Haye Wins

[Manc_Red]

It was noticeable that Haye was breathing heavily from the third & that he was resting as best he could to build himself up for superb bursts of shots.

He'll have to work on that or the Klitschko Bros will make easy work of him.

Wins a win, he has time to get use to the weight.

[mickey1975]

Lets not get carried away,Haye got away with a lot tonight,he still would have won,but wouldnt get away wih that sh!t in Germany.The kliits are miles away yet.They will punch him into submission after around five rounds of taking a sixft 7,18st,jab,repeatedly.And this is coming from a Brit who was really impressed with David tonight.I dont know how to drag up old posts,but someone(Kingfinn?)said he was a harder hitter than Tua.He's not,mate,ever,in his life

[Spud]

hayes biggest problem fighting the klits, is that he has to sacrifice one of his assets, which is his outside boxing skills. If he fights them from the outside, they are going to jab his head off, which means he will need to find a tactic which allows him to get past the jab and into range, without shipping shots on the way in.

Both men have height and reach advantages which are significant, and that will make Haye's job much harder, as he is best throwing long punches. On the inside, Haye always looks vulnerable, because he throws a lot of looping crosses and hooks, which leaves large gaps when someone is on top of him.

Wlad has a pretty devastating uppercut, and Vitali throws short cuffing shots on the inside, which seem to carry rather more pop than they would suggest on first viewing.

I have always stated Haye should pay whatever it takes to get Wladimir in the ring - the bloke has no chin - I agree with the majority of your summing up - I still would favour Vitali - why - because he can take a decent shot and there is no way David Haye hits harder than Lennox.

I honestly think David Haye would smash Wladimir out of the ring within the first 2 rounds - therein lies his chance - if the fight went any longer than that it would have meant Wladimir had taken some big bombs from Haye and comeback with a few of his own.

Haye v Wladimir - TKO 1 (Haye)

Haye v Vitali - TKO 4 (Vitali)

[Carbo]

hayes biggest problem fighting the klits, is that he has to sacrifice one of his assets, which is his outside boxing skills. If he fights them from the outside, they are going to jab his head off, which means he will need to find a tactic which allows him to get past the jab and into range, without shipping shots on the way in.

Both men have height and reach advantages which are significant, and that will make Haye's job much harder, as he is best throwing long punches. On the inside, Haye always looks vulnerable, because he throws a lot of looping crosses and hooks, which leaves large gaps when someone is on top of him.

Wlad has a pretty devastating uppercut, and Vitali throws short cuffing shots on the inside, which seem to carry rather more pop than they would suggest on first viewing.

Actually, I think that the way Haye moves back and walks people onto his punches is tailor made to fight the Klitschkos. I remember seeing a Teddy Atlas tactics preview for (I think) the Gomez-Klitschko fight, and he said there are two ways a shorter fighter can beat a taller man. The first, obviously, is to bore inside, and stick your head on the other guy's chest, and make his longer arms work against him on the inside, where your shorter arms mean your hooks and uppercuts are more compact. Obviously Haye ain't going to do that. The second way was to make, in Atlas's words, "The other guy give up his height" by walking him onto punches.

That's what Haye does, and he did it perfectly tonight. He just walked Ruiz onto his punches.

I thought his defence was great this evening, using head movement and right hand blocks to make Ruiz miss a huge amount. Also pleasing was Haye's jab, which looked like a real weapon. It snapped Ruiz's head back everytime it hit, and really kept him off balance and at the range Haye wanted him. Of course, the other nice thing was to know that that right is a real honey punch. It's soooo smooth and easy, and it's fast and accurate, and, it would seem, heavy.

One thing that irritates me about Haye is his finishing. He gets too excited, throws wild punches, and smothers his work. His power in his right comes from the easy rotation of weight through the point of impact, like a golfer, and when he swings from Arkansas, he looses some of that power, I think. If he just gave himself room, relaxed and picked his shots, he would do a lot better, and would have had Ruiz out in the first.

But that wouldn't have been as impressive a demolition as this was.

The only other thing that concerns me is that he clearly doesn't like being hit. He really does look fragile, which doesn't bode well for the Klitschkos. Haye reminds me of a centre of winger in rugby who's a joy to watch when he's making a break in the open field, and looks like a gazelle gliding at pace and devastating teams with his strike running; but then looks as if he'll crack every time the burly inside centre or the blind side flanker bullocking at him

[jamesmcdonnell]

It was noticeable that Haye was breathing heavily from the third & that he was resting as best he could to build himself up for superb bursts of shots.

He'll have to work on that or the Klitschko Bros will make easy work of him.

Wins a win, he has time to get use to the weight.

I think Haye's stamina is always going to be an issue, bearing in mind he's added a good what, 30 lbs in weight since he was fighting at 190. It wasn't a major problem against Ruiz, because he wasn't able to cut the ring off or make Haye work. It's a lot different if you are eating jabs and having to be the one coming forward and trying to force the fight.

I also agree with what spud said, those Rabbit punches would have gotten him in serious trouble in Germany, or in Vegas for that matter, he got points deducted even with home advantage. Three of the four knockdowns contained a rabbit punch at the end, and that's very risky business, I think ruiz probably deserved some time to recover from those shots. It wouldn't I think have affected the outcome of the fight in any way ultimately.

To beat either Klit, Booth needs to come up with another winning strategy, he came up with a good one for Ruiz, but Ruiz has a very limited skillset, and if he isn't able to drag his opponent into a brawl he struggles.

Let's hope Haye gets the chance to take the brothers on, it's a fight the division needs and soon.

[jamesmcdonnell]

hayes biggest problem fighting the klits, is that he has to sacrifice one of his assets, which is his outside boxing skills. If he fights them from the outside, they are going to jab his head off, which means he will need to find a tactic which allows him to get past the jab and into range, without shipping shots on the way in.

Both men have height and reach advantages which are significant, and that will make Haye's job much harder, as he is best throwing long punches. On the inside, Haye always looks vulnerable, because he throws a lot of looping crosses and hooks, which leaves large gaps when someone is on top of him.

Wlad has a pretty devastating uppercut, and Vitali throws short cuffing shots on the inside, which seem to carry rather more pop than they would suggest on first viewing.

Actually, I think that the way Haye moves back and walks people onto his punches is tailor made to fight the Klitschkos. I remember seeing a Teddy Atlas tactics preview for (I think) the Gomez-Klitschko fight, and he said there are two ways a shorter fighter can beat a taller man. The first, obviously, is to bore inside, and stick your head on the other guy's chest, and make his longer arms work against him on the inside, where your shorter arms mean your hooks and uppercuts are more compact. Obviously Haye ain't going to do that. The second way was to make, in Atlas's words, "The other guy give up his height" by walking him onto punches.

That's what Haye does, and he did it perfectly tonight. He just walked Ruiz onto his punches.

I thought his defence was great this evening, using head movement and right hand blocks to make Ruiz miss a huge amount. Also pleasing was Haye's jab, which looked like a real weapon. It snapped Ruiz's head back everytime it hit, and really kept him off balance and at the range Haye wanted him. Of course, the other nice thing was to know that that right is a real honey punch. It's soooo smooth and easy, and it's fast and accurate, and, it would seem, heavy.

One thing that irritates me about Haye is his finishing. He gets too excited, throws wild punches, and smothers his work. His power in his right comes from the easy rotation of weight through the point of impact, like a golfer, and when he swings from Arkansas, he looses some of that power, I think. If he just gave himself room, relaxed and picked his shots, he would do a lot better, and would have had Ruiz out in the first.

But that wouldn't have been as impressive a demolition as this was.

The only other thing that concerns me is that he clearly doesn't like being hit. He really does look fragile, which doesn't bode well for the Klitschkos. Haye reminds me of a centre of winger in rugby who's a joy to watch when he's making a break in the open field, and looks like a gazelle gliding at pace and devastating teams with his strike running; but then looks as if he'll crack every time the burly inside centre or the blind side flanker bullocking at him

Trouble is, that's the same tactic the klits use, well Wlad anyway. Vitali tends to go after his opponents a lot more with that jab and straight right, whislt Wlad keeps them out of range whilst maintaining ring centre, and avoiding engagement.

It's worth remembering, both the brothers are very intelligent men, and I'm sure they will be studying the tapes of Haye just as diligently as Haye studies the tapes of them both.

Intriguing fights if and when they happen.

[DIRT SUGAR]

Wlad and Vitali both went late with non-combative guys. Are they ready to take Haye's shots? I've not seen any of tonight's fight but Haye stopping him in 9 rounds sounds a very good show against a guy who is so hard to look good against (yes, taking into account Ruiz' activity). Well done Haye. He's just beat two heavyweights on the trot who are about the most difficult to look good against. He may not beat the big Bros but surely he'll give them a fright or two at most and from where I am sitting that's alot more exciting than watching their recent defences which have been really boring. Haye may not be the heavyweight saviour but he's turning into a really good watch and that is what we want from the big lads surely?

[rod riddle]

hayes biggest problem fighting the klits, is that he has to sacrifice one of his assets, which is his outside boxing skills. If he fights them from the outside, they are going to jab his head off, which means he will need to find a tactic which allows him to get past the jab and into range, without shipping shots on the way in.

Both men have height and reach advantages which are significant, and that will make Haye's job much harder, as he is best throwing long punches. On the inside, Haye always looks vulnerable, because he throws a lot of looping crosses and hooks, which leaves large gaps when someone is on top of him.

I agree with that James.

I also think Haye needs to learn how to mix in uppercuts into combinations. He doesn't know how to throw that punch at the moment, but the "low jab" did pay off for him tonight. Ruiz looked like he ran into a train by the end. I think the corner gave him the benefit of the doubt as they would.

Did anyone else think Haye looked hurt at the end of the first round, or am I just imagining it?

[Carbo]

hayes biggest problem fighting the klits, is that he has to sacrifice one of his assets, which is his outside boxing skills. If he fights them from the outside, they are going to jab his head off, which means he will need to find a tactic which allows him to get past the jab and into range, without shipping shots on the way in.

Both men have height and reach advantages which are significant, and that will make Haye's job much harder, as he is best throwing long punches. On the inside, Haye always looks vulnerable, because he throws a lot of looping crosses and hooks, which leaves large gaps when someone is on top of him.

Wlad has a pretty devastating uppercut, and Vitali throws short cuffing shots on the inside, which seem to carry rather more pop than they would suggest on first viewing.

Actually, I think that the way Haye moves back and walks people onto his punches is tailor made to fight the Klitschkos. I remember seeing a Teddy Atlas tactics preview for (I think) the Gomez-Klitschko fight, and he said there are two ways a shorter fighter can beat a taller man. The first, obviously, is to bore inside, and stick your head on the other guy's chest, and make his longer arms work against him on the inside, where your shorter arms mean your hooks and uppercuts are more compact. Obviously Haye ain't going to do that. The second way was to make, in Atlas's words, "The other guy give up his height" by walking him onto punches.

That's what Haye does, and he did it perfectly tonight. He just walked Ruiz onto his punches.

I thought his defence was great this evening, using head movement and right hand blocks to make Ruiz miss a huge amount. Also pleasing was Haye's jab, which looked like a real weapon. It snapped Ruiz's head back everytime it hit, and really kept him off balance and at the range Haye wanted him. Of course, the other nice thing was to know that that right is a real honey punch. It's soooo smooth and easy, and it's fast and accurate, and, it would seem, heavy.

One thing that irritates me about Haye is his finishing. He gets too excited, throws wild punches, and smothers his work. His power in his right comes from the easy rotation of weight through the point of impact, like a golfer, and when he swings from Arkansas, he looses some of that power, I think. If he just gave himself room, relaxed and picked his shots, he would do a lot better, and would have had Ruiz out in the first.

But that wouldn't have been as impressive a demolition as this was.

The only other thing that concerns me is that he clearly doesn't like being hit. He really does look fragile, which doesn't bode well for the Klitschkos. Haye reminds me of a centre of winger in rugby who's a joy to watch when he's making a break in the open field, and looks like a gazelle gliding at pace and devastating teams with his strike running; but then looks as if he'll crack every time the burly inside centre or the blind side flanker bullocking at him

Trouble is, that's the same tactic the klits use, well Wlad anyway. Vitali tends to go after his opponents a lot more with that jab and straight right, whislt Wlad keeps them out of range whilst maintaining ring centre, and avoiding engagement.

It's worth remembering, both the brothers are very intelligent men, and I'm sure they will be studying the tapes of Haye just as diligently as Haye studies the tapes of them both.

Intriguing fights if and when they happen.

Very good point, and worryingly for Haye, from a strategic rather than tactical point of view, in a battle of wills as to who will be the one forced to lead off, it'll be the man who throws and lands the most jabs who wins.

Haye's jab is far, far better, in a traditional sense, than the Klitschkos's. But it's a completely different beast. He throws it sparingly and with real power, where the Klitschko jab is more a range finder, and an eye blinder for the right. It's thown often and will little force -- almost a pawing action -- and it'll probably rack up the points if both are waiting for the other guy to lead.

[Small Axe]

Did anyone else think Haye looked hurt at the end of the first round, or am I just imagining it?

Trod on his foot - I think - then he fell into the ropes.

[Carbo]

hayes biggest problem fighting the klits, is that he has to sacrifice one of his assets, which is his outside boxing skills. If he fights them from the outside, they are going to jab his head off, which means he will need to find a tactic which allows him to get past the jab and into range, without shipping shots on the way in.

Both men have height and reach advantages which are significant, and that will make Haye's job much harder, as he is best throwing long punches. On the inside, Haye always looks vulnerable, because he throws a lot of looping crosses and hooks, which leaves large gaps when someone is on top of him.

I agree with that James.

I also think Haye needs to learn how to mix in uppercuts into combinations. He doesn't know how to throw that punch at the moment, but the "low jab" did pay off for him tonight. Ruiz looked like he ran into a train by the end. I think the corner gave him the benefit of the doubt as they would.

Did anyone else think Haye looked hurt at the end of the first round, or am I just imagining it?

I didn't think he looked hurt, but he really, really looked as if he'd punched himself out a bit. He was gassed. He hid it well, but his punches slowed markedly, and lacked real power right at the end.

Ruiz was absolutely on queer street, though, so it didn't matter.

Can someone not make David run?

Can they not send him to train with Manny Pacquiao for a bit to see what real stamina building is?

[jamesmcdonnell]

Vitali's is maybe a range finder, but I wouldn't say that Wlad's is.

Haye's is much quicker and more spearing, but Wlad's is like a battering ram. Opponents see it coming, but they seem unable to do much about it.

Haye's jab is a thing of beauty when he does use it, I suspect the reason he doesn't use it more, is that it would be predictable and would leave him open to counters, and as a counterpuncher, he doesn't want to do that obviously.

I thought Ruiz did make Haye wince a bit a few times, but I don't know if he ever actually hurt him, Haye seemed to take the sting out of the shots with last minute head movement.

[n1ebf]

I thought it was pedestrian. Not particularly great to watch other than it's a World Heavyweight title fight...involving a Brit, one of our top fighters, and it's going to be big news as no top fighter boxes all that often.

Nice speed by Haye but seems to get lazy......did he gas?? I can understand some nerves being at play, but Ruiz threw just enough leather so that an against the run big shot never looked impossible.


Good speed by Haye at times but pretty dire indictment of the Heavyweight scene for me.

If Tyson, Ali, Holmes, Lewis, Foreman, Holyfield, Spinks etc......were Premier League, then that was League One fare in there tonight.

Not much boxing for your buck....maybe it's intrinsic of Heavyweight boxing.

[DIRT SUGAR]

Oh... and he's ours and we've got a guy whose in with a shout of being the best... let's get behind Haye. He so far talks the talk and walks the walk. And he looks the part and is a small guy taking on massive dudes! Love it. i've stood and chatted with him a Wembley about when Danny Williams got beat against Michael Sprott! i was taken aback about how slight he was for a guy who even then had aspirations of fighting at heavy, despite looking so ripped at cruiser. And remember at cruiser he looked a real specimen but I was shocked because in clothes he wasn't imposing at all. He seemed a good lad too. So let's get behind him and support him while he's here because from where I am looking we're not exactly brimming with heavyweight talent (no disprespect to David Price and Tom Dallas or Tyson Fury who, after all, are bloody massive).

[Manc_Red]

It was noticeable that Haye was breathing heavily from the third & that he was resting as best he could to build himself up for superb bursts of shots.

He'll have to work on that or the Klitschko Bros will make easy work of him.

Wins a win, he has time to get use to the weight.

I think Haye's stamina is always going to be an issue, bearing in mind he's added a good what, 30 lbs in weight since he was fighting at 190. It wasn't a major problem against Ruiz, because he wasn't able to cut the ring off or make Haye work. It's a lot different if you are eating jabs and having to be the one coming forward and trying to force the fight.

I also agree with what spud said, those Rabbit punches would have gotten him in serious trouble in Germany, or in Vegas for that matter, he got points deducted even with home advantage. Three of the four knockdowns contained a rabbit punch at the end, and that's very risky business, I think ruiz probably deserved some time to recover from those shots. It wouldn't I think have affected the outcome of the fight in any way ultimately.

To beat either Klit, Booth needs to come up with another winning strategy, he came up with a good one for Ruiz, but Ruiz has a very limited skillset, and if he isn't able to drag his opponent into a brawl he struggles.

Let's hope Haye gets the chance to take the brothers on, it's a fight the division needs and soon.

Good shout,

Interestingly enough I have a Polish guy here with me - We watched the fight on Polsat, he said that the commentators were more or less laughing at what was going on with Hayes punching to the rear of the head - he said they were saying "How is he getting away with that??"

At this moment in time I think he (haye) struggles against Wlad, Vitali destroys him & hurts him badly.

He's got to get those paws up

[rod riddle]

First defense out of the way, it did feel like DAvid was beating up the old man, really.

What happened with the "back problem" Vitali then Wlad cancellations (was it just '09?). Can't help but think that was a blessing, really.

I do think Haye can beat both of them, but he's going to have to be tactical fixing it in and out of the ring. Looks good on both fronts so far.

[CheckHook]

Haye looked good tonight. Thought he was a little bit wild and erratic at times though. Ruiz had to take alot of flush shots and did well to stick at it. Haye still looks like a very fast handed puncher to me who is going to be a threat to either Klitschko. Wlad has a poor chin and Vitali is looking slower every fight. Not sure how he gets past the jab against the Klitschko's, but it would be fun finding out. Definatley a legitimate threat to either of the brothers though.

[DIRT SUGAR]

Just like it that we've got a guy in the mix and bugger the moribund state of the division. Forget Tyson/Holy/Bowe/Lewis. Different era. We've got a guy who could beat the best of the rest of what's out there now and that's great because it'd be so boring right now!

[mickey1975]

Haye,unfortunately,does not have a chance carrying on like that in Germany.And dont believe for one minute Adam Booth does'nt know that.The negotiationg table will be the biggest obstacle.If Ruiz did a "Direrell",with a fair ref,he would have been kicked out.

[Sweet P]

Good win by Haye, Ruiz looked pretty shot though.

I think Both Klits will beat Haye, i also think Tua would KO him also.

[forcefraser]

Ruiz took some punishment in that fight. There is an air of vunerability abbout Haye though, as though a decent punch will have him in big trouble.

If he could land shots like that against any of the Klits, he would knock them spark out. Ruiz had a freakishly good chin last night.

[m1kee50]

Haye did enough to win, did it well enough for the opponent in front of him, who showed no angles and turned out not to have the power to bother him. Ruiz was fitter than he has been in the past but as Boxing News said, Haye would have had more trouble with the old Ruiz than the re-invented one

Fine, but the problem inherent in this performance is that it leaves a question mark over whether he can deal with fighters who will bring more to the table... the Brothers Klitschko certainly will. Not only do they do it differently to Ruiz, they do it better than Ruiz. I want him to win, as he is an exciting fighter and I prefer his style of boxing, but we cannot be sure that he can translate efforts like the one of last night up to the highest level.

And I must not have been the only one worried by Haye's tendency to hit behind the head... not all of them were shots thrown as Ruiz moved his head, Booth in the corner was telling him to 'do it clean'... he did it against Mormeck too, hopefully they will work on it in the gym - if it is possible to do so - before it costs them dearly in future.

[Autobarn]

haye broke down ruiz, dropping him many times. this is surely what we all wanted.

he showed some great offensive skills, but at other times dived in like a lunatic. his hands were fast, but he looked very heavy on his feet and awkward in his movements.

seems like he didn't get much sparring. he did not look 100% fighting fit. he looked too chunky also. good that he could do the job when he wasn't 100%. great that we have a brit who can win world heavyweight title fights. took bruno 5 attempts, didn't it?

didn't like the rabbit punches. but it's good to have a heavyweight with killer instinct. now dump the WBA title, let valuev have it, and fight one of the K2 bros. or if adamek beats arreola (and if the K2s prove awkward or unwilling in negotiations), that's an HBO payday between two excellent former cruiserweight champs.

[Autobarn]

Just like it that we've got a guy in the mix and bugger the moribund state of the division. Forget Tyson/Holy/Bowe/Lewis. Different era. We've got a guy who could beat the best of the rest of what's out there now and that's great because it'd be so boring right now!

absolutely. too much doom and gloom. ppl loved bruno who took 5 tries to win a world heavyweight title. haye's still clearly developing and became the 2nd man to stop ruiz with some sizzling power shots. he did this without even proper sparring to prepare for the fight, and while looking overweight.

[Autobarn]

Haye,unfortunately,does not have a chance carrying on like that in Germany.And dont believe for one minute Adam Booth does'nt know that.The negotiationg table will be the biggest obstacle.If Ruiz did a "Direrell",with a fair ref,he would have been kicked out.

the thing is, the last talk of haye v klitschko, i think wlad or vitali was considering fighting in the UK.