Ike Ibeabuchi VS Vitali Klitschko

[SaadOffTheDeck]

At 39 he didn't look great vs a guy (Johnson) there just trying to survive for 12 rounds . . come on that's not a huge black mark on any career.

What in the world are you talking about? Who said anything about a black mark? It was just a revelation to me that he couldn't do anything with a guy who wasn't punching, holding or running. Your assumptions off of posts are simply astounding.

He has qualities that would trouble many fighters. But he hasn't beaten anyone of note. His resume is slightly better than Rahman's. Irene is absolutely correct that he is massively overrated, but I think he would beat Ibeabuchi.

[Ezzard]

Vitali has durability, work-rate and dedication. That can take you a long way in boxing. And it makes him a hard man to beat.

People lionize fat HWs from the 1980s who had no commitment to the sport.

[keithmoonhangover]

Vitali has durability, work-rate and dedication. That can take you a long way in boxing. And it makes him a hard man to beat.

[jezzamundo]

I think Klitschko wins this one fairly handily, either a wide points decision or a late stoppage with Ibeabuchi still on his feet. Ike would give Vitali a better fight that anyone since Lewis, though, and pressure him throughout the fight and probably take 2-4 of the early-mid rounds.

I think Vitali's record is severely lacking compared to the heavyweight greats, lacking any wins over impressive opponents. This said, I think he is better than Wlad and would beat him in a fight. Wlad is certainly the more gifted, with greater punching power, but what Vitali lacks in technical skills, he makes up for with his sturdier chin, ring smarts and willingness to engage. His combination of size and skills would be a handful for any heavyweight throughout history.

[Ezzard]

To me the K brothers have lived through a weak era but in that era they have fought everyone except one another (I don't blame them for that).

I am far more critical of people like Jones, Calzaghe, Mayweather who have not fought the best oppoents out there.

[gilgamesh]

This post is proof that some guys just hate on a fighter for the sake of hating on him. Vitali was ahead 4 rounds to 2 over Lennox prior to the cut, and no that's not what makes his career. That is simply what redeemed him from being referred to as Quit-schko after the shoulder injury in the Byrd fight. Vitali's career since that fight has left no doubt that, though he may look awkward as hell, though he may not look like the world's slickest or most technical boxer. He has a style that simply works for him, the fact is he's not easy to hit, he lands his shots fairly frequently, he almost always knocks out opponents. After 4 years away from the sport he comes back and runs through a current WBC titleholder like a hot knife through butter, he's defeated an aggressive come-forward slugger in Chris Arreola, and yes Arreola is a fat out of shape guy, but you can't deny he comes to fight. Vitali shut him down just like he does everyone else. Kevin Johnson stayed in a shell all night, how are you supposed to knock a guy out who's only focus is to stay on his feet? He virtually never attacked Klitschko and therefore never gave any openings for him to take advantage of, Vitali did all a fighter can do in that situation and won a shutout decision. Pacquiao did the same with Clottey, Nonito just did the same with Narvaez. I don't see the difference. Although I'm sure you guys are gonna come up with one. And no Jimmy Young most definitely would not have beaten Vitali Klitschko. He may have lasted the distance, but he'd have lost a wide decision, just like all of Vitali's other recent foes.

[Goodnight, Irene]

Ooooh, he, "ran through a WBC titleist like a hot knife through butter," did he? Thats the PR spin --- heres the reality --- he beat Sam fvcking Peter. Well, sh!t me, when you add that to winning half a fight with an out-of-shape Lewis, and beating up CHRIS ARREOLA, its hard to deny the man.

"Top of The Garbage Heap" - Vitalis future autobio title?

[LeedsLad]

Arreola was well beaten by Adamek - who at HW is little more than a basic boxer that relies on his legs ( at 35) for defence and outworking opponents.

In the 1990's Adamek wouldn't even think about fighting at HW, he'd probably be challenging for world honours in the then 190lb cruiser division.

There's a difference between flat out hating on Vitali, by calling him Quitschko and such, and telling it how it is - his resume is very mediocre, plenty of fighters have produced their best performances in defeats, Tommy Hearns vs Leonard is a possible here - but they either defeated lots of top quality fighters or they aren't rated particularly highly as a result.

Who are his best wins?

Peter
Williams
Arreola
Solis
Hide

Not exactly a murderer's row, is it?

The shout on his slate being comparable to Rahman is pretty good. Aside from the Lewis win they're about even. Rahman actually winning puts him above, even if the result was emphatically reversed in the rematch.

[gilgamesh]

I know some guys are never gonna give him credit, but the fact is his style works for him. It's been proven effective time and time again, if only for his size and his ability to make awkward moves he'd be a tough opponent for several All Time Great Heavyweights, whether or not he'd beat them is another debate entirely, but to say he'd get man-handled by Jimmy Young is just ludicrous. When I look back at all the All time Heavyweights, I don't see anybody who's just gonna walk over him. To place him at the level you guys place him at is simply not living in reality.

[LeedsLad]

There's no question that his style works for him, he's got over 40 professional wins at a high KO % and has accumulated several title defences across multiple reigns as champion.

But - the level of opposition beaten simply doesn't allow for such a statement to be made IMO.

I think Riddick Bowe would relish a fight with Vitali, as would Golota until he realised that the opponent wasn't going to just fall over.... he'd foul himself out or just quit.

[gilgamesh]

Riddick Bowe basically only fought ONE big name opponent, Holyfield. Going 2 out of 3 against him, but he'd relish a fight with Klitschko and I guess he'd eat him alive huh? Come on guys, get real

[Emil]

Vitali by dominant dec. possibly wide.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

I know some guys are never gonna give him credit, but the fact is his style works for him. It's been proven effective time and time again, if only for his size and his ability to make awkward moves he'd be a tough opponent for several All Time Great Heavyweights, whether or not he'd beat them is another debate entirely, but to say he'd get man-handled by Jimmy Young is just ludicrous. When I look back at all the All time Heavyweights, I don't see anybody who's just gonna walk over him. To place him at the level you guys place him at is simply not living in reality.

Jimmy Young was an excellent fighter, if Vitali couldn't hit Johnson he wouldn't be able to hit Young and Jimmy would counter him. Manhandle is a word I did not use. I doubt Vitali wins four rounds.

I think he is a top 40 Heavy that would beat several guys rated above him. If that isn't realistic, then you're the one that isn't living in reality. I like fighters to actually earn their placement, I don't give it away because of what I think might happen. You're rating off of your opinions, I'm rating off of results.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Riddick Bowe basically only fought ONE big name opponent, Holyfield. Going 2 out of 3 against him, but he'd relish a fight with Klitschko and I guess he'd eat him alive huh? Come on guys, get real

Riddick Bowe actually beat a big name opponent. LOL that you're picking on his resume while you champion a guy who has beaten not a single fighter of note. Yeah, everyone else is biased.

[LeedsLad]

Riddick Bowe basically only fought ONE big name opponent, Holyfield. Going 2 out of 3 against him, but he'd relish a fight with Klitschko and I guess he'd eat him alive huh? Come on guys, get real

Bowe would eat him alive, yes.

Riddick had everything necessary to beat Vitali. He'd land the jab regularly, meaning Vitali wouldn't be able to get off as often as he'd like, and he was by far the superior inside fighter.

We saw how Lewis took him into the trenches from rounds 3/4 onwards, from then on the fight changed. Sure Vitali might well have still been ahead, but Lewis was winning the fight. Every round Vitali won, he was being worn down with it.

Bowe was a fair bit better than Lewis when it comes to taking a fight into the trenches, whereas Lennox was the guy more likely to either look to bomb a guy out or box cautiously and have a look.

Klitschko isn't heavy handed enough to get Bowe's respect, which is obviously key in this matchup.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Riddick Bowe basically only fought ONE big name opponent, Holyfield. Going 2 out of 3 against him, but he'd relish a fight with Klitschko and I guess he'd eat him alive huh? Come on guys, get real

Bowe would eat him alive, yes.

Riddick had everything necessary to beat Vitali. He'd land the jab regularly, meaning Vitali wouldn't be able to get off as often as he'd like, and he was by far the superior inside fighter.

We saw how Lewis took him into the trenches from rounds 3/4 onwards, from then on the fight changed. Sure Vitali might well have still been ahead, but Lewis was winning the fight. Every round Vitali won, he was being worn down with it.

Bowe was a fair bit better than Lewis when it comes to taking a fight into the trenches, whereas Lennox was the guy more likely to either look to bomb a guy out or box cautiously and have a look.

Klitschko isn't heavy handed enough to get Bowe's respect, which is obviously key in this matchup.

Nice post, I totally agree.

[LeedsLad]

Cheers

It's a shame this section isn't busier, I've learned a fair bit during my spell posting on here more regularly.

On ESB's classic it seems like people go for the older fighter by default all the time, listening to people trying to mount a case for Jack Dempsey beating Lennox Lewis is painstaking.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Cheers

It's a shame this section isn't busier, I've learned a fair bit during my spell posting on here more regularly.

On ESB's classic it seems like people go for the older fighter by default all the time, listening to people trying to mount a case for Jack Dempsey beating Lennox Lewis is painstaking.

Jack was pretty quick, he would have a punchers chance. But me feelings on how overrated dempsey is are quite maligned in this forum.

[crusader]

Cheers

It's a shame this section isn't busier, I've learned a fair bit during my spell posting on here more regularly.

On ESB's classic it seems like people go for the older fighter by default all the time, listening to people trying to mount a case for Jack Dempsey beating Lennox Lewis is painstaking.

Probably not much different over here.

http://boxrec.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f ... 135&hilit=

http://boxrec.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f ... 811&hilit=

[keithmoonhangover]

Riddick Bowe basically only fought ONE big name opponent, Holyfield. Going 2 out of 3 against him, but he'd relish a fight with Klitschko and I guess he'd eat him alive huh? Come on guys, get real

Bowe would eat him alive, yes.

Riddick had everything necessary to beat Vitali. He'd land the jab regularly, meaning Vitali wouldn't be able to get off as often as he'd like, and he was by far the superior inside fighter.

We saw how Lewis took him into the trenches from rounds 3/4 onwards, from then on the fight changed. Sure Vitali might well have still been ahead, but Lewis was winning the fight. Every round Vitali won, he was being worn down with it.

Bowe was a fair bit better than Lewis when it comes to taking a fight into the trenches, whereas Lennox was the guy more likely to either look to bomb a guy out or box cautiously and have a look.

Klitschko isn't heavy handed enough to get Bowe's respect, which is obviously key in this matchup.

Good post, but I think Vitali beats Bowe.

[BoxBuzz]

I would think Bowe would have the advantage over either K.

[dempseyfire]

My first thought about Bowe-Vitali is that Vitali outboxes him, but then I think the Lewis that Vitali fought wasn't any better than a peak Bowe, and I change my mind. Bowe by stoppage.

[gilgamesh]

I wasn't picking at Riddick Bowe's record, I was just pointing out that it's really no more impressive than Vitali's. Is Evander Holyfield a better opponent than anyone Vitali ever beat? Absolutely he is, no argument there. But still, Vitali's far superior conditioning and discipline, and also his longer stay at the top of the Heavyweight division at the very least matches Bowe's accomplishments in my opinion. I know you guys aren't going to agree, and I'm done trying to prove my point. We can just agree to disagree and I'll argue with you guys later on a different issue I'm sure.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Being more dedicated to condition and thumping inferior competition is better than arguably beating one of histories greatest fighters three times? We just have a different method of evaluating careers. I can't see any scenario where Vitali rates over Bowe. And Riddick doesn't rate that high for me.

[Goodnight, Irene]

I did score that second Bowe-Holyfield bout marginally for Bowe.