Colin Hart

[damianhucker1]

I have to say I'm absolutely astonished that it seems to be unanimous that Tyson should get in. Need I remind you that the man is a convicted rapist? Or that he deliberately maimed a true ring great during a title fight? Or that he has been convicted of assulting women, journalists, promoters and trainers? Or that he has numerous convictions for drug abuse? Or how about the time he explained to the world that his ideal scenario in a fight was to smash his opponent's nose through his brain?

Tyson is a man who has disgraced himself and the sport of boxing in just about every way imaginable, to vindicate and celebrate his career in this way is an affront to the many true greats of the sport who represented it with honour. It is true that the HOF is not a whos who of alter boys but Tyson's crimes are not petty misdemeanours. Including the likes of Tyson in the HOF degrades the sport.

Are you forgetting its the BOXING hall of fame , not whos the nicest person hall of fame

[antcull]

I have to say I'm absolutely astonished that it seems to be unanimous that Tyson should get in. Need I remind you that the man is a convicted rapist? Or that he deliberately maimed a true ring great during a title fight? Or that he has been convicted of assulting women, journalists, promoters and trainers? Or that he has numerous convictions for drug abuse? Or how about the time he explained to the world that his ideal scenario in a fight was to smash his opponent's nose through his brain?

Tyson is a man who has disgraced himself and the sport of boxing in just about every way imaginable, to vindicate and celebrate his career in this way is an affront to the many true greats of the sport who represented it with honour. It is true that the HOF is not a whos who of alter boys but Tyson's crimes are not petty misdemeanours. Including the likes of Tyson in the HOF degrades the sport.

What about Hopkins? Convicted of 9 felonies before he started boxing. Or is it only if your a criminal while boxing that you shouldn't be considered for HOF induction?

Should Monzon and Liston be removed from the HOF?

How about the guys who turned to drugs in the HOF? Should they be removed? Where do you draw the line?

[Old bones Ian]

Ok i think the hall of fame would be a bit short if it didn't include anyone that had done bad things.

I mean Jake LaMotta admits to throwing a fight, which should be a cardinal sin in boxing.
Don King killed a man,

[JamesH]

The website goes along with what I'd always assumed was the criteria for induction, "to chronicle the achievements of those who excel", so it's a celebration of achievement in boxing. With this in mind, surely the youngest heavyweight champ ever deserves his place?

[forcefraser]

Of course Tyson should be in the HOF.

Who cares what he might have been accussed of doing and found guilty by a dozen brainwashed yanks.

He was the most exciting fighter of a generation and a boxing historian of some merit. I would like to get all of the people who have taken advantage of what was essentially a vunerable kid in the young Tyson and subject them to the law of the baseball bat.

[TerribleTerry]

Tyson deserving of Hall of Fame status? Meh. He wasn't all that..

http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?desktop_ur ... EyLY&gl=GB

[Darling]

I am not a Mike Tyson fan but feel he deserves his place in the HOF. Apart from being an amazing figher to watch at his peek he and the Rocky films are responsible for giving boxing a huge boost in the late 80's early 90's.

If McGuigan is the yard stick, Hart has his head up his ass!

[Tko1980]

Colin hart worst pundit and worst wig!!!!

[banjo]

Ok i think the hall of fame would be a bit short if it didn't include anyone that had done bad things.

I mean Jake LaMotta admits to throwing a fight, which should be a cardinal sin in boxing.
Don King killed a man,

Didn't Lamotta also kill a man? A bookie or something like that, I read it somewhere.

[hurlock]

ive got no respect for hart as a pundit. he is way to arrogant & middle class for my liking :!:

tyson was a phenominom :!: & he did put the fear of god in opponent's . his speed & freaky power was unreal :!: he was banged up when he was finished & generated atleast half a billion when released, he relied on reputation & intimidation on his return as it wasnt there no more. but anyone who think's this is the case from dot is fuking dumb as sh1t.

tyson is a legend an icon & was capable of defeating any heavyweight ever & deffo should be the same for the future in another 60years time.

[black panther]

Colin Hart is stuck in the past anyways. His opinions are never worth too much attention anyways.
The years and oppurtunities he has had around boxing - yet, what he knows about boxing, you could write on the back of a stamp ....in large letters.

x2

Who the hell decided Colin "Compare every boxer to Muhammed Ali in my Punditry" Hart should have a vote? One of the most famous boxers ever shouldn't be in the hall of fame? Has the world gone mad? As mentioned Don King kicked a man to death. I bet Colin votes him in though, if he isn't in already.......

[gobbles]

ive got no respect for hart as a pundit. he is way to arrogant & middle class for my liking :!:

tyson was a phenominom :!: & he did put the fear of god in opponent's . his speed & freaky power was unreal :!: he was banged up when he was finished & generated atleast half a billion when released, he relied on reputation & intimidation on his return as it wasnt there no more. but anyone who think's this is the case from dot is fuking dumb as sh1t.

tyson is a legend an icon & was capable of defeating any heavyweight ever & deffo should be the same for the future in another 60years time.

"Too middle class"??!!

So you judge whether someone has the right to comment on a sport not by their knowledge but by their social background?
Apart from the fact that Hart is Jewish and grew up in the East End in the years after the war

[stujones]

I've often stuck up for Hart in the past, this doesn't surprise me..... I can remember his punditary for Tyson at the time, I don't think I heard him once give praise for anything Tyson did post Douglas - slacked off Bruno as opposed to give Tyson any praise in 1996. When Tyson pulled it out of the bag vs Botha all he kept saying was how Botha was an idiot for getting too cocky and Tyson was shot and should retire. I could see his sense but when it was every fight, it did get a bit much.... no praise for the one punch KO that did in Botha.

And now his bias has been shown. Has Colin spoken about why he didn't include him? I don't believe it has THAT much to do with his out of the ring issues - I am sure he had no problem putting in Jake La Motta or would have any issue with Floyd Mayweather Jnr.

[forcefraser]

ive got no respect for hart as a pundit. he is way to arrogant & middle class for my liking :!:

tyson was a phenominom :!: & he did put the fear of god in opponent's . his speed & freaky power was unreal :!: he was banged up when he was finished & generated atleast half a billion when released, he relied on reputation & intimidation on his return as it wasnt there no more. but anyone who think's this is the case from dot is fuking dumb as sh1t.

tyson is a legend an icon & was capable of defeating any heavyweight ever & deffo should be the same for the future in another 60years time.

"Too middle class"??!!

So you judge whether someone has the right to comment on a sport not by their knowledge but by their social background?
Apart from the fact that Hart is Jewish and grew up in the East End in the years after the war

Whatever class he may be, he comes across as arrogant, sneering and snobbish. The bloke just rubs mu up the wrong way.

He`s living in the past and his relevance within modern boxing is questionable.

[reggaereggae]

No he is wrong. The hall of fame is just that, a hall of fame. Tyson was one of the most famous fighters in the history of the sport, he was also the youngest ever undisputed champion. You can pick apart his record, but then the same can be said of Dempsey, Marciano, even Louis.

How many other more dominant champs can anyone name. Ali, Louis, Holmes, Lewis....after that it gets difficult quickly. Most heavyweight champs have had a pretty brief reign when you look at their records. Tyson is one of those, but he still deserves at the least a top 15 rating.

I agree fully - it's not a 'Boxing Morality Hall of Fame' after all....And Lamotta for example is an admitted rapist (read his autobiography), wife beater and ex-criminal. Are they going to bar Tapia because of his drug abuse and jail time?

It gets a little harder when we're dealing with people have taking PEDs or blatantly cheated in a premeditated manner like Margarito.

Let's not forget Roy Jones failed a drug test - nbow that to me is more of a dilemma

[jamesmcdonnell]

ive got no respect for hart as a pundit. he is way to arrogant & middle class for my liking :!:

tyson was a phenominom :!: & he did put the fear of god in opponent's . his speed & freaky power was unreal :!: he was banged up when he was finished & generated atleast half a billion when released, he relied on reputation & intimidation on his return as it wasnt there no more. but anyone who think's this is the case from dot is fuking dumb as sh1t.

tyson is a legend an icon & was capable of defeating any heavyweight ever & deffo should be the same for the future in another 60years time.

"Too middle class"??!!

So you judge whether someone has the right to comment on a sport not by their knowledge but by their social background?
Apart from the fact that Hart is Jewish and grew up in the East End in the years after the war

I was going to say, never struck me as being middle class at all!

[Hagler2002]

What qualifies Colin Hart to vote on the Hall of Fame?

His wig is legendary and because its attached to that self opinionated A-holes head he is entitled to a vote, wrong I know but nothings fair in this life.

[Trojans44]

So nobody thinks that biting a man's ear off during a championship fight and then spitting it out it in the middle of the ring should be taken into account when assessing whether Tyson's career should be honoured by entry into the HOF? Again, Tyson raped a woman while he was the most famous boxer on the planet. In my opinion these two factors demonstrate that Tyson brought the sport into disrepute in just about the most abhorrent way possible. He disgraced himself and the sport in an unforgiveable fashion. Clearly I'm in a minority of one who will find it slightly unsavoury seeing this man's career lauded and honoured.

The Hopkins scenario is entirley different. Hopkins found redemption through boxing. His story honours the sport by demonstrating its reformative powers. Through boxing Hopkins has lived a life of discipline and achievement. His career encapsulates everything that is good about boxing.

As regards LaMotta, King and Liston they'll already in for good or ill. When addressing the question of Tyson's inclusion its surely not enough to cite examples of other unsavoury characters who are already in. The question is whether or not such characters should be admitted in general. I'm not saying inductees must be angels, but Tyson is a convicted rapist! What if Valero had achieved more in the ring? Would people be happy with his inclusion?

As regards Margarito, Jones and Mosley, anybody who cheats in the fashion these men have forfeits any right to fight again never mind entering the HOF.

[JamesH]

So nobody thinks that biting a man's ear off during a championship fight and then spitting it out it in the middle of the ring should be taken into account when assessing whether Tyson's career should be honoured by entry into the HOF? Again, Tyson raped a woman while he was the most famous boxer on the planet. In my opinion these two factors demonstrate that Tyson brought the sport into disrepute in just about the most abhorrent way possible. He disgraced himself and the sport in an unforgiveable fashion. Clearly I'm in a minority of one who will find it slightly unsavoury seeing this man's career lauded and honoured.

The Hopkins scenario is entirley different. Hopkins found redemption through boxing. His story honours the sport by demonstrating its reformative powers. Through boxing Hopkins has lived a life of discipline and achievement. His career encapsulates everything that is good about boxing.

As regards LaMotta, King and Liston they'll already in for good or ill. When addressing the question of Tyson's inclusion its surely not enough to cite examples of other unsavoury characters who are already in. The question is whether or not such characters should be admitted in general. I'm not saying inductees must be angels, but Tyson is a convicted rapist! What if Valero had achieved more in the ring? Would people be happy with his inclusion?

As regards Margarito, Jones and Mosley, anybody who cheats in the fashion these men have forfeits any right to fight again never mind entering the HOF.

Are the works of Oscar Wilde still celebrated?

Is the music of Michael Jackson still played?

The fact that the answer to both questions is yes does not harm the respective reputations of literature and music.

Of course your argument may be that they are, but they shouldn't be. I do understand your point and from conversations I have had you are certainly not a lone voice, but I think you are judging it differently to most on here. The consensus seems to be that Tyson's positive achievements in the ring merit his inclusion. To demonstrate my point, the answer to your Valero scenario would for me be a resounding yes.

I'm not judging the virtues of the nominees as men, but as boxers. If it was recognition of Tysons standing as a role model I would reconsider my view, but its the hall of fame for boxing. Tyson has taken the knocks for his negative contributions to society, I don't think its wrong to also acknowledge the positives.

[Hagler2002]

That about sums it up James, now put a pie in it Colin you're starting to sound like a broken record, hold on, you have for the last 20yrs

[oliverfennell]

Tyson's not already in the HOF????
He should definitely be in IMO

Have to be retired five years before you become eligible.

[oliverfennell]

Christ, you're a bit of an emotional jellyfish aren't you?

yes :( i was once reading my Boxing News in a pub in Soho when a guy started a conversation (not that sort of conversation) about boxing with the gem of "you like boxing (pointing to the magazine) so tell me why that Lennox lewis wont fight Eubank?" i reply with "he must be scared" which he agreed with calling Lewis a yank and walking away.

i've had many an idiot strike up similar conversations

We've all heard them. One of my favourites was overhhearing some blokle insisting "I know my boxing, mate, and this David Kane..." (he meant Haye, but it wasn't just a slip, as he said "Kane" every time. Wouldn't mind some random guy getting a name wrong if he didn't particularly follow the sport, but it was his insistence that "I know my boxing" that got me!

[stujones]

So nobody thinks that biting a man's ear off during a championship fight and then spitting it out it in the middle of the ring should be taken into account when assessing whether Tyson's career should be honoured by entry into the HOF? Again, Tyson raped a woman while he was the most famous boxer on the planet. In my opinion these two factors demonstrate that Tyson brought the sport into disrepute in just about the most abhorrent way possible. He disgraced himself and the sport in an unforgiveable fashion. Clearly I'm in a minority of one who will find it slightly unsavoury seeing this man's career lauded and honoured.

The Hopkins scenario is entirley different. Hopkins found redemption through boxing. His story honours the sport by demonstrating its reformative powers. Through boxing Hopkins has lived a life of discipline and achievement. His career encapsulates everything that is good about boxing.

As regards LaMotta, King and Liston they'll already in for good or ill. When addressing the question of Tyson's inclusion its surely not enough to cite examples of other unsavoury characters who are already in. The question is whether or not such characters should be admitted in general. I'm not saying inductees must be angels, but Tyson is a convicted rapist! What if Valero had achieved more in the ring? Would people be happy with his inclusion?

As regards Margarito, Jones and Mosley, anybody who cheats in the fashion these men have forfeits any right to fight again never mind entering the HOF.

I partially agree with what you are saying.... but wish to clarify a couple of points.

1) Did Roy Jones cheat? His B sample passed the test.... now that is from the same Urine as the first sample. The exact same scenerio happened to his opponent that night also. Cover up? Maybe, possibly... or possibly a flaw in the testing procedure (it happens, ask Diane Modhal). Got to give the man the benefit of the doubt.

I'm still flummouxed as to why Roy would juice up on a routine title defence against one of his easiest opponents and not get caught elsewhere (including throughout a stella Amateur career). He didn't serve a ban and he was (as his B sample passed) cleared of any cheating, so not sure why you say he cheats "in this fashion". What about the less high profile cheaters... who cheating seems to be forgotton about - the likes of James Toney, Frans Botha (not that he will ever get inducted), what about Vitali Klitchsko.

2) Can you expand on why on your second paragraph. I'm not sure why you cannot compare unsavoury characterters who are already in. La Motta was certainly not an annugural inductee, so guys like Hart (appologise if he didn't) must have voted for him. It reaks of double standards. Tyson is certain as worthy as La Motta if you talk about their impact they made on boxing.

[nobby_nobbins]

We've all heard them. One of my favourites was overhhearing some blokle insisting "I know my boxing, mate, and this David Kane..." (he meant Haye, but it wasn't just a slip, as he said "Kane" every time. Wouldn't mind some random guy getting a name wrong if he didn't particularly follow the sport, but it was his insistence that "I know my boxing" that got me!

I think some boxers get each others' names wrong - even their own opponents. I also remember some boxer referring to an up and coming guy as a "good container". I think he meant "contender".

Lionel

[Baboon]

If we take out of the ring activity into account we'd lose hald the HOF. Tyson was a sporting crossover who introduced a sizeable chunk of people who would never have watched boxing to watch boxing. He beat everyone that was available to him at the time of his peak. There are plenty of HOFers who don't meet either of these criteria so to suggest Tyson shouldn't be in is utter balls.

From a boxers or fans point of view ask the question (as BN regularly do) 'what's your dream historical fight' and a helluva lot of people will suggest peak Tyson vs Ali. I'm not saying he's up there with Ali (he's not), but he was a dominant champion within his generation who drew people to the sport. Has to be in the HOF.