Greatness poll Marciano vs Dempsey

[Grimm]

Recently I've discovered a couple of posters making a claim that Dempsey was greater than Marciano which I find ridiculous. Dempsey was the biggest hype job of all time. Marciano is a true great, maybe not as great as some believe but never the less a great.

[Ezzard]

Two great fighters. I hope this thread doesn't turn into one of those "let's defame one to acclaim the other"...

Both men could bang. Both men were in exciting fights.

To me Dempsey looks the better fighter, more fluid, faster of hand and foot, better defence (though Marciano is underrated here)... Marciano went from slugger to swarmer, and you have to give the man credit for changing his game. He was grinding opponents down once he became champ rather than looking for the money shot with every punch.

Dempsey has a great record pre-title (often overlooked). Marciano has the better record as champion.

Dempsey didn't fight Wills. Marciano gets criticism because his best wins were against older fighters (Walcott, Charles and Moore). But they weren't over the hill. And reading old copies of The Ring, the magazine actively pushed for the Moore fight as they saw Archie as a real threat.

This one will come down to individual's personal preference (okay, I guess it always does).

[raylawpc]

I voted for Dempsey - not because I give a rat's you-know-what about which of them was "greater," but because I consider Dempsey an ATG, and to counter Grimm's notion that Dempsey "was the biggest hype job of all time." I consider Rocky an ATG too, and don't know or care which one was "greater" or who would win head-to-head.

[BoxBuzz]

yep grimm, you've got spaghetti sauce all over your face on this one. I gotta go with Dempsey though I think the Rock was great. I just don't believe that his "O" liness is the best of all time. And Dempsey is one of the names I think out shines the Rock.

[Grimm]

I guess where there is lack of film there is always room for imagination.

[Crease]

Marciano... But the fight would have been a brawl.

[The Great John L]

I guess where there is lack of film there is always room for imagination.

I'm not sure what you mean here, because there is plenty of film of both guys.

And what do you mean by which is greater? That could mean quite a few different things.

[gilgamesh]

I think given their styles if these guys fought 6 times, I could see them going like 3-3 against each other, or possibly 3-2-1. Both are good puncher's. Both would likely score knockdowns. Marciano's vulnerability would be that he would be a lot more likely to cut. If these guys fought though, I think their styles would make for absolute bloody slugfests every time.

[Goodnight, Irene]

Recently I've discovered a couple of posters making a claim that Dempsey was greater than Marciano which I find ridiculous. Dempsey was the biggest hype job of all time. Marciano is a true great, maybe not as great as some believe but never the less a great.

LOL.

You are kidding. Dempsey did virtually everything better.

[Grimm]

I guess where there is lack of film there is always room for imagination.

I'm not sure what you mean here, because there is plenty of film of both guys.

And what do you mean by which is greater? That could mean quite a few different things.

There is much less film of Dempsey and what is left of him is in very poor quality.

[Darling]

Recently I've discovered a couple of posters making a claim that Dempsey was greater than Marciano which I find ridiculous. Dempsey was the biggest hype job of all time. Marciano is a true great, maybe not as great as some believe but never the less a great.

Oh, dear.

[ben geoghegan]

i like dempsey to stop the rock

[Goodnight, Irene]

i like dempsey to stop the rock

Smart man.

[Diamond WEAPON]

i like dempsey to stop the rock

Smart man.

[Ezzard]

Poll is running 7-7… Nice to see both have their fans.

Last night I was in the dentist waiting room with my kids. There’s another family in there; two boys about 3-4 years old running around. The receptionist calls out the name of the person to go in next. She walks over and calls out “Jack Dempsey…” I’m up on my toes looking for the Mauler. The mom picks up her boy and says, “Come on Jack.”

[Diamond WEAPON]

Poll is running 7-7… Nice to see both have their fans.

Last night I was in the dentist waiting room with my kids. There’s another family in there; two boys about 3-4 years old running around. The receptionist calls out the name of the person to go in next. She walks over and calls out “Jack Dempsey…” I’m up on my toes looking for the Mauler. The mom picks up her boy and says, “Come on Jack.”

Nice.

[Knucklez]

You can't even begin to answer this question without having a clear definition of the word "greatness" as it probably means something different to everyone on here.

So Grimm, seeing as it's your thread...........define "greatness".

[Grimm]

Combination of head to head mixed with accomplishments

[Ezzard]

Combination of head to head mixed with accomplishments

H2H in terms of Jack v Rocky

Or H2H in terms of how each do against a sample of the top 30 HWs of all time?

[Goodnight, Irene]

Dempsey was a better fighter, & better in almost all regards. At absolute worst, his achievements are on-par with Marciano, & he was twenty times the superstar Marciano ever was.

I'd say Dempsey has Marciano beat in any definition of greatness...

[Grimm]

Dempsey was a better fighter, & better in almost all regards. At absolute worst, his achievements are on-par with Marciano, & he was twenty times the superstar Marciano ever was.

I'd say Dempsey has Marciano beat in any definition of greatness...

He definitely was a huge superstar which is why I feel he gets over rated.

Not to say that Marciano doesn't but I believe Dempsey does much more.

Anyway I see were at a 50/50 disagreement here

[Robinson]

I picked Marciano....

3 reasons....

He was active...he did not sit on the title for 3 yrs.
He did not draw a race line when he was champ.
He was undefeated..no Jim Flynn's in his record.

I like to watch Dempsey and I would love to see these
men fight in that fantasy hypothetical realm. It would be
close and fun to view.

But 'Greatness' is not so much a head to head, prime v
prime exercise. And it is because of that I have given
my reasons why I placed Marciano above Dempsey.

[actjac]

If the question was who would win the all time greatest fight this would be it! (followed by the Sugar Rays)

Marciano.

After this fight boxing would be banned as too brutal and the public would have to move on to more genteel forms of entertainment.....like watching terrorist attacks or a nuclear war.

[dempseyfire]

I picked Marciano....

3 reasons....

He was active...he did not sit on the title for 3 yrs.
He did not draw a race line when he was champ.
He was undefeated..no Jim Flynn's in his record.

I like to watch Dempsey and I would love to see these
men fight in that fantasy hypothetical realm. It would be
close and fun to view.

But 'Greatness' is not so much a head to head, prime v
prime exercise. And it is because of that I have given
my reasons why I placed Marciano above Dempsey.

Dempsey in his pre-title days was much more 'active' vs dangerous comp than Marciano ever was and Rocky built up his record on tomato cans until his controversial win over LaStarza.

And Jack never drew a race line a la Sullivan, he was more than willing to fight Wills, that was a case of the politics of boxing promotion at the time.

And if you're gonna bring up being undefeated, well then I guess Marciano is the greatest of all time.

[Goodnight, Irene]

It's funny to me people are gonna pick Marciano to win.

You go down the list of attributes for each fighter, & Dempsey has the advantage in almost every category --- but people are gonna pick the other guy?