they didn't have it til they found it

tiredoldngrey · Post by **tiredoldngrey** » 29 May 2005, 15:58

Throughout boxing history there have been instances of a fighter with a poor record turning it around to reach the top, then losing it again to fade away. Freddie Pendleton and Hector Lizarraga are modern examples while the quintessential specimen may well be Lew Jenkins who, for a short frame of time, might have been one of the best LWs ever. Why do you think this happens? Any others?

Chopping Right · Post by **Chopping Right** » 29 May 2005, 16:04

It could be argued Glen Johnson might be midway through something similar right now. If you go back to only the year 2000 he was actually brought over to the UK as a tough trialhorse with 7 losses to bolster the record of a British prospect called Toks Owoh. Now the idea seems ridiculous.

He KO'ed the somewhat over-rated and motor-mouthed Owoh by the way.

KOJOE90 · Post by **KOJOE90** » 29 May 2005, 17:34

Former WBO Featherweight Champion Steve Roninson of Wales.

Had many loses on his record and was considered by many as just a skilled journeyman. Fought for the WBO title at about 48 hours notice, won it and made many defences.

tiredoldngrey · Post by **tiredoldngrey** » 01 Jun 2005, 16:24

Then, if memory serves, Glen McCrory and Johnny Nelson had each had a bit of a revival. What has always intrigued me about Jenkins is that during his streak he was nearlt unbeatable. Everybody he hit with his right hand fell down. Given his whole career he was one of boxing's great characters, not one of its great boxers. But for 2-3 years there it is entirely likely that he could have beaten, by KO, any LW ever. How, then, does one evaluate the Top Ten in a division?

ferocity · Post by **ferocity** » 04 Jun 2005, 02:28

How about Jake "Snake" Rodriguez? Wasn't he considered another opponet, then he beats Charles Murry and made a few title defences that he wasn't supposed to win, then lost to Tszyu, then Whitiker.

Kirino Garcia made a good run near the top -at jr.middleweight- but never got a world title. He did good considering he had over 10 loses.

kingpawn · Post by **kingpawn** » 04 Jun 2005, 02:56

Seems to me Pipino Cuevas started his professional career with a string of losses, then went on to become champion, then lost badly to Hearns and was never quite the same.

Manos de Oro · Post by **Manos de Oro** » 04 Jun 2005, 04:04

kingpawn wrote:Seems to me Pipino Cuevas started his professional career with a string of losses, then went on to become champion, then lost badly to Hearns and was never quite the same.

Yeah, it's weird, can anyone shed any light on what Pipino's early career fights were like? His title reign was so brutal, but it wasn't just the punching power - he was hanging in there against guys like Harold Weston. Were some of his early losses robberies, or against pseudonyms or something?

kingpawn · Post by **kingpawn** » 04 Jun 2005, 04:21

Manos ... from what I've been able to gather, Cuevas lost 6 of his first 12 fights, all of them against fighters who were either making their debut or fighting only about their second or third fights. In fact, his last fight before challenging for the WBA welterweight title was actually a UD loss. Very strange, eh?

Because he went on, as you to say, to be brutal in four or five defenses of the title, before Hearns took him out. After that, his career is just kind of a mixture of wins and losses, including a 4-round stoppage to Duran.