Ray Mercer vs. Rocky Marciano

[Alan Partridge]

Mr Marciano would feast off Mercer, yes really make a meal of him. Mercers's jab is the only thing that gives Rocky any trouble. Although I can see Rocky walking through it... Until BANG! The right hook lands on Ray's temple and he's out!
Rocky was a terror for doing this late in gruelling contests.

[yancey]

I like Rocky but this seems like a very tough nite for him. If Mercer is in shape his jab, size n chin may be just to much for Rocky. The Rock could also be just to much of a bull and score late round ko

Summed up real well.

This is indeed a tough fight for Rocky, unless you be swigging down the Kool-Aid.

[Goodnight, Irene]

I like Rocky but this seems like a very tough nite for him. If Mercer is in shape his jab, size n chin may be just to much for Rocky. The Rock could also be just to much of a bull and score late round ko

Summed up real well.

This is indeed a tough fight for Rocky, unless you be swigging down the Kool-Aid.

Would it be a tough night for Frazier?

[raylawpc]

I like Rocky but this seems like a very tough nite for him. If Mercer is in shape his jab, size n chin may be just to much for Rocky. The Rock could also be just to much of a bull and score late round ko

Summed up real well.

This is indeed a tough fight for Rocky, unless you be swigging down the Kool-Aid.

Would it be a tough night for Frazier?

[Goodnight, Irene]

I wasnt being facetious, I was asking sincerely.

[raylawpc]

Given our friend Yancey's track record viz-a-viz Marciano and Frazier, I thought it was funny . . .

[yancey]

I like Rocky but this seems like a very tough nite for him. If Mercer is in shape his jab, size n chin may be just to much for Rocky. The Rock could also be just to much of a bull and score late round ko

Summed up real well.

This is indeed a tough fight for Rocky, unless you be swigging down the Kool-Aid.

Would it be a tough night for Frazier?

GI,

I'm guessing a Mercer fight could have some tough moments for Frazier, but....

I do think the odds are pretty strong that Frazier does prevail.

Also, please disregard raylawpc's delusional notion that any remark I post that is less than gushing admiration for Marciano is actually a grand conspiracy to boost Frazier by lessening Marciano.

Am I not allowed to have a sincere viewpoint of Marciano?

I sincerely feel he is somewhat overrated and came along in a fairly weak era. I would not have him in the top 15, for instance, but I do respect what he accomplished in the ring.

In rawlawpc's delusional world, this means I hate the guy.

Please seek help, rawlawpc. You can turn it around.

[Goodnight, Irene]

I do agree Marciano arrived in a weakened era, but over-rated? I can't agree with that. Marciano is probably the most consistently savaged (arguable) all-time great in HW history.

The days of Marciano being over-rated are long, long gone.

[yancey]

I do agree Marciano arrived in a weakened era, but over-rated? I can't agree with that. Marciano is probably the most consistently savaged (arguable) all-time great in HW history.

The days of Marciano being over-rated are long, long gone.

GI,

About where would you have Rocky in your all-timer list?

Would you list the names you would think likely to beat him h2h?

[raylawpc]

Summed up real well.

This is indeed a tough fight for Rocky, unless you be swigging down the Kool-Aid.

Would it be a tough night for Frazier?

GI,

I'm guessing a Mercer fight could have some tough moments for Frazier, but....

I do think the odds are pretty strong that Frazier does prevail.

Also, please disregard raylawpc's delusional notion that any remark I post that is less than gushing admiration for Marciano is actually a grand conspiracy to boost Frazier by lessening Marciano.

Am I not allowed to have a sincere viewpoint of Marciano?

I sincerely feel he is somewhat overrated and came along in a fairly weak era. I would not have him in the top 15, for instance, but I do respect what he accomplished in the ring.

In rawlawpc's delusional world, this means I hate the guy.

Please seek help, rawlawpc. You can turn it around.

You don't want to wind up avoided by all in the old folk's home, do you?

Do you still have Marciano in your top 20? This Summer, you wrote that he wasn't in your top 5 or top 10 (I can't exactly remember what number you were responding to), but he was definitely in your top 20. Where exactly do you have him? Number 18, number 16? What is your top twenty?

Now in answer to your question: "Am I not allowed to have a sincere viewpoint of Marciano?" Of course you are! And you will notice that I said not a word criticizing your original message that Marciano would have a tough night with Mercer. My response was to Irene. I thought he was trying to be funny given your proclivity to build up Frazier by tearing down Marciano. In the past, I've tried to help you break that dreadful habit, and thought I had succeeded. But maybe not . . .

[dempseyfire]

First off, Mercer was not a very big HW. He was just over 6 ft and had been weighing at 200 lbs in the AMs in his late 20s. Yes as his career progressed the guy got fatter but it's not like he was 230 lbs of muscle.

If perennial losers Mo Wilson and Jesse Ferguson can outhustle Mercer, you can bet your a$$ Marciano will and yes he'd have Mercer close to a knockout at several points within the fight. Over 15 give me Rocky by stoppage.

The lightest Mercer ever weighed as a pro was 210lbs (12th fight), even then he would have been a good 20-25lbs heavier than Marciano. Marciano never fought anyone of Mercers size that could bang, take a punch and were still in their prime. Pretty much everyone Marciano fought was under 200lbs. I know size isn't always the deciding factor but 2-3 stone is a lot to give away.

I think its far from being an easy fight for Marciano

I would put a peak Mercer not far from a past-it 214 lb Joe Louis.
Mercer at anything over 215 was pudgy and in true tip top shape would not be over 210. Not a small man but his size will not be anything Marciano hadn't contended with in both the pros and in sparring. Mercer is not naturally much bigger than Walcott or Layne.

Don't think Marciano would win every second or anything. He probably loses the first 3 out of 4 but once Mercer starts to gas Rocky will be all over him like white on rice and Mercer would simply not be able to keep up the pace and his punches will become slow and lose their snap. Plus Mercer's defense was simply atrocious.

[Goodnight, Irene]

I do agree Marciano arrived in a weakened era, but over-rated? I can't agree with that. Marciano is probably the most consistently savaged (arguable) all-time great in HW history.

The days of Marciano being over-rated are long, long gone.

GI,

About where would you have Rocky in your all-timer list?

Would you list the names you would think likely to beat him h2h?

I'd have him at the tail end of my top-15. My criteria for a list is part achievements, part-head to head.

Ex-champs I like to beat Marciano...

Louis

Ali

Foreman

Dempsey

Jeffries

Tyson

Liston

Holmes

Lewis

Bowe

I think fights with Tunney, Holyfield, Frazier, & a prime Walcott would be touch-&-go, roughly 50-50 affairs.

[yancey]

I do agree Marciano arrived in a weakened era, but over-rated? I can't agree with that. Marciano is probably the most consistently savaged (arguable) all-time great in HW history.

The days of Marciano being over-rated are long, long gone.

GI,

About where would you have Rocky in your all-timer list?

Would you list the names you would think likely to beat him h2h?

I'd have him at the tail end of my top-15. My criteria for a list is part achievements, part-head to head.

Ex-champs I like to beat Marciano...

Louis

Ali

Foreman

Dempsey

Jeffries

Tyson

Liston

Holmes

Lewis

Bowe

I think fights with Tunney, Holyfield, Frazier, & a prime Walcott would be touch-&-go, roughly 50-50 affairs.

Jack Johnson? Prime Ezzard?

I know you were naming the ex-champs, but how would the Rock do against the Klits?

Agree with the other names, though I think Frazier and Holyfield are decidedly better than 50/50.

[Goodnight, Irene]

Prime Charles (at least, his HW prime) is another very close bout. Charles gets WAY too little due as a Heavy, and he'd go stride-for-stride with Marciano if fresher. Like with their contemporary Walcott, it would be winnable for either man.

I considered Johnson & figured him to lose a competitive fight. He never came near to dealing with such a busy fighter, but would still have his successes at times.

Dont consider Vitali to have ever held the real title, but I favour Wlad to beat Marciano, being honest.

[raylawpc]

Prime Charles (at least, his HW prime) is another very close bout. Charles gets WAY too little due as a Heavy, and he'd go stride-for-stride with Marciano if fresher. Like with their contemporary Walcott, it would be winnable for either man.

I considered Johnson & figured him to lose a competitive fight. He never came near to dealing with such a busy fighter, but would still have his successes at times.

Dont consider Vitali to have ever held the real title, but I favour Wlad to beat Marciano, being honest.

Sam Langford, Stan Ketchel, Tommy Burns, Marvin Hart, and Jack Jeffries ain't busy enough for ya?

[Goodnight, Irene]

Green Langford, Middleweight Ketchel, under-sized Burns...Johnson does not impress me the way he does others.

[crusader]

x3

[Goodnight, Irene]

I think he'd give Marciano a good argument, but he's heavily over-rated for mine. Just so many of the guys in that day were, "one-two," punchers who rarely committed to combinations & a lot were over-sized or otherwise-unprepped for Johnson in ways other than pure ability. I have always had the opinion a healthy young Jeffries would have reversed their actual result.

I can't see Johnson being favourite against any of the top 10-12 Heavies of all-time. Some here pick him to beat Foreman