sauersausage says there's no contract, written or verbal.
they say the bout is to take place in europe, in the most economically viable place, wherever that id. they say they're confident that it'd happen, if necessary on neutral soil.
still, sauersausage has to fighters in the super 6. for bith of them to get home adv vs froch is pushing it a bit, if it happens.
i reckon sauer's plans changed after abraham lost to dirrell.
Froch Delusional?
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mickey1975
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 23116
- Joined: 02 Mar 2009, 12:54
Re: Froch Delusional?
Didnt everyone on here laugh at Fwank when he claimed various verbal contracts with all the boxers who left him?GOmez,have a look round all the major boxing websites,nobody is calling it a robbery or even controversial.One bloke from Showtime scores for Froch and thats it,he must be right!Start a poll,mate.
Re: Froch Delusional?
I was very impressed with Kessler from start to finish, but it was still a very close fight and after initially frowning upon Froch's post fight comment (had it been in the uk he would have got the decision), he's not far from the truth at all. Maybe he could have worded it better, but 5 minutes after a blistering war and Froch being Froch he just comes out with it.
It was tremendous spectacle and both Froch and Kessler served up a classic for the fans.
Out of the two of them, i reckon it's Froch who can improve on his performance, should they meet again in the super 6.
It was tremendous spectacle and both Froch and Kessler served up a classic for the fans.
Out of the two of them, i reckon it's Froch who can improve on his performance, should they meet again in the super 6.
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WelshDevil
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 536
- Joined: 18 Sep 2006, 14:23
Re: Froch Delusional?
Very good fight and the right man won. Fair play to Kessler.
I didn't understand why Carl kept fighting on the backfoot? He doesn't have the accuracy to be effective and wasn't. I was expecting him to go forward alot more and try and impose himself on Mikkel.
Maybe a case of wrong tactics?
Not good to hear fighters complain so much about a decision that in my eyes was fair. The better fighter won. I thought beforehand that Froch would beat the slightly faded Dane but Mikkel raised his game.
After Froch's comments before the fight aimed at Joe saying Calzaghe hadn't beaten anyone. Well, Carl.... Joe managed to beat a better version of Kessler.
Both lost a a few early rounds but Calzaghe was able to adapt - Carl sadly couldn't.
I didn't understand why Carl kept fighting on the backfoot? He doesn't have the accuracy to be effective and wasn't. I was expecting him to go forward alot more and try and impose himself on Mikkel.
Maybe a case of wrong tactics?
Not good to hear fighters complain so much about a decision that in my eyes was fair. The better fighter won. I thought beforehand that Froch would beat the slightly faded Dane but Mikkel raised his game.
After Froch's comments before the fight aimed at Joe saying Calzaghe hadn't beaten anyone. Well, Carl.... Joe managed to beat a better version of Kessler.
Both lost a a few early rounds but Calzaghe was able to adapt - Carl sadly couldn't.
Last edited by WelshDevil on 26 Apr 2010, 23:55, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Froch Delusional?
there's nothing wrong in not wanting too concede defeat.I think froch succumbs to his own pressures, he puts himself under.his slow starting i feel is a sighn of it.
i aint seen the fight, but by listening to mcracken after the fight & reading reports i wasnt suprised from froch going into a shell like he would in the ams at top level almost allowing the opponent to win.
i think the loss will give froch the kick in the rear he needs.
i aint seen the fight, but by listening to mcracken after the fight & reading reports i wasnt suprised from froch going into a shell like he would in the ams at top level almost allowing the opponent to win.
i think the loss will give froch the kick in the rear he needs.
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mickey1975
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 23116
- Joined: 02 Mar 2009, 12:54
Re: Froch Delusional?
Carl is at it again in todays The Sun."The home-town decisions in this competition have been a disgrace",only one has been conroversial for me...He is going on about eating on the Wednesday when he thought the fight was off,despite bragging for years how he never blows up and even eating breakfast on the day of the weigh in on 360(and gloating at the camera).He also went 12 with an absoloute legend,apparently.No mention of Ward or Calzaghe schooling him.Fortunately,he could meet Kessler in the semis and now knows "how to beat him easy" 
Re: Froch Delusional?
Calzaghe didn't really school him, he just beat him.mickey1975 wrote:No mention of Ward or Calzaghe schooling him.
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damianhucker1
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 3071
- Joined: 20 Sep 2008, 17:36
Re: Froch Delusional?
im a big fan of roch , but when i read this mormning that even after watching the fight over and over again he still thinks he got robbed , i felt he must be crackers, if he knows anything about scoring a bout he should know he lost , plain and simple . i still maintain he deserved to win vs dirrell but in no way did he beat kessler , he thinks he won by 2 or 3 rounds , not a chance carl.
Re: Froch Delusional?
I agree with you there damian. Froch beat dirrell but unfortunately got beat by kessler. he seemed to admire his own work instead of tryinh to stop kessler.damianhucker1 wrote:im a big fan of roch , but when i read this mormning that even after watching the fight over and over again he still thinks he got robbed , i felt he must be crackers, if he knows anything about scoring a bout he should know he lost , plain and simple . i still maintain he deserved to win vs dirrell but in no way did he beat kessler , he thinks he won by 2 or 3 rounds , not a chance carl.
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Terminator666
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 1665
- Joined: 06 Nov 2007, 10:18
Re: Froch Delusional?
A defeats been coming for a while now where Frochs concerned. Even going back to the Taylor fight he got out of jail. Then the Dirrel fight and finally he gets beaten. Cant see him beating AA either regardless of where the fight is held.
Re: Froch Delusional?
In this weeks BN, he seems as delusional as ever ... he apparently has re-watched the fight. And states he scored it in an unbiased way 
... made himself a winner by 2-3rnds 
... he does add it was a close fight
More interestingly .. is his critism of Hennessy ... if his hands were not so tied .. I really see him looking elsewhere.....
... made himself a winner by 2-3rnds ... he does add it was a close fight More interestingly .. is his critism of Hennessy ... if his hands were not so tied .. I really see him looking elsewhere.....
Re: Froch Delusional?
Has he scored the Dirrel fight yet.
For me, still, Dirrell won that fight more clearly than Kessler beat Froch.
For me, still, Dirrell won that fight more clearly than Kessler beat Froch.
Re: Froch Delusional?
I had Dirrell ahead by 4 rounds, it might have even been 5 if my memory serves me correctlystujones wrote:Has he scored the Dirrel fight yet.
For me, still, Dirrell won that fight more clearly than Kessler beat Froch.
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mickey1975
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 23116
- Joined: 02 Mar 2009, 12:54
Re: Froch Delusional?
Fair comment,but Joe adapted after a close first six rounds to kick on and win fairly comfortably.Horse wrote:Calzaghe didn't really school him, he just beat him.mickey1975 wrote:No mention of Ward or Calzaghe schooling him.
Re: Froch Delusional?
Yep, completely agree.stujones wrote:Has he scored the Dirrel fight yet.
For me, still, Dirrell won that fight more clearly than Kessler beat Froch.
Re: Froch Delusional?
He schooled him in the sense it was an education for the Dane and he prob learned as much in that defeat than in all his wins put together, but it was still a very competitive fight. Kessler weren't beat up at all more, old manned out of itmickey1975 wrote:Fair comment,but Joe adapted after a close first six rounds to kick on and win fairly comfortably.Horse wrote:Calzaghe didn't really school him, he just beat him.mickey1975 wrote:No mention of Ward or Calzaghe schooling him.
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Spud
- Heavyweight
Re: Froch Delusional?
I had Kessler winning the fight - comfortably - however with that said:
Carl Froch is a class boxer - just because of one loss against a world class operator the knives are out.
Throughout his career Froch has been matched relatively toughly and has the proud distinction of winning a reputable world title belt in a tough division.
As for the slaggings of his promoter - they are also uncalled for - Hennessy is the man who got Froch in the position in the first place.
Very easy to slate a boxer when he has lost.
Next please .....
Carl Froch is a class boxer - just because of one loss against a world class operator the knives are out.
Throughout his career Froch has been matched relatively toughly and has the proud distinction of winning a reputable world title belt in a tough division.
As for the slaggings of his promoter - they are also uncalled for - Hennessy is the man who got Froch in the position in the first place.
Very easy to slate a boxer when he has lost.
Next please .....
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mickey1975
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 23116
- Joined: 02 Mar 2009, 12:54
Re: Froch Delusional?
But a lot of posters were predicting his downfall and slating him long before the Kessler fight.Everyone has given him credit for taking entering the tournament,but,after one loss,he is thinking of pulling out due to a non-controversial defeat.All the kudos he has got for his willingness to box anyone will dissapear if he refuses to box AA.And,lets face it,it would generate more in Germany,and who would blame THEM for refusing to come here after what happened to Dirrell(by far the most controversial decision in the Super 6).Spud wrote:I had Kessler winning the fight - comfortably - however with that said:
Carl Froch is a class boxer - just because of one loss against a world class operator the knives are out.
Throughout his career Froch has been matched relatively toughly and has the proud distinction of winning a reputable world title belt in a tough division.
As for the slaggings of his promoter - they are also uncalled for - Hennessy is the man who got Froch in the position in the first place.
Very easy to slate a boxer when he has lost.
Next please .....
Re: Froch Delusional?
Spud wrote: As for the slaggings of his promoter - they are also uncalled for - Hennessy is the man who got Froch in the position in the first place.
Spud, if you really believe that it's you who is delusional.Re: Froch Delusional?
Spud
In relation to slagging off Hennesey - although I'd prefer to use the term "justifiable criticism" rather than getting emotive, the two main issues people have raised about Mick have also been cited by Froch, namely:
1. Lack of TV exposure. Blame the world economy, falling boxing budgets, TV slots or whatever, but it is still amazing to me that Froch gets shunted onto a new, unknown channel (actually that's not to critice them, well done for having the commercial confidence to go for it and bring the fight to us). Even with these macro-economic factors, it is impossible not to form the view that the TV exposure would have been very different had he been with a rival promoter. A perfect counterpoint is Kevin Mitchell: outside crowd, Sky backing and much more media coverage. One can perhaps admire Froch's loyalty to Hennesey in not signing with Warren, Hatton Promotions etc (although query, given point 2 below), but it has resulted in less TV exposure and therefore, one assumes less revenue for Froch.
2. The handshake agreement for the next fight. This week's Boxing News makes it clear that Froch is rightly annoyed by this. It is sloppy, unprofessional and almost laughable that someone could think the geographical location for an event generating seven figures is agreed by a handshake and not a written contract. No major promoter would do business like that.
Loynesy
In relation to slagging off Hennesey - although I'd prefer to use the term "justifiable criticism" rather than getting emotive, the two main issues people have raised about Mick have also been cited by Froch, namely:
1. Lack of TV exposure. Blame the world economy, falling boxing budgets, TV slots or whatever, but it is still amazing to me that Froch gets shunted onto a new, unknown channel (actually that's not to critice them, well done for having the commercial confidence to go for it and bring the fight to us). Even with these macro-economic factors, it is impossible not to form the view that the TV exposure would have been very different had he been with a rival promoter. A perfect counterpoint is Kevin Mitchell: outside crowd, Sky backing and much more media coverage. One can perhaps admire Froch's loyalty to Hennesey in not signing with Warren, Hatton Promotions etc (although query, given point 2 below), but it has resulted in less TV exposure and therefore, one assumes less revenue for Froch.
2. The handshake agreement for the next fight. This week's Boxing News makes it clear that Froch is rightly annoyed by this. It is sloppy, unprofessional and almost laughable that someone could think the geographical location for an event generating seven figures is agreed by a handshake and not a written contract. No major promoter would do business like that.
Loynesy
Re: Froch Delusional?
I know 100% Carl is prepared to go and fight anyone, anywhere - but is rightly digging his heels in this time.
Put yourself in his shoes, you get told to go to Denmark and in return Abraham comes to the UK.
You honour your perceived side of the agreement and then they say 'sorry, don't ever recall us coming to the UK...it will be Berlin' and then when you review the fight at home and you watch yourself winning more than your fair share of the first 10 rounds... and then you see a crack pot, handle bar moustache wanker like Tilleman giving you 1 round from the first 10 - you'd be pretty pissed off too.
He's putting it out there, to all concerned, that you have all collectively screwed up and they need to sort the f***** out.
Let's say he goes to Germany, pounds Abraham, but the German makes the final bell... they will screw him over, of which there is little doubt about that.
I think Hennessy and Saulerland started out honourable.
But since then, Kessler and Abraham have both been rumped by god damn awful, unqualified and piss poor referees since they fought abroad. Kessler took 8 headbutts and had both his eyes split open and then Abraham was discreetly manoeuvred out of legit knockdown and the controversial DQ.
Saulerland have now thought 'balls to this' and are now backing their fighters in any possible way. The spirit of the competition has changed and who can blame them?
They know Arthur is huge in Germany and to pack him off to the UK for another fight on the road is not really doing the best by their fighter. If they can get him the fight at home then that's a great advantage and they're prepared to stick two fingers up at Hennessy to provide this for their man.
If Arthur had won abroad it would not be quite as political, but he lost and its obvious that if they can fight in Berlin....and flesh out the judging panel with Tillemans etc then he will only have to go through the motions on the night, stay off the floor and put a few shots together and he will win the fight.
Carl realises all of the above is stating "no way are you getting me to Germany. I will pull the f*** out rather than go and get robbed out there." That's not being dramatic, it's being upfront and realistic about his chances.
He wont pull out, he loves the competition and the great fighters in it. What he doesn't love is poorly organised arrangments and handshake deals.. and judges with massive moustaches patting Kessler on the back at the weigh in, laughing and joking with Mikkel and then walking straight past him.
Put yourself in his shoes, you get told to go to Denmark and in return Abraham comes to the UK.
You honour your perceived side of the agreement and then they say 'sorry, don't ever recall us coming to the UK...it will be Berlin' and then when you review the fight at home and you watch yourself winning more than your fair share of the first 10 rounds... and then you see a crack pot, handle bar moustache wanker like Tilleman giving you 1 round from the first 10 - you'd be pretty pissed off too.
He's putting it out there, to all concerned, that you have all collectively screwed up and they need to sort the f***** out.
Let's say he goes to Germany, pounds Abraham, but the German makes the final bell... they will screw him over, of which there is little doubt about that.
I think Hennessy and Saulerland started out honourable.
But since then, Kessler and Abraham have both been rumped by god damn awful, unqualified and piss poor referees since they fought abroad. Kessler took 8 headbutts and had both his eyes split open and then Abraham was discreetly manoeuvred out of legit knockdown and the controversial DQ.
Saulerland have now thought 'balls to this' and are now backing their fighters in any possible way. The spirit of the competition has changed and who can blame them?
They know Arthur is huge in Germany and to pack him off to the UK for another fight on the road is not really doing the best by their fighter. If they can get him the fight at home then that's a great advantage and they're prepared to stick two fingers up at Hennessy to provide this for their man.
If Arthur had won abroad it would not be quite as political, but he lost and its obvious that if they can fight in Berlin....and flesh out the judging panel with Tillemans etc then he will only have to go through the motions on the night, stay off the floor and put a few shots together and he will win the fight.
Carl realises all of the above is stating "no way are you getting me to Germany. I will pull the f*** out rather than go and get robbed out there." That's not being dramatic, it's being upfront and realistic about his chances.
He wont pull out, he loves the competition and the great fighters in it. What he doesn't love is poorly organised arrangments and handshake deals.. and judges with massive moustaches patting Kessler on the back at the weigh in, laughing and joking with Mikkel and then walking straight past him.
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Spud
- Heavyweight
Re: Froch Delusional?
Deserter,
Hennessy, McCracken and Froch plotted the way in which Froch's career would go from the very outset - that career path worked to a treat and if you and others dig up the many posts the one fighter I stated Froch should not fight until the end of his career it was Kessler - a fighter who I also have always rated - thus my viewpoint is there is absolutely no shame in losing a good fight in a hostile atmosphere - also against a fighter who many people had him running Calzaghe very close indeed.
Criticise Hennessy all you want but in the case of Froch he has done his job - in that he got Froch fights for the maximum earning potential - please in your eagerness to have a go, remember I personally do not have a lot of time for Hennessy but if there was one boxer in the Hennessy stable who has benefitted its Froch - he has earned a lot of cash - much more than many in his position have that is quite simply a FACT. It is rumoured/alledged that to keep Froch within the stable Hennessy made Froch an offer which ensured he did not need to look too much elsewhere.
Loynsey,
Your post is a very good one - I remain totally convinced that Hennessy has always had his boxers best interests at heart - what a lot of people cannot grasp is in negoitiations to gain "home" advantage there needs to be the TV revenue in the bag before you go into either private negoitiations or purse bids - Hennessy has always been hampered by the reluctance of TV executives wanting to give him a lucrative TV deal despite the progression of Froch - If there was one area of weakness in my opinion Hennessy had it was his diplomacy when dealing with these people - whenever I was in earshot of Hennessy he was never prepared to "suck up" to anyone - or to put it another way - he was never prepared "to sell his granny" to get on - yes okay others have been and thats perhaps why they have the contracts.
However - what I find utterly flabberghasting is many many people on here only a short time ago had Hennessy as their man who was going to overtake Mr W arren in the promotional stakes - many people complimented Hennessy quite rightly too on the top quality and competitive shows he put on, on a regular basis.
With regards to the "handshake" comments - Dennis Hobson always did his agreements with Clinton Woods on this basis and he also did in other areas which many would argue was his downfall - you could argue when Hennessy shook hands he was relying on the honesty and integrity of others he shook hands with - whilst yes in the "dishonest" world of boxing this was a massively wrong - but for Hennessy to be honest and to have his integrity still intact for me speaks volumes.
Boxing is a horrible murky world - Hennessy is being criticised for his inability to "suck up" to TV executives and relying on the honesty and integrity of others - should you and others be looking at other people rather than Meaty Mick????
Hennessy, McCracken and Froch plotted the way in which Froch's career would go from the very outset - that career path worked to a treat and if you and others dig up the many posts the one fighter I stated Froch should not fight until the end of his career it was Kessler - a fighter who I also have always rated - thus my viewpoint is there is absolutely no shame in losing a good fight in a hostile atmosphere - also against a fighter who many people had him running Calzaghe very close indeed.
Criticise Hennessy all you want but in the case of Froch he has done his job - in that he got Froch fights for the maximum earning potential - please in your eagerness to have a go, remember I personally do not have a lot of time for Hennessy but if there was one boxer in the Hennessy stable who has benefitted its Froch - he has earned a lot of cash - much more than many in his position have that is quite simply a FACT. It is rumoured/alledged that to keep Froch within the stable Hennessy made Froch an offer which ensured he did not need to look too much elsewhere.
Loynsey,
Your post is a very good one - I remain totally convinced that Hennessy has always had his boxers best interests at heart - what a lot of people cannot grasp is in negoitiations to gain "home" advantage there needs to be the TV revenue in the bag before you go into either private negoitiations or purse bids - Hennessy has always been hampered by the reluctance of TV executives wanting to give him a lucrative TV deal despite the progression of Froch - If there was one area of weakness in my opinion Hennessy had it was his diplomacy when dealing with these people - whenever I was in earshot of Hennessy he was never prepared to "suck up" to anyone - or to put it another way - he was never prepared "to sell his granny" to get on - yes okay others have been and thats perhaps why they have the contracts.
However - what I find utterly flabberghasting is many many people on here only a short time ago had Hennessy as their man who was going to overtake Mr W arren in the promotional stakes - many people complimented Hennessy quite rightly too on the top quality and competitive shows he put on, on a regular basis.
With regards to the "handshake" comments - Dennis Hobson always did his agreements with Clinton Woods on this basis and he also did in other areas which many would argue was his downfall - you could argue when Hennessy shook hands he was relying on the honesty and integrity of others he shook hands with - whilst yes in the "dishonest" world of boxing this was a massively wrong - but for Hennessy to be honest and to have his integrity still intact for me speaks volumes.
Boxing is a horrible murky world - Hennessy is being criticised for his inability to "suck up" to TV executives and relying on the honesty and integrity of others - should you and others be looking at other people rather than Meaty Mick????
Last edited by Spud on 22 May 2010, 05:47, edited 2 times in total.
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alexpaterson
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 4310
- Joined: 22 Feb 2009, 11:22
Re: Froch Delusional?
I cant stand him, he clearly lost that fight but he cant just say that, he was either robbed or his ear was playing up. He should learn to take defeat
Re: Froch Delusional?
Spud, here's where we have to disagree completely. I think Froch would have earned more through going elsewhere. Crucially, he would also have generated far more money through a higher public profile - sponsorships etc. He's now the face of a clothing brand called onetruesaxon but how ridiculously late in the day is that compared to his achievements and given it's a niche brand, it's not going to be particuarly lucrative either. Contrast that with the type of money Naz was generating through the likes of adidas.Spud wrote: Criticise Hennessy all you want but in the case of Froch he has done his job - in that he got Froch fights for the maximum earning potential
As Loynesy has already indicated, the 'gentlemen's agreement' re. the AA fight is also shockingly inept.
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Spud
- Heavyweight
Re: Froch Delusional?
Deserter,
Thank you for the reply - you say inept - I say Hennessy was relying on someone's honesty and integrity - trusting someone is hardly a bad trait is it?
If people were to say Hennessy was naive to believe people he shook hands with would be honest or keep to their word then fine.
If Abraham does not come to the UK to fight then I truly believe Froch should tell them to stick the fight up their arse and pull out of the tournament - whilst I believe Froch is incorrect and out of order not to have given Kessler for winning the fight - he believe he would be correct to withdraw as a matter of principle.
Thank you for the reply - you say inept - I say Hennessy was relying on someone's honesty and integrity - trusting someone is hardly a bad trait is it?
If people were to say Hennessy was naive to believe people he shook hands with would be honest or keep to their word then fine.
If Abraham does not come to the UK to fight then I truly believe Froch should tell them to stick the fight up their arse and pull out of the tournament - whilst I believe Froch is incorrect and out of order not to have given Kessler for winning the fight - he believe he would be correct to withdraw as a matter of principle.