Prime Lennox Lewis V

[ThatOne]

Jack Johnson
Gene Tunney
Jersey Joe Walcott
Ezzard Charles
Floyd Patterson
George Foreman
Archie Moore
Joe Louis
Joe Frazier
Larry Holmes
Muhammad Ali

[gambler49]

Jack Johnson 12 rounds Lewis SD 15+ Johnson
Gene Tunney = Lewis MD
Jersey Joe Walcott = Lewis TKO 12
Ezzard Charles = Lewis TKO 11
Floyd Patterson = Lewis KO 7
George Foreman = Foreman KO 8
Archie Moore = Lewis KO 8
Joe Louis = Louis KO 9
Joe Frazier = Frazier TKO 11
Larry Holmes = Holmes MD
Muhammad Ali = Ali UD

[Goodnight, Irene]

Jack Johnson 12 rounds Lewis SD 15+ Johnson
Gene Tunney = Lewis MD
Jersey Joe Walcott = Lewis TKO 12
Ezzard Charles = Lewis TKO 11
Floyd Patterson = Lewis KO 7
George Foreman = Foreman KO 8
Archie Moore = Lewis KO 8
Joe Louis = Louis KO 9
Joe Frazier = Frazier TKO 11
Larry Holmes = Holmes MD
Muhammad Ali = Ali UD

Six wins & five losses for Lewis --- I agree.

Lewis beats Tunney, Walcott, Charles, Patterson, & Moore.

Loses to Foreman, Louis, Frazier, Holmes, & Ali.

He might lose to Walcott, but I wouldn't call it likely. He might beat Frazier & Holmes, but you'd get no money from me on it.

[dempseyfire]

He loses to Johnson, Ali, Holmes by decision amd Foreman Louis, and Frazier by KO.

Beats Tunney, Patterson and Moore.

I could see him and Walcott splitting fights. Ditto with Charles. I see the trouble a past-it Evander gave Lewis and I think Charles and Walcott at their best could definitely beat him via smart in and out boxing, sharp counters and movement. But Lewis could also turn the tide with one big right hand or uppercut at any time.

[Goodnight, Irene]

He loses to Johnson, Ali, Holmes by decision amd Foreman Louis, and Frazier by KO.

Beats Tunney, Patterson and Moore.

I could see him and Walcott splitting fights. Ditto with Charles. I see the trouble a past-it Evander gave Lewis and I think Charles and Walcott at their best could definitely beat him via smart in and out boxing, sharp counters and movement. But Lewis could also turn the tide with one big right hand or uppercut at any time.

At the same time, Lewis completely shellacked that same Holyfield (past his best, I know), so that one swings both ways...

[hitman09]

Jack Johnson- Lewis UD
Gene Tunney -Lewis KO
Jersey Joe Walcott -Walcott UD
Ezzard Charles -Charles UD (not sure about this one)
Floyd Patterson -Lewis KO
George Foreman -Foreman KO
Archie Moore -Lewis KO
Joe Louis -Louis KO
Joe Frazier Frazier KO
Larry Holmes -Holmes UD
Muhammad Ali -Ali KO

[skelp]

Jack Johnson - Lewis by KO3, clubbed JJ into submission.
Gene Tunney - Lewis KO2, power punching breaks Tunney in half.
Jersey Joe Walcott - Lewis KO5, finds it hard to land early on, but his uppercut catches Joe.
Ezzard Charles - Lewis KO2, Too big and strong.
Floyd Patterson - Lewis KO8, Floyd fights well, but; is overwhelmed by Lewis' strength.
George Foreman - Foreman by KO9, Lewis wins early rounds, but; gets complacent drops hands and bang!
Archie Moore - Lewis KO4, too big and powerful.
Joe Louis - Lewis KO6, he'll find it hard to land as Louis goes runs early on.
Joe Frazier - Lewis TKO10, Lewis shows good variety, his height saves him from Frazier's left hook.
Larry Holmes - Larry TKO11, Lewis' eye close because of the jab, but; Larry hits the deck but fires back hard.
Muhammad Ali - Ali UD12, Lewis is tormented all night, Ali does everything right.

[NazNaci1]

vs Jack Johnson W15
vs Gene Tunney W TKO13
vs Jersey Joe Walcott W TKO10
vs Ezzard Charles W15
vs Floyd Patterson W TKO8
vs George Foreman L KO5
vs Archie Moore W TKO 9
vs Joe Louis L KO 8
vs Joe Frazier L TKO 10
vs Larry Holmes L15
vs Muhammad Ali L15

Definately agree with most of you, Walcott and Charles are most certainly difficult opponents for Lewis. Although I pick Lewis to beat the pair of them, either of those guys on their game would give Lewis, serious, serious problems.

[dempseyfire]

He loses to Johnson, Ali, Holmes by decision amd Foreman Louis, and Frazier by KO.

Beats Tunney, Patterson and Moore.

I could see him and Walcott splitting fights. Ditto with Charles. I see the trouble a past-it Evander gave Lewis and I think Charles and Walcott at their best could definitely beat him via smart in and out boxing, sharp counters and movement. But Lewis could also turn the tide with one big right hand or uppercut at any time.

At the same time, Lewis completely shellacked that same Holyfield (past his best, I know), so that one swings both ways...

I think he won a very boring decision their first fight, and should've lost the rematch by a point, so 'shellacked' is a word I wouldn't describe for either fight.

[Goodnight, Irene]

At 10-1-1 for Lewis, I would.

[jezzamundo]

Lennox Lewis MD15 Jack Johnson
Lennox Lewis TKO8 Gene Tunney
Lennox Lewis KO8 Jersey Joe Walcott
Lennox Lewis KO7 Ezzard Charles
Lennox Lewis KO5 Floyd Patterson
George Foreman TKO3 Lennox Lewis - Lewis wins rematch by 8th round TKO
Lennox Lewis TKO7 Archie Moore
Lennox Lewis KO6 Joe Louis - Louis wins rematch by 2nd round KO
Lennox Lewis TKO9 Joe Frazier
Larry Holmes UD15 Lennox Lewis
Muhammad Ali UD15 Lennox Lewis

[Klee Gluckman]

Lewis can win all of these fights, he'd lose two of them, but I can't say which he could beat Ali, he would do it at 1 out of 3. He could beat Holmes who never beat anyone as good as Lewis. Tough calls here.

[dempseyfire]

At 10-1-1 for Lewis, I would.

I had it 7-4-1. Even the British commentators had it 8-4. Not an impressive night for either fighter IMO. The extent of the 'robbery' the fight was is completly blown out of proportion.

Can see that some of the Brits and Aussies here are over-rating Lennox a little here. Holmes never beat anyone as good as Lewis? Who the hell did Lennox beat who was as good as Holmes? And please don't say a shot, overweight, overly medicated Mike Tyson.

[Goodnight, Irene]

Lewis never did beat anyone as good as Holmes, no. I picked Holmes, but it's a competitive fight, alright.

[NazNaci1]

At 10-1-1 for Lewis, I would.

I had it 7-4-1. Even the British commentators had it 8-4. Not an impressive night for either fighter IMO. The extent of the 'robbery' the fight was is completly blown out of proportion.

Can see that some of the Brits and Aussies here are over-rating Lennox a little here. Holmes never beat anyone as good as Lewis? Who the hell did Lennox beat who was as good as Holmes? And please don't say a shot, overweight, overly medicated Mike Tyson.

I agree with you on Lewis - Holyfield I and definately his win over Tyson, which, personally I don't even classify as a decent win.

However Lewis was good heavyweight champ, who could hold his own with these guys. I wouldn't call it overrating, to be honest.

As the majority have listed, he wouldn't beat all these great fighters, but he would do ok and certainly Walcott, Charles and Patterson would very competitve and by no means a forgone conclusion.

[jezzamundo]

At 10-1-1 for Lewis, I would.

I had it 7-4-1. Even the British commentators had it 8-4. Not an impressive night for either fighter IMO. The extent of the 'robbery' the fight was is completly blown out of proportion.

Can see that some of the Brits and Aussies here are over-rating Lennox a little here. Holmes never beat anyone as good as Lewis? Who the hell did Lennox beat who was as good as Holmes? And please don't say a shot, overweight, overly medicated Mike Tyson.

I don't think Holmes ever beat anyone as good as a prime Lennox Lewis, but as you say, Lewis certainly never beat anyone as good as a prime Larry Holmes. The lack of an impressive win over a great opponent in his prime is the biggest weakness in Lewis's resume.

I completely agree with you on the first Lewis-Holyfield fight, I also scored it 7-4-1 to Lewis and agree that I was not impressed with either fighter - it was a boring fight that Lewis should have dominated had he chosen to be more aggressive. So no, it wasn't the landslide that some remember it to be, but it was still a blatant robbery and one of the worst I've seen.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

If Lewis would have fought aggressively Evander would have put him on his ass. Everytime he really pressed in those 24 rds he got the worst of it. Lennox fought very smart in those fights, boring as hell. But he could never win a firefight with Holyfield and he knew it.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Lewis can win all of these fights, he'd lose two of them, but I can't say which he could beat Ali, he would do it at 1 out of 3. He could beat Holmes who never beat anyone as good as Lewis. Tough calls here.

He couldn't beat Foreman imo.

[jezzamundo]

If Lewis would have fought aggressively Evander would have put him on his ass. Everytime he really pressed in those 24 rds he got the worst of it. Lennox fought very smart in those fights, boring as hell. But he could never win a firefight with Holyfield and he knew it.

Not out-and-out aggressively, but more aggressively than he did in the first fight. I'll agree, no way does Lennox survive a war with Evander like Bowe did, but particularly in the first fight, considering how poorly Holyfield was performing, Lennox should have stepped it up. Holyfield was much better in the rematch (the last glimpse of a great fighter, he only went downhill from there), Lewis was perhaps a little more aggressive than in the first and did get hurt in the middle rounds. One thing that Lewis had going for him against Holyfield is that Holyfield was not a huge puncher and his best punch, the left hook, was a punch that Lewis was good at blocking. I rate Lewis a little higher than most on this forum do (generally #7 or #8 of all-time) but I do believe he underperformed in both Holyfield fights.

[jezzamundo]

Lewis can win all of these fights, he'd lose two of them, but I can't say which he could beat Ali, he would do it at 1 out of 3. He could beat Holmes who never beat anyone as good as Lewis. Tough calls here.

He couldn't beat Foreman imo.

He certainly couldn't take Foreman's best punches, but I actually like Lewis in this matchup. I believe what it comes down to is who wins the battle of the jabs, Lewis has the faster longer jab, but Foreman has the harder and more consistent jab. Here's my overall breakdown:

Jab - even
Power - Foreman
Body Punching - Foreman (Lewis was quite adept and avoiding and taking body shots, I don't see this as a big factor)
Hand speed - Lewis
Foot speed - Lewis (negated by Foreman's ring-cutting, so relatively unimportant)
Chin - Foreman (Lewis has the power to put Foreman down repeatedly, Foreman only has to put Lewis down once)
Strength - even (this is a very important factor, neither will be able to physically bully the other)
Defense - Lewis (although vulnerable to the jab)
Strategy - Lewis (if it goes past the 5th I'll take Lewis 75% of the time)
Stamina - even (both below average in this regard for top heavyweights)

I tend to think that a fit and focused Lewis knocks out the best version of Foreman in the mid to late rounds after winning most of the rounds. This is why I had him beating George in a rematch after getting sparked in their first fight.

[Goodnight, Irene]

Lewis, IMO, too slow to get out of the way of a prime (& primed) Foreman, & it's a given Foreman's punches would fold him like an accordian.

Lewis had the smarts, style & mind-set to trouble someone like Foreman, but, at 6'5" & a whopping 245lbs (20-25lbs. heavier than even the peak Foreman), he's just too sluggish. Sooner or later, Foreman would connect. First round, second, third, fourth, wherever --- you can't beat Foreman with just the ideology of a Matador. You need his agility as well.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

If Lewis would have fought aggressively Evander would have put him on his ass. Everytime he really pressed in those 24 rds he got the worst of it. Lennox fought very smart in those fights, boring as hell. But he could never win a firefight with Holyfield and he knew it.

Not out-and-out aggressively, but more aggressively than he did in the first fight. I'll agree, no way does Lennox survive a war with Evander like Bowe did, but particularly in the first fight, considering how poorly Holyfield was performing, Lennox should have stepped it up. Holyfield was much better in the rematch (the last glimpse of a great fighter, he only went downhill from there), Lewis was perhaps a little more aggressive than in the first and did get hurt in the middle rounds. One thing that Lewis had going for him against Holyfield is that Holyfield was not a huge puncher and his best punch, the left hook, was a punch that Lewis was good at blocking. I rate Lewis a little higher than most on this forum do (generally #7 or #8 of all-time) but I do believe he underperformed in both Holyfield fights.

Lewis is in my top 10, Holyfield was a much bigger puncher than many give him credit for. Lennox was more vulnerable to right hands but I have no doubt that Holyfield was capable of stopping him with one shot. He never hit a guy he didn't hurt.

[Heartbreak_Kid79]

Jack Johnson - Lewis W12
Gene Tunney - Lewis KO6
Jersey Joe Walcott- Lewis KO9
Ezzard Charles - Leiws KO9
Floyd Patterson - Leiws KO3
George Foreman - Foreman KO5
Archie Moore - Lewis KO4
Joe Louis - Louis W12
Joe Frazier - Lewis W12
Larry Holmes - Holmes w12
Muhammad Ali - Ali W12

[Heartbreak_Kid79]

Evander would have put him on his ass. Everytime he really pressed in those 24 rds he got the worst of it.

Evanders headbutts are a powerful weopan

[The Great John L]

Lewis, IMO, too slow to get out of the way of a prime (& primed) Foreman, & it's a given Foreman's punches would fold him like an accordian.

Lewis had the smarts, style & mind-set to trouble someone like Foreman, but, at 6'5" & a whopping 245lbs (20-25lbs. heavier than even the peak Foreman), he's just too sluggish. Sooner or later, Foreman would connect. First round, second, third, fourth, wherever --- you can't beat Foreman with just the ideology of a Matador. You need his agility as well.

That makes sense. Foreman's stamina wasn't as bad as most suggest, and as long as he kept his composure, he would have had enough late that eventually I think Lennox gets stopped. There is also a small possibility of George getting busted up as he moves forward with a possible Lewis stoppage, but I think that's a much less likely ending.

If they fought 5 times, George probably takes 4 of them.