fighters who showed under-rated skills

[Counter-puncher]

when i say 'showed', here, it could be that the fighters named flashed the skills on only one night, or you only saw them showing those skills for a brief period, as well as fighters you think are generally under-rated for their skills .

i got a couple of names that come to mind, for one thing, maybe i didn't see enough of Iran barkley back in the day, but it seems to me that he showed a LOT more skill in the Duran fight than I had seen from him before or since. doubling and tripling with the jab, stepping right and doubling with the left hook, showing some counterpunching, but most of all, just looking like he had nice organised and balanced movement in there. i recall the US commentary team going a bit ga-ga over him doing stuff as above, that in most fighters you wouldn't really comment, but in Barkley?
i am pretty sure Barkley's best performance was that night, which is at least doubly ironic as he got a bit of a stiffing on the cards IMO.

the other name that comes to mind is Wayne McCullough, or at least the young fresh version, before he fell in love with his infinite capacity for absorbing percussion as his best way to win fights. check out his first title crack in Japan vs Yakashiji (sp?), when Wayne had not been with Futch too long.

for a man known only as a swarmer with a titanium chin, McCullough showed some great skill that night. he's doubling and tripling with the jab, landing consistently against a much taller man, landing it as a counter, to the body, and one of my favourite Futch-school moves, landing an up-jab after slipping the jab low and to the outside. he was also really utilising the Futch staple, counter right uppercut to the body. and neat footwork, too, quick step across to the right against an advancing Yakashiji, right uppercut under his elbow and either flurry off that or circle away and step in again behind the double jab. classic Futch stuff.

another thing i really like what he did was putting punches together in combinations, where later in his career he often looked as though he was just throwing willy-nilly, trying to reach some kind of Compubox-style target by hook or by crook. watch the yakushiji fight again and you see him properly switching from head to body, and i don't mean, 'throw a flurry at the head, man's hands go up, throw to the body', i mean the way Chavez would do it, switching so constantly and seamlessly that there's no point trying to defend a particular area, as he's never focussing on that area for long enough for you to kno what-all to protect.


any more shouts on these kind of fighters, or displays?

[Counter-puncher]

Fenech, sometimes, showed surprising skill. I'm thinking, for example, of the Villasana fight when it turned out Villasana wasn't going to be beasted/butted/barged/kneed out of there, and fenech boxed and moved for a considerable strecth of time in rds 10-15 (i think it was 15...??)

[Expug]

This is a good thread topic CP.

Im trying to think of some more,but Greg Haugen had a real nice jab that I think was underated a bit.
He really busted Paz up with it when he took his belt. He boxed well in that fight.

[Counter-puncher]

yup, Haugen was a decent counterpuncher too, he just didn't look 'silky' in the way we expect our skilled boxers to be.

thinking more on it there are loads and loads of guys who, if you watch what they are doing carefully, are more skilled than they look/ you would assume.

[Ezzard]

Fenech really was one of the boxing Gods of the 80s. Truly great fighter who doesn't always get the plaudits he deserved for his ring accomplishments.

The lightweight from the 80s Jimmy Paul was a polished performer. Maurice Blocker was also a good welterweight with some sound fundamentals.

The South African guy Mitchell from the 80s is another who people overlook but he was a skillful and intelligent fighter.

[Counter-puncher]

all good shouts, actually i was mentioning Mitchell in exactly that context only the other day

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Carl Froch fits the bill as an active fighter, Excellent jab and he knows what he is doing in there yet is only known as a brawler. He out boxed the guy that out boxed Dawson.

I call him overrated, and he is, but Chavez better skills than a lot of people credit him with. Look no further than the Laporte and Lockridge fights when he was forced to back up and held his own back peddling down the stretch.

Victor Galindez had the reputation of of a brawler and he certainly did some. But he loved laying on the ropes and counter punching. His defense was underrated and he fired back shots a bit reminiscent of Toney in there.

Nice thread, here is A couple more without the description as I have a conference call.

Gene Fullmer
George Foreman
Saad Muhammad
Mustafa hamsho

[Counter-puncher]

all good shouts, i think 'aesthetic' reasons are largely behind a lot of these perceptions, EG stylewise galindez just looked plain wild and ugly but like you say could counter pretty cleverly.

funny, i was going to mention Saad. he definitely played the boxer, or at least not the brawler, for large early portions against Johnson. and its great to watch him cover up against the ropes and come back (finally) with the stiff jab once Yaqui punched himself out.

[Expug]

I think early in Saads career he boxed much more. At some point,he started banging and trading shots,becoming the crowd pleaser.
Maybe those Philly gym wars were an influence.
Sometimes getting in there in the gym and going toe to toe becomes contagious. Its fun.

[Diamond WEAPON]

Erik Morales - He was incredibly skillful but more often than not let his emotions get the best of him and decided to engage in a toe-to-toe battle with his opponents, regardless of who they were. They could've been guys with no virtual chance at winning and he'd still take some of their best shots in exchange for bludgeoning them violently to the canvas. His fights against Barrera and Pacquiao are excellent examples of him using his skills in small bursts before deciding that he'd rather beat the snot out of them instead, and when he turned southpaw in the final round of their first fight to humiliate Pacquiao it was pretty astonishing to say the least, despite it being unnecessarily risky.

Aaron Pryor - He looked like Henry Armstrong on coke in there but he could really move around the ring and box if need be, as he did in spots against Arguello when he figured out that if he simply rushed Alexis like he did everyone else he was going to eat power punches all night.

Meldrick Taylor - Another Philly fighter who simply couldn't avoid getting into wars with guys. For all intents and purposed he was an offensive dynamo, with the ability to be adept on the defensive side as well, but rather than choosing to hit-and-not-be-hit he'd rush head-first into battle with blistering combinations trying to score KOs and ignite the crowds he performed in front of. It would've been great to see him and Whitaker fight but alas, he decided to brawl with Chavez instead of box him like Pernell did.

[King Carlos]

I don't think Saad really developed into a brawler until his physical gifts started to wane and he went careening off the top tier, at least not exclusively. He was a very well-rounded boxer-puncher in the late 70's, who just happened to fight the types of fighters that would bring out those types of fights. Even when the fights got down to the nitty gritty, he was always a very poised, technically aware fighter who threw compact punches with terrific torque, and was a beautiful combination puncher. One of the best left hands of the era.

[Goodnight, Irene]

Erik Morales - He was incredibly skillful but more often than not let his emotions get the best of him and decided to engage in a toe-to-toe battle with his opponents, regardless of who they were. They could've been guys with no virtual chance at winning and he'd still take some of their best shots in exchange for bludgeoning them violently to the canvas. His fights against Barrera and Pacquiao are excellent examples of him using his skills in small bursts before deciding that he'd rather beat the snot out of them instead, and when he turned southpaw in the final round of their first fight to humiliate Pacquiao it was pretty astonishing to say the least, despite it being unnecessarily risky.

Aaron Pryor - He looked like Henry Armstrong on coke in there but he could really move around the ring and box if need be, as he did in spots against Arguello when he figured out that if he simply rushed Alexis like he did everyone else he was going to eat power punches all night.

Meldrick Taylor - Another Philly fighter who simply couldn't avoid getting into wars with guys. For all intents and purposed he was an offensive dynamo, with the ability to be adept on the defensive side as well, but rather than choosing to hit-and-not-be-hit he'd rush head-first into battle with blistering combinations trying to score KOs and ignite the crowds he performed in front of. It would've been great to see him and Whitaker fight but alas, he decided to brawl with Chavez instead of box him like Pernell did.

I wouldn't call Taylor very sound defensively, myself. His getting hit a lot was primarily down to his willingness to engage, yes --- but for a fighter short on fight-changing power, he was very willing to focus his energies on offense.

It wasn't often you saw any deft displays of heightened skill from Taylor which related to his defense.

[King Carlos]

Well, since he's been mentioned, I'll throw in Armstrong for the purposes of this thread. Tremendous bob and weave defense combined withhis whirl-wind offense. Vicente Saldivar is another. Terrific sharp-shooter.

[Jpreisser]

I agree about this being a good thread. I have to give credit to a few fighters as I have always like alot of guys who were never 'elite fighters'.
Damian Fuller- Though not a real good fighter,he did on one night look very good. That one night was against Lamar Murphy. It was the same night I became a boxing fan. Lamar Murphy was known for his very high punch output but on this night(For the most part)Damian Fuller shut it down with a great jab,nice lateral movement,and excellent timing.

Jesse "The Texas Tornado" James Leija-Good,good fighter with good credentials. The man had good handspeed,good defense,good defense,loads of heart,and what kept him fighting into his later years craft. You don`t hear his name mentioned alot but he had a record of 47 wins,8 defeats,2 draws and 19 Ko`s. He lost to most of the elite fighters but was fun to watch and showed alot of class throughout his career. He was a one time title holder but looking at his record I admire his guts;he fought Azumah Nelson 4 times(The fights resulted in Leija winning 2,losing one,and another being a draw),Gabriel Ruelas,Oscar De La Hoya,Shane Mosley,Juan Lascano,Ivan Robinson,Micky Ward,Kostya Tszyu,Francisco Bojado,and Arturo Gatti.

Javier Castillejo-Pretty similar mold to Leija,not exactly though. Big power difference. Record was won 62 (KO 43) + lost 8 (KO 2) + drawn 1 and obtained this record through a variety of means. He was nothing spectacular but in all honesty it`s guys like him is what makes boxing interesting. He was kind of like a boxing middleman,he could beat decent fighters,even good fighters but it was his consistent willingness to stay in a fight with real good people that I can appreciate. He didn`t pack it in when he fought and I always liked his determination. He had heart,he had craft and good ability but his keep-on keeping-on is what kept me tuning in. That`s why he still hangs in there. He lost convincingly to alot of good fighters but he seems like the guy who showed up for work day in and day out.

[Jpreisser]

Notables:Miguel Angel Gonzalez,Julian Letterlough,Demarcus Corley,Micky Ward,Lovemore N`dou,Roman Karmazin,Carlos Baldomir,etc.

[King Carlos]

Notables:Miguel Angel Gonzalez,Julian Letterlough,Demarcus Corley,Micky Ward,Lovemore N`dou,Roman Karmazin,Carlos Baldomir,etc.

I would have to disagree strongly with almost every one of those picks. Corley? Ward? Baldomir? N'Dou? I really don't see where you're coming from. Thoroughly mediocre, if not outright poor fighters technically.

[Goodnight, Irene]

^^^I thought Gonzalez was a pretty good shout.

[Cutman Scabbers]

I remember being amazed by Marlon Starling. He had some crazy sense of timing, like a radar, so he could slip and duck all kinds of punches and return. So smooth!

[Jpreisser]

Notables:Miguel Angel Gonzalez,Julian Letterlough,Demarcus Corley,Micky Ward,Lovemore N`dou,Roman Karmazin,Carlos Baldomir,etc.

I would have to disagree strongly with almost every one of those picks. Corley? Ward? Baldomir? N'Dou? I really don't see where you're coming from. Thoroughly mediocre, if not outright poor fighters technically.

Poor fighters? What? None of them were poor fighters. How did they amass winning records? We are not talking about Reggie Strickland here. Corley almost stopped Cotto,N`Dou was hardly an easy outing for anyone(see Cotto,Mitchell,Malignaggi,and others),and Ward was just a pick for a little recognition. That post proves why I picked alot of them. They are good fighters that won`t get a whole lot of credit but as the OP said "as well as fighters you think are generally under-rated for their skills ". Underrated fighters imo.

[Knucklez]

Herol Graham showed countless flashes of brilliance in an otherwise so-so career. I think I'm right in saying he never won a big four world title (?)

His performance against Julian Jackson was punch perfect until he walked onto one and got the lights turned out.