the missing rematches in history

[man]

hagler - leonard
ali - foreman
delahoya - trinidad
lewis - klitschko

just top ones that come to mind.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Leonard/hearns is the biggest one for me. I have no doubt it would have changed a lot in the history books.

[Idisagree]

hagler - leonard
ali - foreman
delahoya - trinidad
lewis - klitschko

just top ones that come to mind.

Hagler - Leonard - This is the most intriguing of these rematches.
De La Hoya - Trinidad - I could care less the first fight was a stinker no need to repeat it.
Lewis - Klitschko - I don't see any different outcome. Lewis was just simply better than Klitschko.

[man]

hagler - leonard
ali - foreman
delahoya - trinidad
lewis - klitschko

just top ones that come to mind.

Hagler - Leonard - This is the most intriguing of these rematches.
De La Hoya - Trinidad - I could care less the first fight was a stinker no need to repeat it.
Lewis - Klitschko - I don't see any different outcome. Lewis was just simply better than Klitschko.

but given the hype around the fight DLH-trinidad II was
simply weird to not happen.
lewis klitschko was quite competitive enough to justify a
rematch big time.
and ali foreman in my book was injustice to foreman, cause
he was up at eight at round end and usually the defending
champ should be given the chance to continue. don't think
it would have changed the overall bout, don't think he would
have won the rematch ... nevertheless it is kind of missing
in my book. i mean foreman was undefeated defending champ.

[sweetsci]

Yes, a Spring 75 Ali-Foreman rematch should have happened. But when it didn't, George didn't do himself any favors by not fighting in 75 and not looking so good against Lyle in Jan 76. It wasn't until June 76 and the Frazier rematch that George was taken seriously again; by that time Ali-Norton 3 was booked for fall. That left Ali out of the rematch picture until Spring of 77, by which time George had lost to Jimmy Young.

To the list I'll add (apologies for any duplicates):
Tyson-Douglas II, Summer or Fall 90
Bowe-Holyfield III, Spring 94
Foreman-Moorer II, Spring 95
Ali-Frazier II, Fall 71 or 1972
Ali-Liston II, November 64

[Goodnight, Irene]

Yes, a Spring 75 Ali-Foreman rematch should have happened. But when it didn't, George didn't do himself any favors by not fighting in 75 and not looking so good against Lyle in Jan 76. It wasn't until June 76 and the Frazier rematch that George was taken seriously again; by that time Ali-Norton 3 was booked for fall. That left Ali out of the rematch picture until Spring of 77, by which time George had lost to Jimmy Young.

To the list I'll add (apologies for any duplicates):
Tyson-Douglas II, Summer or Fall 90
Bowe-Holyfield III, Spring 94
Foreman-Moorer II, Spring 95
Ali-Frazier II, Fall 71 or 1972
Ali-Liston II, November 64

Not true. Ali wanted no part of a Foreman rematch --- the fact that Foreman completely sat out 1975 is incidental to that (though it indeed put him behind the eight-ball). Foreman was patently back in the title picture mix by the point of his second comeback fight (having beaten two top contenders since returning --- hmmm, sound familiar? Now where have we seen that scenario resulting in a title shot before? ) & had then impressively dispatched three or four more foes, all the while being transparently dicked around by Ali & his management.

Ali was never going to get in the ring with Foreman again --- that went double after Manila --- & neither Ken Norton nor Jimmy Young had anything to do with that.

[BoxBuzz]

Yes, a Spring 75 Ali-Foreman rematch should have happened. But when it didn't, George didn't do himself any favors by not fighting in 75 and not looking so good against Lyle in Jan 76. It wasn't until June 76 and the Frazier rematch that George was taken seriously again; by that time Ali-Norton 3 was booked for fall. That left Ali out of the rematch picture until Spring of 77, by which time George had lost to Jimmy Young.

To the list I'll add (apologies for any duplicates):
Tyson-Douglas II, Summer or Fall 90
Bowe-Holyfield III, Spring 94
Foreman-Moorer II, Spring 95
Ali-Frazier II, Fall 71 or 1972
Ali-Liston II, November 64

Not true. Ali wanted no part of a Foreman rematch --- the fact that Foreman completely sat out 1975 is incidental to that (though it indeed put him behind the eight-ball). Foreman was patently back in the title picture mix by the point of his second comeback fight (having beaten two top contenders since returning --- hmmm, sound familiar? Now where have we seen that scenario resulting in a title shot before? ) & had then impressively dispatched three or four more foes, all the while being transparently dicked around by Ali & his management.

Ali was never going to get in the ring with Foreman again --- that went double after Manila --- & neither Ken Norton nor Jimmy Young had anything to do with that.

.....thus spoke Zarathustra.......

[Goodnight, Irene]

& what do you have to add to this discussion, Buzz?

Your usual five-paragraph jumble amounting to sweet fvck-all on its way, I presume?

[The Great John L]

Not true. Ali wanted no part of a Foreman rematch --- the fact that Foreman completely sat out 1975 is incidental to that (though it indeed put him behind the eight-ball). Foreman was patently back in the title picture mix by the point of his second comeback fight (having beaten two top contenders since returning --- hmmm, sound familiar? Now where have we seen that scenario resulting in a title shot before? ) & had then impressively dispatched three or four more foes, all the while being transparently dicked around by Ali & his management.

Ali was never going to get in the ring with Foreman again --- that went double after Manila --- & neither Ken Norton nor Jimmy Young had anything to do with that.

While there was certainly a valid claim for George getting a rematch in the 2nd half of '76, there was hardly a major public outcry. The manner in which he lost to Ali, the subsequent bizzare claims by Foreman and his long period of inactivity post Zaire didn't help his chances. And yes his beating Lyle and Frazier helped his case, but it didn't help the generally accepted opinion that George didn't know how to beat anyone who didn't stand in front of him. And while beating Joe Frazier is a very good thing, the actual fight itself certainly didn't show that George had really learned much.

Since you weren't around then you missed out on a lot of this stuff, but leading up to Zaire Ali was extremely vocal about George's weaknesses, and the fight showed exactly what Ali had been talking about. And yes of course Young had a lot to do with Foreman not getting a rematch. Had George won that fight, he would have gotten his rematch and probably would have had a decent chance of beating Ali with his declining skills. But while George did show that he had improved his skills, they still weren't quite capable of cracking Youngs great defense.

BTW, to imply somehow that Ali was afraid of fighting Foreman again is ridiculous and also very disrespectful. Especially if you peruse Foremans rather anemic pre-title resume.

[keithmoonhangover]

Kaylor - Christie

[Syntax Error]

Isn't it amazing that Ali can be accused of not wanting a rematch with Foreman, when Ali himself was fighting continually & Foreman spent the whole of 1975 sat at home sulking because he didn't manage to knock out the past it Ali in 1974.

[IRLangmaid25]

How about

Evander Holyfield v Michael Moorer II: Did Holyfield have an off night or did he really have a heart attack in the ring?
Juan Manuel Marquez v Manny Pacquiao III: The Pacman wins on draw the second and JMM claims he has won both of them.
Joe Bugner v Henry Cooper II: I watched it and I am baffled how Bugner won it
Max Schemling v Joe Louis III. They score a knockout a piece a third fight would have certainly happened if World War II had not intervened regardless of the objections of Hitler and the National Socialists.

James J Braddock v Max Baer II: Did Baer think he was going to have an easy night against "The Cinderella Man" or did Braddock rise to the big occasion.

[crusader]

How about

Evander Holyfield v Michael Moorer II: Did Holyfield have an off night or did he really have a heart attack in the ring?

I imagine that rematch would play out something like this.........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-o55tyP ... re=related

[man]

How about

Evander Holyfield v Michael Moorer II: Did Holyfield have an off night or did he really have a heart attack in the ring?

I imagine that rematch would play out something like this.........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-o55tyP ... re=related

hard to imagine. i guess it would have ended decisively.
but that's just me guessing ...

[Ezzard]

Leonard – Hagler II
Hagler – Hearns II
Leonard – Hearns (154) II
Sanchez – Nelson II
Holmes – Witherspoon II
Tyson – Douglas II
Spinks – EMM II
Ali – Foreman II
Lewis – Klitschko II

[IRLangmaid25]

How about

Evander Holyfield v Michael Moorer II: Did Holyfield have an off night or did he really have a heart attack in the ring?

I imagine that rematch would play out something like this.........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-o55tyP ... re=related

Thanks for that, when I wrote my rematch list I was doing it off the top of my head. That is next on my viewing visit after Donaire-Darchniyan. Okay then how about

Holyfield-Valuev II: Was it a robbery
Wladimir K-Corrie Sanders II: Did Sanders' get lucky or did Wladmir K underestimate him?
Danny Williams- Matt Skelton III 1-1 time for a decider

[perrycarter]

Leonard – Hagler II
Hagler – Hearns II
Leonard – Hearns (154) II
Sanchez – Nelson II
Holmes – Witherspoon II
Tyson – Douglas II
Spinks – EMM II
Ali – Foreman II
Lewis – Klitschko II

Holmes vs. Witherspoon II, absolutely. Great champions, like Joe Louis for example, should give rematches to the guys who gave them a tough fight the first time around. This is a black mark for Holmes.

[Ezzard]

Leonard – Hagler II
Hagler – Hearns II
Leonard – Hearns (154) II
Sanchez – Nelson II
Holmes – Witherspoon II
Tyson – Douglas II
Spinks – EMM II
Ali – Foreman II
Lewis – Klitschko II

Holmes vs. Witherspoon II, absolutely. Great champions, like Joe Louis for example, should give rematches to the guys who gave them a tough fight the first time around. This is a black mark for Holmes.

Sort of a watershed moment for Holmes. From that moment he never really wanted to take on the best (and I'm a fan).