Classic American West Coast Boxing

[bennie]

Sorry, I missed the earlier posts on Eddie.

[kikibalt]

Willie And Joe
By Frank Baltazar

In the summer of 1973, we took a trip to Phoenix, Arizona to take some kids to box, on the trip was John Martinez and Gary Orchard, both were boxing trainers and friends of mine, also going for the ride was my brother in law Willie and my wife’s brother in law Joe, plus about six kids that were going to box. When I invited Willie he said he would go, but with one condition, that I had to promise to take a picture of him with a big Indian woman, I promise to do so, not knowing how I was going to accomplish that, Joe said that he would go just to get out of town.

Willie and Joe, who did not really know each other, said that they would ride in the camper with the kids, riding in the cab was John and Gary with me driving. It was late afternoon when we left La Puente heading east on I-10, as we reach the Palm Springs area we made a pit stop at a rest area, as soon as I stopped, Joe jumped from the camper yelling.
“I am not riding with that SOB any more!” pointing at Willie.
“What’s wrong Joe?” I asked
“That SOB is crazy!’ said Joe.
“Okay Joe, you ride in the cab with John and I, Gary will you ride in the camper please?” I said
“No problem Frank” said Gary.

We get back on I-10 and travel eighty miles or so before we made another pit stop in the middle of nowhere. Joe had calm down and said he would ride in the camper with Willie again.
“Are you sure Joe?”.
“Ya, it’ll be alright”.

Another eighty miles or so we made another pit stop, this time its Willie who jumped out yelling.
“I not riding with that SOB!” pointing at Joe.
“Damn!, you guys are worse then some married couples I know!,” I told them.
I was beginning to feel like Dear Abby.
“Willie, you ride in the cab with us!, John, Please ride in the camper” I said
“No problem” said John.

We get back on I-10, after traveling some miles we made another pit stop, now Willie said he would ride in the camper with Joe.
“Okay Willie, but if you guys keep on fighting I’m going to leave both of you here in the middle of nowhere” I said

“Gary, Will you drive, please?”
“Sure Frank”

Its about 2:00 AM when we get into Phoenix and we’re hungry, as we are looking for a place that was open at that hour we spotted a Jack-In-The-Box that was open, Gary drives through the drive thru and in doing so hits and knocks Jack of the pole that he was on, after going through all that we still parked in their parking area, I went inside and what do I see?, two Indian women that had to be size 5 by 5, okay maybe not 5 feet wide, but you know what I mean, I seen them and I did a u-turn and ran to the camper.
“Willie!, Willie!, come with me and bring the camera!”
I shot some pictures with Willie and the two Indian women, Willie had a big smile on his face as he stood between both of them.
“Thanks brother in law for taking those pictures” said Willie
“I said I would, didn’t I ?”
“Ya! you did”
“Hey Willie, are you going to show them to Annie”
“Don’t know”.
I don’t know if he ever showed them to Annie.

After eating we drove to the motel where some rooms were waiting for us.
That night the kids fought, as tired as they were from the long trip, they all still won their fights.
After the fights we adults went to a country club and listen to some sh*t-kicking music.

Next morning we started our drive back home, we left Phoenix and stopped in Buckeye, a small town a few miles west of Phoenix for breakfast, we found a restaurant that had a big table big enough for all of us, we all ordered, and when the waitress took Willie’s order she had to sit down as she couldn’t believe what he had just ordered, he ordered half a dozen pan cakes with an egg in between each pan cake, that’s six pan cakes and six eggs!, what made the waitress sit down was this, he also ordered a side order of bacon and eggs, hash browns and toast, he ate the whole thing!, after eating he drank a beer and slept most of the way home. At least that way Willie and Joe didn’t fight…..

[THEHAMMER321]

Willie And Joe
By Frank Baltazar

In the summer of 1973, we took a trip to Phoenix, Arizona to take some kids to box, on the trip was John Martinez and Gary Orchard, both were boxing trainers and friends of mine, also going for the ride was my brother in law Willie and my wife’s brother in law Joe, plus about six kids that were going to box. When I invited Willie he said he would go, but with one condition, that I had to promise to take a picture of him with a big Indian woman, I promise to do so, not knowing how I was going to accomplish that, Joe said that he would go just to get out of town.

Willie and Joe, who did not really know each other, said that they would ride in the camper with the kids, riding in the cab was John and Gary with me driving. It was late afternoon when we left La Puente heading east on I-10, as we reach the Palm Springs area we made a pit stop at a rest area, as soon as I stopped, Joe jumped from the camper yelling.
“I am not riding with that SOB any more!” pointing at Willie.
“What’s wrong Joe?” I asked
“That SOB is crazy!’ said Joe.
“Okay Joe, you ride in the cab with John and I, Gary will you ride in the camper please?” I said
“No problem Frank” said Gary.

We get back on I-10 and travel eighty miles or so before we made another pit stop in the middle of nowhere. Joe had calm down and said he would ride in the camper with Willie again.
“Are you sure Joe?”.
“Ya, it’ll be alright”.

Another eighty miles or so we made another pit stop, this time its Willie who jumped out yelling.
“I not riding with that SOB!” pointing at Joe.
“Damn!, you guys are worse then some married couples I know!,” I told them.
I was beginning to feel like Dear Abby.
“Willie, you ride in the cab with us!, John, Please ride in the camper” I said
“No problem” said John.

We get back on I-10, after traveling some miles we made another pit stop, now Willie said he would ride in the camper with Joe.
“Okay Willie, but if you guys keep on fighting I’m going to leave both of you here in the middle of nowhere” I said

“Gary, Will you drive, please?”
“Sure Frank”

Its about 2:00 AM when we get into Phoenix and we’re hungry, as we are looking for a place that was open at that hour we spotted a Jack-In-The-Box that was open, Gary drives through the drive thru and in doing so hits and knocks Jack of the pole that he was on, after going through all that we still parked in their parking area, I went inside and what do I see?, two Indian women that had to be size 5 by 5, okay maybe not 5 feet wide, but you know what I mean, I seen them and I did a u-turn and ran to the camper.
“Willie!, Willie!, come with me and bring the camera!”
I shot some pictures with Willie and the two Indian women, Willie had a big smile on his face as he stood between both of them.
“Thanks brother in law for taking those pictures” said Willie
“I said I would, didn’t I ?”
“Ya! you did”
“Hey Willie, are you going to show them to Annie”
“Don’t know”.
I don’t know if he ever showed them to Annie.

After eating we drove to the motel where some rooms were waiting for us.
That night the kids fought, as tired as they were from the long trip, they all still won their fights.
After the fights we adults went to a country club and listen to some sh*t-kicking music.

Next morning we started our drive back home, we left Phoenix and stopped in Buckeye, a small town a few miles west of Phoenix for breakfast, we found a restaurant that had a big table big enough for all of us, we all ordered, and when the waitress took Willie’s order she had to sit down as she couldn’t believe what he had just ordered, he ordered half a dozen pan cakes with an egg in between each pan cake, that’s six pan cakes and six eggs!, what made the waitress sit down was this, he also ordered a side order of bacon and eggs, hash browns and toast, he ate the whole thing!, after eating he drank a beer and slept most of the way home. At least that way Willie and Joe didn’t fight…..

You ever find out why willie was fighting with everyone ?, also I wonder if Willie eats more than a friend of mine ''buffet Jim'' btw we didn't give him that name, he earned it lol.
\\\

[kikibalt]

Willie And Joe
By Frank Baltazar

In the summer of 1973, we took a trip to Phoenix, Arizona to take some kids to box, on the trip was John Martinez and Gary Orchard, both were boxing trainers and friends of mine, also going for the ride was my brother in law Willie and my wife’s brother in law Joe, plus about six kids that were going to box. When I invited Willie he said he would go, but with one condition, that I had to promise to take a picture of him with a big Indian woman, I promise to do so, not knowing how I was going to accomplish that, Joe said that he would go just to get out of town.

Willie and Joe, who did not really know each other, said that they would ride in the camper with the kids, riding in the cab was John and Gary with me driving. It was late afternoon when we left La Puente heading east on I-10, as we reach the Palm Springs area we made a pit stop at a rest area, as soon as I stopped, Joe jumped from the camper yelling.
“I am not riding with that SOB any more!” pointing at Willie.
“What’s wrong Joe?” I asked
“That SOB is crazy!’ said Joe.
“Okay Joe, you ride in the cab with John and I, Gary will you ride in the camper please?” I said
“No problem Frank” said Gary.

We get back on I-10 and travel eighty miles or so before we made another pit stop in the middle of nowhere. Joe had calm down and said he would ride in the camper with Willie again.
“Are you sure Joe?”.
“Ya, it’ll be alright”.

Another eighty miles or so we made another pit stop, this time its Willie who jumped out yelling.
“I not riding with that SOB!” pointing at Joe.
“Damn!, you guys are worse then some married couples I know!,” I told them.
I was beginning to feel like Dear Abby.
“Willie, you ride in the cab with us!, John, Please ride in the camper” I said
“No problem” said John.

We get back on I-10, after traveling some miles we made another pit stop, now Willie said he would ride in the camper with Joe.
“Okay Willie, but if you guys keep on fighting I’m going to leave both of you here in the middle of nowhere” I said

“Gary, Will you drive, please?”
“Sure Frank”

Its about 2:00 AM when we get into Phoenix and we’re hungry, as we are looking for a place that was open at that hour we spotted a Jack-In-The-Box that was open, Gary drives through the drive thru and in doing so hits and knocks Jack of the pole that he was on, after going through all that we still parked in their parking area, I went inside and what do I see?, two Indian women that had to be size 5 by 5, okay maybe not 5 feet wide, but you know what I mean, I seen them and I did a u-turn and ran to the camper.
“Willie!, Willie!, come with me and bring the camera!”
I shot some pictures with Willie and the two Indian women, Willie had a big smile on his face as he stood between both of them.
“Thanks brother in law for taking those pictures” said Willie
“I said I would, didn’t I ?”
“Ya! you did”
“Hey Willie, are you going to show them to Annie”
“Don’t know”.
I don’t know if he ever showed them to Annie.

After eating we drove to the motel where some rooms were waiting for us.
That night the kids fought, as tired as they were from the long trip, they all still won their fights.
After the fights we adults went to a country club and listen to some sh*t-kicking music.

Next morning we started our drive back home, we left Phoenix and stopped in Buckeye, a small town a few miles west of Phoenix for breakfast, we found a restaurant that had a big table big enough for all of us, we all ordered, and when the waitress took Willie’s order she had to sit down as she couldn’t believe what he had just ordered, he ordered half a dozen pan cakes with an egg in between each pan cake, that’s six pan cakes and six eggs!, what made the waitress sit down was this, he also ordered a side order of bacon and eggs, hash browns and toast, he ate the whole thing!, after eating he drank a beer and slept most of the way home. At least that way Willie and Joe didn’t fight…..

You ever find out why willie was fighting with everyone ?, also I wonder if Willie eats more than a friend of mine ''buffet Jim'' btw we didn't give him that name, he earned it lol.
\\\

Paul, Willie ate a lot, he was a big boy, not very tall, he was about five ten, but weighted about 270, he really was an easy going guy, he and Joe just didn't hit it off.

[THEHAMMER321]

Frank never liked sh-t kicker music, also we have the rodeo here twice a year and it is really big, but I have never went same for nascar, I will never make it as a sh-t kicker.

[kikibalt]

Frank never liked sh-t kicker music, also we have the rodeo here twice a year and it is really big, but I have never went same for nascar, I will never make it as a sh-t kicker.

I don't like either myself, but in Phoenix most clubs back then were sh*t-kicking joints, nascar? that's for red necks.....

[THEHAMMER321]

Frank never liked sh-t kicker music, also we have the rodeo here twice a year and it is really big, but I have never went same for nascar, I will never make it as a sh-t kicker.

I don't like either myself, but in Phoenix most clubs back then were sh*t-kicking joints, nascar? that's for red necks.....

got a friend who comes out here every year for the rodeo from Oklahoma, he calls his truck with dual wheels '' my cowboy Cadillac '' he puts the red in redneck.

[Rick Farris]

Frank never liked sh-t kicker music, also we have the rodeo here twice a year and it is really big, but I have never went same for nascar, I will never make it as a sh-t kicker.

I don't like either myself, but in Phoenix most clubs back then were sh*t-kicking joints, nascar? that's for red necks.....

I lived in Phoenix for more than three years. Never again!
Too hot for me. I grew up in Southern Cal and appreciate warm weather, but Phoenix is an inferno six months a year.
Frank, good story on Willie & Joe.

[kikibalt]

Frank never liked sh-t kicker music, also we have the rodeo here twice a year and it is really big, but I have never went same for nascar, I will never make it as a sh-t kicker.

I don't like either myself, but in Phoenix most clubs back then were sh*t-kicking joints, nascar? that's for red necks.....

I lived in Phoenix for more than three years. Never again!
Too hot for me. I grew up in Southern Cal and appreciate warm weather, but Phoenix is an inferno six months a year.
Frank, good story on Willie & Joe.

I agree Rick, Phoenix gets too hot for us Calfornia surfer's....

Not been a writer its being a kick in the head putting my thoughts together from the Simons's stories to Willie and Joe. You know, I just about lost all interest in today's boxing, working on the CBHOF and writing these stories is all I need to make my day....

[THEHAMMER321]

I don't like either myself, but in Phoenix most clubs back then were sh*t-kicking joints, nascar? that's for red necks.....

I lived in Phoenix for more than three years. Never again!
Too hot for me. I grew up in Southern Cal and appreciate warm weather, but Phoenix is an inferno six months a year.
Frank, good story on Willie & Joe.

I agree Rick, Phoenix gets too hot for us Calfornia surfer's....

Not been a writer its being a kick in the head putting my thoughts together from the Simons's stories to Willie and Joe. You know, I just about lost all interest in today's boxing, working on the CBHOF and writing these stories is all I need to make my day....

Today's boxing isn't the only thing I lost interest in, what about T.V these days, when a jailbird Trailer trash guy like dog the bounty hunter becomes a celebrity you know the way people think has went to hell, other than the western channel I watch the classic movie channel and that's about it.

[kikibalt]

I lived in Phoenix for more than three years. Never again!
Too hot for me. I grew up in Southern Cal and appreciate warm weather, but Phoenix is an inferno six months a year.
Frank, good story on Willie & Joe.

I agree Rick, Phoenix gets too hot for us Calfornia surfer's....

Not been a writer its being a kick in the head putting my thoughts together from the Simons's stories to Willie and Joe. You know, I just about lost all interest in today's boxing, working on the CBHOF and writing these stories is all I need to make my day....

Today's boxing isn't the only thing I lost interest in, what about T.V these days, when a jailbird Trailer trash guy like dog the bounty hunter becomes a celebrity you know the way people think has went to hell, other than the western channel I watch the classic movie channel and that's about it.

Same here Paul, I don't watch much tv, never have, but when I do now days, its the western channel, TMC and the Fox movie classis and the hell with everything else....

[scartissue]

Danny Holland was one of our greatest ever cutsmen. He worked the corner of Henry Cooper.

bennie, could you remind me, who was the guy who looked after Buchanan? he did a tremendous job on his swelling in the 2nd Laguna fight..........

Eddie Thomas. Kenny left him after Laguna in a dispute over, what else, money, and linked up with Gil Clancy. Kenny admits in his autobiography that it was a mistake leaving Thomas, a former outstanding boxer and an outstanding trainer who also steered Howard Winstone and Colin Jones.

I never knew the actual reason Ken left Eddie, and actually, I still don't. Was it how he was taking too big a percentage or what? What was father Tommy's role in all this? I'll tell you one thing, to produce a Winstone, Buchanan and Jones over that period in time was no small feat. Thomas had the knack. He wasn't one of these "I have a towel over my shoulder, so I'm a trainer" types.

Scartissue

[CNorkusJr]

John Duddy versus Julio Cesar Chavez Jr at the Alamodome, Texas June 26th.

Any thoughts on this one.?

I think its a toss up. Duddy too erratic nowadays and Julio Jr shows flashes of mediocrety. I think its a good match putting them together, Julio is still young and could move ahead with a great showing by putting Duddy away early. Stating the obvious here but his weight changes can make a difference.

[Randyman]

John Duddy versus Julio Cesar Chavez Jr at the Alamodome, Texas June 26th.

Any thoughts on this one.?

I think its a toss up. Duddy too erratic nowadays and Julio Jr shows flashes of mediocrety. I think its a good match putting them together, Julio is still young and could move ahead with a great showing by putting Duddy away early. Stating the obvious here but his weight changes can make a difference.

I more or less agree with your assessment. Neither has been impressive but Junior still has some years ahead of him. maybe, and it's a longshot but maybe he can still find his way.

Chavez' best bet, in my opinion, would be to separate himself from his father. Being the son of a legend like Chavez Sr, in Mexico, is like starting off your career with an undeserved Olympic gold medal. There will be resentment. Not giving the kid real competitive fights and keeping him from growing as a fighter just makes matters worse. Chavez is a dad, he's just doing what he thinks is best for his kid. Not all fathers can handle being their sons trainers. Frank Baltazar is a perfect example of a father who trusted his sons to learn and grow, while still keeping an eye on them. Chavez on the other hand is a afraid to let go. Joe Frazier was just the opposite. He expected Marvis to be another "Smoking Joe" and Marvis was a completely different type of fighter. Might have made a good cruiser weight or light heavy but we'll never know. I got nothing but love for Chavez and Frazier as fighters but as trainers or managers ........ Well you get my point.

As far as Chavez Jr and Duddy, It's a toss up.

[CNorkusJr]

Your right Randy, Chavez Sr is instrumental in bringing his son into the game his way. The kid already has to achieve to the adoring Mexican fans what his father achieved and thats too much pressure. The father probably feels the pressure too. Very tough to guide your own kid when you have a Champion father at the helm. On paper it seems great but in reality its very tough at both ends. Mayweather caused more of a rift between the two.

I do believe the kid has potential but the weight gain is significant. Hes better at 155 lbs. unless hes still growing taller (hes still young). We'll see what the future brings.

Duddy on the other hand is tough to figure. The kid got guts but likes to get hit. Alot.
New mgmt team for him now. Hopefully they can teach him how to bob and weave more.

I think its going to be a entertaining fight.

[Randyman]

I don't normally watch basketball but dam, this was a good game. It was like a good fight. Congrats to The Champs, the Lakers!

Randy

[CNorkusJr]

Lakers Again. Papers in New York here had last week- Jackson coming to New York to coach Knicks or Nets. Yeah, Right ?

Way to Go you West Coasters on another Championship.

[Randyman]

Your right Randy, Chavez Sr is instrumental in bringing his son into the game his way. The kid already has to achieve to the adoring Mexican fans what his father achieved and thats too much pressure. The father probably feels the pressure too. Very tough to guide your own kid when you have a Champion father at the helm. On paper it seems great but in reality its very tough at both ends. Mayweather caused more of a rift between the two.

I do believe the kid has potential but the weight gain is significant. Hes better at 155 lbs. unless hes still growing taller (hes still young). We'll see what the future brings.

Duddy on the other hand is tough to figure. The kid got guts but likes to get hit. Alot.
New mgmt team for him now. Hopefully they can teach him how to bob and weave more.

I think its going to be a entertaining fight.

Maybe the best we can hope for is that one of them or both will rise to the occasion. Good assessment!

Randy

[Randyman]

Lakers Again. Papers in New York here had last week- Jackson coming to New York to coach Knicks or Nets. Yeah, Right ?

Way to Go you West Coasters on another Championship.

I hope the fans behave tonight!!

[Rick Farris]

Lakers -

[Rick Farris]

I don't like either myself, but in Phoenix most clubs back then were sh*t-kicking joints, nascar? that's for red necks.....

I lived in Phoenix for more than three years. Never again!
Too hot for me. I grew up in Southern Cal and appreciate warm weather, but Phoenix is an inferno six months a year.
Frank, good story on Willie & Joe.

I agree Rick, Phoenix gets too hot for us Calfornia surfer's....

Not been a writer its being a kick in the head putting my thoughts together from the Simons's stories to Willie and Joe. You know, I just about lost all interest in today's boxing, working on the CBHOF and writing these stories is all I need to make my day....

Me too, Frank. I understand completely.
You are a very good writer.

[kikibalt]

For the Hammer.....

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_spaghettios_recall

[kikibalt]

I lived in Phoenix for more than three years. Never again!
Too hot for me. I grew up in Southern Cal and appreciate warm weather, but Phoenix is an inferno six months a year.
Frank, good story on Willie & Joe.

I agree Rick, Phoenix gets too hot for us Calfornia surfer's....

Not been a writer its being a kick in the head putting my thoughts together from the Simons's stories to Willie and Joe. You know, I just about lost all interest in today's boxing, working on the CBHOF and writing these stories is all I need to make my day....

Me too, Frank. I understand completely.
You are a very good writer.

Thanks Rick.....

[kikibalt]

Tom, on what day are you coming out to the coast?

[bennie]

bennie, could you remind me, who was the guy who looked after Buchanan? he did a tremendous job on his swelling in the 2nd Laguna fight..........

Eddie Thomas. Kenny left him after Laguna in a dispute over, what else, money, and linked up with Gil Clancy. Kenny admits in his autobiography that it was a mistake leaving Thomas, a former outstanding boxer and an outstanding trainer who also steered Howard Winstone and Colin Jones.

I never knew the actual reason Ken left Eddie, and actually, I still don't. Was it how he was taking too big a percentage or what? What was father Tommy's role in all this? I'll tell you one thing, to produce a Winstone, Buchanan and Jones over that period in time was no small feat. Thomas had the knack. He wasn't one of these "I have a towel over my shoulder, so I'm a trainer" types.

Scartissue

Thomas was taking a third of Buchanan's purses, and when their contract expired and Buchanan demanded he take a quarter, Thomas walked.