danfoster wrote:The Ingle style of boxing isn't defined by low hands or sticking your chin out. It's defined but excellent footwork, smooth movement and often a capacity to box comfortably in both stances.
The style is taught that you should never drop your hands in range. Sometimes, exceptional exponents like Naz and Junior are happy to box that way and take that risk but all Ingle trained fighters develop the style in their own way. The low hands style should generally be used when out of range but at a distance and added to feints to make the opponent think that he IS in range and consequently throw a shot that will miss, leaving him open to the counter.
Herol was before my time in terms of attending the gym but i loved watching him when i was growing up. I'm sure that a large amount of his style was unique to him BUT look at what Brendan has done with countless other kids. Not just the champs and stars - look at what kids like Andrew Facey achieved. Now we've got Lee Duncan and others who may not have Naz's talent but make a good living and never even get a mark on their because the are exceptionally adept defensive fighters. This, in reality, has nothing to do with Bomber and everything to do with BRendan, Dominic and John and the unique lines and blows training system.
Hooky - there are some good kids coming through, as ever, but as has been said above, Barry Awad (aka Kid Galahad) is coming on leaps and bounds and might just have that something special about him to go all the way. I've seen him spar Kell and Junior open and trust me, he is not out of his depth whatsoever.
I think he'll certainly emerge as the best British fighter around 8'10 - 9st and i'd back him to beat most of our top domestic kids right now. But after we all bigged-up Steve Barnes and that went wrong, we're not gonna shout about Barry unless anyone asks! In terms of the Manchester reference above, i understand what Pugilist Specialist means because Barry's slickness would be perfect to counteract the classic 'Manchester Mexican' style.
There's also an exceptionally hard-hitting amateur kid called Sam O'Maison who has plenty to learn but is a serious banger - Richie Towers tells people that Sam once hit him so hard he thought his bladder and bowells were gonna empty themselves!
When is Richard Towers stepping up Dan?, I would love to see him fight Fury.
Also what weight is the O'Maison kid?
Re Richie, i'm not quite sure. He had a bit of an enforced period of inactivity at the turn of the year (through no fault of his own) and doesn't have any real amateur experience so i think people are wary about running before they can walk. IF you look at his record, he's been matched with reasonable kids who have boxed other prospects and usually at least matched, if not bettered, the other prospect's performance. Rich is so dedicated and such a good liver that there's no rush. When Dom feels he's ready they will move him on. To answer your question, though - i should think he'll be fighting at a high level within twelve months. He's had excellent sparring with FUry and CHisora and flourished in these sessions.
danfoster wrote:The Ingle style of boxing isn't defined by low hands or sticking your chin out. It's defined but excellent footwork, smooth movement and often a capacity to box comfortably in both stances.
The style is taught that you should never drop your hands in range. Sometimes, exceptional exponents like Naz and Junior are happy to box that way and take that risk but all Ingle trained fighters develop the style in their own way. The low hands style should generally be used when out of range but at a distance and added to feints to make the opponent think that he IS in range and consequently throw a shot that will miss, leaving him open to the counter.
Herol was before my time in terms of attending the gym but i loved watching him when i was growing up. I'm sure that a large amount of his style was unique to him BUT look at what Brendan has done with countless other kids. Not just the champs and stars - look at what kids like Andrew Facey achieved. Now we've got Lee Duncan and others who may not have Naz's talent but make a good living and never even get a mark on their because the are exceptionally adept defensive fighters. This, in reality, has nothing to do with Bomber and everything to do with BRendan, Dominic and John and the unique lines and blows training system.
Hooky - there are some good kids coming through, as ever, but as has been said above, Barry Awad (aka Kid Galahad) is coming on leaps and bounds and might just have that something special about him to go all the way. I've seen him spar Kell and Junior open and trust me, he is not out of his depth whatsoever.
I think he'll certainly emerge as the best British fighter around 8'10 - 9st and i'd back him to beat most of our top domestic kids right now. But after we all bigged-up Steve Barnes and that went wrong, we're not gonna shout about Barry unless anyone asks! In terms of the Manchester reference above, i understand what Pugilist Specialist means because Barry's slickness would be perfect to counteract the classic 'Manchester Mexican' style.
There's also an exceptionally hard-hitting amateur kid called Sam O'Maison who has plenty to learn but is a serious banger - Richie Towers tells people that Sam once hit him so hard he thought his bladder and bowells were gonna empty themselves!
When is Richard Towers stepping up Dan?, I would love to see him fight Fury.
Also what weight is the O'Maison kid?
Re Richie, i'm not quite sure. He had a bit of an enforced period of inactivity at the turn of the year (through no fault of his own) and doesn't have any real amateur experience so i think people are wary about running before they can walk. IF you look at his record, he's been matched with reasonable kids who have boxed other prospects and usually at least matched, if not bettered, the other prospect's performance. Rich is so dedicated and such a good liver that there's no rush. When Dom feels he's ready they will move him on. To answer your question, though - i should think he'll be fighting at a high level within twelve months. He's had excellent sparring with FUry and CHisora and flourished in these sessions.
Sam is about 10 stone mate.
The reason I ask about Richard Towers is that for a bib boy he appears more althletic than Price, Dallas, Fury, he seems looser and more relaxed, he's the one im most curious about in Britain.
look forward to seeing what sam O'Mailey is all about.
Jon Saxon wrote:
When is Richard Towers stepping up Dan?, I would love to see him fight Fury.
Also what weight is the O'Maison kid?
Re Richie, i'm not quite sure. He had a bit of an enforced period of inactivity at the turn of the year (through no fault of his own) and doesn't have any real amateur experience so i think people are wary about running before they can walk. IF you look at his record, he's been matched with reasonable kids who have boxed other prospects and usually at least matched, if not bettered, the other prospect's performance. Rich is so dedicated and such a good liver that there's no rush. When Dom feels he's ready they will move him on. To answer your question, though - i should think he'll be fighting at a high level within twelve months. He's had excellent sparring with FUry and CHisora and flourished in these sessions.
Sam is about 10 stone mate.
The reason I ask about Richard Towers is that for a bib boy he appears more althletic than Price, Dallas, Fury, he seems looser and more relaxed, he's the one im most curious about in Britain.
look forward to seeing what sam O'Mailey is all about.
yes i shall ask dom when he's gonna turn pro - he's an exciting kid, no doubt about it. very hard to predict how far a good 19 or 20 yr old will actually go when they get in to the pros, don't you think? some just dont perform and are out the game after ten fights, some who you think have much less talent go on and win titles. i'm not saying sam is gonna be a world champ, just that he is a good prospect with an exciting style
Jon Saxon wrote:
When is Richard Towers stepping up Dan?, I would love to see him fight Fury.
Also what weight is the O'Maison kid?
Re Richie, i'm not quite sure. He had a bit of an enforced period of inactivity at the turn of the year (through no fault of his own) and doesn't have any real amateur experience so i think people are wary about running before they can walk. IF you look at his record, he's been matched with reasonable kids who have boxed other prospects and usually at least matched, if not bettered, the other prospect's performance. Rich is so dedicated and such a good liver that there's no rush. When Dom feels he's ready they will move him on. To answer your question, though - i should think he'll be fighting at a high level within twelve months. He's had excellent sparring with FUry and CHisora and flourished in these sessions.
Sam is about 10 stone mate.
The reason I ask about Richard Towers is that for a bib boy he appears more althletic than Price, Dallas, Fury, he seems looser and more relaxed, he's the one im most curious about in Britain.
look forward to seeing what sam O'Mailey is all about.
Oh, and i agree that richie is a better mover than the other heavyweights coming through. he's very good athletically and dom has done a superb job with him both in terms of his skills and his conditioning. trust me though, his best asset is his fire to succeed, which manifests itself in total dedication to training and complete lack of ego in terms of his willingness to accept advice and guidance from his trainer. Fingers crossed he makes it because you will not meet a friendlier and more humble person.
danfoster wrote:
Re Richie, i'm not quite sure. He had a bit of an enforced period of inactivity at the turn of the year (through no fault of his own) and doesn't have any real amateur experience so i think people are wary about running before they can walk. IF you look at his record, he's been matched with reasonable kids who have boxed other prospects and usually at least matched, if not bettered, the other prospect's performance. Rich is so dedicated and such a good liver that there's no rush. When Dom feels he's ready they will move him on. To answer your question, though - i should think he'll be fighting at a high level within twelve months. He's had excellent sparring with FUry and CHisora and flourished in these sessions.
Sam is about 10 stone mate.
The reason I ask about Richard Towers is that for a bib boy he appears more althletic than Price, Dallas, Fury, he seems looser and more relaxed, he's the one im most curious about in Britain.
look forward to seeing what sam O'Mailey is all about.
Oh, and i agree that richie is a better mover than the other heavyweights coming through. he's very good athletically and dom has done a superb job with him both in terms of his skills and his conditioning. trust me though, his best asset is his fire to succeed, which manifests itself in total dedication to training and complete lack of ego in terms of his willingness to accept advice and guidance from his trainer. Fingers crossed he makes it because you will not meet a friendlier and more humble person.
Seen Sam box a few times tho Quite skillfull what struck me was his strength. Thought he'd have been in ABAS last season as they were a bit wide open. Can see him doing well as a pro, especially with the quality coaching and sparring at Thomas's.
manno wrote: I never said Herol made any 1 box like him, my point was NO ONE from sheffield boxed like him before and if your honest comparing Pete Bennett is poor. As to Brendan takin gloves on sites and gettin fellas to take a dig at him means absolutley nothing- im sure i could take a couple of my 3 bout novice kids on a building site and a strong but uncultured man wouldn't lay a glove on them. Brendan was a very shrewd trainer and while not ev1 adapted to that style quite a few did BUT Herol was the ORIGINAL exponent from Sheffield. Much respect to you PUGILIST-SPECIALIST but our opinions will just have to differ.
Hi Manno
My reference to Brendan on the building sites was to point out to Hurlock that he was doing things that Herol was later famous for. He also labelled him a journeyman - again unfair, he got to no.8 middleweight in UK.
You mentioned your novice kids. From previous comments about seeing Fewky box Kell, I'm guessing your from Glyn's gym?
Also I have never before heard "Pete Bennett" and "poor" in the same sentence. Brendan has always spoken VERY highly of him.
danfoster wrote:The Ingle style of boxing isn't defined by low hands or sticking your chin out. It's defined by excellent footwork, smooth movement and often (but not always) a capacity to box comfortably in both stances. The style is taught by Dominic and John (formerly Brendan) so that you should never drop your hands when in range. Sometimes, exceptional exponents like Naz and Junior are happy to box that way and take that risk but all Ingle trained fighters develop the style in their own way. The low hands style should generally be used when out of range but at a distance close enough that when added to feints, the opponent thinks that he IS in range and consequently throw a shot that will miss, leaving him open to the counter. THis much is pretty obvious, surely?Herol was before my time in terms of attending the gym but i loved watching him when i was growing up. I'm sure that a large amount of his style was unique to him BUT look at what Brendan has done with countless other kids since. Not just the champs and stars - look at what kids like Andrew Facey achieved. Now we've got Lee Duncan and others who may not have Naz's talent but make a good living and never even get a mark on their face because the are exceptionally adept defensive fighters. This, in reality, has nothing to do with Bomber and everything to do with BRendan, Dominic and John and the unique lines and blows training system. Hooky - there are some good kids coming through, as ever, but as has been said above, Barry Awad (aka Kid Galahad) is coming on leaps and bounds and might just have that something special about him to go all the way. I've seen him spar Kell and Junior open many times and trust me, he is not out of his depth whatsoever. He is very skilful defensively, very hard to hit clean (never been over, not even sparring open with outstanding kids), fast and his punch power is really coming through. A natural switch-hitter too and perhaps best of all, cunning as a rat and can really work out an opponent and shut him down.
I think he'll certainly emerge as the best British fighter around 8'10 - 9st and i'd back him to beat most of our top domestic kids right now. But after we all bigged-up Steve Barnes and that went wrong, we're not gonna shout about Barry unless anyone asks! In terms of the Manchester reference above, i understand what Pugilist Specialist means because Barry's slickness would be perfect to counteract the classic 'Manchester Mexican' style.
There's also an exceptionally hard-hitting amateur kid called Sam O'Maison who has plenty to learn but is a serious banger - Richie Towers tells people that Sam once hit him so hard he thought his bladder and bowells were gonna empty themselves!
Dan - if you get chance I'm sure Brendan would have a few choice words to say about this thread and that video! Also ask his views on Pete Bennett. Thanks
It would be an easy interview for any journo. Isn't Ian McNeilly Sheffield-based? Or now's your chance Hooky!
Jon Saxon wrote:The reason I ask about Richard Towers is that for a bib boy he appears more althletic than Price, Dallas, Fury, he seems looser and more relaxed, he's the one im most curious about in Britain.
look forward to seeing what sam O'Mailey is all about.
Just for you Saxo-baby. Sammo (white top) in with Kell Brook a couple of years ago.
Jon Saxon wrote:The reason I ask about Richard Towers is that for a bib boy he appears more althletic than Price, Dallas, Fury, he seems looser and more relaxed, he's the one im most curious about in Britain.
look forward to seeing what sam O'Mailey is all about.
Just for you Saxo-baby. Sammo (white top) in with Kell Brook a couple of years ago.
manno wrote: I never said Herol made any 1 box like him, my point was NO ONE from sheffield boxed like him before and if your honest comparing Pete Bennett is poor. As to Brendan takin gloves on sites and gettin fellas to take a dig at him means absolutley nothing- im sure i could take a couple of my 3 bout novice kids on a building site and a strong but uncultured man wouldn't lay a glove on them. Brendan was a very shrewd trainer and while not ev1 adapted to that style quite a few did BUT Herol was the ORIGINAL exponent from Sheffield. Much respect to you PUGILIST-SPECIALIST but our opinions will just have to differ.
Hi Manno
My reference to Brendan on the building sites was to point out to Hurlock that he was doing things that Herol was later famous for. He also labelled him a journeyman - again unfair, he got to no.8 middleweight in UK.
You mentioned your novice kids. From previous comments about seeing Fewky box Kell, I'm guessing your from Glyn's gym?
Also I have never before heard "Pete Bennett" and "poor" in the same sentence. Brendan has always spoken VERY highly of him.
The comparison was poor- not the fighters.I was at Glyns for a while but have been around prior and latterly to my time there. I think Pete got to the junior aba final the same year as Walt Clayton didn't he? Only saw him train, never box but the guys in the gym with him at the same time did indeed rave about him.
Pugilist-specialist wrote:Yeah that's settled it. Herol taught himself that "black style" and then takes the credit for teaching it to a young Arab kid.
How many kids has he passed it on to since he left Brendan's gym?
It's all gone quiet mate........
Any other Ingle fighters we should be looking out for guys? Who are the youngsters coming through?
Hi Hooky. Keep your eye on Kid Galahad. He may break the heart of some (Manchester) super-bantams!
it never fails to amaze me the amount of sympathy herol graham gets. i know he was really talented and that, but he had 3 opportunities to win a world title and came up short each time. thats 3 more chances than most fighters get (at least it was when he was fighting)
manno wrote: I never said Herol made any 1 box like him, my point was NO ONE from sheffield boxed like him before and if your honest comparing Pete Bennett is poor. As to Brendan takin gloves on sites and gettin fellas to take a dig at him means absolutley nothing- im sure i could take a couple of my 3 bout novice kids on a building site and a strong but uncultured man wouldn't lay a glove on them. Brendan was a very shrewd trainer and while not ev1 adapted to that style quite a few did BUT Herol was the ORIGINAL exponent from Sheffield. Much respect to you PUGILIST-SPECIALIST but our opinions will just have to differ.
Hi Manno
My reference to Brendan on the building sites was to point out to Hurlock that he was doing things that Herol was later famous for. He also labelled him a journeyman - again unfair, he got to no.8 middleweight in UK.
You mentioned your novice kids. From previous comments about seeing Fewky box Kell, I'm guessing your from Glyn's gym?
Also I have never before heard "Pete Bennett" and "poor" in the same sentence. Brendan has always spoken VERY highly of him.
The comparison was poor- not the fighters.I was at Glyns for a while but have been around prior and latterly to my time there. I think Pete got to the junior aba final the same year as Walt Clayton didn't he? Only saw him train, never box but the guys in the gym with him at the same time did indeed rave about him.
Same as you regarding Pete Bennett, manno - I never saw Clayton.
Somebody who's opinion I really respect once told me of the young Bennett : " he was better than Herol".
stevieb_8006 wrote:it never fails to amaze me the amount of sympathy herol graham gets. i know he was really talented and that, but he had 3 opportunities to win a world title and came up short each time. thats 3 more chances than most fighters get (at least it was when he was fighting)
Yeah know what your sayin stevie, probably 3 attempts was a good quota considering his longevity in top class- would say his fight with mike mac was probably the closest he came. What do you think PUG-SPEC? By the way im something of a paradox when it comes to Bomber- while acknowledging his craft and sublime skill i was more turned on to the violence of Kaylor,Christie,Sibson,Gumbs and co. Now all these years later im singing his praises to all and sundry!!!
Pugilist-specialist wrote:
Hi Manno
My reference to Brendan on the building sites was to point out to Hurlock that he was doing things that Herol was later famous for. He also labelled him a journeyman - again unfair, he got to no.8 middleweight in UK.
You mentioned your novice kids. From previous comments about seeing Fewky box Kell, I'm guessing your from Glyn's gym?
Also I have never before heard "Pete Bennett" and "poor" in the same sentence. Brendan has always spoken VERY highly of him.
The comparison was poor- not the fighters.I was at Glyns for a while but have been around prior and latterly to my time there. I think Pete got to the junior aba final the same year as Walt Clayton didn't he? Only saw him train, never box but the guys in the gym with him at the same time did indeed rave about him.
Same as you regarding Pete Bennett, manno - I never saw Clayton.
Somebody who's opinion I really respect once told me of the young Bennett : " he was better than Herol".
Wish i had the pleasure of watchin some of the guys Brendan trained who never even 'made it'. If the walls of Thomas' could tell a story eh PUG-SPEC?
Jon Saxon wrote:The reason I ask about Richard Towers is that for a bib boy he appears more althletic than Price, Dallas, Fury, he seems looser and more relaxed, he's the one im most curious about in Britain.
look forward to seeing what sam O'Mailey is all about.
Just for you Saxo-baby. Sammo (white top) in with Kell Brook a couple of years ago.
I've seen him fight several times now and i've been impressed by his development. The Ingle's have always run an excellent gym IMO and have some unique and innovative training methods. Body sparring is a very good method for avoiding unnecessary injury in training and also for 'clocking up' unnecessary punishment mileage on a fighter. Anyone who thinks sparring is the primary tool for learning to move the head clearly doesn't know the sport!
danfoster wrote:The Ingle style of boxing isn't defined by low hands or sticking your chin out. It's defined by excellent footwork, smooth movement and often (but not always) a capacity to box comfortably in both stances.
The style is taught by Dominic and John (formerly Brendan) so that you should never drop your hands when in range. Sometimes, exceptional exponents like Naz and Junior are happy to box that way and take that risk but all Ingle trained fighters develop the style in their own way. The low hands style should generally be used when out of range but at a distance close enough that when added to feints, the opponent thinks that he IS in range and consequently throw a shot that will miss, leaving him open to the counter. THis much is pretty obvious, surely?
Herol was before my time in terms of attending the gym but i loved watching him when i was growing up. I'm sure that a large amount of his style was unique to him BUT look at what Brendan has done with countless other kids since. Not just the champs and stars - look at what kids like Andrew Facey achieved. Now we've got Lee Duncan and others who may not have Naz's talent but make a good living and never even get a mark on their face because the are exceptionally adept defensive fighters. This, in reality, has nothing to do with Bomber and everything to do with BRendan, Dominic and John and the unique lines and blows training system.
Hooky - there are some good kids coming through, as ever, but as has been said above, Barry Awad (aka Kid Galahad) is coming on leaps and bounds and might just have that something special about him to go all the way. I've seen him spar Kell and Junior open many times and trust me, he is not out of his depth whatsoever. He is very skilful defensively, very hard to hit clean (never been over, not even sparring open with outstanding kids), fast and his punch power is really coming through. A natural switch-hitter too and perhaps best of all, cunning as a rat and can really work out an opponent and shut him down.
I think he'll certainly emerge as the best British fighter around 8'10 - 9st and i'd back him to beat most of our top domestic kids right now. But after we all bigged-up Steve Barnes and that went wrong, we're not gonna shout about Barry unless anyone asks! In terms of the Manchester reference above, i understand what Pugilist Specialist means because Barry's slickness would be perfect to counteract the classic 'Manchester Mexican' style.
There's also an exceptionally hard-hitting amateur kid called Sam O'Maison who has plenty to learn but is a serious banger - Richie Towers tells people that Sam once hit him so hard he thought his bladder and bowells were gonna empty themselves!
Good to see Kid Galahad progressing and an exciting debut from Sam O'Maison last night.
Brendan is a rare thing. A legend in his own life time. His style has been there for decades; before, during and after the Herol era, but its more than just the style, its the effort that he has put in and the support that he gives to people. Outside the multiple champions that he has produced there are also the trainers, Glyn Rhodes, David Coldwell, Chris Smedley who have gone on to do very well in these roles and beyond, and his own children Dominic and John, who continue to produce champions from that gym!!
manno wrote: Not wrong on all counts at all- i feel your splitting hairs, While an 'elusive reflex southpaw' Bomber also stepped in with his shots when the mood took him vs Rodney,price,Kalule etc. The point im making sexy southpaw, as you seem to know your sheffield boxing history so well is how many fighters who Brendan trained B4 bomber even had a slight look of him- Pete Bennett?,Walt Clayton?,Chris Walker?,Mick Mills?Winston Ho-shing? Herol developed it and Brendan tweaked it with different fighters, like you said Nelson, Rhodes, Naz were not Herol clones but they boxed more like him than they did Mick MILLS.!!
Pete Bennett was quite fluid and a good mover.
Jon Keeton boxed more like Mick Mills than Herol Graham.
Slugger O'Toole was quite orthodox.
Brendan trained all these fighters but they developed styles to suit them.
The top Cuban boxers often box in a style similar to that referred to as the "Ingle style" - has Herol influenced them?
The footwork lines in the Ingle gym are patented - did Herol help design those?
To suggest that Herol came up with the "Ingle style" is disingenuous to Brendan.
Think a few people are missing my point,Brendan was/is a superb trainer and can teach fighters to box to their strengths superbly, you quoted a couple of great examples in Keeton and Castro but the fact remains that NO ONE before Herol came to Brendans boxed remotely like him. Pete was indeed a smooth boxer but on a different planet style wise to Herol. After Herol you could see more than a few similarities with the schoolboys right thru to the pros. Oh and PUG-SPEC, you know fine well the lines are Ingles own design but once again you miss my point-when most boxing fans are asked to explain the ingle style what do you think they'll say? hands down,hard to hit,great tho sometimes unorthodox footwork,punches hard with either hand comin forward or on the backfoot,punching from terrific angles,great athletisim -would they be talking about Herol or Brendans most famous student Naz?
Actually the Ingles had a young fighter called Nicky Daley very flash and could switch won everything as a Junior Very similar to Graham.
This argument could go on forever,Herol Graham was a flawed genious as a fighter but as a trainer forget it.
The Ingle Gym has been riding high for years and has produced all the best fighters out of Sheffield through innovation discipline of their fighters and dedication to the sport.Herol Graham had his day in the sun.Why hasn't he managed to produce one single fighter let alone a Champion in the last 20 years with his training method based on his style,simple,you can't teach what you don't know or don't understand.Herol doesn't end of !
The comparison was poor- not the fighters.I was at Glyns for a while but have been around prior and latterly to my time there. I think Pete got to the junior aba final the same year as Walt Clayton didn't he? Only saw him train, never box but the guys in the gym with him at the same time did indeed rave about him. 
