The Super Fight That Never Happened: Tyson VS Foreman

[keithmoonhangover]

Tyson before prison wins. Tyson after prison loses.

[yancey]

Tyson before prison wins. Tyson after prison loses.

I can buy that.

[Dave81]

1988 Tyson destroys any version of Foreman.

[Idisagree]

Lyle was a huge puncher & this is Old Foreman anyway. He was never floored

And Tyson was not a huge puncher? Lyle I believe had more brute force but he was not a better puncher than Tyson. Tyson had better technique, way more speed, and better timing.

I never said Mike wasn't. But using Lyle as an example why George didn't have a granite chin is pretty silly. And George was even sturdier during his comeback from what I saw.

It depends on what your definition of granite chin is. During Lyle fight Foreman did not display a granite chin and that is a fact. Also, during his comeback he did not face a puncher like Lyle or Tyson and that is why probably he was sturdier. Besides the point if he was hurt by huge puncher like Lyle he certainly could have been hurt by Tyson too.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

He faced plenty of punchers in his comeback. Stewart,Morrison,Moorer, Cooney and Holyfield has underrated power.

Since this thread is about his comeback, when he never touched the canvas, you might want to give up whatever point you're trying to make about the huge punching Lyle hurting him several times. I'd disagree that he didn't exhibit an excellent chin in that fight anyway. Most any other Heavyweight would have been finished from those shots.

And where in the world are you getting that Tyson couldn't hurt him? I don't recall saying that.

[Idisagree]

He faced plenty of punchers in his comeback. Stewart,Morrison,Moorer, Cooney and Holyfield has underrated power.

Since this thread is about his comeback, when he never touched the canvas, you might want to give up whatever point you're trying to make about the huge punching Lyle hurting him several times. I'd disagree that he didn't exhibit an excellent chin in that fight anyway. Most any other Heavyweight would have been finished from those shots.

And where in the world are you getting that Tyson couldn't hurt him? I don't recall saying that.

Maybe you should explain what did you meant by "Lyle was a huge puncher"? Yes he was a huge puncher and so was Tyson. I don't get the point you are trying to make with that statement.

Is Stewart, Morrison, Moorer, Cooney, and Holyfield in Lyle's or Tyson league in punching ability/power? I don't think so. I agree that Holyfield has under-rated power but he still a cut below Lyle and Tyson when it comes to power. I'll give you that Holyfield was more skillful than Lyle and Tyson but he did not punch as hard as they did.

You are saying that the point of this thread is about his comeback, when he never touched the canvas. And I'm saying that he never touched the canvas because he did not faced a puncher like Lyle. Having said that, Tyson was better puncher than Lyle and what I'm saying is if Lyle had the power to drop Foreman, then so does Tyson.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

I didn't think an explanation was necessary. Lyle was a huge puncher, getting hurt and dropped by him does not eliminate you from having a great chin.

I already stated that Tyson was a bigger puncher than those guys. You brought up George's chin and insinuated that it's overrated and that is what I responded to. What does Tyson's power have to do with that?

And for the second time. I never said that Tyson couldn't hurt him. Why do you continue to act like I did?

[Dave81]

1988 Tyson destroys any version of Foreman.

nope.

'70-'74 foreman destroys any version of tyson (including the '85-'88 version). a prime foreman is actually the worst match-up possible for a prime tyson. tyson die-hards would have been crying for a while after what that version of foreman would have done to him.

Nope!

Tyson would of been to fast and relentless, Foreman wasn't quick enough, not saying it's an easy fight, but reckon it would of been a simliar ended as the Pinklon Thomas fight.

[Dave81]

nope.

'70-'74 foreman destroys any version of tyson (including the '85-'88 version). a prime foreman is actually the worst match-up possible for a prime tyson. tyson die-hards would have been crying for a while after what that version of foreman would have done to him.

Nope!

Tyson would of been to fast and relentless, Foreman wasn't quick enough, not saying it's an easy fight, but reckon it would of been a simliar ended as the Pinklon Thomas fight.

i see that you're a tyson die-hard. so i know logic won't be apart of this conversation, but anyone who was bigger than mike - someone mike couldn't bully around - someone that wouldn't be afraid to punch mike - someone who could go the distance - some one who could mike would not want to fight anymore (past the 6th) is going to kick mike's ass and no one fits this recipe better than a prime big george.

it's been reported multiple times that if mike couldn't get you out of there right away he would get discouraged and would almost look for a way out. mike would be "relentless" for maybe the first two/three rounds before he realizes that george's stiff jab and uppercut are no joke. prime foreman after the fourth round would see that mike's psyche was folding and it would be curtains for mike around the 8th.

pinky was kickin' mike's ass (i don't know what the eff fight those three judges were watching) before that KO in the 6th. foreman would take what pinky did but only better.

what you have to realize is that mike in his prime wasn't invincible and that a lot of his game when discussing hypothetical fights involves his lack of mental toughness.

i'm a fan of that tyson too but i also know how to look at things realistically/objectively. if that fight ever happened that is the one fight (that if it were possible) i would bet every single penny to my name and would tell my parents the same so we could be rich forever. no way in hell does mike a) win this fight & b) see the final bell.

Yes im a big Tyson fight, but im also a realist, Tyson went 12 rounds with Tucker and Smith and took probably ever round. I hear what your saying with Foremans power and toughness, but if Lyle puts Foreman down, so doe's Tyson, and one thing Tyson did possibly better than any other fighter, was finish the job when the opponent was hurt. Tyson would of been able to elude Foremans big shots and counter with his quick hooks to the body and head, shortly after that the uppercuts would follow, Tyson could of thrown 4 fast knockout shots by the time Foreman had got one off. Anyway this debate could go on forever, you have your opinion and i have mine.

[keithmoonhangover]

Prime for Prime, I've gotta agree that Foreman is a not an easy fight for Tyson, but at the same time, Mike had a very good chin.

I think it could go one of two ways.

If Tyson moves his head and gives Big George angles, then it could be pretty much all Mike.

Or Foreman catches Mike with a big shot early and punishes him until it's stopped.

In no way is it cut and dried.

[jrc26]

nope.

'70-'74 foreman destroys any version of tyson (including the '85-'88 version). a prime foreman is actually the worst match-up possible for a prime tyson. tyson die-hards would have been crying for a while after what that version of foreman would have done to him.

Nope!

Tyson would of been to fast and relentless, Foreman wasn't quick enough, not saying it's an easy fight, but reckon it would of been a simliar ended as the Pinklon Thomas fight.

i see that you're a tyson die-hard. so i know logic won't be apart of this conversation, but anyone who was bigger than mike - someone mike couldn't bully around - someone that wouldn't be afraid to punch mike - someone who could go the distance - some one who could mike would not want to fight anymore (past the 6th) is going to kick mike's ass and no one fits this recipe better than a prime big george.

it's been reported multiple times that if mike couldn't get you out of there right away he would get discouraged and would almost look for a way out. mike would be "relentless" for maybe the first two/three rounds before he realizes that george's stiff jab and uppercut are no joke. prime foreman after the fourth round would see that mike's psyche was folding and it would be curtains for mike around the 8th.

pinky was kickin' mike's ass (i don't know what the eff fight those three judges were watching) before that KO in the 6th. foreman would take what pinky did but only better.

what you have to realize is that mike in his prime wasn't invincible and that a lot of his game when discussing hypothetical fights involves his lack of mental toughness.

i'm a fan of that tyson too but i also know how to look at things realistically/objectively. if that fight ever happened that is the one fight (that if it were possible) i would bet every single penny to my name and would tell my parents the same so we could be rich forever. no way in hell does mike a) win this fight & b) see the final bell.

Please define "kickin' ass" for me, because we must have different meanings.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LDDqMKv9 ... 3462D996AE

I would love to see your scoring on this fight. Remember Tyson is wearing black trunks. (I had it 3-2 for Tyson at the time of the stoppage and 1 of the rounds I gave to Thomas was a toss up). Again, we may just have different definitions of an ass kicking.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

i see that you're a tyson die-hard. so i know logic won't be apart of this conversation, but anyone who was bigger than mike - someone mike couldn't bully around - someone that wouldn't be afraid to punch mike - someone who could go the distance - some one who could mike would not want to fight anymore (past the 6th) is going to kick mike's ass and no one fits this recipe better than a prime big george.

it's been reported multiple times that if mike couldn't get you out of there right away he would get discouraged and would almost look for a way out. mike would be "relentless" for maybe the first two/three rounds before he realizes that george's stiff jab and uppercut are no joke. prime foreman after the fourth round would see that mike's psyche was folding and it would be curtains for mike around the 8th.

pinky was kickin' mike's ass (i don't know what the eff fight those three judges were watching) before that KO in the 6th. foreman would take what pinky did but only better.

what you have to realize is that mike in his prime wasn't invincible and that a lot of his game when discussing hypothetical fights involves his lack of mental toughness.

i'm a fan of that tyson too but i also know how to look at things realistically/objectively. if that fight ever happened that is the one fight (that if it were possible) i would bet every single penny to my name and would tell my parents the same so we could be rich forever. no way in hell does mike a) win this fight & b) see the final bell.

Yes im a big Tyson fight, but im also a realist, Tyson went 12 rounds with Tucker and Smith and took probably ever round. I hear what your saying with Foremans power and toughness, but if Lyle puts Foreman down, so doe's Tyson, and one thing Tyson did possibly better than any other fighter, was finish the job when the opponent was hurt. Tyson would of been able to elude Foremans big shots and counter with his quick hooks to the body and head, shortly after that the uppercuts would follow, Tyson could of thrown 4 fast knockout shots by the time Foreman had got one off. Anyway this debate could go on forever, you have your opinion and i have mine.

yeah, we'll have to agree to disagree. the one thing i will say with the lyle fight was that foreman was coming off a 14 month lay-off and i believe it was much easier for lyle to hit foreman than it would have been tyson. i think tyson would have had to lunge/jump at foreman to catch him solid and i believe foreman would have used some tactics to clinch and bully around mike or hold him beside/behind the head and not mike to do much attack upstairs.

and tyson didn't always finish people when he hurt them. he put tillis down pretty hard in the 4th and tillis got up and still gave him a very tough fight. even though it's the not the '85-'88 tyson, tyson had holyfield hurt in the 1st round of their first fight and couldn't do anything after that round (i may have given him a 10-10 round in another round - can't remember which one).

i also believe tucker got some rounds under his belt and it looked like in the smith fight that both were content with just hugging and not trying hurt each other mid-way through the fight.

Tyson had Holyfield hurt in the first round? Ummmm, NO. Possibly for a brief moment in the fifth. That was the only round I gave Mike. Tyson's best punch in the first was the opening right and Holyfield immediately backed him off with a counter.

[Idisagree]

I didn't think an explanation was necessary. Lyle was a huge puncher, getting hurt and dropped by him does not eliminate you from having a great chin.

I already stated that Tyson was a bigger puncher than those guys. You brought up George's chin and insinuated that it's overrated and that is what I responded to. What does Tyson's power have to do with that?

And for the second time. I never said that Tyson couldn't hurt him. Why do you continue to act like I did?

I never said that Foreman didn’t have a great chin. I responded to the comment that Tyson did not have a chance because Foreman had a granite chin which I disagree. He had a great chin but not quite a granite chin. Juan LaPorte I consider him to have a granite chin. Foreman could be hurt by a huge puncher like Tyson and that is why I would not classify his chin as granite. Maybe you and I define granite chin differently.

[Giancarlo]

pinky was kickin' mike's ass (i don't know what the eff fight those three judges were watching) before that KO in the 6th.

Kicking his ass?

You have either never seen that fight or ought to pick another sport to follow.

[Giancarlo]

for all those that seem to want to hang on my one comment about the thomas/tyson fight. i had thomas up 4-1 before the 6th. i haven't seen it in a while so maybe i'll go back and re-watch since it seems to be so blasphemous that that one comment needs to get dissected. pick a new sport to follow? please eff out of here with that noise wanna be experts.

Oh dear.

Anyway, do come back AFTER YOU HAVE WATCHED THE FIGHT and explain the supposed ass kicking Pinky was administering...

[SaadOffTheDeck]

I didn't think an explanation was necessary. Lyle was a huge puncher, getting hurt and dropped by him does not eliminate you from having a great chin.

I already stated that Tyson was a bigger puncher than those guys. You brought up George's chin and insinuated that it's overrated and that is what I responded to. What does Tyson's power have to do with that?

And for the second time. I never said that Tyson couldn't hurt him. Why do you continue to act like I did?

I never said that Foreman didn’t have a great chin. I responded to the comment that Tyson did not have a chance because Foreman had a granite chin which I disagree. He had a great chin but not quite a granite chin. Juan LaPorte I consider him to have a granite chin. Foreman could be hurt by a huge puncher like Tyson and that is why I would not classify his chin as granite. Maybe you and I define granite chin differently.

LOL, so I could say Foreman had an awesome chin and you would agree? But concrete would be a no-no? You're spinning around in circles my man. I'd let this one pass.

[Heartbreak_Kid79]

In the late 80s Foreman was continually calling out Tyson:
But remember what a prime Tyson did to a 38 year old Larry Holmes?

I see Tyson winning this on decision as George tires from the mid rounds onwards.

A prime Tyson was much better than the Michael Moorer that Foreman KO'd (whilst losing on points) to win the title.

Tyson decision

[SaadOffTheDeck]

In the late 80s Foreman was continually calling out Tyson:
But remember what a prime Tyson did to a 38 year old Larry Holmes?

I see Tyson winning this on decision as George tires from the mid rounds onwards.

A prime Tyson was much better than the Michael Moorer that Foreman KO'd (whilst losing on points) to win the title.

Tyson decision

George was much better against Holyfield than he was against Moorer.

[hhaehre]

I think any pre-prison version of Tyson beats old Foreman to a pulp and 73 Foreman brutally ko's any version of Tyson.

[BoxBuzz]

Just an FYI to those in doubt

Say what you want about who would win and when.....but keep in mind.....

Tyson honestly ducked Foreman..or if you prefer his management ducked Foreman.......and not the other way around.

It's clearly documented in many ways.....here is just one example.

Foreman NEVER backed away from making this fight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmG_gR576EA

[keithmoonhangover]

Just an FYI to those in doubt

Say what you want about who would win and when.....but keep in mind.....

Tyson honestly ducked Foreman..or if you prefer his management ducked Foreman.......and not the other way around.

It's clearly documented in many ways.....here is just one example.

Foreman NEVER backed away from making this fight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmG_gR576EA

Regarding Foreman on Letterman.....

At the time, I, along with a hell of a lot of other fight fans DID NOT want to see Foreman anywhere near Tyson in the ring - for his own safety. The general consensus at the time was Foreman-Cooney was a joke fight - the headline was 'Geezers at Ceasars' Foreman wasn't in the top ten and I didn't read a single article that thought Tyson-Foreman was a good idea.

Once Tyson dropped the title, there was more talk and The Ring featured the possible fight on it's cover.

[misterpunch]

iron mike would never beat a guy that scared the shite out of him. every model of george beats iron mike because mike just would not work effectively against a man he thought could starch him. you cant take the mentality factor away from a fight like this or any dream fight

[Brutu]

IMOP of course Mike Tyson had no desire to meet George Foreman in the ring at any time of his comeback.
Foreman was the real deal destruction machine,especially for vertically challenged heavyweights.
One good uppercut and Tyson goes into a defensive mode just trying to get to the end of the bell
of any round.
I use to laugh when the younger generation considered Tyson such a ring bad asss.
Cause he never fought the competion that Foreman did.
In 1977 Foreman fought a year of Mike Tyson's up and coming opponents just in one night(Toronto).
Foreman may have fought even over all better competion in just that one night.
Too bad even Foreman was in on the'fat man"more cheeseburgers please joking.
He sort of made a mockery of his own bad asss ring self.
Although at one point in his comebck,imop Foreman not only changed his persona,
but also his boxing style.This was around the time of the Gerry Cooney fight.
He fought Rocky Sakorski like a bad ass,but sort of after that,he came into the ring walking around like Fred Sanford.

[Controversial]

Tyson for me. The second version of Foreman was very carefully matched and quite slow. Tyson way to fast in my opinion and unless he walked into a Foreman sledgehammer blow I can't see Foreman knocking him out.

[HomicideHenry]

I think it had all the makings of going the distance; I can't see Foreman getting knocked out, and I have a hard time seeing Foreman doing it only because George was slower due to age; but it would have been either A) a slow fight (like Bonecrusher Smith) where both men respected eachother way too much, or B) a slugout; I'm thinking the first.