Changing of the guard UK.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 08 Aug 2005, 18:21

Everyone has talked about a changing of the guard on the world scene with Jones, Hopkins, Tszyu, Trinidad, Moseley and DLH all suffering recent defeats.

There seems to be a slight change of the guard on the UK scene - many of the mainstayers of the P4P lists seem to be losing. Some of them have been recent.

Lennox Lewis - retired
Howard Eastman - two successive defeats
Robin Reid - Heavy loss, first stoppage loss
Wayne McCullough - First stoppage loss
Michael Gomez - Heavy loss last time
Michael Brodie - 3 succesive defeats, retirement.
Jawid Khaliq - so inactive looks like retirment.
Richard Williams - defeat and inactivity
Danny Williams - career doubt following Skelton pull out.

There are some who also appear to be on borrowed time like Nelson, Thompson in the late 30's/early 40's and Kelly who seems to be struggling to get the big fights. We have Clinton Woods and Joe Calzaghe in their 30's also. Junior Witter is relatively new to P4P lists but he is in his 30's now and dissapointed last time.

Scott Harrison and Ricky Hatton are two fighters who have been high in UK P4P terms for a while and look like it will stay that way for a bit.

So we have more and more P4P lists who encorporate fighters such as Cook, Arthur, Pickering, and several other fighters who are young a look impressive at Domestic/European level.

My question is - how long do you think the "new" guard of UK P4P claimants will last. Do you think the likes of Pickering, Arthur, Cook will lose (again in some cases) before it is age that beats them. Or do you think their careers will be more successful, for a longer period, than those guys they are replacing.

tonyevs · Post by **tonyevs** » 08 Aug 2005, 18:32

Pickering, Cook and Arthur seem to be European level at best.

There just seems too many real good fighters about at their weight to let them in, unless your talking WBU...IBO etc

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 08 Aug 2005, 18:46

tonyevs wrote:Pickering, Cook and Arthur seem to be European level at best.

There just seems too many real good fighters about at their weight to let them in, unless your talking WBU...IBO etc

I'd agree on Pickering, definately not on Cook and I think Arthur (with luck) could win a geniune world title.

If Cook vs Harrison happend now, I'd been down the bookies putting a fair amount on Cook. Not saying Cook could end up being the best Featherweight in the world - but I think can beat Harrison.

Manuel Medina looks set to be fighting for the IBF Super Featherweight title - if he wins, I would put Arthur in with him immediately - he will beat Medina.

No he won't beat Barrera but I cannot see either Barrera or Morales sticking at Super Feather for much longer, so another avenue (as far as belt) might arise for Alex.

tonyevs · Post by **tonyevs** » 08 Aug 2005, 18:54

I`d like you to be proved correct, Arthur is one of my favourites

It all depends on what title we`re talking though, maybe the WBO and now IBF look do-able, but the big two will have trickier mandatory`s and an army of South Americans eager to fight for them.

josh fg · Post by **josh fg** » 08 Aug 2005, 19:01

I would add Carl Froch to that mix he is relatively young. I also think david haye could perform on the european level.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 08 Aug 2005, 19:03

josh fg wrote:I would add Carl Froch to that mix he is relatively young. I also think david haye could perform on the european level.

The former is certainly a good shout.

Coconut · Post by **Coconut** » 09 Aug 2005, 03:37

I also think Scott Dann has the ability to do something on the European stage.

There's that young lad from Bolton as well, he looks quite handy given a few years.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 09 Aug 2005, 06:08

stujones wrote:Everyone has talked about a changing of the guard on the world scene with Jones, Hopkins, Tszyu, Trinidad, Moseley and DLH all suffering recent defeats.

There seems to be a slight change of the guard on the UK scene - many of the mainstayers of the P4P lists seem to be losing. Some of them have been recent.

Lennox Lewis - retired
Howard Eastman - two successive defeats
Robin Reid - Heavy loss, first stoppage loss
Wayne McCullough - First stoppage loss
Michael Gomez - Heavy loss last time
Michael Brodie - 3 succesive defeats, retirement.
Jawid Khaliq - so inactive looks like retirment.
Richard Williams - defeat and inactivity
Danny Williams - career doubt following Skelton pull out.

There are some who also appear to be on borrowed time like Nelson, Thompson in the late 30's/early 40's and Kelly who seems to be struggling to get the big fights. We have Clinton Woods and Joe Calzaghe in their 30's also. Junior Witter is relatively new to P4P lists but he is in his 30's now and dissapointed last time.

Scott Harrison and Ricky Hatton are two fighters who have been high in UK P4P terms for a while and look like it will stay that way for a bit.

So we have more and more P4P lists who encorporate fighters such as Cook, Arthur, Pickering, and several other fighters who are young a look impressive at Domestic/European level.

My question is - how long do you think the "new" guard of UK P4P claimants will last. Do you think the likes of Pickering, Arthur, Cook will lose (again in some cases) before it is age that beats them. Or do you think their careers will be more successful, for a longer period, than those guys they are replacing.

Funny, I was just thinking the same thing myself, case of 'Say hello, wave goodbye.'

There's some young talent coming through like Murray, but it's unproven and some way off yet. There's also the other guys you mentioned who have all lost, but may turn out better fighters for it.

Bard of Boxrec · Post by **Bard of Boxrec** » 09 Aug 2005, 06:09

The next 10 years will be all about Khan.

I don't care if we have no other world contenders in that span- I think Khan will make up for it all.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 09 Aug 2005, 06:14

What only one fighter of world class from our shores, that would be a disaster....

In the era when Lewis was around, we had Naz, Benn, Eubank, Calzaghe early on, Watson, Collins, Thompson, Nelson, Damaen Kelly, McCulloch etc.

You think it would be ok to just have Khan?

J · Post by J » 09 Aug 2005, 06:20

khan, mitchell, dann, haye, froch, hatton, witter, calzaghe, cook, jennings, doherty, enzo, woods, arthur, harrison (both of em).

fornicate me, cheer up

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 09 Aug 2005, 06:22

Its not all bad, at least we can look forward to 2019 when a 48 year old Robin Reid - the king of sour grapes fights for the Cruiserweight title and moaning he was robbed despite being knocked clean out in 30 seconds.

Some things are worth the wait!

J · Post by J » 09 Aug 2005, 06:23

and i didnt even mention hatton

Bard of Boxrec · Post by **Bard of Boxrec** » 09 Aug 2005, 06:31

jamesmcdonnell wrote:What only one fighter of world class from our shores, that would be a disaster....

In the era when Lewis was around, we had Naz, Benn, Eubank, Calzaghe early on, Watson, Collins, Thompson, Nelson, Damaen Kelly, McCulloch etc.

You think it would be ok to just have Khan?

Well, maybe I didn't mean it quite like that, but along the lines of, if Khan can fulfil his capabilities ,be a legend winning titles, unifying and stepping up and doing the same & being top p4p (not to be premature or anything

) then the prospect of an all time great would eclipse any other fighter we had and make them irrelevant. Obviously thats such a mammoth accomplishment it's a huge 'if' but if anyone's capable of being a future #1 p4p it's him.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 09 Aug 2005, 06:36

J wrote:khan, mitchell, dann, haye, froch, hatton, witter, calzaghe, cook, jennings, doherty, enzo, woods, arthur, harrison (both of em).

fornicate me, cheer up

I was making the point that to have only one world class fighter would be a disaster....it's never ever been that bad in this country.

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 09 Aug 2005, 06:42

Things can only improve from here lets be honest. I think the last 5 years or so have been pretty poor in terms of the fights and shows we have been getting on Sky on the whole. Now it seems meaningful matches are the only way forward then I think we'll see a marked improvement in fighters who can kick on to european and world level. While we have a few at the moment, there dont seem to be as many world level fighters as we may have had in the past. This is kind of a transition period though I think as things are definitely looking up and we're not going to be getting a full bill of fighters scheduled against TBA anymore. That was never good for anyone, especially the fighters themselves.

J · Post by J » 09 Aug 2005, 08:06

jamesmcdonnell wrote:
J wrote:khan, mitchell, dann, haye, froch, hatton, witter, calzaghe, cook, jennings, doherty, enzo, woods, arthur, harrison (both of em).

fornicate me, cheer up
I was making the point that to have only one world class fighter would be a disaster....it's never ever been that bad in this country.

and i was making the point that it wont happen.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 09 Aug 2005, 08:15

I never said it would happen, I was pointing out that Riddick said he would happy with Khan being the only world class fighter, and I was saying that wasn't really acceptable....

Come on....

Kilburn · Post by **Kilburn** » 09 Aug 2005, 08:22

J wrote:harrison (both of em)

That's right, Scott and John.

8)

J · Post by J » 09 Aug 2005, 08:24

jamesmcdonnell wrote:I never said it would happen, I was pointing out that Riddick said he would happy with Khan being the only world class fighter, and I was saying that wasn't really acceptable....

Come on....

clever c***

J · Post by J » 09 Aug 2005, 08:24

Kilburn wrote:
J wrote:harrison (both of em)
That's right, Scott and John.

8)

see above post

Changing of the guard UK.

Changing of the guard UK.

Re: Changing of the guard UK.