What would have happened had......

[stujones]

Ryan Rhodes not got upset by Jason Matthews.

Now Ryan seemed to have more talent in his big toe than Jason Matthews (no disrespect to the Method Man) and to see how Ryan has come on now in his mid 30's on the verge of a world title shot and looking very sharp.

This defeat by Matthews really those instigated a steep decline in fortunes for Ryan. He would soon take time out, contimplate his career. Suffer another upset defeat, then appear to be nothing more than a hard sparring partner for Gary Lockett - I remain convinced that he had him "out" and seemed to take it easy. Ryan is a very different fighter now.

But just wondering what do you think his path would have been had he won the WBO interim title. First up he would have had to have faced Armand Kranjc (a winnable fight for Rhodes) to get the title proper. Would he have moved down or stay at Middleweight? Could he have even been involved in the Middleweight tournament of 2001?

[orbtastic]

He should never really have been up at middleweight.

[stujones]

He should never really have been up at middleweight.

True, but I think he subsequent career at both weights has shown that result to be a bit of a freak. He took Locketts best shots well.

[orbtastic]

He did, but he just didn't have the strength to cope with Matthews, who just bulled him around and hit him with some huge shots, he was lucky to see the end of the 1st.

That sort of tactic was never his forte - He wasn't a big middle and always had short arms. He's best doing what he does now.

When he first came through he was being fed relatively soft touches (I think his 154lb British title run was pretty weak) and he was bowling them over all over the place.

Lockett was a fairly big middle, but Matthews was huge...god knwos what he was on fight night, well over 160, no question.

I remember the Grant fight, he was only 20 (?) and just didn't seem to have many answers for Grant's experience and workrate.

I was always left watching Rhodes that the Wincobank - no head sparring rule did him no favours whatsoever when it came to actually taking a punch (they can't all be Herol Graham).

[stujones]

He did, but he just didn't have the strength to cope with Matthews, who just bulled him around and hit him with some huge shots, he was lucky to see the end of the 1st.

That sort of tactic was never his forte - He wasn't a big middle and always had short arms. He's best doing what he does now.

When he first came through he was being fed relatively soft touches (I think his 154lb British title run was pretty weak) and he was bowling them over all over the place.

Lockett was a fairly big middle, but Matthews was huge...god knwos what he was on fight night, well over 160, no question.

I remember the Grant fight, he was only 20 (?) and just didn't seem to have many answers for Grant's experience and workrate.

I was always left watching Rhodes that the Wincobank - no head sparring rule did him no favours whatsoever when it came to actually taking a punch (they can't all be Herol Graham).

Excellent post.

Grant just old manned him, hands speed was too good and Ryan not being used to head shots seemed shell shocked. It was a really brave performance though.

Jon Jo Irwin did something similar to Esham Pickering around the same time.

[Jeff Thomas]

Lee Blundell?

[Captain Hook]

I was going to mention Blundell too.......was momentum at that point, nothing was going right for him. Some surprise/shocking losses when you look at him now.

He has come back from the boxing wasteland to become a champ again, he deserves all the props in the world.

It was a brave showing against Grant, I agree it was experience that beat him that night. He seemed bemused at times but kept plugging away and really tried his best. The Rhodes of 2009/10 would have beaten Grant that night.

I keep forgetting his opponent at the MEN in 2006, when he laboured to a points win over six rounds. He looked shot to pieces and at the time, when I said as much having watched it live, some of his pals came on Boxrec (including 26) and took issue with my comments.

I have held my hands up since and am truly thrilled he has come back and proven what a talent he is.

Some great posts on this thread and an interesting topic...

[stujones]

Had Rhodes beaten Matthews, which I think with experience plus less hype he would have (even taking into account the size difference; Matthews didn't have the best of chins) then 1) I don't think a fight with Blundell would have ever happened, 2) Even if it did it would have been a far more confident Rhodes. As I said in my opening post, it would have had to have been Kranjc next, winnable and then it might have been the route of bulked up Light Middles, or Rhodes moving down. I'm sure down the line a fight with Harry Simon might have been a possibility.

There was never a doubt about Rhodes' chin before Matthews, and that doubt seemed to really affect Rhodes mentally. It seemed to be the Lockett display, and possibly more importantly, the calls from the boxing media who suggested that Rhodes should have won (I aint talking about the decision, but the manner of trouble he had Lockett in and let him off) that seemed to help his mentality.

He came in against Matthews far too cocky, in someways the Grant fight did him more harm than good. Cause he got alot of praise from it, even though he was the betting favourite against Grant - many many people said Ryan would be a better fighter after it.... and it seemed to get to his head a little. He didn't really learn from it. Looking at boxrec it shows he was a whisker away from beating Grant on the cards..... rediculous scoring, Grant was a clear winner.

Rhodes vs Grant would have been a great one in Rhodes' peak. Grant is a very underated fighter.

[orbtastic]

Lee Blundell?

I've seen highlights of it, but only after the event. It was only shortly after his shocking KO to Matthews, which whilst not at home, was about as close to it as you could get and he just seemed to lose his way after that. I'd imagine his confidence was crushed.

Credit to him though, he's got back on track and turned it around and trains hard etc.

Can someone clue me in on the numbers thing? I know he has a tattoo but never really understood the significance of it.

[stujones]

Something like

His Birthday, his wifes birthday and his kids' birthday - so 26 is his lucky number.

[Jeff Thomas]

I agree great thread, Rhodes is an absolute gem of a bloke and one of my favourite fighters- the way he has turned his career round is absolutely inspirational. I see a lot of bernard hopkins in him as crazy as that sounds- clever moves, able to slow pace effectively- dangerous punch. I'd be almost as pleased if he won a world title as I was when Ricky Burns won his. He'd have a great chance Vs Bundrage.

The Blundell fight is here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y77eQJyOWBI

[curtis wood]

ryans living proof that if you dont give up on yourself you can achieve great things ive been lucky enough to train along side him in the second part of his career and learned so much from him he told me about the matthews fight he said he saw him at the weigh in and he didnt look that big then he saw him fight night and he said he was fornicating huge! the blundell fight he said his head was all over the place and it showed in the performance but the way he has come back has been something else my dad always use to say to me never judge people when everything is rosey because we can all be great when its all going our way judge people when the shit hits the fan and you find out what they are really made of ryans been at the top then hit rock bottom then climbed to the top of the mountain again thats takes a hell of alot of guts most people would have packed it all in and blamed it on bad luck if he was to win a world title he would have earned it

[Jeff Thomas]

ryans living proof that if you dont give up on yourself you can achieve great things ive been lucky enough to train along side him in the second part of his career and learned so much from him he told me about the matthews fight he said he saw him at the weigh in and he didnt look that big then he saw him fight night and he said he was effing huge! the blundell fight he said his head was all over the place and it showed in the performance but the way he has come back has been something else my dad always use to say to me never judge people when everything is rosey because we can all be great when its all going our way judge people when the shit hits the fan and you find out what they are really made of ryans been at the top then hit rock bottom then climbed to the top of the mountain again thats takes a hell of alot of guts most people would have packed it all in and blamed it on bad luck if he was to win a world title he would have earned it

Class

[Andypittcov]

ryans living proof that if you dont give up on yourself you can achieve great things ive been lucky enough to train along side him in the second part of his career and learned so much from him he told me about the matthews fight he said he saw him at the weigh in and he didnt look that big then he saw him fight night and he said he was effing huge! the blundell fight he said his head was all over the place and it showed in the performance but the way he has come back has been something else my dad always use to say to me never judge people when everything is rosey because we can all be great when its all going our way judge people when the shit hits the fan and you find out what they are really made of ryans been at the top then hit rock bottom then climbed to the top of the mountain again thats takes a hell of alot of guts most people would have packed it all in and blamed it on bad luck if he was to win a world title he would have earned it

Class

x2 good post

[T.M.K]

Great posts everyone and I fully agree with the sentiments,

I first met Ryan about the time he became British champ for the first time and he struck me as down to earth, amiable, likeable and we chatted about various bits for quite a while. I was also impressed when a few months later I attended a show at York hall, went to walk past him without bothering him, and he said "Hey, Col - alright?" (cue big grin on yours truly).

I still feel that his career was hampered by trying to keep up with Naz. If Ryan hadn't been fast-tracked quite so much it could have all fallen into place: instead of going up to Middleweight to try and become a world champion I wish he'd have stayed at 11st and grabbed Commonwealth and European belts, beaten a couple of really teak-tough Russians and an eleiminator against a top-10 American etc - then got his world title shot a couple of years later - for goodness sake he'd still have only been about 23!!!!


However: what happened, happened and the I agree with the comments that the Grant defeat alsmot gave him a false sense of security that he would win the belt if Grant vacated. That happened (well, Interim) and Matthew just walloped him. That defeat seemed to send him on a very quick downward spiral, which wasn't helped by the Naz "fallout" (with the Wincobank, in general) and Ryan has also pointed out personal problems/low-times which followed etc etc

It is almost impossible to disagree with the sentiments that if he comes back to win a world title it will be the biggest RE-CLIMB of any British fighter in recent memory, if not all time. It is on most people's wish list that he gets his title shot this year, and I hope they can get Bundrage over personally......the WBC/WBO titles seem to be held-up for a while and the WBA belt is just a mess. Don't waste time, get the title shot NOW!

Go Ryan!


Colin "T.M.K" Harris

[bennie]

Ryan took a long time to get over the Matthews defeat, in front of his own Sheffield fans.

[mickey1975]

Ryan took a long time to get over the Matthews defeat, in front of his own Sheffield fans.

Doncaster!

[orbtastic]

Ryan took a long time to get over the Matthews defeat, in front of his own Sheffield fans.

Doncaster!

Presumably the huge distance between the two kept his fans away?

[mickey1975]

Ryan took a long time to get over the Matthews defeat, in front of his own Sheffield fans.

Doncaster!

Presumably the huge distance between the two kept his fans away?

I was being sarcastic,hence the exclamation mark.I was at the fight as well,went to watch Levi Pattison and it was also the first time i saw Ricky Hatton live.

[orbtastic]

Yeah, I was working abroad, so couldn't go which gutted me cos I used to enjoy watching both and had seem them live a few times.

[bennie]

Ryan took a long time to get over the Matthews defeat, in front of his own Sheffield fans.

Doncaster!

...in front of his own Sheffield fans - in Doncaster.