Classic American West Coast Boxing

[CNorkusJr]

Mark Sanchez just threw his third TD pass of the day. Jets-28 Patriots-14

for the homie

Kept up my season tickets plan this year at the New Meadowlands Stadium. My wife Roseann and I were at the game yesterday. California homeboy Mark Sanchez, was off to a shakey start, but whatever transpired in the dressing room, he and the team were possessed in the 2nd half.
For Sale: One Offensive Coordinator (Brian Shottenheimer) take Best(Any) Offer
Contact any Jets Fan

J-E-T-S Jets Jets Jets Thank You

[kikibalt]

Mark Sanchez just threw his third TD pass of the day. Jets-28 Patriots-14

for the homie

Kept up my season tickets plan this year at the New Meadowlands Stadium. My wife Roseann and I were at the game yesterday. California homeboy Mark Sanchez, was off to a shakey start, but whatever transpired in the dressing room, he and the team were possessed in the 2nd half.
For Sale: One Offensive Coordinator (Marty Shottenheimer) take Best(Any) Offer
Contact any Jets Fan

J-E-T-S Jets Jets Jets Thank You

for Charlie

[kikibalt]

Candy Lopez
Another forgotten Fighter from L.A.'s golden era. Candy had an attention gimmick, during his walk to the ring he and his corner people would toss candies to the fans.



division featherweight
stance southpaw
alias Al

country United States
residence Hollywood, California, United States

won 13 (KO 8) + lost 4 (KO 2) + drawn 1 = 18
rounds boxed 78 KO% 44.44

1957-03-23 130 Jimmy Lassiter 131 5-7-4
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L UD 6 6

1956-06-02 131 Jesse Resendez 130 7-2-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W SD 6 6

1956-03-27 129 Benny Coca 129 5-4-2
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 1 6
~ referee: Tommy Hart ~
Coca was knocked down twice.

1956-02-04 130½ Billy Walker 128¼ 2-0-1
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W UD 6 6

1955-03-12 124 Larry Vasquez 129 3-1-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L TKO 6 8
~ time: 2:37 | referee: Dynamite Jackson ~

1954-11-06 121½ Walter Caldwell 121½ 1-4-1
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 4 6
~ time: 0:43 ~
Caldwell was knocked down four times

1954-10-09 Collier Cox 10-4-2
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W KO 4 6

1954-07-24 124½ Kildo Martinez 127 2-4-4
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W SD 6 6

1954-06-05 121½ Gil Velarde 125½ 6-3-1
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L SD 6 6

1954-03-27 124½ Fugi Rodriguez 125½ 5-5-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W PTS 6 6

1954-02-27 Manuel Ramirez 1-0-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W KO 4 6

1954-01-23 123¼ Mickey McGuire 126 1-0-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W KO 4 6
McGuire was knocked down once in the 1st, 3rd, and 4th round.

1953-12-26 122½ Mr Boston 123½ 5-7-2
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 5 6
~ referee: Dynamite Jackson ~

1953-11-21 Mr Boston 5-7-1
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States D PTS 6 6

1953-10-24 Tony Silva
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W PTS 4 4

1953-08-22 123½ Vic Kid Ponce 125 4-1-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L TKO 1 6

1953-06-22 122½ Bobby Leal 118¾ 0-1-0
Arena, South Gate, California, United States W KO 1 4

1953-06-08 123½ Joe Garcia 123 1-14-2
Arena, South Gate, California, United States W TKO

[Rick Farris]

Mark Sanchez just threw his third TD pass of the day. Jets-28 Patriots-14

for the homie

Kept up my season tickets plan this year at the New Meadowlands Stadium. My wife Roseann and I were at the game yesterday. California homeboy Mark Sanchez, was off to a shakey start, but whatever transpired in the dressing room, he and the team were possessed in the 2nd half.
For Sale: One Offensive Coordinator (Marty Shottenheimer) take Best(Any) Offer
Contact any Jets Fan

J-E-T-S Jets Jets Jets Thank You

Charlie . . . L.A. has no pro team, and USC will be dead in the water for a couple of years, so I decided before the season to join my N.Y. buddies and follow the Jets this year. Mark Sanchez sat on the bench most of his days as a Trojan, now he's leading the Jets and that was one great 2nd half yesterday. During the game yesterday, my friend Martin would call me from his home in Statan Island and say, "Did you see that!!!" I hope it can continue, that was a fun game to watch, unless you were a Patriot fan.

[Rick Farris]

Frank . . .

Isn't Vic Ponce a brother of the late trainer, Joe Ponce?
I believe the Ponce brothers fought out of the San Pedro area.

[kikibalt]

Frank . . .

Isn't Vic Ponce a brother of the late trainer, Joe Ponce?
I believe the Ponce brothers fought out of the San Pedro area.

I'm not sure Rick, but I believe Vic Ponce was a nephew of Joe Ponce, and yes, the Ponce's fought out of San Pedro.

[kikibalt]

Young Jack Johnson
Another one that makes the list of the Forgotten



birth date 1928-10-26
death date 1963-10-01
division heavyweight
height 6′ 3″ / 191cm

country United States
residence Los Angeles, California, United States

birth place Lockhart, Texas, United States
birth name John Lee Storey

won 24 (KO 13) + lost 20 (KO 3) + drawn 1 = 45
rounds boxed 363 KO% 28.89


1963-04-02 233 Cleveland Williams 213 55-4-1
Sam Houston Coliseum, Houston, Texas, United States L TKO 10 10
~ referee: Jimmy Webb ~

1963-01-05 235 Ernie Terrell 203 28-4-0
Madison Square Garden, New York, New York, United States L PTS 10 10

1962-12-14 240 Ernie Terrell 199 27-4-0
Coliseum, Chicago, Illinois, United States L UD 10 10

1962-05-26 223¾ Sonny Banks 190½ 10-3-0
Graystone Ballroom, Detroit, Michigan, United States W KO 5 10

1962-02-26 245 Brian London 213½ 24-8-0
King's Hall, Belle Vue, Manchester, Lancashire, United Kingdom L PTS 10 10x3

1961-10-06 219½ Thorner Ahsman 196¾ 10-2-2
Masshallen, Gothenburg, Sweden W KO 4 8
~ time: 2:39 | referee: Åke Jacobsson ~
Åhsman down in 3rd and three times in 4th

1961-09-29 233 Karl Mildenberger 188 26-1-0
Sportpalast, Schoeneberg, Berlin, Germany L PTS 10 10

1961-07-10 225 Roger Rischer 194 17-6-2
Kezar Pavilion, San Francisco, California, United States L PTS 10 10
~ referee: Tony Bosnich 2-8 ~

1961-06-07 225 George Logan 207 19-4-1
Boise, Idaho, United States W MD 10 10
~ referee: Jim Nally 99-98 | 97-97 | 97-97 ~

1961-05-04 206 Amos Lincoln 210 26-2-1
Coliseum, Spokane, Washington, United States L PTS 10 10

1961-02-18 Willi Besmanoff 44-24-7
Fairgrounds Coliseum, Salt Lake City, Utah, United States W SD 10 10
~ referee: Ken Shulsen 96-95 | judge: Del Markham 96-95 | judge: Max Kosof 88-96 ~

1961-02-04 242 Cortez Stewart 244 16-2-0
Madison Square Garden, New York, New York, United States L UD 10 10~ 4-5 | 4-5 | judge: Mike Davidowitch 3-7 ~

1961-01-26 Walter Robinson 4-16-0
Athletic Club, West Jordan, Utah, United States W KO 3

1960-12-03 240 Tommy Fields 210 9-6-2
Sports Arena, Los Angeles, California, United States W TKO 5 6

1960-11-11 Clarence Williams 6-14-1
Logan, Utah, United States W KO 5

1960-07-18 220 Andy Isaacs 198 5-14-1
Coliseum, Denver, Colorado, United States W PTS 6 6

1959-03-05 218 Eddie Machen 194 24-1-1
Portland, Oregon, United States L UD 10 10
~ referee: Ralph Gruman 91-100 | judge: George Robinson 95-99 | judge: Eddie Volk 94-99 ~

1958-12-09 218 Reuben Vargas 190 16-6-0
Memorial Auditorium, Sacramento, California, United States L TKO 9 12
~ referee: Johnny Reno | 82-90 | 84-89 | 84-88 ~
~ vacant USA California State heavyweight title ~

1958-04-21 208 Willie Wilson 210 22-5-0
Arcadia Ballroom, Providence, Rhode Island, United States W UD 8 8

1958-01-29 214 Wayne Bethea 204 16-7-2
Chicago Stadium, Chicago, Illinois, United States L UD 10 10
~ 44-48 | 43-49 | 40-48 ~

1957-09-26 215 Duke Sabedong 215 13-4-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W UD 10 10

1956-11-16 201 Harold Carter 194¼ 20-2-2
Madison Square Garden, New York, New York, United States L UD 10 10~ referee: Ruby Goldstein 3-6 | judge: Bert Grant 2-8 | judge: Artie Aidala 1-9 ~

1956-09-13 203½ Ben Wise 193 8-5-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W UD 10 10
~ referee: Dynamite Jackson 97-93 | judge: Lee Grossman 96-95 | judge: Jack McDonald 98-94 ~

1956-08-16 205 Duke Sabedong 207 13-3-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W UD 10 10
~ referee: George Latka 98-85 | judge: Russ Bradford 98-90 | judge: Tommy Herman 97-92 ~

1956-07-21 Roger Rischer 185 13-4-2
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L PTS 12 12
California State Heavyweight Title Eliminator.
Johnson had been stripped of the title shortly before the bout, for failing to defend in the last six months.

1956-03-20 205 Ben Wise 201 5-5-1
Auditorium, Oakland, California, United States L TKO 4 10
~ time: 1:10 | referee: Vern Bybee ~

1956-02-23 210½ Johnny Summerlin 194½ 28-4-2
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L UD 10 10
~ referee: Abe Roth 53-57 | judge: John Thomas 54-56 | judge: George Latka 50½-59½ ~

1955-12-29 209 Ezzard Charles 196 89-16-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W TKO 6
~ referee: Lee Grossman ~
Charles suffered a badly cut lip and was unable to continue.

1955-12-01 208 Zora Folley 189 21-1-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W RTD 5 12
~ 29-26 ~
~ USA California State heavyweight title ~
Folley retired in his corner after the 5th round, citing an injured rib.

1955-11-19 206 Marty Marshall 178 22-8-2
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W UD 10 10

1955-09-10 206 Willie Bean 208 41-23-5
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W PTS 12 12
~ USA California State heavyweight title ~

1955-05-12 207 Johnny Summerlin 193 23-4-2
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L MD 10 10
~ referee: Tommy Hart 53-57 | judge: John Thomas 52½-57½ | judge: Russ Bradford 55-55 ~

1955-04-23 210 Gene Thompson 184½ 5-2-3
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 5 10
~ time: 1:28 | referee: Dynamite Jackson ~
Thompson was knocked down once in the 3rd round, and twice in the 5th round.

1955-02-12 Willie Bean 41-21-5
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W PTS 12 12
~ USA California State heavyweight title ~

1954-11-27 203 Frank Buford 211 22-27-7
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 4 10
~ time: 0:47 | referee: Joe Stone ~
The bout was stopped after Buford was knocked down for the first time.

1954-07-10 209 Willie Bean 207 39-19-5
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L SD 12 12
~ referee: Joe Stone 64½-66½ | judge: Lee Grossman 65-66 | judge: Charley Randolph 66-65 ~
~ USA California State heavyweight title ~

1954-05-15 207 Willie Bean 203 39-18-5
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W UD 12 12
~ referee: Frankie Van 66-63 | judge: Charley Randolph 69-60 | judge: Jimmy Wilson 65-64 ~
~ USA California State heavyweight title ~
Bean was knocked down for an eight-count in the 2nd round.

1954-03-01 204 Frank Buford 210½ 22-23-7
Arena, South Gate, California, United States W RTD 3 10
Buford did not come out for the 4th round, due to a shoulder injury.

1953-11-07 202 Frankie Daniels 178 22-7-1
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L SD 10 10

1953-09-05 207 Gene Brown 187 9-5-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 2 10
~ time: 2:12 | referee: Charley Randolph ~

1953-08-01 207 Sonny Andrews 175 12-8-1
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L MD 10 10
~ referee: Charley Randolph 55-55 | judge: Tommy Hart 54-56 | judge: Jack McDonald 54-56 ~

1953-06-15 208 Sonny Andrews 179 12-8-0
Arena, South Gate, California, United States D PTS 10 10

1953-06-06 208 Harland Kelly 228 1-1-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 2 6

~ time: 1:20 | referee: Tommy Hart ~

1953-04-14 217½ Fred Taylor 198 0-2-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W TKO 3 4

1953-03-28 222 Kirby Seals 196 1-1-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L SD 4 4

[raylawpc]

Young Jack Johnson
Another one that makes the list of the Forgotten



birth date 1928-10-26
death date 1963-10-01
division heavyweight
height 6′ 3″ / 191cm

country United States
residence Los Angeles, California, United States

birth place Lockhart, Texas, United States
birth name John Lee Storey

won 24 (KO 13) + lost 20 (KO 3) + drawn 1 = 45
rounds boxed 363 KO% 28.89


1963-04-02 233 Cleveland Williams 213 55-4-1
Sam Houston Coliseum, Houston, Texas, United States L TKO 10 10
~ referee: Jimmy Webb ~

1963-01-05 235 Ernie Terrell 203 28-4-0
Madison Square Garden, New York, New York, United States L PTS 10 10

1962-12-14 240 Ernie Terrell 199 27-4-0
Coliseum, Chicago, Illinois, United States L UD 10 10

1962-05-26 223¾ Sonny Banks 190½ 10-3-0
Graystone Ballroom, Detroit, Michigan, United States W KO 5 10

1962-02-26 245 Brian London 213½ 24-8-0
King's Hall, Belle Vue, Manchester, Lancashire, United Kingdom L PTS 10 10x3

1961-10-06 219½ Thorner Ahsman 196¾ 10-2-2
Masshallen, Gothenburg, Sweden W KO 4 8
~ time: 2:39 | referee: Åke Jacobsson ~
Åhsman down in 3rd and three times in 4th

1961-09-29 233 Karl Mildenberger 188 26-1-0
Sportpalast, Schoeneberg, Berlin, Germany L PTS 10 10

1961-07-10 225 Roger Rischer 194 17-6-2
Kezar Pavilion, San Francisco, California, United States L PTS 10 10
~ referee: Tony Bosnich 2-8 ~

1961-06-07 225 George Logan 207 19-4-1
Boise, Idaho, United States W MD 10 10
~ referee: Jim Nally 99-98 | 97-97 | 97-97 ~

1961-05-04 206 Amos Lincoln 210 26-2-1
Coliseum, Spokane, Washington, United States L PTS 10 10

1961-02-18 Willi Besmanoff 44-24-7
Fairgrounds Coliseum, Salt Lake City, Utah, United States W SD 10 10
~ referee: Ken Shulsen 96-95 | judge: Del Markham 96-95 | judge: Max Kosof 88-96 ~

1961-02-04 242 Cortez Stewart 244 16-2-0
Madison Square Garden, New York, New York, United States L UD 10 10~ 4-5 | 4-5 | judge: Mike Davidowitch 3-7 ~

1961-01-26 Walter Robinson 4-16-0
Athletic Club, West Jordan, Utah, United States W KO 3

1960-12-03 240 Tommy Fields 210 9-6-2
Sports Arena, Los Angeles, California, United States W TKO 5 6

1960-11-11 Clarence Williams 6-14-1
Logan, Utah, United States W KO 5

1960-07-18 220 Andy Isaacs 198 5-14-1
Coliseum, Denver, Colorado, United States W PTS 6 6

1959-03-05 218 Eddie Machen 194 24-1-1
Portland, Oregon, United States L UD 10 10
~ referee: Ralph Gruman 91-100 | judge: George Robinson 95-99 | judge: Eddie Volk 94-99 ~

1958-12-09 218 Reuben Vargas 190 16-6-0
Memorial Auditorium, Sacramento, California, United States L TKO 9 12
~ referee: Johnny Reno | 82-90 | 84-89 | 84-88 ~
~ vacant USA California State heavyweight title ~

1958-04-21 208 Willie Wilson 210 22-5-0
Arcadia Ballroom, Providence, Rhode Island, United States W UD 8 8

1958-01-29 214 Wayne Bethea 204 16-7-2
Chicago Stadium, Chicago, Illinois, United States L UD 10 10
~ 44-48 | 43-49 | 40-48 ~

1957-09-26 215 Duke Sabedong 215 13-4-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W UD 10 10

1956-11-16 201 Harold Carter 194¼ 20-2-2
Madison Square Garden, New York, New York, United States L UD 10 10~ referee: Ruby Goldstein 3-6 | judge: Bert Grant 2-8 | judge: Artie Aidala 1-9 ~

1956-09-13 203½ Ben Wise 193 8-5-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W UD 10 10
~ referee: Dynamite Jackson 97-93 | judge: Lee Grossman 96-95 | judge: Jack McDonald 98-94 ~

1956-08-16 205 Duke Sabedong 207 13-3-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W UD 10 10
~ referee: George Latka 98-85 | judge: Russ Bradford 98-90 | judge: Tommy Herman 97-92 ~

1956-07-21 Roger Rischer 185 13-4-2
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L PTS 12 12
California State Heavyweight Title Eliminator.
Johnson had been stripped of the title shortly before the bout, for failing to defend in the last six months.

1956-03-20 205 Ben Wise 201 5-5-1
Auditorium, Oakland, California, United States L TKO 4 10
~ time: 1:10 | referee: Vern Bybee ~

1956-02-23 210½ Johnny Summerlin 194½ 28-4-2
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L UD 10 10
~ referee: Abe Roth 53-57 | judge: John Thomas 54-56 | judge: George Latka 50½-59½ ~

1955-12-29 209 Ezzard Charles 196 89-16-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W TKO 6
~ referee: Lee Grossman ~
Charles suffered a badly cut lip and was unable to continue.

1955-12-01 208 Zora Folley 189 21-1-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W RTD 5 12
~ 29-26 ~
~ USA California State heavyweight title ~
Folley retired in his corner after the 5th round, citing an injured rib.

1955-11-19 206 Marty Marshall 178 22-8-2
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W UD 10 10

1955-09-10 206 Willie Bean 208 41-23-5
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W PTS 12 12
~ USA California State heavyweight title ~

1955-05-12 207 Johnny Summerlin 193 23-4-2
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L MD 10 10
~ referee: Tommy Hart 53-57 | judge: John Thomas 52½-57½ | judge: Russ Bradford 55-55 ~

1955-04-23 210 Gene Thompson 184½ 5-2-3
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 5 10
~ time: 1:28 | referee: Dynamite Jackson ~
Thompson was knocked down once in the 3rd round, and twice in the 5th round.

1955-02-12 Willie Bean 41-21-5
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W PTS 12 12
~ USA California State heavyweight title ~

1954-11-27 203 Frank Buford 211 22-27-7
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 4 10
~ time: 0:47 | referee: Joe Stone ~
The bout was stopped after Buford was knocked down for the first time.

1954-07-10 209 Willie Bean 207 39-19-5
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L SD 12 12
~ referee: Joe Stone 64½-66½ | judge: Lee Grossman 65-66 | judge: Charley Randolph 66-65 ~
~ USA California State heavyweight title ~

1954-05-15 207 Willie Bean 203 39-18-5
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W UD 12 12
~ referee: Frankie Van 66-63 | judge: Charley Randolph 69-60 | judge: Jimmy Wilson 65-64 ~
~ USA California State heavyweight title ~
Bean was knocked down for an eight-count in the 2nd round.

1954-03-01 204 Frank Buford 210½ 22-23-7
Arena, South Gate, California, United States W RTD 3 10
Buford did not come out for the 4th round, due to a shoulder injury.

1953-11-07 202 Frankie Daniels 178 22-7-1
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L SD 10 10

1953-09-05 207 Gene Brown 187 9-5-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 2 10
~ time: 2:12 | referee: Charley Randolph ~

1953-08-01 207 Sonny Andrews 175 12-8-1
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L MD 10 10
~ referee: Charley Randolph 55-55 | judge: Tommy Hart 54-56 | judge: Jack McDonald 54-56 ~

1953-06-15 208 Sonny Andrews 179 12-8-0
Arena, South Gate, California, United States D PTS 10 10

1953-06-06 208 Harland Kelly 228 1-1-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 2 6

~ time: 1:20 | referee: Tommy Hart ~

1953-04-14 217½ Fred Taylor 198 0-2-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W TKO 3 4

1953-03-28 222 Kirby Seals 196 1-1-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L SD 4 4

I had never seen a photo of him before. He looks like the original Jack Johnson.

[Rick Farris]

Young Jack Johnson . . .

I first saw the name Young Jack Johnson when reading ancient KO and Referee magazines given me by Johnny Flores & George Parnassus.
Even then, aside from learning his record and a few stats, I never heard much about him.
One thing is certain, he had a great trainer in Johnny Forbes.

I'll have to reach out to Frank and ask his opinion of Johnson.
I've seen the smaller fighters that Forbes turned into boxing masters, but what about Johnson?
He died at age 35, six months after his last bout.

Any memories, Frank?

[kikibalt]

Young Jack Johnson . . .

I first saw the name Young Jack Johnson when reading ancient KO and Referee magazines given me by Johnny Flores & George Parnassus.
Even then, aside from learning his record and a few stats, I never heard much about him.
One thing is certain, he had a great trainer in Johnny Forbes.

I'll have to reach out to Frank and ask his opinion of Johnson.
I've seen the smaller fighters that Forbes turned into boxing masters, but what about Johnson?
He died at age 35, six months after his last bout.

Any memories, Frank?

Managers: Wirt Ross, Bert Lewis, Johnny Forbes
Johnson was a former Army boxing champion. He was discovered by Wirt Ross, who subsequently sold his contract to Bert Lewis and Johnny Forbes.

In the autumn of 1963, he was fatally stabbed by his step-daughter, Bobby Steptoe, at his home in Queens.
From BoxRec
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I remember seeing Johnson fight a few times, I was at the Olympic the night he ko Charles. As a heavyweight he was not your Johnny Forbes type fighter, plus Forbes didn't start Johnson, when Forbes got Johnson, Johnson was already set in his ways as a fighter. He was a good fighter though. He would clean up todays heavys.....

[Rick Farris]

Young Jack Johnson . . .

I first saw the name Young Jack Johnson when reading ancient KO and Referee magazines given me by Johnny Flores & George Parnassus.
Even then, aside from learning his record and a few stats, I never heard much about him.
One thing is certain, he had a great trainer in Johnny Forbes.

I'll have to reach out to Frank and ask his opinion of Johnson.
I've seen the smaller fighters that Forbes turned into boxing masters, but what about Johnson?
He died at age 35, six months after his last bout.

Any memories, Frank?

Thanks, Frank.
Managers: Wirt Ross, Bert Lewis, Johnny Forbes
Johnson was a former Army boxing champion. He was discovered by Wirt Ross, who subsequently sold his contract to Bert Lewis and Johnny Forbes.

In the autumn of 1963, he was fatally stabbed by his step-daughter, Bobby Steptoe, at his home in Queens.
From BoxRec
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I remember seeing Johnson fight a few times, I was at the Olympic the night he ko Charles. As a heavyweight he was not your Johnny Forbes type fighter, plus Forbes didn't start Johnson, when Forbes got Johnson, Johnson was already set in his ways as a fighter. He was a good fighter though. He would clean up todays heavys.....

[raylawpc]

Young Jack Johnson . . .

I first saw the name Young Jack Johnson when reading ancient KO and Referee magazines given me by Johnny Flores & George Parnassus.
Even then, aside from learning his record and a few stats, I never heard much about him.
One thing is certain, he had a great trainer in Johnny Forbes.

I'll have to reach out to Frank and ask his opinion of Johnson.
I've seen the smaller fighters that Forbes turned into boxing masters, but what about Johnson?
He died at age 35, six months after his last bout.

Any memories, Frank?

Managers: Wirt Ross, Bert Lewis, Johnny Forbes
Johnson was a former Army boxing champion. He was discovered by Wirt Ross, who subsequently sold his contract to Bert Lewis and Johnny Forbes.

In the autumn of 1963, he was fatally stabbed by his step-daughter, Bobby Steptoe, at his home in Queens.
From BoxRec
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I remember seeing Johnson fight a few times, I was at the Olympic the night he ko Charles. As a heavyweight he was not your Johnny Forbes type fighter, plus Forbes didn't start Johnson, when Forbes got Johnson, Johnson was already set in his ways as a fighter. He was a good fighter though. He would clean up todays heavys.....

What was his style, Frank?

[kikibalt]

Young Jack Johnson . . .

I first saw the name Young Jack Johnson when reading ancient KO and Referee magazines given me by Johnny Flores & George Parnassus.
Even then, aside from learning his record and a few stats, I never heard much about him.
One thing is certain, he had a great trainer in Johnny Forbes.

I'll have to reach out to Frank and ask his opinion of Johnson.
I've seen the smaller fighters that Forbes turned into boxing masters, but what about Johnson?
He died at age 35, six months after his last bout.

Any memories, Frank?

Managers: Wirt Ross, Bert Lewis, Johnny Forbes
Johnson was a former Army boxing champion. He was discovered by Wirt Ross, who subsequently sold his contract to Bert Lewis and Johnny Forbes.

In the autumn of 1963, he was fatally stabbed by his step-daughter, Bobby Steptoe, at his home in Queens.
From BoxRec
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I remember seeing Johnson fight a few times, I was at the Olympic the night he ko Charles. As a heavyweight he was not your Johnny Forbes type fighter, plus Forbes didn't start Johnson, when Forbes got Johnson, Johnson was already set in his ways as a fighter. He was a good fighter though. He would clean up todays heavys.....

What was his style, Frank?

Stand-up fighter with good hand speed, not slow on-foot, but not much foot movement either......

[Rick Farris]

Time to hunt for The Hawk . . .

Next year California Boxing Hall of Famer, Dwight Hawkins, is somewhere very close, and very visible.
I'll get on with finding him. You have no idea how good this makes me feel.

This is a true Hall of Famer. A great man, who you'll never get to talk about himself, nothing about his career.
Long before he hung up the gloves, Dwight Hawkins dedicated himself to show young people a better path.
Here's an irony. When I receieved my award this year, it included awards from the City & County of Los Angeles.
The award is like a certificate, and signed by several L.A. City officials.
One of those officials, Mark Ridley-Thomas, is a high profile personality in his community.
As a high school student at L.A.'s Manuel Arts H.S. Ridley-Thomas met a youth counselor named Dwight Hawkins.
Dwight and Thomas maintained a close relationship thru the years, both professionally and socially.
The Councilman is well aware of the impact Hawkins had on the community.

Dwight spoke of Mark Ridley-Thomas the last time I saw the former featherweight contender fifteen years ago.

[Randyman]

Time to hunt for The Hawk . . .

Next year California Boxing Hall of Famer, Dwight Hawkins, is somewhere very close, and very visible.
I'll get on with finding him. You have no idea how good this makes me feel.

This is a true Hall of Famer. A great man, who you'll never get to talk about himself, nothing about his career.
Long before he hung up the gloves, Dwight Hawkins dedicated himself to show young people a better path.
Here's an irony. When I receieved my award this year, it included awards from the City & County of Los Angeles.
The award is like a certificate, and signed by several L.A. City officials.
One of those officials, Mark Ridley-Thomas, is a high profile personality in his community.
As a high school student at L.A.'s Manuel Arts H.S. Ridley-Thomas met a youth counselor named Dwight Hawkins.
Dwight and Thomas maintained a close relationship thru the years, both professionally and socially.
The Councilman is well aware of the impact Hawkins had on the community.

Dwight spoke of Mark Ridley-Thomas the last time I saw the former featherweight contender fifteen years ago.

Rick, either of these two sites might be a good place to start.

http://www.whitepages.com/search/FindPe ... ins&where=

http://www.veromi.com/Search.aspx?sType ... bdd=&doby=

[Rick Farris]

Thanks, Randy!

Using your link, I was able to find The Hawk.
I knew the street he lived on, but did not have the address. The Houses all look the same and it's a long block.
When I checked the link, I found Dwight Hawkins on the same street and it listed his wife's name.
I'll forward it to Don and Frank.

Thanks again!

[CNorkusJr]

I liked your posts on Young Jack Johnson- I remember as a kid my father mentioned his name a few times but I misunderstood it-taking it for a young of age Jack Johnson of hvywt championship fame in the 20's. When the real Young Jack Johnson was killed here in New York it caught a blip in the newspapers and my father was quite bothered by it.

My father also talked of a LA fighter he fought in Providence RI. He was a substitute for Roland Lastarza who pulled out of the Norkus/ LaStarza bout with an arm injury. Tommy Harrison. My father had a lot of respect for this guy, and said he was a hell of a puncher. My dad had him down late in the fight but it was not enough. Mr Harrison got the SD. My father mentioned Mr Harrison was Rocky Marciano's sparmate for his fights with Jersey Joe Walcott & Kid Mathews.

Tommy Harrison- Have you guys seen him around, maybe he passed on by now but I'll take my father's word on it that he was a very good heavyweight in his day.

[kikibalt]

Tommy Harrison

Harrison was the subject of a movie "Resurrecting the Champ" played by Samuel L. Jackson. Harrison now homeless in Santa Ana, CA. was born in Kingston Jamaica but grew up in Chicago. He said he had fought under the name of "Battlin" Bob Satterfield. He actually didn't, but was ranked higher than Satterfield by Ring Magazine in 1953. He's content living on the streets and answers to the name "champ" to passersby. He had made some money in the ring, saying he used to spend $1000 in a night back in the day with fancy suits and driving a pink Cadillac. He now has a broom and can be seen sweeping in front of shops occasionally being given money for his efforts.
BoxRec



birth date 1929-11-08
division light heavyweight

country United States
residence Los Angeles, California, United States
won 22 (KO 5) + lost 13 (KO eight) + drawn 2 = 37
rounds boxed 241 KO% 13.51


1958-12-19 182 Monroe Ratliff 181½ 12-10-4
Coliseum, San Diego, California, United States L KO 4 10

1958-08-28 182 Bob Butcher 200 20-1-0
Auditorium, Richmond, California, United States L TKO 9 10

1956-02-13 182 Matt Jackson 177 19-5-4
Arena, San Diego, California, United States L TKO 4 10

1954-08-02 176¼ Floyd Patterson 169 14-1-0
Eastern Parkway Arena, Brooklyn, New York, United States L TKO 1 8
~ time: 1:29 | referee: Mark Conn ~

1954-04-12 185¼ Earl Walls 194¾ 28-8-0
Maple Leaf Gardens, Toronto, Ontario, Canada L KO 1 10
~ time: 2:36 ~
Walls dropped Harrison early with a left hook for a five count, then battered him with a right to the jaw and a battery of lefts and rights to the body until he slumped to the floor and was counted out.

1954-01-26 183 Earl Walls 190½ 28-7-0
Maple Leaf Gardens, Toronto, Ontario, Canada W PTS 10 10

1953-10-20 183 Murray Burnett 180½ 4-15-1
Sioux City, Iowa, United States W PTS 10 10

1953-08-19 180½ Jimmy Slade 177½ 24-7-4
Chicago Stadium, Chicago, Illinois, United States D PTS 10 10
~ referee: Frank Gilmer 50-50 | judge: Ed Hintz 56-44 | judge: Frank Toombs 49-51 ~

1953-07-22 182 Dan Bucceroni 193 43-3-0
Chicago Stadium, Chicago, Illinois, United States L UD 10 10
Harrison was down in the 1st

1953-04-25 180 Wes Bascom 180 15-5-1
Winter Garden, Saint Louis, Missouri, United States W SD 10 10
~ referee: Ray Palmer ~

1953-04-06 182½ Jimmy Bivins 192 82-24-1
Miami, Florida, United States W UD 10 10

1953-02-04 181¾ Ezzard Charles 187 77-8-1
Olympia Stadium, Detroit, Michigan, United States L TKO 9 10
Harrison was knocked down in the 8th, before his manager stopped the fight in the 9th round.

1952-12-01 Wes Bascom 15-3-0
Rhode Island Auditorium, Providence, Rhode Island, United States W SD 10 10

1952-11-03 178¼ Jimmy Bivins 185 82-22-1
Rhode Island Auditorium, Providence, Rhode Island, United States W UD 10 10

1952-10-20 177 Charley Norkus 191¾ 17-9-0
Rhode Island Auditorium, Providence, Rhode Island, United States W SD 10 10 ~ referee: Sharkey Buonanno | judge: Eddie Jansen | judge: Dick Cotter ~
Harrison was down in the 9th. Harrison was a substitute for Roland LaStarza who pulled out with an injury. Referee Buonanno voted for Norkus, with judges Jansen and Cotter gave Harrison the edge.

1952-09-23 171 Rocky Jones 178 13-8-2
Municipal Stadium, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, United States L PTS 6 6

1952-07-28 170 Paul Andrews 170 15-1-0
Yankee Stadium, Bronx, New York, United States W PTS 6 6

1952-05-24 170½ Frankie Crane 171 22-7-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States D PTS 12 12
~ referee: Abe Roth 64-68 | judge: Dynamite Jackson 71½-60½ | judge: Jack McDonald 66-66 ~
~ USA California State light heavyweight title ~

1952-04-05 172 Abel Fernandez 175 9-6-1
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W UD 12 12
~ referee: Abe Roth 68½-63½ | judge: Tommy Herman 71-61 | judge: Tommy Hart 69½-62½ ~
~ vacant USA California State light heavyweight title ~

1952-02-15 167 Bobo Olson 162 47-5-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L UD 10 10
~ referee: Mushy Callahan 50½-59½ | judge: Dynamite Jackson 49½-60½ | judge: Frank Holborow 50½-59½ ~

1952-02-05 170 Al Callahan 171 14-9-0
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W TKO 4 6
~ time: 1:27 | referee: Dynamite Jackson ~
Callahan was knocked down once in the 4th round.

1952-01-04 172 Al Callahan 168 14-8-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W UD 6 6

1951-12-11 171 Abel Fernandez 180¼ 7-5-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L KO 2 6
Harrison was knocked down once in both the 1st and 2nd round.

1951-11-23 172½ Abel Fernandez 179 7-4-1
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W PTS 6 6
Fernandez was knocked down for a nine-count in the 3rd round.

1951-11-06 173 Paulie Pargo 168 4-8-0
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W TKO 4 4

1951-08-21 172 Sonny Boy Harris 174 0-2-0
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W TKO 2 6
Harris was knocked down for an eight-count in the 2nd, before the bout was stopped.

1951-06-29 168 Frankie Crane 161¾ 19-6-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W UD 6 6

1951-06-12 169 Frankie Crane 163 17-6-0
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L KO 5 6

1951-04-09 171 Al Timmons 176 16-18-3
Arena, Ocean Park, California, United States W PTS 4 4

1951-04-06 170 Al Timmons 178 16-17-3
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W PTS 4 4

1951-03-26 171 Paulie Pargo 170 1
Arena, Ocean Park, California, United States W TKO 4 4

1951-03-20 164¾ Billy McNeece 162 3-0-0
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L SD 6 6

1951-02-27 163 Frankie Crane 159½ 17-5-0
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W PTS 6 6

1951-02-13 163 Frankie Crane 161 16-5-0
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L SD 6 6

1951-02-02 162¾ Frankie Crane 161½ 16-4-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W PTS 6 6

1951-01-30 164½ Lou Newman 165½ 2-3-0
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W KO 2 4

1951-01-12 167½ Earl Keel 167 13-8-0
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W PTS 4

[raylawpc]

Managers: Wirt Ross, Bert Lewis, Johnny Forbes
Johnson was a former Army boxing champion. He was discovered by Wirt Ross, who subsequently sold his contract to Bert Lewis and Johnny Forbes.

In the autumn of 1963, he was fatally stabbed by his step-daughter, Bobby Steptoe, at his home in Queens.
From BoxRec
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I remember seeing Johnson fight a few times, I was at the Olympic the night he ko Charles. As a heavyweight he was not your Johnny Forbes type fighter, plus Forbes didn't start Johnson, when Forbes got Johnson, Johnson was already set in his ways as a fighter. He was a good fighter though. He would clean up todays heavys.....

What was his style, Frank?

Stand-up fighter with good hand speed, not slow on-foot, but not much foot movement either......

What kind of puncher was he? Boxrec indicates the kayo win over Charles was actually a TKO stoppage necessitated by a badly cut lip suffered by Charles.

[kikibalt]

What was his style, Frank?

Stand-up fighter with good hand speed, not slow on-foot, but not much foot movement either......

What kind of puncher was he? Boxrec indicates the kayo win over Charles was actually a TKO stoppage necessitated by a badly cut lip suffered by Charles.

He was a decent puncher, who could put you away with combinations, but no, not a big puncher per se.
You are right about the stoppages on the Charles fight.

[CNorkusJr]

Certainly sad news to hear Tommy Harrison on the streets. Not all that rare in the history of boxing though. Recently the Rocky Lockridge story has gotten media play, and the Willie Pastrano story is very sad too. Pastrano I heard died of cancer, but his last few years were very tough for him financially taking on crap jobs here and there to just get by.

I dont know how long ago the Boxrec Tommy Harrison story was posted, hopefully someone is looking after him. Ring 8 VBA looks after indigent fighters here in NY.(which is one of the many purposes of the various Ring org. that are still around-fighters on hard times dont have to be members). I am not sure if CA. has such an organization. There's a Ring 8 meeting tonite which I attend here in NY. Maybe help has been offered and he constantly refuses it-but let me ask Matt Farago Pres. of Ring 8 if there is help available for him and if CA has a org. and his whereabouts is known.

[kikibalt]

Manny Renteria
Renteria was tag as a can't-miss prospect, sure to a be champion. He got derail when he fought Don Jordan, and was never the same after that.



division lightweight

country United States
residence Hollywood, California, United States
won 15 (KO eight) + lost 6 (KO three) + drawn 1 = 22
rounds boxed 133 KO% 36.36


1956-12-12 George Dunn 65-18-7
Calgary, Alberta, Canada L TKO 6 10
~ time: 0:43 ~

1955-02-22 138 Sonny Amoroso 139 11-1-1
Auditorium, Richmond, California, United States L KO 8 10
~ time: 2:22 | referee: Jack Silver 39-38 ~
Renteria was knocked down for an eight count in the 1st round.

1955-02-10 Eddie Chavez 49-7-3
Winterland Arena, San Francisco, California, United States L SD 10 10
~ referee: Ray Flores 56-54 | judge: Eddie James 53-57 | judge: Jack Downey 54-56 ~

1955-01-27 141½ Frankie Cockrell 140½ 27-20-8
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L SD 10 10
~ referee: Lee Grossman 57½-52½ | judge: George Latka 54-56 | judge: Abe Roth 52-58 ~

1954-11-29 134 Don Jordan 135 15-2-0
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States L KO 7 12
~ time: 1:20 | referee: Abe Roth ~
~ USA California State lightweight title ~
Roth counted out Renteria on his feet, when he became entangled in the ropes, while stunned.

1954-09-27 138 Lavert Smith 141 14-10-3
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W TKO 6 10
~ time: 1:26 | referee: Tommy Hart ~

1954-08-09 135½ Freddie Herman 143 46-40-8
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W UD 10 10
~ referee: Tommy Hart 57½-52½ | judge: Charley Randolph 57-53 | judge: George Latka 59-51 ~
Herman was knocked down in the 1st round

1954-06-21 140 Mario Trigo 139 62-42-10
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States D PTS 10 10
~ referee: Charley Randolph 54-58 | judge: Frankie Van 55-55 | judge: Dynamite Jackson 55-55 ~

1954-05-04 139 Joe Felan 140 24-2-2
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W KO 4 10
~ time: 0:11 | referee: Frankie Van ~
Felan was knocked down in the 3rd and 4th round.

1954-03-23 138 Johnny Efhan 137 16-7-2
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W RTD 4 10
~ referee: Reggie Gilmore ~
Efhan was knocked down in the 1st round. Renteria was down in the 4th round. Efhan did not come out for the 5th round.

1954-02-16 138¼ Armando Muniz 138½ 12-2-2
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W KO 2 10
~ time: 2:28 | referee: Reggie Gilmore ~

1954-01-12 137 Baby Face Mathis 138 38-23-8
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W UD 6 6
Renteria was knocked down in the 2nd round.

1953-12-01 137 Armando Muniz 137½ 11-1-2
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W SD 6 6

1953-07-28 138 Armand Goetters 139½ 7-0-1
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W TKO 5 6
~ referee: Dynamite Jackson ~

1953-06-06 135 Marvin Smith 135½ 27-16-4
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W UD 6 6

1953-05-02 133 Jimmy Grow 133 14-6-1
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 4 6
~ referee: Dynamite Jackson ~
The bout was halted when Grow suffered a broken nose.

1953-04-04 133 Rudy Jordan 137 7-0-1
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States L SD 6 6

1953-03-07 130 LeRoy Richards 126 3-3-2
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W PTS 6 6

1953-02-14 132 Mickey Northrup 130 15-6-1
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W PTS 6 6

1953-01-03 130½ Henry Briere 132 16-46-6
Legion Stadium, Hollywood, California, United States W TKO 6 6

1952-12-02 136 Chato Duarte 139 1-2-0
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W KO 1 4

1952-10-16 134 Armando Rivera 132
Olympic Auditorium, Los Angeles, California, United States W PTS 4 4

[raylawpc]

Certainly sad news to hear Tommy Harrison on the streets. Not all that rare in the history of boxing though. Recently the Rocky Lockridge story has gotten media play, and the Willie Pastrano story is very sad too. Pastrano I heard died of cancer, but his last few years were very tough for him financially taking on crap jobs here and there to just get by.

I dont know how long ago the Boxrec Tommy Harrison story was posted, hopefully someone is looking after him. Ring 8 VBA looks after indigent fighters here in NY.(which is one of the many purposes of the various Ring org. that are still around-fighters on hard times dont have to be members). I am not sure if CA. has such an organization. There's a Ring 8 meeting tonite which I attend here in NY. Maybe help has been offered and he constantly refuses it-but let me ask Matt Farago Pres. of Ring 8 if there is help available for him and if CA has a org. and his whereabouts is known.

These guys come into all this wealth when they are too young to deal with it, and then p*ss it all away. It is mind bloggling to me that Mike Tyson could blow the millions that he earned in his career and had to file bankruptcy. How do you blow $50 to $100 million and have nothing to show for it except debt? Holyfield is reportedly about to lose his home due to back taxes and delinquent mortgage payments. I understand he is fighting now just to keep his creditors at bay. Unbelievable.

It really hits home to me because I'm a tax/estate lawyer and hold certification as a financial planner (a CFP). I wish I knew how to help these guys, but I have no idea what can be done. The young guys still fighting won't listen, and for the old guys is too late. Its a real problem for those of us who love boxing and boxers.

[kikibalt]

Hope these people get put away for a long time

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2 ... arges.html

[CNorkusJr]

I agree with you Tom. To blow through millions of dollars in ones lifetime seems ridiculous to me, but in many cases,look at the people surrounding these guys. Certainly boxers should take most of the blame on their mis-spendings, but entourages and hanger ons (which the boxer apparently approves of now) leech most of the money.

I think for most of the old timers 40's-mid 60's, and especially that group who fought before TV and televised theatre, the times were a bit different. Usually the mgrs and so-called financial backers stole more than their share and of course the Carbo-Palermo/mob payout cuts to get bigger purses stole more than their shares leaving most boxers high and dry. What little they did get was usually mis-spent too. I'm talking about the contenders and pre-lim guys. Champions were suckers too but popularity got them wages outside of boxing too.
If a boxer was married it was a plus as she made sure some went to the bank instead of other vices. My father was a case in point here. Please note that my father never needed assistance and always worked during and after his boxing career.He helped start Ring 8 back in the early 50's along with many others. Boxers for boxers. Today, you would think these millionaire boxing guys would support these groups to the tune of thousands, but no, most VBA have to hold events to get contributions to pay overhead. Most $$$ comes from dues paying members and occaisional hundred dollar or $1,000 donation..

The Veteran Boxers Groups I talk about are groups that actively try to reach out to guys who are essentially good guys but no means of income. They pick up medicine tabs as well of assisting with govt housing placement to get a roof over their heads. They help fill out the paperwork for federal or state relief funds and when needed lay out cash so the boxer eats.Also, pugilistic dementia is a huge problem, but state assistance where available is better than dying on the streets.

No cash gets handed to the boxer outright-unless he has a person with him to oversee his care. Holiday gifts are in order so that the guy feels like he has family too. Placement family counseling services are tried if all agree it helps. Most boxers ID's are kept confidential -only known to org. trustees who write out the checks (cash). Some are known and appear at some of the meetings to say thanks for the new set of clothes he got.All are treated like champs. Donations are appreciated any time/and can explicitly be placed to a person or item of your choice. (Boxer health care/clothes/etc etc). Ring 1 in Philidelphia, Ring 8 in New York, Ring 4 in Boston are just a few and most have websites.