Joe Calzaghe @ Crusierweight

[Wrists]

Fair do's J mate.

I reckon your right, somewhere in the middle.

Being there though at the Lacy fight is something I will always remember.

[J]

EVEN I HAVE TO ADMIT THAT WAS SPECIAL.

[stujones]

Calzaghe vs Haye at Cruiser after the Enzo Mac fight would have been huge.

[Autobarn]

far too much risk with little reward.

of course, if he'd tried to win a 3rd title, there would be the historical achievement, of him possibly being champ at 168, 175 and then 200. and it would clearly be an event. but it's too big a risk, especially when you think what the extra weight would do to his speed, and in lieu of his punching style (from the elbow, often cuffing) which would have got him laughed at by some of the top cruiserweights. calzaghe wouldn't take that kind of leap of faith, no way.

joe was always open to right hands and at cruiser there had been some serious punchers (haye), some super hard bastards (bell), and technicians like adamek who are a combination of the two.

[Finn]

According to Calzaghe, he could've gone up to heavyweight and win a world-title.

:P

He said as a champion he has the self belief that he could get in the ring with the klitschkos and find a way to win.

What he was saying is he believes he could get in the ring with anyone and win - thats a champions mentality.

[hurlock]

According to Calzaghe, he could've gone up to heavyweight and win a world-title.

:P

He said as a champion he has the self belief that he could get in the ring with the klitschkos and find a way to win.

What he was saying is he believes he could get in the ring with anyone and win - thats a champions mentality.

until he get's hit

jc would get spanked from pillar to post, he never had the smart's to compete against a big heavy :!:

what would he do???? jump in & out with flurry's or even pressure & outwork them D jc was a talent but he never had that ability :!:
let's not get carried away he scraped a lhw world title against a 43 yr old career middleweight.

[SteveDow]

Calzaghe vs Haye at Cruiser after the Enzo Mac fight would have been huge.

I agree but Calzaghe would have been brutally knocked out. As others have mentioned, his punch resistance had diminished and he was hurt by both Bernard Hopkins and Roy Jones so one can only imagine what a decent shot from Haye would have done.

I actually think he could have won a world title at cruiserweight though. I think he'd have beaten Maccarinelli, Mormeck and Huck. Haye and Adamek would have been a step too far. Cunningham is a toss up for me.

[Captain Hook]

sorry hookie was never a fan of the man, didnt like him when he was active and i dont like him now, i didnt like him when i met him either...just one of those things mate sorry bout that.

one of the reasons i dont usually post in JC threads my view is pretty one eyed on the matter i do admit.

Hey mate you're entitled to your opinion, I met him and thought he was a class act.

No harm in having a different view :)

[Captain Hook]

According to Calzaghe, he could've gone up to heavyweight and win a world-title.

:P

He said as a champion he has the self belief that he could get in the ring with the klitschkos and find a way to win.

What he was saying is he believes he could get in the ring with anyone and win - thats a champions mentality.

until he get's hit

jc would get spanked from pillar to post, he never had the smart's to compete against a big heavy :!:

what would he do???? jump in & out with flurry's or even pressure & outwork them D jc was a talent but he never had that ability :!:
let's not get carried away he scraped a lhw world title against a 43 yr old career middleweight.

Come on that's a very narrow minded post.

Kessler, Lacy, Reid, Woodhall, Brewer, Hopkins..... etc? They get overlooked......

He fought Jones a couple of years ago, do you think Green is getting this much stick, and how about Hopkins?

fornicating Tarver had done nothing before beating a faded Jones.

Give the guy a break, he's retired, it's boring now......

[Captain Hook]

PS That career middleweight then came back and beat one of the p4p top five in Pavlik, let's not forget.

[Deserter]

he was hurt by both Bernard Hopkins and Roy Jones.

No offence to you Steve, but I'm fed up with people referencing the Jones knockdown in the context of Calzaghe's diminishing punch resistance as it was a 'freak' shot in that Jones actually connected with his bare forearm rather than the glove, hence the result. Watch it in slow mo and you'll see what I mean.
That type of unprotected forearm 'smash' would have seriously impacted on any fighter.

[hitman_hatton1]

calzaghe would do well up there i think.

it's an average division anyway and he had the speed advantage to do it.

he'd paint job steve cunningham.

too fast.

[DavidPayne]

Remember, for a long time Joe was 168 pound boss, the Cruiserweight limit was 190. Big difference, as Joe probably came to the ring weighing 180 whilst at Super-middle.

Calzaghe will divide opinion for years.

Sakio Bika, a ghost from Calzaghe's past returns to the fore

Always has always will.

Too many omissions for me to be the great his 46-0 records implies.

[Captain Hook]

That could be true, but you could argue (and would be right) that Ottke ducked far more challenges than Calzaghe.

Who else? A prime Jones, maybe, but he'd moved up to light heavy.....Liles? Beyer?

There weren't that many to choose from and IMO he'd have handled both of them.

I agree he could have done things differently, but he was still a great fighter....he'll always pay for being unbeaten!

[DavidPayne]

That could be true, but you could argue (and would be right) that Ottke ducked far more challenges than Calzaghe.

Who else? A prime Jones, maybe, but he'd moved up to light heavy.....Liles? Beyer?

There weren't that many to choose from and IMO he'd have handled both of them.

I agree he could have done things differently, but he was still a great fighter....he'll always pay for being unbeaten!

In 1999-2000 why didn't he fight Glen Catley? He always moans about not being part of the Benn-Eubank-Watson=Collins years and here he had a WBC champion from fkking 60 miles away.

Why did he never make that Glen Johnson fight - the WBO wouldn't have stripped him, even in defeat? Why didn't he fight Danny Green? Why did he never travel for Hopkins, why was a Clinton Woods fight SO hard to make?

Every champion has patsies. Every single one. But there was some real dross on JC's for too long.

But the argument is polarised.

He was a great fighter with a good resume.

Why did always fight guys AFTER Ottke and not before?

[DavidPayne]

I'm sure Calzaghe would have been competitive with anyone from 160-175 pounds from any point in history.

The trouble is from 1997-2009 he shared the limelight with

Markus Beyer, Sven Ottke, Anthony Mundine, Glen Catley, Carl Froch, Mikkel Kessler, Antonio Tarver, Kelly Pavlik, Jermaine Taylor, Arthur Abraham, Eric Lucas, Robin Reid, Glen Johnson, Clinton Woods, Danny Green, Roy Jones, Byron Mitchell, Bernard Hopkins, Darius Michelcsweksi....off the top of my head.

He didn't tackle many of them. And he had opportunity, backing and the ability to.

It isn't all his fault of course. But he had a lot of leverage to make some of those fights and had his fear of flying not been an issue nor his ego that he was the star - he could have been fighting and beating BHop and Jones when the fights were far more meaningful.

[FLINT ISLAND]

Calzaghe vs Haye at Cruiser after the Enzo Mac fight would have been huge.

I agree but Calzaghe would have been brutally knocked out. As others have mentioned, his punch resistance had diminished and he was hurt by both Bernard Hopkins and Roy Jones so one can only imagine what a decent shot from Haye would have done.

I actually think he could have won a world title at cruiserweight though. I think he'd have beaten Maccarinelli, Mormeck and Huck. Haye and Adamek would have been a step too far. Cunningham is a toss up for me.

Mormeck would have been too powerful - he was like a ox and would walk down Joe through his slaps.

I dont know about Huck - havent seen him fight that much.

Maccarenelli and Joe would never have fought - they are like Brothers and love each other too much to punch the crap out of each other.

[FLINT ISLAND]

Calzaghe vs Haye at Cruiser after the Enzo Mac fight would have been huge.

Well Haye ambushed Enzo in the corner to defeat in March 2008.

Joe scraped past Hopkins in April 2008.

Then Haye fought Monte Barret and Calzaghe fought Roy Jones - both around November 2008.

If they had scraped them fights - they could have made Calzaghe V Haye for November 2008 instead.

It could have been promoted at the angle of Calzaghe trying to get revenge for Enzo and Camp Calzaghe.

But I have to say - Joe would have got smashed out - probaly the same way Enzo did - in about 2 rounds.

Only if the fight dragged into the later rounds could Joes fitness and workrate overwhelm Haye.

[Wrists]

I cant believe some of this!!

Haye was a massive cruiser/heavy and Calzaghe was a big supermiddle/light heavy.

Haye as soon as he landed a right hand of any substance would have badly KO'd Calzaghe.

The fight was never made as it is a silly idea.

JC was a great full stop, did not need to go to Cruiser to cement this.

Thread bordering on strange now, but to be fair look at the thread creator.

[FLINT ISLAND]

I cant believe some of this!!

Haye was a massive cruiser/heavy and Calzaghe was a big supermiddle/light heavy.

Haye as soon as he landed a right hand of any substance would have badly KO'd Calzaghe.

The fight was never made as it is a silly idea.

JC was a great full stop, did not need to go to Cruiser to cement this.

Thread bordering on strange now, but to be fair look at the thread creator.

well if you read my post - you would actually see I said the most likely outcome would be Haye smashing out Calzaghe early - just the same way he ambushed Enzo in the corner inside 2 rounds.

[Craig14]

Its a stupid thread! Ofcourse Haye would have knocked J.C out hes naturally bigger and stronger! You said yourself you think that! So why did you start the thread then???

Went by boat and come back by ferry!!!

[Captain Hook]

David,

I don't have much time to respond but I think it's fair to say Glen Catley would have done little to bolster his CV.

If people aren't impressed with Calzaghe beating Reid, Woodhall, Brewer, Hopkins, Lacy, Sheika, Kessler, Jones, Bika and Mitchell then old Glen wouldn't have done much for him, belt or no belt.

People like Starie were considered, at the time, as much of a challenge as Catley would have been.

I agree he should have stayed away from the likes of Ashira and Thornberry, no excuses......but there were some great names on his record, like him or not.

[Captain Hook]

PS A lot of the other guys on his record - in fact about 90% - have records that are not as strong as Calzaghe's

And he can't be blamed for not fighting Tarver, Pavlik, Abraham and co....surely?

Some good points though, as always

[FLINT ISLAND]

Its a stupid thread! Ofcourse Haye would have knocked J.C out hes naturally bigger and stronger! You said yourself you think that! So why did you start the thread then???

Went by boat and come back by ferry!!!

Because Haye is not the only Crusierweight in the World and if Calzaghe had been knocked out by Haye - he still might of beaten alot of other crusierweights.

In fact - if Calzaghe had gone to Crusierweight after his fight with Roy Jones - to try and win a belt there for his legacy - Haye would have already left the division.

Calzaghe would stand alot better chance against the likes of Frogemeni, etc

[DavidPayne]

David,

I don't have much time to respond but I think it's fair to say Glen Catley would have done little to bolster his CV.

If people aren't impressed with Calzaghe beating Reid, Woodhall, Brewer, Hopkins, Lacy, Sheika, Kessler, Jones, Bika and Mitchell then old Glen wouldn't have done much for him, belt or no belt.

People like Starie were considered, at the time, as much of a challenge as Catley would have been.

I agree he should have stayed away from the likes of Ashira and Thornberry, no excuses......but there were some great names on his record, like him or not.

Fighting Catley, the bloke who knocked out Beyer, in a Bristol/Cardiff face off might have lifted his profile a little, don't ya think?

Er...did you put Sheika on that list?