Who is now the "man" at 140lb?

Hesketh Vampire · Post by **Hesketh Vampire** » 26 Jun 2005, 09:27

So, an interesting month for the light-welters with all 3 major belts changing hands. Difficult to assess who is truly the "man" at 140lb right now though, Hatton definitely beat the previous "man", and Mayweather beat a lesser fighter than Kostya to get his belt. But the way Floyd looked beating Gatti and his career prior to moving to 140 suggests maybe he is the "man".

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 26 Jun 2005, 09:31

Hatton beat the better champion, so it's Hatton, although mayweathers explosive performance might suggest otherwise, he wasn't fighting a true elite level fighter like Tszyu.

What worried me was how strong Floyd looked, he looks like a puncher at 140 when he chooses to, which is what I always suspected. Like Ray Leonard, when he plants his feet he's a really hurtful puncher.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 26 Jun 2005, 09:31

Its Floyd for me, sorry guys. Its close but Ricky only has one win over a top ten opponent (at the time of the fight), Floyd has two, both probably in the top 5 at the time of the contest also.

Hesketh Vampire · Post by **Hesketh Vampire** » 26 Jun 2005, 09:33

jamesmcdonnell wrote:What worried me was how strong Floyd looked, he looks like a puncher at 140 when he chooses to, which is what I always suspected. Like Ray Leonard, when he plants his feet he's a really hurtful puncher.

That's something that surprised me, they were painfully solid shots that Floyd was bouncing cleanly off Gatti's head. It really was a fantastic performance that will have Teams Hatton and Cotto wondering long and hard about fights with Floyd.

Cannibal · Post by **Cannibal** » 26 Jun 2005, 09:39

The only thing working in favour of a Mayweather-Hatton fight is the heaps of money the US TV will throw at them. I reckon Hatton will want a lot of money for the risk of Mayweather, Mayweather will be more willing. I still reckon that within the next month or so you will hear the Hatton camp approaching Cotto more than Mayweather.

Hesketh Vampire · Post by **Hesketh Vampire** » 26 Jun 2005, 09:41

Cannibal wrote:I still reckon that within the next month or so you will hear the Hatton camp approaching Cotto more than Mayweather.

Cotto isn't such an easy fight to make either though, Miguel is also with HBO and the smaller amount of cash Hatton v Cotton would generate may not be enough to resolve the HBO-Showtime issue. Personally I think we'll see some slightly more routine defences from both Hatton and Mayweather in their next fights.

Mayweather v Wittter anyone?

Cannibal · Post by **Cannibal** » 26 Jun 2005, 10:18

Problem is, everyone seems to be expecting Hatton to deliver a big name for his next fight and apart from Mayweather there is little else he can do in the short term. I reckon he'd pressure Mayweather more than Gatti cause he wouldn't use that wide stance that Gatti was using which I think put Gatti at a disadvantage in the fight, he kept trying to inch his way forward with a jab but Mayweather was too quick for that and could see what Gatti was going to do even before Gatti knew. Ricky I think would come at more of a charge and take a few shots to get inside I think and use body punch pressure to slow Mayweather down in the latter rounds but the problem is Mayweather will know that will be Rickys gameplan and adapt his style accordingly. I can see Mayweather using the jab and move while catching Ricky with the odd combination as he tries to bull his way in. It would be up to Ricky to walk across Mayweather and trap him in corners and not let him slip and slide out, something he has experience doing but not so sure he can trap Mayweather as often as he'll need to. I can see Ricky taking one of the first 2 rounds from sheer work rate and his eagerness to impress but I'd see Mayweather winning at least 4 of the first six rounds. Second half of the fight would be where Hatton could get stronger if he keeps at it and doesn't get discouraged. If he applies the body pressure Mayweather will start to slow and become more hittable and then Hatton needs to turn it into a scrap and rough Mayweather up and take him places he's never been but I still think Mayweather is good enough to pull through and I see him winning at least 3 of the last 6. Which is why I think team Hatton will look a other options. There are few options out there though and the pressure from the US will be for Mayweather-Hatton.

Cotto-Would be suitable if they can pull it off. I think Hattons style is a good one to beat Cotto.

Maussa - As Billy Graham said, Hatton would murder him but I think fans would view this as the easy road. Maussa is worse than a lot of opposition Hatton faced before Tszyu, he just has a title and that is the only thing Hatton has to gain from the fight as it will lead to a larger pay day should he eventually want to go for the unification bout with Mayweather.

Witter - We all know by now that this won't happen unless Witter picks up one of the other versions of the world title and Hatton is looking for bigger pay days.

Magee - I don't see the point in it. Magee before the attack gave him a hard time but Magee on the comeback trail I think would just be an easy defense.

Coralles - Already been ruled out.

Tszyu Rematch - I don't think Tszyu wants it.

Gatti, Harris - Both beaten, Gatti going up to Welter which seems to be becoming the division where the big names who fail at Light Welter and Middelweight go. Harris needs a couple of very good wins to even be considered again.

lvlarc · Post by **lvlarc** » 26 Jun 2005, 10:25

It's definetly Mayweather for me, Hatton a close 2nd :)

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 26 Jun 2005, 10:36

I think Maussa will be in for a big payday, what a route back for Tszyu, what an opportunity for the likes of Witter, Magee, Gatti (if he doesn't move up), Corrales, Castillo, Leija, Urkal (although enjoying life at 147).

Fantastic opportunity to get a belt and move into the Hatton picture.

Cannibal · Post by **Cannibal** » 26 Jun 2005, 10:41

Yeah, I'm starting to think that the first man to get to Maussa will be Hattons next opponent.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 26 Jun 2005, 10:45

Come on Frank, get Eamomn in there - lets have Magee vs Maussa as part of an UK PPV involving Ricky (maybe vs Mbaye) and the Williams vs Skelton winner in a big fight.

You have one of the star box office attractions now, like you did with Naz, Naz bills paved the way for a lot of opportunity for others in your stable. Lets go back to those times.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 26 Jun 2005, 10:54

Lets not forget though, that Gatti played right into Floyds hands, but standing one pace off of him the whole time, and when he did get close he did nothing, the worst possible tactics against someone with better skills and more speed.

Billy graham was right in mentioning Duran against Leonard. With fast handed slipperty guys you have to get on them early and rough it up on the inside. despite his defence, i think hattons body shots can make an impact, and hatton's own speed is very much underrated, he closes the gap nice and quickly, and as Billy said, he has excellent balance and footwork.

I would favour Hatton to make a much better job of it than Gatti, and the way he took those shots off of tszyu makes me think Floyd wouldn't be able to just stand and tee off.

Over the course of a fight though, you could see Floyd's sharper shots marking hatton up, but he might also find himself in hot water over the latter half of the fight.

There was much reminiscent of Ray Leonard in that performance tonight, and floyd may well go on to emulate leonard's achievements, however, let's not confuse Gatti with Duran or Hearns, Hagler, Benitez et al.

Looking good against someone of Gatti's level is one thing, but worth remembering that he didn't have it so easy in the first fight with Castillo.

'Educated pressure' as graham said, is the key to beating Floyd, doing it though is another matter

Freiheit · Post by **Freiheit** » 26 Jun 2005, 10:58

THe WBA 140 belt had its last mandatory defense in october last year so if someone doesnt give M'Baye step aside money it will most likely be him that gets the first crack at Maussa.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 26 Jun 2005, 11:07

jamesmcdonnell wrote:Lets not forget though, that Gatti played right into Floyds hands, but standing one pace off of him the whole time, and when he did get close he did nothing, the worst possible tactics against someone with better skills and more speed.

Billy graham was right in mentioning Duran against Leonard. With fast handed slipperty guys you have to get on them early and rough it up on the inside. despite his defence, i think hattons body shots can make an impact, and hatton's own speed is very much underrated, he closes the gap nice and quickly, and as Billy said, he has excellent balance and footwork.

I would favour Hatton to make a much better job of it than Gatti, and the way he took those shots off of tszyu makes me think Floyd wouldn't be able to just stand and tee off.

Over the course of a fight though, you could see Floyd's sharper shots marking hatton up, but he might also find himself in hot water over the latter half of the fight.

There was much reminiscent of Ray Leonard in that performance tonight, and floyd may well go on to emulate leonard's achievements, however, let's not confuse Gatti with Duran or Hearns, Hagler, Benitez et al.

Looking good against someone of Gatti's level is one thing, but worth remembering that he didn't have it so easy in the first fight with Castillo.

'Educated pressure' as graham said, is the key to beating Floyd, doing it though is another matter

Good post, I didn't like Gatti's performance but I don't know if it is entirely fair to criticise Gatti's "Level". Although his performance was not as I expected.

I'm not sure what happend with Mayweather vs Castillo he was very subdued in both fights (although I scored him a comfortable winner in both). Was it hand problems I don't know, but one thing is for certain Castillo is a damn fine fighter as we have since found out.

Billy Graham was spot on with his analysis, but can Ricky perform this "educated pressure" and do it at that level - I wouldn't call his performance vs Tszyu "educated" pressure.

Southpaw Stylist · Post by **Southpaw Stylist** » 26 Jun 2005, 11:10

Talent wise - Mayweather..by miles

At the moment - Hatton.

I just hope this fight comes off....

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 26 Jun 2005, 11:18

stujones wrote:
jamesmcdonnell wrote:Lets not forget though, that Gatti played right into Floyds hands, but standing one pace off of him the whole time, and when he did get close he did nothing, the worst possible tactics against someone with better skills and more speed.

Billy graham was right in mentioning Duran against Leonard. With fast handed slipperty guys you have to get on them early and rough it up on the inside. despite his defence, i think hattons body shots can make an impact, and hatton's own speed is very much underrated, he closes the gap nice and quickly, and as Billy said, he has excellent balance and footwork.

I would favour Hatton to make a much better job of it than Gatti, and the way he took those shots off of tszyu makes me think Floyd wouldn't be able to just stand and tee off.

Over the course of a fight though, you could see Floyd's sharper shots marking hatton up, but he might also find himself in hot water over the latter half of the fight.

There was much reminiscent of Ray Leonard in that performance tonight, and floyd may well go on to emulate leonard's achievements, however, let's not confuse Gatti with Duran or Hearns, Hagler, Benitez et al.

Looking good against someone of Gatti's level is one thing, but worth remembering that he didn't have it so easy in the first fight with Castillo.

'Educated pressure' as graham said, is the key to beating Floyd, doing it though is another matter
Good post, I didn't like Gatti's performance but I don't know if it is entirely fair to criticise Gatti's "Level". Although his performance was not as I expected.

I'm not sure what happend with Mayweather vs Castillo he was very subdued in both fights (although I scored him a comfortable winner in both). Was it hand problems I don't know, but one thing is for certain Castillo is a damn fine fighter as we have since found out.

Billy Graham was spot on with his analysis, but can Ricky perform this "educated pressure" and do it at that level - I wouldn't call his performance vs Tszyu "educated" pressure.

yes but Graham said it would be a totally different fight from the tszyu one. I think against Tszyu they knew they had to tire him otherwise Ricky was going to get clattered all night by those huge right and left hands. hatton took them well, but he couldn't have taken them all night.

No doubt about it, Hatton will have his work cut out against mayweather if the fight ever happens.

I think Hatton wants the fight, i have my doubts whether Warren is going to want to make it happen when there are ready made stumbling blocks in the form of the HBO/showtime problem.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 26 Jun 2005, 11:23

I agree, don't get me wrong I rate Hatton but his performance vs Tszyu is just how I expected him to fight (didn't get the result right). I just don't know if I have seen Hatton fight very differently from that throughout his career.

Maybe the Tackie and Magee fights (although I still think Magee did the bigger tactical change that night). He was still open for shots though then, people still used those fights as examples when they went for the Tszyu vs Hatton prediction (and going for Tszyu).

Deserter · Post by **Deserter** » 26 Jun 2005, 12:06

Hatton should steer well clear of Mayweather and instead aim to grab another belt by fighting Maussa, a fight he's clearly capable of winning.
I think Cotto will move up, and Ricky may be able to bide his time in a couple of routine defences until Floyd moves up - not because of weight-making difficulties, but because that's where the big money fights against the likes of Judah and De La Hoya will be. If this scenario plays out, Hatton is in with a great chance of unifying all the belts.
I haven't seen Mayweather's performance last night, but based on what I've read I find it hard to make a case for a Hatton victory. Mayweather may not be far off being another Leonard, and while I accept that Hatton is no Dave Boy Green, I believe he's unfortunate that he's in an era that increasingly looks as though it is going to be defined by Mayweather's greatness.

Lenny · Post by **Lenny** » 27 Jun 2005, 04:51

Well i'd much rather see him give it a go Deserter. Castillo has proved that losing to Floyd doesn't have to mean the end. I'd much rather see Hatton give it his all against Mayweather, even if he gets beat, than taking on Maussa (pointless fight) and trying to avoid Cotto and Mayweather till they move up. I find it strange that you'd rather see him avoid people than try and fight the best??
I actually believe Ricky would give Floyd a good fight, Gatti was perfect for him in the way he fought. Would no way be as one sided as some people are predicting.

BubiScholz · Post by **BubiScholz** » 27 Jun 2005, 05:26

Hatton beat the living legend and then the best man in the division so you must consider him at the #1 at the moment. future will show and the future lies in Ricky´s hands. Go Hatton!!!!

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 27 Jun 2005, 05:56

Hatton in No#1 and rightly so - but P4P no#1 it's Floyd - aaaaall the way.

A predictable one sided thrashing - this was never a so called superfight, as some were hyping it.
But you have to hand it to Mayweather - that was absolutely brilliant.
The type of breathtaking skills not seen since Ray Leonard at his peak.

Disagree about his punch though - I don't think he hits too hard in world class terms - those shots landed absolutely flush, time after time, and Gatti never came close to going over.
If Leonard had landed shots like that, Gatti would be waking up just about now.

Tough fight to take for Hatton, don't imagine FW is in any hurry for that one....

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 27 Jun 2005, 07:04

I think Floyd has power enough, bear in mind that he was hitting a bigger man than himself, Leonard did hit harder, but I think that was probably because he planted his feet more.

Gatti was on rubbery legs by the end, and he tottered back to his corner like a drunk, don't tell me he wasn't hurt.

Floyd has carried his power up well, considering he's not a natural 140 lber, I thought his punch power was pretty impressive.

Leonard was a natural Welterweight, he wasn't a puncher at any other weight unless you consider knocking out a weight drained LaLonde a major achievement.

Floyd's already fighting above his best weight and drilled Gatti and would definetly have knocked Gatti out the next round.

Chambers2 · Post by **Chambers2** » 27 Jun 2005, 07:15

Ricky beat the man, who was the man, so now hes the man

Deserter · Post by **Deserter** » 27 Jun 2005, 11:02

Lenny Albert wrote:Well i'd much rather see him give it a go Deserter. Castillo has proved that losing to Floyd doesn't have to mean the end. I'd much rather see Hatton give it his all against Mayweather, even if he gets beat, than taking on Maussa (pointless fight) and trying to avoid Cotto and Mayweather till they move up. I find it strange that you'd rather see him avoid people than try and fight the best??
I actually believe Ricky would give Floyd a good fight, Gatti was perfect for him in the way he fought. Would no way be as one sided as some people are predicting.

I hear you, but for every Castillo who manages to come back, there's an example of a defeat that can be career-ending - not because of the physical damage sustained, but because of the psychological damage. Ricky is at an all-time high at the moment and his confidence in the wake of the Tsyzu win will be flying - put him into a fight with Mayweather, which I believe he'd lose convincingly, and you take away that strong mental 'armour'.
I should clarify that I normally never endorse this approach, but Mayweather is a once in a generation talent that deserves unique consideration. Ricky's a great fighter but I simply can't make a convincing case for a Hatton win whichever scenario I consider. It's only given this that I'd prefer to see him prolong his career at the top and indulge in other exciting fights against the likes of Corrales, that will still be testing.

tonyevs · Post by **tonyevs** » 27 Jun 2005, 12:29

The `Man at 140` is definetly Hatton.

The biggest threat at 140 would be Mayweather, followed very closely by Cotto.

Gatti for me fought without an ounce of fire in his belly, Hatton would have it coming out of his ears.

Castillo gave Mayweather two very hard fights,at lightweight, and our Hatton is an even more intense fighter with much more natural strength and power.

I am not convinced of Mayweathers punch power, he seems more of a wear them down puncher, as his weight has crept up the KO`s have changed more to TKO`s

At this moment I`d favour Hatton over Mayweather.