Graziano/ LaMotta

tonyevs · Post by **tonyevs** » 29 Mar 2005, 16:20

Why didn`t these two ever fight each other, both came from similar backgrounds and the same place yet didn`t face each other in the ring.

What a fight it would have been though, and an even better one outside of the ropes.

KOJOE90 · Post by **KOJOE90** » 29 Mar 2005, 16:23

tonyevs wrote:Why didn`t these two ever fight each other, both came from similar backgrounds and the same place yet didn`t face each other in the ring.

What a fight it would have been though, and an even better one outside of the ropes.

I understand they were very good friends and so didn't want to fight each other.

I am sure they even did national service together but I may be wrong on that point.

But yes it would have been a great fight, but I lean towards a LaMotta victory.

tonyevs · Post by **tonyevs** » 29 Mar 2005, 16:36

Yes LaMotta did have the stamina and chin to outlast Rocky.

I wouldn`t think he`d have served in the military with Rocky, Graziano didn`t stay there too long, he was at the military prison longer if I remember rightly.
Rocky says he did a bit in juvenile with him, but I`m not sure how friendly they were during their fighting days.

In or out of the ring only Mickey Walker or the Great Greb would rate for toughness next to these two.

KOJOE90 · Post by **KOJOE90** » 29 Mar 2005, 16:39

tonyevs wrote:Rocky says he did a bit in juvenile with him,.

That may be what I was thinking of.

We Wuz Robbed · Post by **We Wuz Robbed** » 29 Mar 2005, 18:27

A LaMotta/Graziano was ready to go, contracts signed, training camp started.

In his book LaMotta says that as champion he wanted Graziano before Robinson because he knew a LaMotta/Graziano fight would be worth more money than a sixth Robinson fight. LaMotta being friends with Graziano (and partners in crime when they were kids) offered Graziano a sweet percentage and Graziano signed on the dotted line.

But while training for the Graziano fight up in the Catskills, LaMotta got word that the fight was off -- Graziano in training camp broke his hand.

The fight was a go, but unfortunately boxing fans never got to see a LaMotta/Graziano battle.

Chuck1052 · Post by **Chuck1052** » 29 Mar 2005, 19:42

Jake LaMotta would have big advantages in skill, strength,
and durability over Rocky Graziano. Heck! LaMotta was a
much better fighter who fought much, much better opposition.
It is my belief that Sugar Ray Robinson, Charley Burley,
Marcel Cerdan, and Tony Zale were better fighters than
Graziano, too. As a result, LaMotta would have destroyed
Graziano in a bout between the two.

Jaclem · Post by **Jaclem** » 29 Mar 2005, 23:59

..the inside word was that it was mostly hype...to keep their names in the paper....they were good friends...although later jake said he would have foght rocky to give rocky a shot at a good purse.

but...if they had fought it would not have been a great one or a competitive one. if he went all out jake would have battered graziano all over the ring . rocky was a small middleweight...liked to come in at about 154..and jake was a light heavy squeezed into a middleweight's body. graziano's most spectacular kayos were over welterweights. made his middle reputation against zale....and even there he won only one out of three. his big punch was his right hand, which would have bounced of lamotta's chin. plus, for all his brawling style, jake was amuch better boxer.

klompton · Post by **klompton** » 30 Mar 2005, 00:38

The REAL inside word was that Grazianos handlers wanted the fight for monetary reasons and when Graziano realized that LaMotta was ready and willing to break him in half Graziano punched a tree and broke his hand to get out of the fight.

LaMotta would have put an ass whipping on Graziano. Graziano was the best middleweight in the welterweight division. He was NEVER the best middleweight in the middleweight division.

tonyevs · Post by **tonyevs** » 30 Mar 2005, 12:17

klompton wrote: Graziano was the best middleweight in the welterweight division. He was NEVER the best middleweight in the middleweight division.

Bold statement there, aren`t the best welters almost always referred to as the best middles eg. Sugar Ray
Mickey Walker
Charley Burley

klompton · Post by **klompton** » 30 Mar 2005, 13:27

Maybe but I didnt refer to him as the best welter. I refered to him as the best middleweight in the welterweight division. By this I mean that he spent his career feasting on smaller fighters in order to build up his record. Even then he often lost to the best guys he faced. At middleweight he was nothing more than an exciting fighter. LaMotta would walked through him.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 30 Mar 2005, 18:12

klompton wrote:The REAL inside word was that Grazianos handlers wanted the fight for monetary reasons and when Graziano realized that LaMotta was ready and willing to break him in half Graziano punched a tree and broke his hand to get out of the fight.

LaMotta would have put an ass whipping on Graziano. Graziano was the best middleweight in the welterweight division. He was NEVER the best middleweight in the middleweight division.

While I agree that Lamotta would have beaten Graziano I think your put down of Graziano is too harsh... firstly Graziano was a formidable fighter and I think he would have given Jake a good fight, he wouldn't just have been blown away... also Tony Zale was a middleweight unless I'm mistaken and Graziano baet him for the world title so yes he did beat middleweights too and to say otherwise is simply silly and unfair to a great fighter.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 30 Mar 2005, 18:14

Also its worth pointing out that Graziano was quite a small middleweight not scaling more than 154 normally in his prime...

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 30 Mar 2005, 18:16

Even a shot Graziano managed to give Robinson a scare when he floored him... few fighters managed to floor Ray.

Jaclem · Post by **Jaclem** » 31 Mar 2005, 02:58

......lamotta fought twelve years and about a hundred fights before he was knocked off his feet....by the hard hitting light heavy danny nardico.

robinson couldn't put him down....in six fights. irish bob murphy ..light heavy puncher...couldn't put him down..when jake was past his prime. the great lloyd marshall couldn't put him down. bob satterfield......BOB SATTERFIELD!!!!!!...couldn't put him down. even when he went into the tank against billy fox he just sat on the ropes and let fox hit him over and over until the referee stopped it...his pride wouldn't let him hit the canvas,

there is no way...no way....that graziano...a terror among welterweights...could have put any hurt on lamotta.....and if rocky couldn't hurt you he was hardly going to stick and move his way to a decision. in short....lamotta blows rocky out of the ring.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 31 Mar 2005, 06:16

Jaclem wrote:......lamotta fought twelve years and about a hundred fights before he was knocked off his feet....by the hard hitting light heavy danny nardico.

robinson couldn't put him down....in six fights. irish bob murphy ..light heavy puncher...couldn't put him down..when jake was past his prime. the great lloyd marshall couldn't put him down. bob satterfield......BOB SATTERFIELD!!!!!!...couldn't put him down. even when he went into the tank against billy fox he just sat on the ropes and let fox hit him over and over until the referee stopped it...his pride wouldn't let him hit the canvas,

there is no way...no way....that graziano...a terror among welterweights...could have put any hurt on lamotta.....and if rocky couldn't hurt you he was hardly going to stick and move his way to a decision. in short....lamotta blows rocky out of the ring.

I'm not saying Graziano would win but it wouldn't be a walkover... Rocky would give Jake a war before being stopped in the later rounds.
Also to say Graziano only fought Welterweights is unfair.

tonyevs · Post by **tonyevs** » 31 Mar 2005, 12:52

For sure Graziano was basicaly a crude puncher, but a very brave and exciting one who loved a tear up as much as the spectators loved to watch it.
But as big a favourite as LaMotta would have justifiably been an upset would not have come as that big a surprise.

I happen to think this could have been one of the most brutal fights ever, Jake takes the big Graziano right hands, and mauls Graziano to a halt in the middle to late rounds, blood and guts for sure..

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 31 Mar 2005, 17:09

tonyevs wrote:For sure Graziano was basicaly a crude puncher, but a very brave and exciting one who loved a tear up as much as the spectators loved to watch it.
But as big a favourite as LaMotta would have justifiably been an upset would not have come as that big a surprise.

I happen to think this could have been one of the most brutal fights ever, Jake takes the big Graziano right hands, and mauls Graziano to a halt in the middle to late rounds, blood and guts for sure..

Graziano was basic but he had great power and at his best would fight like a madman... I've no doubt that he and Jake would go toe to toe and it would have been a very brutal and bloody fight for both... with Jake wearing Rocky down but not before he'd been in a real war.

Graziano/ LaMotta

Graziano/ LaMotta

Re: Graziano/ LaMotta

LaMotta vs. Graziano