British Top 30 P4P November 2010

[Horse]

There should be no "IF" about it. You clearly base your judgement on quality of opponents faced or beaten.
Froch's last 4 fights are better than any 4 Haye and Khan will have in the future.

I only move fighters after they fight. I will have to wait until after Froch and Khan's next fights to move them.

[Horse]

Sprott had become more or less a continental journeyman and was a substitute when Audley beat him.Quigley and Dodson have never been journeymen.

Sprott might be a European journeyman, but he is fighting good opposition and I don't think losing against those sorts of fighters should be held against him too much.

How well would Quigley and Dodson have faired against the level of opposition that Sprott has been fighting?

[hurlock]

what about rees ???

[Horse]

So was Afolabi, and he lost to the world number 1 at the weight (almost stopping him in the 5th). He's been more active than both the fighters you mentioned also (winning a shutout last month). I don't understand your reasoning.

He should be top 10 minimum

Afolabi has had 5 fights in the last 5 years. His activity level has been poor.

[Horse]

Smith has also defended once and does not have bad opposition. I think it is a case of inconsistency. I think you should admit you are wrong!

I think we will have to agree to disagree for now.

[Horse]

how can craig watson be infront of grove's & degale & gAvin

Watson has achieved a lot more than Groves, DeGale and Gavin as a pro.

[JDC]

So was Afolabi, and he lost to the world number 1 at the weight (almost stopping him in the 5th). He's been more active than both the fighters you mentioned also (winning a shutout last month). I don't understand your reasoning.

He should be top 10 minimum

Afolabi has had 5 fights in the last 5 years. His activity level has been poor.

All these 5 fights have come in the last 2 and a half years. Cook has had 2 fights and Witter 3 in the same time frame.

[Horse]

what about rees ???

Rees will enter next month.

[Horse]

All these 5 fights have come in the last 2 and a half years. Cook has had 2 fights and Witter 3 in the same time frame.

If Cook or Witter had just beaten a fighter like Siproshvili then they wouldn't have moved up the rankings much either.

[mickey1975]

what about rees ???

Rees will enter next month.

How is Rees not in already?He is a former W.B.A Champion at the weight ABOVE and holds wins over Lynes and Cook in Prizefighter.Does he have to unify before getting on your list?

[Horse]

How is Rees not in already?He is a former W.B.A Champion at the weight ABOVE and holds wins over Lynes and Cook in Prizefighter.Does he have to unify before getting on your list?

Rees was in the top 10 when he was the WBA champion just over 2 1/2 years ago, but he has since fallen out.

Prizefighter fights are only over 3 rounds, so I don't consider those results to be as good as wins over a longer distance. Before Rees's win this month he hadn't fought in a fight scheduled for 8 rounds or above for over 2 1/2 years, so I don't think it is unreasonable for him to have fallen out of the rankings in that time.

[JDC]

All these 5 fights have come in the last 2 and a half years. Cook has had 2 fights and Witter 3 in the same time frame.

If Cook or Witter had just beaten a fighter like Siproshvili then they wouldn't have moved up the rankings much either.

He lost a close fight to the best in his division. Thats the point. You brought level of activity in as an issue as to why Cook and Witter are ahead of him. They have lost to more convincingly, to lesser fighters a longer time ago.

You never ranked him after he KO'd Enzo.

In the past 2 and a half years he has stopped Eric Fields and Mac and narrowly lost a decision against the best in the division.

I would go as far as saying none of these have done more than him:

4. (4.) Nathan Cleverly
5. (5.) Rendall Munroe
6. (6.) Ricky Burns
7. (7.) Matthew Macklin
8. (8.) John Murray
9. (9.) Ryan Rhodes
10. (10.) Kell Brook

11. (11.) Matthew Hatton
12. (12.) Brian Magee (Irish)
13. (17.) Paul McCloskey (Irish)
14. (13.) Kevin Mitchell
15. (14.) Junior Witter
16. (15.) Jamie McDonnell
17. (16.) Martin Lindsay (Irish)
18. (18.) Darren Barker
19. (19.) Jason Booth
20. (NE.) Stephen Foster

21. (20.) Andy Lee (Irish)
22. (21.) Dereck Chisora
23. (22.) Audley Harrison
24. (23.) Stephen Smith

[Horse]

He lost a close fight to the best in his division. Thats the point. You brought level of activity in as an issue as to why Cook and Witter are ahead of him. They have lost to more convincingly, to lesser fighters a longer time ago.

Is Huck really better than Alexander or Martinez?

You never ranked him after he KO'd Enzo.

In the past 2 and a half years he has stopped Eric Fields and Mac and narrowly lost a decision against the best in the division.

His win against Eric Fields was over 2 1/2 years ago and it was only against a prospect. His win against Maccarinelli was over 18 months ago and Maccarinelli has been knocked out twice since then.

[JDC]

He lost a close fight to the best in his division. Thats the point. You brought level of activity in as an issue as to why Cook and Witter are ahead of him. They have lost to more convincingly, to lesser fighters a longer time ago.

Is Huck really better than Alexander or Martinez?

At the time of their fights, yes a loss to Huck was marginally better than a loss to Alexander. I don't feel that Huck has improved as much as Alexander though. Huck is, and will remain without doubt, better than Martinez. Its the manner of defeat which holds the most weight in both cases. Both Alexander and Martinez were relevantly untested at world level. Huck was, and still is, a seasoned world level pro

Witter quit, on the way to a shutout loss (minimum).

Cook was KO'd in front of his own fans. .

Afolabi went the distance in a close fight and almost stopped Huck in Germany.

You never ranked him after he KO'd Enzo.

In the past 2 and a half years he has stopped Eric Fields and Mac and narrowly lost a decision against the best in the division.

His win against Eric Fields was over 2 1/2 years ago and it was only against a prospect. His win against Maccarinelli was over 18 months ago and Maccarinelli has been knocked out twice since then.

Afolabi's best recent win is against Maccarinelli. He has been stopped by good fighters in Lebedev and Frenkel, but he also beat Kotlobay for the European Title

Witter's only recent win was against Victor Hugo Castro in 2008 http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_ ... &cat=boxer

Cook's only recent win was against Alex Arthur in 2008.

Maccaranelli has done better than Castro and Arthur since their losses.


In summary. Ola has been more active, had more recent wins and has won more recently. He has lost to a more established fighter in a much closer fashion. In a relative timescale, he has beaten better opponents. Theres no way to justify having him below Stephen Smith

[Horse]

At the time of their fights, yes a loss to Huck was marginally better than a loss to Alexander. I don't feel that Huck has improved as much as Alexander though. Huck is, and will remain without doubt, better than Martinez. Its the manner of defeat which holds the most weight in both cases. Both Alexander and Martinez were relevantly untested at world level. Huck was, and still is, a seasoned world level pro

Witter quit, on the way to a shutout loss (minimum).

Cook was KO'd in front of his own fans. .

Afolabi went the distance in a close fight and almost stopped Huck in Germany.

Afolabi had a decent loss to Huck, but his only good recent win was against Maccarinelli 18 months ago.

I could have moved Afolabi up a few more places after his recent win against Siproshvili, but it seemed a bit of a nothing fight so I wasn't very generous.

Afolabi's best recent win is against Maccarinelli. He has been stopped by good fighters in Lebedev and Frenkel, but he also beat Kotlobay for the European Title

Witter's only recent win was against Victor Hugo Castro http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_ ... &cat=boxer

Cook's only recent win was against Alex Arthur in 2008.

Maccaranelli has done better than Castro and Arthur since their losses.


In summary Ola has been more active, had more recent wins, beaten better opponents recently and lost to more established fighters in closer fashion.

I think too much focus is being put on Witter/Cook vs Afolabi (Afolabi is above Cook anyway). Witter has had a much more successful career than Afolabi has had so far, so he still has a rather high ranking based on that.

Theres no way to justify having him below Stephen Smith

Stephen Smith's recent win was better than Afolabi's.

[mickey1975]

So its O.k to say "Witter has had a more successful career so far" but this does not apply to Rees who has had a lot more success than most on your list are ever likely to have?Very inconsistent,and for that reason i wont bother commenting again.

[Horse]

So its O.k to say "Witter has had a more successful career so far" but this does not apply to Rees who has had a lot more success than most on your list are ever likely to have?

Gavin Rees dropped out of the top 10 over two and a half years ago after he lost to Kotelnik. After his loss to Kotelnik Rees didn't have another fight for 1 year and 5 months, he also hadn't fought in a fight scheduled for over 6 rounds since the Kotelnik loss until this month.

Do you really think Rees shouldn't have fallen out of the rankings in that time?

Very inconsistent,and for that reason i wont bother commenting again.

That's up to you, but with Rees being inactive for well over a year after the Kotelnik fight (which would probably have lead to most people taking him off their list) and only fighting in his first title fight since then this month, I think you are choosing a strange reason to stop commenting.

[mickey1975]

When did Witter last quit/box?

[Horse]

When did Witter last quit/box?

Witter last boxed on 1st August 2009.

[mickey1975]

When did Witter last quit/box?

Witter last boxed on 1st August 2009.

Do you really think Witter should not fall out of the ratings in that time?

[Horse]

Do you really think Witter should not fall out of the ratings in that time?

No, because he was in 7th place after his loss, so it should take longer for him to fall out of the rankings than it took Rees, who was ranked 12th after his loss.

Now Witter is ranked lower he will fall down the list faster.

[JDC]

Fair enough Horse, but Ola didn't get his due credit when he did have his fights with Mac and Huck. If he had, he couldn't have been so far down the list. He'll be on the Chistora Klit undercard, and I fully expect him to be impressive again

[Hulbert]

Horse ...

[Horse]

Fair enough Horse, but Ola didn't get his due credit when he did have his fights with Mac and Huck. If he had, he couldn't have been so far down the list. He'll be on the Chistora Klit undercard, and I fully expect him to be impressive again

Hopefully he fights a good opponent, so I will have no choice but to give him a good ranking.