Has Braithwaite F'd up?

J · Post by J » 04 Apr 2005, 08:55

no certainly not, he undoubtedly isnt ready for such fights, and theres a big difference between taking on a perceived shot 40 yr old ex world champ which thompson was and the present 4 time defending WBA and now WBC champ of course Haye will get done over.

you arent comparing like for like. to suggest haye would fight mormeck is, i repeat throwing him to the lions at this stage. Another 2 years and it might be different but not yet. For all the talk i dont see them doing so neither.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 04 Apr 2005, 08:56

Let's hope so. Another big loss at this stage could be a career wrecker, and could really dent Haye mentally.

It's hard to know where to pitch Haye next.

J · Post by J » 04 Apr 2005, 08:58

he sure needs rounds btu we have been saying that for a year.
he did look good against kelly tho.

hobson ideally but that wont happen.

Bard of Boxrec · Post by **Bard of Boxrec** » 04 Apr 2005, 09:04

At least Haye would have a REAL puncher's chance, as opposed to Braithwaite who proved that he wasn't the monster hitter everyone had previously said.

Haye's power is real.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 04 Apr 2005, 09:26

Or is it? He didn't manage to stop Thompson after all, and generally the people he has been knocking out have been vastly inferior to Mormeck. The Kelly win was tainted by the fact Kelly was all over the place in his previous bout.

J · Post by J » 04 Apr 2005, 09:39

think thompsons chin is just out of this world to be honest, totally unreal.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 04 Apr 2005, 09:42

J wrote:think thompsons chin is just out of this world to be honest, totally unreal.

Ezra Sellars would disagree. He may have "played possom" when hurt in the past, but he was out that fight.

J · Post by J » 04 Apr 2005, 09:47

so you think thompson has ap oor chin then?

sellers really does bang tho and that once could just be the shot, i cant think of any other active british fighter who has taken as much punishment as thompson and stood up to it. not at the top level.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 04 Apr 2005, 10:01

Not one?

Wayne McCullough,

Chris Eubank,

Steve Collins.

Never said Thompson had a poor chin, just don't think it is unbelivable. He goes down, and gets hurt (not just flash KD) quite easily. If Rothman or Haye had a bit more patience they would have stopped him (might have been on his feet), if Eubank had a bit more devil he might have stopped him also.

He runs the risk of getting stopped too many times to say he is playing possom. For me, he was periously close to being stopped vs Haye and Rothman - infact I think there was more of a case for the stoppage there than it was for Nelson vs Thompson.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 04 Apr 2005, 10:04

Agreed. Thompson may be wobbled easily, but hurt, not on your life. He took some thunderous shots off of Haye, but was smart enough to ride the effect of many of them out by ducking and sliding away.

I think Thompson has an excellent chin too, but I also think that perhaps Haye's power is overrated. The better fighters aren't going to just stand there and take flush shots.

Sellers was a phenomenal puncher at cruiserweight, especially early in fights, you only have to look at his KO record to see that. He had Nelson on the floor in their fight.

One KO to a murderous puncher certainly doesn't make you chinny. It's like saying that Holmes was chinny for getting decked by shavers.

J · Post by J » 04 Apr 2005, 10:06

no i know you didnt stu was being deliberately ott. hence the little smiley.
also, the key word being "active" Stu.
ill give you mccullough though.

Lefthookhappy19 · Post by **Lefthookhappy19** » 04 Apr 2005, 11:01

I think Haye's power is better as he said himself when he doesn't force the punches and just lets them flow. His timing isn't their when he goes out forcing the knockout like against Thompson.

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 04 Apr 2005, 14:19

Haye's power is overrated.

Thompson can take some puishment alright, but if Haye was the world class puncher everyone claimed he'd have put Thompson to sleep with that amount of leather he landed. His power has looked good in the circles he has been mixing but once he steps up he won't be knocking that many out.

I really dont think Haye is as good as everyone makes out, there's more to being a top fighter than talent, you've got to have the dedication which in all honesty he has lacked thus far.

Manos de Oro · Post by **Manos de Oro** » 04 Apr 2005, 14:50

nickd wrote:Haye's power is overrated.

Thompson can take some puishment alright, but if Haye was the world class puncher everyone claimed he'd have put Thompson to sleep with that amount of leather he landed. His power has looked good in the circles he has been mixing but once he steps up he won't be knocking that many out.

I really dont think Haye is as good as everyone makes out, there's more to being a top fighter than talent, you've got to have the dedication which in all honesty he has lacked thus far.

Indeed, I'm not convinced Haye hits harder than Braithwaite. It's all to do with levels. The dangerous thing is that he himself hasn't realised that it doesn't matter how hard you punch, there's always going to be someone who takes you the distance. Happens to virtually all big punching prospects who go on to big success. When Haye said in his post-fight interview after the Kelly fight 'nobody can take that power', or something to that effect, alarm bells should have been going off in Adam Booth's head... were they? Time will tell...

Ideally, like J says, Haye should go for the big boys in a year and a half or two years from now; build up a good resume and absorb the experience having proper titles brings, before he goes on to challenge the best. But from the way he talks himself up I don't think it's entirely improbable that his ego will push him into a big fight after four or five more blowouts. There's a huge chance of disaster if that happens.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 04 Apr 2005, 14:56

stujones wrote:Not one?

Wayne McCullough,

Chris Eubank,

Steve Collins.

Never said Thompson had a poor chin, just don't think it is unbelivable. He goes down, and gets hurt (not just flash KD) quite easily. If Rothman or Haye had a bit more patience they would have stopped him (might have been on his feet), if Eubank had a bit more devil he might have stopped him also.

He runs the risk of getting stopped too many times to say he is playing possom. For me, he was periously close to being stopped vs Haye and Rothman - infact I think there was more of a case for the stoppage there than it was for Nelson vs Thompson.

The thing about Thompson is that he is one of those fighters who is actually more dangerous when he is hurt!.... hurting him is one thing, beating him is another. I'm still of the opinion that he could have beaten Nelson had their fight not been stopped so early.... Nelson seemed to be tiring for me and would have lost heart once the fight had gone into the later rounds.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 04 Apr 2005, 15:50

I don't know about Nelson losing heart, he's boxed his way to plenty of decision in his career, and he's gone the distance with big punching heavyweights, so I think that's a bit dubious.

Without doubt, Thompson could most probably have gone on, but whether he would have won is another matter.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 05 Apr 2005, 06:34

But he hasn't been under the pressure that Thompson may have put him under had the fight gone on past 6 or 7 rounds. Thompson seemed to be turning things around a bit when Nelson just caught him with a few and the ref stepped in..... its one of the worse stoppages I've seen!

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 05 Apr 2005, 07:34

It's a shame a rematch never happened. I'd like to see the two fight one another again, a fitting conclusion to their careers. Neither man seems likely to be involved in a big contest against anyone with a proper title, so why not do it again as a big domestic clash? It would be nice if promoters could work together on shows and make these fights happen, but chances are bugger all of that ever happening.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 05 Apr 2005, 17:56

Back in the 'good old days' the top domestic fighters often squared up with eachother.... these days our top fighters are usually fighting some unknown southAmerican or Eastern Europeon from a lower division or else that legendary opponent... TBA!.
I don't think Nelson would be interested in it. I think thompson would fight anyone. I'd like to see Thompson end his career on a winning note with a big money fight but these things don't always happen.
A friend of mine used to kickbox with Thompson years ago and says he was a class guy. I've always thought Carl has been rather underrated and unappreciated, much like Dennis Andries was.
Always being reminded of his age like Dennis too!.