Classic American West Coast Boxing

[Captain Hook]

Thank you Rick.

For the record, we were discussing British fighters, not all-time world greats.

If that were the case neither Lennox nor Hamed would get into the top 20, I agree with you on that.

And I thought I recognised the name. I bow to your greater knowledge on the subject :)

For what it's worth Lewis is, in my opinion, one of the top 10 heavyweights of all time, probably sneaking in at around 7/8.

Hamed isn't even in the top 10 featherweights in history, he's a long way behind the greats, including the modern ones....Morales, Barrera et al.

Thanks again.....this thread is a good read by the way, have enjoyed perusing the last few pages.

[bennie]

After we left the Expo at the Convention Center, yesterday, we walked over to Shoreline Village and strolled the boardwalk. We stopped at Parker's Light House for lunch. I was going to take some photos of the food but my camera battery died out.


Shoreline Village


Shoreline Village-The Yard House Restaurant


Lion's Lighthouse, across the harbor from Shoreline Village


Parker's Lighthouse Restaurant, where Jeri and I had lunch


A view of the Queen Mary from our table

F uck me, Randy, that is some table you got.

[bennie]

Thank you Rick.

For the record, we were discussing British fighters, not all-time world greats.

If that were the case neither Lennox nor Hamed would get into the top 20, I agree with you on that.

And I thought I recognised the name. I bow to your greater knowledge on the subject :)

For what it's worth Lewis is, in my opinion, one of the top 10 heavyweights of all time, probably sneaking in at around 7/8.

Hamed isn't even in the top 10 featherweights in history, he's a long way behind the greats, including the modern ones....Morales, Barrera et al.

Thanks again.....this thread is a good read by the way, have enjoyed perusing the last few pages.

Mickey Duff raves about Lewis in his autobiography. I would agree with top 10. As for Naz, his unconvincing displays overseas (think of the Soto stinker) hurt his all-time standing, although in Britain he is definitely right up there. It is difficult (for me) to judge exactly where because he went down the WBO route (mostly) and the only all-time great he really faced gave him a thorough pasting. I would put Honeyghan over him, for example, for beating Curry in the States when Curry was unbeaten and BIG, and Honeyghan also scored fine wins over Blocker and Rosi when they were on the way up.
I would also put Buchanan over Naz for building his career overseas, particularly the wins over Laguna and Carlos Ortiz, even if Ortiz was past it. Buchanan also beat Carlos Hernandez and a young Jim Watt. The apparent reluctance of Roberto Duran to fight Kenny again, and Duran was hardly shy when it came to rematches, also helps Kenny's case.

[CNorkusJr]

Great pictures Randy. Sunny day in CA, and the Queen Mary in the background to boot !
Sounds like a day well spent over looking some old boxing things.
Every couple of weekends or so, they have shows like that here too.
Mostly baseball things-Yankees and Mets history stuff, if you dig deep you find the rare boxing program or exhibit cards that are available. The shows are usually peppered with local sports heroes from the past and I enjoy going to see them and talking to them.
HOF'ers get a big following in any sport, but I enjoy talking to the guys like who I recently met:
Jets Sack Exchange members,Stan Bahnson (Yankee rookie of year 1967); stars like that.
Mark Gastineau doesnt look well,someone said he is on pain killers for his back,but that is between him and God I guess. We didnt touch on his boxing career, but Joe Klecko talked about how he boxed to keep in shape during his career and afterwards.

Those items you posted look nice. Joey Giambra-excellent fighter with real skills.

[raylawpc]

I'm sorry I'm not much company at the moment. I'm missing my dog.

To be expected.

Who else loves you unconditionally just for being you, and is happy every time they see you? You miss it when it's gone. It's hard.

[bennie]

I'm sorry I'm not much company at the moment. I'm missing my dog.

To be expected.

Who else loves you unconditionally just for being you, and is happy every time they see you? You miss it when it's gone. It's hard.

Thanks, Tom. He was an ex-guide dog, the most intelligent dog I ever had. He even knew how to break up fights between other dogs.

[CNorkusJr]

I'm sorry I'm not much company at the moment. I'm missing my dog.

To be expected.

Who else loves you unconditionally just for being you, and is happy every time they see you? You miss it when it's gone. It's hard.

Well said, Tom. We are with you on this.
It certainly seems like alot of the members here on CAWCB lost some long time furry companions the last few months. Very tough emotions to deal with. Feel better.

[Captain Hook]

Thank you Rick.

For the record, we were discussing British fighters, not all-time world greats.

If that were the case neither Lennox nor Hamed would get into the top 20, I agree with you on that.

And I thought I recognised the name. I bow to your greater knowledge on the subject :)

For what it's worth Lewis is, in my opinion, one of the top 10 heavyweights of all time, probably sneaking in at around 7/8.

Hamed isn't even in the top 10 featherweights in history, he's a long way behind the greats, including the modern ones....Morales, Barrera et al.

Thanks again.....this thread is a good read by the way, have enjoyed perusing the last few pages.

Mickey Duff raves about Lewis in his autobiography. I would agree with top 10. As for Naz, his unconvincing displays overseas (think of the Soto stinker) hurt his all-time standing, although in Britain he is definitely right up there. It is difficult (for me) to judge exactly where because he went down the WBO route (mostly) and the only all-time great he really faced gave him a thorough pasting. I would put Honeyghan over him, for example, for beating Curry in the States when Curry was unbeaten and BIG, and Honeyghan also scored fine wins over Blocker and Rosi when they were on the way up.
I would also put Buchanan over Naz for building his career overseas, particularly the wins over Laguna and Carlos Ortiz, even if Ortiz was past it. Buchanan also beat Carlos Hernandez and a young Jim Watt. The apparent reluctance of Roberto Duran to fight Kenny again, and Duran was hardly shy when it came to rematches, also helps Kenny's case.

Good points....the issue with Lloyd is that it was one big win and he never went on and dominated. Whether Donald was weight-drained or not, it was a monumental victory. Blocker is a good shout...my overriding memory of him is the Norris fight.

That said, you could argue Hatton's win over Tszyu was just as great as Honeyghan's over Curry, though it was on home soil.

Had Vazquez not been stripped by the WBA of his belt, Hamed would have had the distinction of winning all four world titles in a division, something only Riddick Bowe had achieved at heavyweight.

He will be remembered as a huge puncher, a cocky, brash, thrilling boxer, who sadly disappeared up his own backside and was, in the end, more interested in religion and money than training hard for his biggest test.....Barrera.

The fact he never attemped to avenge that loss sadly says a lot about the man.

[bennie]

Thank you Rick.

For the record, we were discussing British fighters, not all-time world greats.

If that were the case neither Lennox nor Hamed would get into the top 20, I agree with you on that.

And I thought I recognised the name. I bow to your greater knowledge on the subject :)

For what it's worth Lewis is, in my opinion, one of the top 10 heavyweights of all time, probably sneaking in at around 7/8.

Hamed isn't even in the top 10 featherweights in history, he's a long way behind the greats, including the modern ones....Morales, Barrera et al.

Thanks again.....this thread is a good read by the way, have enjoyed perusing the last few pages.

Mickey Duff raves about Lewis in his autobiography. I would agree with top 10. As for Naz, his unconvincing displays overseas (think of the Soto stinker) hurt his all-time standing, although in Britain he is definitely right up there. It is difficult (for me) to judge exactly where because he went down the WBO route (mostly) and the only all-time great he really faced gave him a thorough pasting. I would put Honeyghan over him, for example, for beating Curry in the States when Curry was unbeaten and BIG, and Honeyghan also scored fine wins over Blocker and Rosi when they were on the way up.
I would also put Buchanan over Naz for building his career overseas, particularly the wins over Laguna and Carlos Ortiz, even if Ortiz was past it. Buchanan also beat Carlos Hernandez and a young Jim Watt. The apparent reluctance of Roberto Duran to fight Kenny again, and Duran was hardly shy when it came to rematches, also helps Kenny's case.

Good points....the issue with Lloyd is that it was one big win and he never went on and dominated. Whether Donald was weight-drained or not, it was a monumental victory. Blocker is a good shout...my overriding memory of him is the Norris fight.

That said, you could argue Hatton's win over Tszyu was just as great as Honeyghan's over Curry, though it was on home soil.

Had Vazquez not been stripped by the WBA of his belt, Hamed would have had the distinction of winning all four world titles in a division, something only Riddick Bowe had achieved at heavyweight.

He will be remembered as a huge puncher, a cocky, brash, thrilling boxer, who sadly disappeared up his own backside and was, in the end, more interested in religion and money than training hard for his biggest test.....Barrera.

The fact he never attemped to avenge that loss sadly says a lot about the man.

I actually preferred Naz as a super-bantamweight when he was smashing all the Mexicans and Argentines and Puerto Ricans. No British fighter had ever smashed the liver-punching Latins like that before. His knockout of Sergio Liendo is probably the worst knockout I have ever seen.

[Captain Hook]

Yeah, ouch......that left hook, legs dipped, and then he really bundled him over.

Did a real number on Armando Castro, whose chin was solid (despite him goofing around) and battered Enrique Angeles. Polo Perez swallowed it and pretty much gave in, and I remember him having his way with the seasoned Freddy Cruz, who had never been stopped before.

The way Hamed toyed with Belcastro was a sight to behold, and he was only 19/20.

Had he carried on in that vein he would have been even more special...

I think perhaps that 1994-97 era is when I really, really had a soft spot for the guy. Was a precocious talent.

[bennie]

I thought Naz peaked the night he picked apart Robinson, although you could argue he fought in a similar fashion against Jose Badillo. However, for the most part as a featherweight, he loaded up too much and that disappointed me.

[bennie]

Amir Khan won few friends as he serened his way back from the States for a defence of his WBA light-welterweight title in Manchester in April and, given the distance, immediately dumped a conditioning coach in Los Angeles who had developed real strength in his legs over the last 18 months, a decent man by the name of Alex Ariza.
The arrogant Bolton boy is certainly no Carl Thompson, the humble, iron-jawed Bolton man who once thumped David Haye, but Khan's own jaw (and his legs) surprisingly got him through a war against Argentine puncher and mandatory challenger Marcos Maidana in Las Vegas in December. The task of finding a voluntary challenger in April then proved almost just as hard.
One by one, the lovely Khan and his team rejected a hatful of legitimate opponents because, allegedly, they wanted a few quid for showing up. In the end, Khan agreed to defend against a man he had ruled out a week or so earlier: Northern Ireland southpaw Paul McCloskey. Exciting? McCloskey is strong, clever and, of course, unbeaten, which the same TV 'suits' who grassed up Andy Gray and Richard Keys for essentially nothing always blindly insist upon, but star appeal hardly exudes from the challenger.
McCloskey is a mucker, nothing more, nothing less, a solid fighter who failed a litmus test against Giuseppe Lauri two fights ago at the King's Hall in Belfast where he needed 11 sloppy rounds to finish the Italian, a man Ricky Hatton and Junior Witter had finished much earlier and much more impressively, but then, they would have beaten Khan in their pomp, and everyone in the world knows that McCloskey is not going to do so.
Yes, the burly McCloskey can whack a bit, which will result in the predictable puncher's chance lines, and yes, he is effective at domestic level; however, Khan rose above domestic level a long time ago and can whack a bit himself. He also has a huge edge in speed and, quite simply, in ability. As much as I dislike saying this, because I have nothing against "Dudey" Paul while Khan comes across as aloof and rather glum, Khan is just the better fighter.

[kikibalt]

For Paul

http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-sup ... 7070.story

[CNorkusJr]

For Paul

http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-sup ... 7070.story

Great Post, Frank. Thanks.

Lets see- $100 on the 2011 season being played without losing any games to lockout.
$300 on Jets to WIN Super Bowl.
$100 on Sanchez throwing over 300 yds in Super Bowl.
$200 on Vlad losing titles in 2011 to anyone.

[bennie]

Belated congratulations to Austin and Louie. Louie must have got Trout into some shape, given that Austin had been out for over a year. I really hope Louie breaks through into the big leagues, because Manny Steward and Freddie Roach are virtually monopolising the training side of things.

[bennie]

F uck me, I mention Steve Robinson last night, and now his son has just turned pro.

[kikibalt]

For Paul

http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-sup ... 7070.story

Great Post, Frank. Thanks.

Lets see- $100 on the 2011 season being played without losing any games to lockout.
$300 on Jets to WIN Super Bowl.
$100 on Sanchez throwing over 300 yds in Super Bowl.
$200 on Vlad losing titles in 2011 to anyone.

Paul has just been voted the resident odd-maker....

[bennie]

An excellent update on Genaro Hernandez by Bill Dwyre:


http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-dwy ... umn?page=1

[kikibalt]

Mando Ramos & Allen Syers

[Randyman]

An excellent update on Genaro Hernandez by Bill Dwyre:


http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-dwy ... umn?page=1

Hernandez has certainly had his fair share of hard times and I give him credit for hanging in there.

I was reading a newspaper a couple of years ago, it was either the L.A. Times or the Orange County Register, there was an article about some of the homes on a hill that were destroyed or damage by rains and mudslides that winter. They mentioned Genaro Hernandez, I believe there was a picture of him in his back yard if I remember correctly. His home was severely damaged. There was no mention of who he was in regards to being a former champion. I don't think the writer had any idea who he was, other than another homeowner about to lose his home to a mudslide. It wasn't too long after that when the news of his cancer was announced.

I wish him all the best!

[Randyman]

Mando Ramos & Allen Syers

Man, they look young,especially Mando. Nice photo Frank.

[Randyman]

Randy, where exactly is that in LA? If Linda comes out to the CBHOF with me, I'd like to take her there. She loves harbor areas like that. It looks very scenic! (Maybe you and Jeri will go with us! )

Tom, Shoreline Village is located in Long Beach, while it is still within Los Angeles County, it is about 20 miles south of Downtown Los Angeles. Within walking distance is Pine Ave, where restaurants and pubs are located, also within walking distance is The Pike, (not to be confused with the original Pike) which also has restaurants and pubs, a ferris wheel and other rides as well as arcades.

I put some websites up for you, including an interesting website on the original Pike which was more or less, the Coney Island of California back in the day. It was an interesting place. I'm sure Frank remembers it. The whole area with the new Pike and Shoreline Village was the location of the original Pike.

Tom, it would be great to spend some time with you and Linda but this year our time will be committed to my cousins Louie and Rocky Burke and other family members during that weekend.

I'm also posting a photo of The Hyatt Hotel which overlooks Shoreline Village.

http://www.shorelinevillage.com/

http://www.thepikeatlongbeach.com/

http://downtownlongbeach.org/residents/Home

http://www.millikanalumni.com/Pike/PikeHistory.html


http://longbeach.hyatt.com

[Randyman]

Big things on the horizon for New Mexico's Austin Trout.

From http://Newmexicoboxing.com

Mexican prodigy Saul “Canelo” Alvarez is already talking about vengeance – a possible showdown with the man who outclassed and dethroned his brother, Rigoberto Alvarez, last weekend. Alvarez told BS that he’s open to a fight with WBA Super Welterweight World Champ Austin Trout as early as June. Speaking of the champ, Trout returned home last night.

[Randyman]

These are the items I picked up yesterday. I had to dig but I knew there would be something worth finding, there always is.


Joe Olivo, Ruben Castillo, Frankie Baltazar Jr and John Montes


A brief article about Alfonso Zamora's upcoming fight with Korean Soo Hwan Hong. Zamora won that fight on March 14, 1975 at the Forum, stopping him in the 4th round, winning the WBA World bantamweight title. Two years later,almost to the date and in the same arena, Carlos Zarate would stop Zamora in the 4th round.


Our very own Bobby Chacon


Joey Gimbra

[kikibalt]

An excellent update on Genaro Hernandez by Bill Dwyre:


http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-dwy ... umn?page=1

Thanks for the post Bennie....