter. 
But it's not always quite as simple or straight forward as that. When Holmes fought Tyson he was a ringrusty inactve fighter. When Holmes fought Holyfield and McCall he had been fighting on a regular basis so would have been much sharper and in 'fighting shape'.Trent wrote:I have to agree with computer.. a prime tyson knocked out larry holmes.. larry holmes 4 years later only just lost to holyfield on points.. Larry holmes also beat ray mercer.. So larry holmes was still good at 40.. Larry holes was a great yes.. but the way mike tyson made him look that night.. just shows that a prime tyson would have beaten a prime holmes.. On larry homes website he states that he was out of condition.. but he also says that he has not diteriated with age as a fighter.
Age is not the only factor in a fighters ability.
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Professor X
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 130
- Joined: 22 Jun 2004, 10:42
Prime Tyson looked just the same against Tucker, Bonehugger and Green as he did against Douglas. But Douglas really fought back with purpose, disregarding the Tyson mystique.
Douglas couldn't carry Prime Holmes' jockstrap.
I wouldn't pick Tyson over any top-10 heavyweight. Some Tyson fans act as though the mental aspect of the game is meaningless. It's not. Tyson seems easily disoriented. I would never say that about Louis, Ali, Marciano, Charles, Johnson, Holmes, etc..
Yes, I was vindicated when Douglas seperated Tyson from is senses. Tyson stuck his mouthpiece back in sideways.
Douglas couldn't carry Prime Holmes' jockstrap.
I wouldn't pick Tyson over any top-10 heavyweight. Some Tyson fans act as though the mental aspect of the game is meaningless. It's not. Tyson seems easily disoriented. I would never say that about Louis, Ali, Marciano, Charles, Johnson, Holmes, etc..
Yes, I was vindicated when Douglas seperated Tyson from is senses. Tyson stuck his mouthpiece back in sideways.
Ok from what I can remember of the Holmes Tyson debacle was plain and simple.
Watching the first 3 rounds Larry beat Mike to the punch at every turn, he was on his toes and made a prime Tyson miss his shots, he picked him off with jabs that were rusty and with no sting.
The old man then came off his toes as fatigue set in and Tyson mauled him.
A fit younger Holmes would have been on his toes and still stinging Tyson for 12 rounds unless Iron Mike imploded and got himself stopped late on.
And I agree with this prime argument. Tyson crashed and burned before he hit his prime. With the right attitude and the right preparation Tyson would STILL be the undisputed Heavyweight Champion of the world. But the little bully boy lost more than a father figure when D'Amato went, I think THAT was the downfall of Michael Gerald Tyson. The death of old Cus and the sacking of Team Tyson ended Mike as a real deal. He fell from grace from then on.
Have any of you read the Ring interviews with him from behind bars. How he never trained, he disposed of Berbick quick time as he was suffering from the clap and feeling rather uncomfortable in there.
His career nose dived then. I am a fan of Mikes but I don't think the world got the chance to see what he was really capable of with maturity.
I struggle to find a place for him in my top ten, there will always be a place in there for Larry Holmes.
Incidently Larry didn't do his career any favours either when he insulted the Marciano family. He was headed for a career of 49-0 when he said some nasty things about the Rock. Larry then walked into Mike Spinks spoiling his party. Thw WBC stripped him of his title and the IBF was born
Watching the first 3 rounds Larry beat Mike to the punch at every turn, he was on his toes and made a prime Tyson miss his shots, he picked him off with jabs that were rusty and with no sting.
The old man then came off his toes as fatigue set in and Tyson mauled him.
A fit younger Holmes would have been on his toes and still stinging Tyson for 12 rounds unless Iron Mike imploded and got himself stopped late on.
And I agree with this prime argument. Tyson crashed and burned before he hit his prime. With the right attitude and the right preparation Tyson would STILL be the undisputed Heavyweight Champion of the world. But the little bully boy lost more than a father figure when D'Amato went, I think THAT was the downfall of Michael Gerald Tyson. The death of old Cus and the sacking of Team Tyson ended Mike as a real deal. He fell from grace from then on.
Have any of you read the Ring interviews with him from behind bars. How he never trained, he disposed of Berbick quick time as he was suffering from the clap and feeling rather uncomfortable in there.
His career nose dived then. I am a fan of Mikes but I don't think the world got the chance to see what he was really capable of with maturity.
I struggle to find a place for him in my top ten, there will always be a place in there for Larry Holmes.
Incidently Larry didn't do his career any favours either when he insulted the Marciano family. He was headed for a career of 49-0 when he said some nasty things about the Rock. Larry then walked into Mike Spinks spoiling his party. Thw WBC stripped him of his title and the IBF was born
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elmersalsa
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 15654
- Joined: 02 Feb 2003, 03:50
Hello Folks!!!
Great topic!!!
To tell ya the truth, Tyson NEVER WAS IN HIS PRIME, he was getting there. But all fell off after he fired Kevin Rooney and his staff and Don King comes in. I saw the END of Tyson at the first Frank Bruno Fight.
A GOOFY FIGHTER like Bruno gave him problems, I imagine a PRIME Larry Holmes would have done to an ALMOST AT HIS PEAK TYSON???
I cannot see a Mike Tyson passing through from one of THE BEST JABS IN HISTORY in Holmes. Holmes had too much ring generalship and too many tricks in the book to defeat Tyson by a comfortable decision or late TKO.
Spinks vs Holmes II??? I saw Spinks win the fight.
Great topic!!!
To tell ya the truth, Tyson NEVER WAS IN HIS PRIME, he was getting there. But all fell off after he fired Kevin Rooney and his staff and Don King comes in. I saw the END of Tyson at the first Frank Bruno Fight.
A GOOFY FIGHTER like Bruno gave him problems, I imagine a PRIME Larry Holmes would have done to an ALMOST AT HIS PEAK TYSON???
I cannot see a Mike Tyson passing through from one of THE BEST JABS IN HISTORY in Holmes. Holmes had too much ring generalship and too many tricks in the book to defeat Tyson by a comfortable decision or late TKO.
Spinks vs Holmes II??? I saw Spinks win the fight.