Groves on undercard of Alvarez v Hatton

[goldenears]

Looks like hayemaker really serious about fighting DeGale. Or not.

[whiskey]

5th March ?

Perhaps they want Groves to have a fight of sorts before Degale regardless.

The speculation will be, that A) the Degale scrap aint happening or B) it's definitely on, but at a later agreed time which affords space for this tune-up.

I pray it's the latter

[Scottrf]

5th March ?

Perhaps they want Groves to have a fight of sorts before Degale regardless.

The speculation will be, that A) the Degale scrap aint happening or B) it's definitely on, but at a later agreed time which affords space for this tune-up.

I pray it's the latter

B) The fight had to be before April 11th. Seems unlikely.

[goldenears]

5th March ?

Perhaps they want Groves to have a fight of sorts before Degale regardless.

The speculation will be, that A) the Degale scrap aint happening or B) it's definitely on, but at a later agreed time which affords space for this tune-up.

I pray it's the latter

B) The fight had to be before April 11th. Seems unlikely.

exactly - they were going to avoid him all the way along - looks like they winning a purse bid knowing they had no intention of fighting in order to make it look like they weren't swerving. Mind you , I don't blame them, DeGale is on another level to Groves and deep down they know it. Hayemaker are going to end up with a legacy of avoiding dangerous fights.

[Dioufy]

Come on, lads, haven't we learnt by now? The fights we really want to see will never happen.

[bonters]

Isn't it a sad irony though, that Booth is doing with Groves, exactly what he criticised Wlad for doing with Haye?

[Tomasino]

Isn't it a sad irony though, that Booth is doing with Groves, exactly what he criticised Wlad for doing with Haye?

I long ago lost faith in anything Booth says. Those dodgy purse bids told a tale. Sadly, Groves is going nowhere fast with Hayemaker.

[watson748]

Surely if this was going to be such a walkover for DeGale, Frank would have pulled out all the stops to win the purse and get it on???? A win over Groves would have wiped out Hayemakers biggest prospect, taken some wind out of a rival promoters sails and fired DeGale right up the rankings, media and credibility stakes. So who is exactly avoiding who here? Do they both (ie promoters cause I know both boxers do) not want this fight? Somebody enlighten me please?

[Tomasino]

Surely if this was going to be such a walkover for DeGale, Frank would have pulled out all the stops to win the purse and get it on???? A win over Groves would have wiped out Hayemakers biggest prospect, taken some wind out of a rival promoters sails and fired DeGale right up the rankings, media and credibility stakes. So who is exactly avoiding who here? Do they both (ie promoters cause I know both boxers do) not want this fight? Somebody enlighten me please?

I think bidding £320000 for a prospect v prospect match is pulling out the stops.

[bonters]

Surely if this was going to be such a walkover for DeGale, Frank would have pulled out all the stops to win the purse and get it on???? A win over Groves would have wiped out Hayemakers biggest prospect, taken some wind out of a rival promoters sails and fired DeGale right up the rankings, media and credibility stakes. So who is exactly avoiding who here? Do they both (ie promoters cause I know both boxers do) not want this fight? Somebody enlighten me please?

I think bidding £320000 for a prospect v prospect match is pulling out the stops.

Exactly right. Like him or loathe him, Warren has enough wool on his back to know what this caliber of fight is worth in terms of bids. Not only have Hayemaker bid way too high, they bid against themselves in the process. Booth is emerging as just about the biggest Jodrell Banker in British boxing today! He's the last thing the World boxing scene needs right now, and no mistake!

[danfoster]

Isn't it a sad irony though, that Booth is doing with Groves, exactly what he criticised Wlad for doing with Haye?

I long ago lost faith in anything Booth says. Those dodgy purse bids told a tale. Sadly, Groves is going nowhere fast with Hayemaker.

What was 'dodgy' about it mate?

[Scottrf]

Isn't it a sad irony though, that Booth is doing with Groves, exactly what he criticised Wlad for doing with Haye?

I long ago lost faith in anything Booth says. Those dodgy purse bids told a tale. Sadly, Groves is going nowhere fast with Hayemaker.

What was 'dodgy' about it mate?

Two bids apparently with the same team behind them for vastly different amounts.

[danfoster]

I long ago lost faith in anything Booth says. Those dodgy purse bids told a tale. Sadly, Groves is going nowhere fast with Hayemaker.

What was 'dodgy' about it mate?

Two bids apparently with the same team behind them for vastly different amounts.

So are we all agreed that this is 'dodgy behaviour'? Seriously.

Interested to know what Boxingchat thinks of this tactic, or perhaps our new friend DaveBoyMorrison.

[goldenears]

Surely if this was going to be such a walkover for DeGale, Frank would have pulled out all the stops to win the purse and get it on???? A win over Groves would have wiped out Hayemakers biggest prospect, taken some wind out of a rival promoters sails and fired DeGale right up the rankings, media and credibility stakes. So who is exactly avoiding who here? Do they both (ie promoters cause I know both boxers do) not want this fight? Somebody enlighten me please?

£320k for a British title fight only to be outbid by people with seemingly no intention of making it happen?

Hardly avoiding it is he.

Why would DeGale avoid Groves? Smigga poised far more danger and getting Groves out of the way would be like swatting an irritating little fly knowing that DeGale seems to want a career more in line with Froch's endless quest to fight the best men he can. You get the feeling that DeGale with his short term contract forced FW's hand to get him the Smigga fight which was well out of character for FW with his prospects, especially as it risked another of his own big ticketsellers' progress when not far off of a European/even World Title shot.

With their absolutely whack undercards and carefully selected opponents, Hayemaker show no respect for boxing fans.

This sort of thing leaves a further bad taste

[danfoster]

Surely if this was going to be such a walkover for DeGale, Frank would have pulled out all the stops to win the purse and get it on???? A win over Groves would have wiped out Hayemakers biggest prospect, taken some wind out of a rival promoters sails and fired DeGale right up the rankings, media and credibility stakes. So who is exactly avoiding who here? Do they both (ie promoters cause I know both boxers do) not want this fight? Somebody enlighten me please?

£320k for a British title fight only to be outbid by people with seemingly no intention of making it happen?

Hardly avoiding it is he.

Why would DeGale avoid Groves? Smigga poised far more danger and getting Groves out of the way would be like swatting an irritating little fly knowing that DeGale seems to want a career more in line with Froch's endless quest to fight the best men he can. You get the feeling that DeGale with his short term contract forced FW's hand to get him the Smigga fight which was well out of character for FW with his prospects, especially as it risked another of his own big ticketsellers' progress when not far off of a European/even World Title shot.

With their absolutely whack undercards and carefully selected opponents, Hayemaker show no respect for boxing fans.
This sort of thing leaves a further bad taste

Interesting that you are selecting Hayemaker for anger here. Can you think of any other promotor for whom the same could be said?

[bennie]

Say what you like about Matthew Hatton - the poor man's Ricky, the powder-puff puncher, and so on and so forth - but you cannot knock him for taking on Mexican sensation Saul "Canelo" Alvarez for the vacant WBC light-middleweight title in the States on March 5.
Hatton, a natural welterweight, makes his way to the Honda Center in Anaheim, California, to face a light-middleweight puncher with an unbeaten record of 36 fights, 26 of them ending early, including eight of his last 10. Nobody expects Hatton to win but he bears a nice boxing name, so American-TV is buying the younger brother of Ricky. It also helps, of course, that Matthew and Ricky will be the first brothers in the entire history of British boxing to win world titles if Matthew wins.
Don't laugh. "Magic" Matthew takes over a fair slice of experience - and ability - at a solid 41-4-2 (16) and has won six out of six in the States, in fights most British fans expected him to lose (Tackie, Zepeda, Vazquez...). They also expected him to lose to Italy's Gianluca Branco in a crack at the European welterweight title early last year but Hatton worked his way to the belt and retained it twice, impressively.
The 29-year-old Hatton lacks charisma but has improved massively under new trainer Bobby Shannon from the dark old days when he was outscored by David Kirk, thrown out against Alan Bosworth and outboxed by Craig Watson. His defence is tighter, his stamina better, his combinations sharper. Much like that classy Welsh stylist of a few years ago, Barry Jones, Hatton thinks 'win the round, win the round' in his fights, a mindset that holds him in good stead as those rounds tick by. Matthew needs to build up the points because he hardly whacks like the now-retired "Hitman".
So, Hatton is a 12-round fighter which begs the question: what happens if a cocky, complacent "Canelo" fails to budge him early and finds himself on the receiving end of Hatton's quick combinations in the later championship rounds? Hatton's punches may not hurt Alvarez, but they may hurt him on the cards.
Yes, Alvarez outscored Lovemore Ndou over 12 rounds last time out (and Ndou had held Hatton to an earlier draw) but Ndou barely threw a punch against the freckled, red-haired, 20-year-old Alvarez (a pro at 15) who looks like the American boy next door, the Irish boy next door (or just the milkman's), and the Mexican fans cherish him and his relentless, heavy handed style, of course, so in all ways he gets the full hype treatment. This man is a real crossover fighter - but is he for real?
We are shortly to find out. I feel that Hatton, out of his natural weight class at light-middleweight, has been stitched-up by Team Alvarez, regardless of the world title at stake and presumably the nice payday Hatton will go home with. At welterweight, Hatton would have made it tough for Alvarez, tougher than many might have imagined. A weight up, Alvarez is big and strong enough to force a stoppage win, possibly on cuts.

[alexpaterson]

I thought Hatton was with Bob Shannon? But that's pretty much the way I see it as well.

[bennie]

I thought Hatton was with Bob Shannon? But that's pretty much the way I see it as well.

Thanks, Alex.

[Dioufy]

I thought Hatton was with Bob Shannon? But that's pretty much the way I see it as well.

Thanks, Alex.

Effing numpty, Bennie.

:)

[Tomasino]

Isn't it a sad irony though, that Booth is doing with Groves, exactly what he criticised Wlad for doing with Haye?

I long ago lost faith in anything Booth says. Those dodgy purse bids told a tale. Sadly, Groves is going nowhere fast with Hayemaker.

What was 'dodgy' about it mate?

Are you for real? I am. I use my real name and give my honest opinion.

[danfoster]

I long ago lost faith in anything Booth says. Those dodgy purse bids told a tale. Sadly, Groves is going nowhere fast with Hayemaker.

What was 'dodgy' about it mate?

Are you for real? I am. I use my real name and give my honest opinion.

Course I am 'for real'! Are you saying that the two different bids from two seemingly linked people is a tactic that is in some way shady or against the rules? Because hayemaker are not the only ones to go down that route, in fact someone else did it before them very recently but it didn't seem to offend your moral code then.

[Tomasino]

What was 'dodgy' about it mate?

Two bids apparently with the same team behind them for vastly different amounts.

So are we all agreed that this is 'dodgy behaviour'? Seriously.

Interested to know what Boxingchat thinks of this tactic, or perhaps our new friend DaveBoyMorrison.

I don't like your style pal. I am nothing to do with anyone else and am only stating my opinions which I was under the impression that this forum is all about. Am I wrong? Should I just agree with the wee cliques so as no doubt about my character falls upon me?

If you seriously think that two bids, £75000 apart for a brittish title fight isn't dodgy then we just aren't on the same wavelength.

Please don't insult me further by stupidly suggesting I have an agenda.

[dondada]

If you seriously think that two bids, £75000 apart for a brittish title fight isn't dodgy then we just aren't on the same wavelength.

Please don't insult me further by stupidly suggesting I have an agenda.

Maybe Dan thinks you have an agenda because most of your posts concern one issue/promoter.

I agree with you about the bids in the sense that it doesn't look good. However, both Adam Booth and Dave Coldwell have promoter's licences, I believe, as individuals and are entitled to put in bids.

Presumably you think the same regarding the recent purse bids of FWP and AA Promotions for Macklin v Barker?

[Tomasino]

BTW Dan, I dont want to get into a daft argument over opinions that ultimately mean very little.

Lets agree to disagree and leave it at that?

[Tomasino]

If you seriously think that two bids, £75000 apart for a brittish title fight isn't dodgy then we just aren't on the same wavelength.

Please don't insult me further by stupidly suggesting I have an agenda.

Maybe Dan thinks you have an agenda because most of your posts concern one issue/promoter.

I agree with you about the bids in the sense that it doesn't look good. However, both Adam Booth and Dave Coldwell have promoter's licences, I believe, as individuals and are entitled to put in bids.

Presumably you think the same regarding the recent purse bids of FWP and AA Promotions for Macklin v Barker?

I had only looked at that once Dan mentioned it in this thread, although once I checked he had mentioned it on the thread I put up asking about the Booth/Coldwell bids which I had not noticed.

Can you provide more details? I dont know any facts on it.

To answer your question; I think anyone doing it is a bit shady in any kind of business.

You mention that they both have promotors licences but they work for the same company, so I would expect they would have discussed the bids before placing them. With that in mind I asked the question "What is the thinking behind this". I had hoped someone such as yourself would have given me an answer or offered their thoughts but no, I had to start the thread and contact the board (who have not got back to me at all).....

Boxingchat (whoever he is) was the only person who actuallyu bothered to state what the rules and precedent were, which I thanked him for.

Do you think I am connected to someone who competes with Booth?