British Top 30 P4P March 2012

[Horse]

1. (1.) Carl Froch
2. (2.) Amir Khan
3. (3.) Ricky Burns
4. (4.) David Haye
5. (5.) Nathan Cleverly
6. (7.) Brian Magee (Irish)
7. (6.) Matthew Macklin
8. (8.) Jamie McDonnell
9. (9.) Kevin Mitchell
10. (10.) Andy Lee (Irish)

11. (11.) Kell Brook
12. (12.) Rendall Munroe
13. (13.) Matthew Hatton
14. (14.) Ola Afolabi
15. (15.) Ryan Rhodes
16. (16.) George Groves
17. (17.) Darren Barker
18. (18.) Paul McCloskey (Irish)
19. (19.) Lee Selby
20. (20.) Martin Murray

21. (26.) Dereck Chisora
22. (21.) Tyson Fury
23. (30.) Scott Quigg
24. (22.) John Murray
25. (23.) Gavin Rees
26. (24.) James DeGale
27. (25.) Ajose Olusegun
28. (27.) Anthony Crolla
29. (28.) Chris Edwards
30. (29.) Tony Bellew

[Horse]

Any comments, criticisms or P4P lists are very welcome.

[NazNaci1]

Cleverly is too high, in my opinion. I'd have him below Magee.

George Groves, who has also fought much better opposition, should be higher. Martin Murray is a bit low and David Haye, as much as I like him, should not really be in there. At least definitely not in the Top 10. Last week apart, he is inactive / retired, for now.

Thanks again for the list mate. Not too much wrong with it, though.

[crusader]

Cleverly is too high, in my opinion. I'd have him below Magee.

George Groves, who has also fought much better opposition, should be higher. Martin Murray is a bit low and David Haye, as much as I like him, should not really be in there. At least definitely not in the Top 10. Last week apart, he is inactive / retired, for now.

Thanks again for the list mate. Not too much wrong with it, though.

Much better opposition than Cleverly?

[NazNaci1]

Cleverly is too high, in my opinion. I'd have him below Magee.

George Groves, who has also fought much better opposition, should be higher. Martin Murray is a bit low and David Haye, as much as I like him, should not really be in there. At least definitely not in the Top 10. Last week apart, he is inactive / retired, for now.

Thanks again for the list mate. Not too much wrong with it, though.

Much better opposition than Cleverly?

Fair enough, maybe not 'much better', however Tony B aside, Murat is ok (and no his dubious draw with Campilo is not something I point to). 'Better' opposition, is probably more accurate.

[clintonmcphilbin]

How can chirosa be above tyson fury when fury beat him and he as lost is last two fights since no matter what belt for he still lost

[crusader]

Cleverly is too high, in my opinion. I'd have him below Magee.

George Groves, who has also fought much better opposition, should be higher. Martin Murray is a bit low and David Haye, as much as I like him, should not really be in there. At least definitely not in the Top 10. Last week apart, he is inactive / retired, for now.

Thanks again for the list mate. Not too much wrong with it, though.

Much better opposition than Cleverly?

Fair enough, maybe not 'much better', however Tony B aside, Murat is ok (and no his dubious draw with Campilo is not something I point to). 'Better' opposition, is probably more accurate.

Why do you think Groves' opposition is better? Best 7 wins:

Clev: Murat, Bellew, Kuziemski, Mohammadi, Brancalion, McIntosh, Fry or Oakey
Groves: Degale, Smith, Anderson, Adamu, Conteras, Samuels, random Ghanaian

On a side note, Anderson is the most overrated fighter on this forum. He's defeated 4 opponents with winning records at the time of combat, and only one of them still has a winning record.

clintonmcphilbin wrote:
How can chirosa be above tyson fury when fury beat him and he as lost is last two fights since no matter what belt for he still lost

1. The result of a head-to-head matchup shouldn't be the only criterion used to determine how fighters are ranked in relative terms. Chisora's performances against Helenius and Klitschko--who entered the ring as top 5/6 and top 1/2 heavyweights respectively ---were arguably more impressive than Fury's win over a 260 pound version of Chisora.

2. Rankings will be more accurate if they're based on what happened in the ring, rather than a look at the cards.

[clintonmcphilbin]

Much better opposition than Cleverly?

Fair enough, maybe not 'much better', however Tony B aside, Murat is ok (and no his dubious draw with Campilo is not something I point to). 'Better' opposition, is probably more accurate.

Why do you think Groves' opposition is better? Best 7 wins:

Clev: Murat, Bellew, Kuziemski, Mohammadi, Brancalion, McIntosh, Fry or Oakey
Groves: Degale, Smith, Anderson, Adamu, Conteras, Samuels, random Ghanaian

On a side note, Anderson is the most overrated fighter on this forum. He's defeated 4 opponents with winning records at the time of combat, and only one of them still has a winning record.

clintonmcphilbin wrote:
How can chirosa be above tyson fury when fury beat him and he as lost is last two fights since no matter what belt for he still lost

1. The result of a head-to-head matchup shouldn't be the only criterion used to determine how fighters are ranked in relative terms. Chisora's performances against Helenius and Klitschko--who entered the ring as top 5/6 and top 1/2 heavyweights respectively ---were arguably more impressive than Fury's win over a 260 pound version of Chisora.

2. Rankings will be more accurate if they're based on what happened in the ring, rather than a look at the cards.

But boxing is results based buiness and futher more chisora lost more badly to fury then he did against the other two so based on that performance fury is higher. In fury last two fights he ko a guy who as been the distance with povetkin and banks also he beat a unbeaten candian champion. Chisora best win in the last year as come against a lithuania journey man.

[Captain Hook]

Unbeaten WBO champ Nathan Cleverly is behind the retired David Haye and Amir Khan - who lost to Peterson - at number 5?

Groves has to be 5-10 after beating Smith and DeGale, surely?

Horse, your list is lame...

[Captain Hook]

Gavin Rees at 25?

Chisora has lost 3 out of his last 4 and is above the unbeaten Fury (who beat him)?

Sigh...

[smoggy7188]

I dont see how Chisora is so high because when you look at his record he only has one decent win on it in Sexton.

[Captain Hook]

I'm really not sure what criteria he is using.

It can't be based purely on results because Cleverly and Fury and Groves would surely be higher?

Horse - is it purely on the performance, even if that person loses?

Chisora, for example

[smcb80]

McCloskey shouldn't be rated higher than Murray, not given recent bouts

[Lenny]

Unbeaten WBO champ Nathan Cleverly is behind the retired David Haye and Amir Khan - who lost to Peterson - at number 5?

I get that, if he gives people a year to think about their retirements, then Nathan hasn't done a thing to be considered better than Haye or Khan. Haye and Khan both lost in world class, Cleverly has yet to go anywhere near that level, WBO belt or not

But yes I'd have Chisora below Fury, Groves above Rhodes and Hatton, Macklin lower, Selby higher than McCloskey

[Horse]

Cleverly is too high, in my opinion. I'd have him below Magee.

Cleverly has beaten beaten his two main domestic rivals Bellew and McIntosh as well as having a world level win against Murat. Magee hasn't fought a domestic opponent in 3 years and I don't think any of his recent wins count as world level. I think that Cleverly currently has the better recent record and deserves to be ahead of Magee.

George Groves, who has also fought much better opposition, should be higher. Martin Murray is a bit low and David Haye, as much as I like him, should not really be in there. At least definitely not in the Top 10. Last week apart, he is inactive / retired, for now.

Cleverly's opposition is better than Groves's. Murray's record before his fight against Sturm wasn't very strong, so I didn't want to enter him too high after his draw with Sturm.

Haye has been inactive for 8 months, so he hasn't been hugely inactive, and I don't think he can be counted as retired when he is trying to arrange a fight with Vitali. I think Haye's record is still good enough to justify his current ranking. If Cleverly had fought someone decent instead of Carpency then I probably would have moved him above Haye.

Thanks again for the list mate. Not too much wrong with it, though.

Thank you.

[jessi]

How can bellew be 30th and cleverly 5th, bellew practically beat him, Hayes retired, surely chisora's last 2 loosing performances count for something, we all know he beat helenius and gave the world number 1 his toughest test since Lewis, I know you put him up 5 places but what does he need to do to move forward another 10, (beat fury) ? I understand it's hard to put together a list but bellew and chisora are top 15 at least

[Captain Hook]

Unbeaten WBO champ Nathan Cleverly is behind the retired David Haye and Amir Khan - who lost to Peterson - at number 5?

I get that, if he gives people a year to think about their retirements, then Nathan hasn't done a thing to be considered better than Haye or Khan. Haye and Khan both lost in world class, Cleverly has yet to go anywhere near that level, WBO belt or not

But yes I'd have Chisora below Fury, Groves above Rhodes and Hatton, Macklin lower, Selby higher than McCloskey

That said, so many boxers come out of retirement I'm surprised Lennox isn't still on there...

[Horse]

How can chirosa be above tyson fury when fury beat him and he as lost is last two fights since no matter what belt for he still lost

Most people think Chisora deserved the win against Helenius who was ranked at about 4th in the world in most people's rankings. Chisora then gave Vitali his hardest fight since Lewis beat him, which has to be considered a positive result for Chisora even though it was a loss.

Chisora has two very good results since his loss to Fury and Fury's results since that fight haven't been as good, so I think it is reasonable for Chisora to overtake Fury even though he has a recent loss to him. If Fury beats Rogan in April then he will overtake Chisora.

[Captain Hook]

Chisora has lost twice since Fury and Fury has not lost since Chisora (or at all) so how can you say his RESULTS are better?

A RESULT is the outcome....

[jessi]

Chisora has lost twice since Fury and Fury has not lost since Chisora (or at all) so how can you say his RESULTS are better?

A RESULT is the outcome....

No, if your not appreciating the performance as opposed to the result then it's not worth looking at this list.

[Captain Hook]

He just said the result was better, a result is the outcome of the fight - win, lose or draw

So how are losses better than victories when it comes to the result?

And yes I will be pedantic because Horse is the most pedantic poster on Boxrec!

[Lenny]

And yes I will be pedantic because Horse is the most pedantic poster on Boxrec!

Why do you say that?

[Captain Hook]

It must just be me then. Will leave you all to it...

Good luck!

[jessi]

He just said the result was better, a result is the outcome of the fight - win, lose or draw

So how are losses better than victories when it comes to the result?

And yes I will be pedantic because Horse is the most pedantic poster on Boxrec!

Ok I understand where your coming from, but if chisora's next fight is fury who wins iyo ?
I know your probably thinking that's irrelevant because they have fought and tyson won, but it's not Irrelevant because this is a p4p list, for example khans knocking on the door for world p4p top ten but Prescott isn't !
Chisora's last two looses have done so much more for him then beating two bums in 30 seconds, no one will ever agree on someone else's p4p list, but that's the beauty if it.

[NazNaci1]

Why do you think Groves' opposition is better? Best 7 wins:

Clev: Murat, Bellew, Kuziemski, Mohammadi, Brancalion, McIntosh, Fry or Oakey
Groves: Degale, Smith, Anderson, Adamu, Conteras, Samuels, random Ghanaian

On a side note, Anderson is the most overrated fighter on this forum. He's defeated 4 opponents with winning records at the time of combat, and only one of them still has a winning record.

Degale, Smith and Anderson are a much better trio. Tony Belleuw is a good fighter and that was a good win against him. Saying Anderson is overrated might be fair comment but what about Murat? Stupidly overrated. Kuziemski? Brancalion, who got KO'd in 1 round by Braehmer? I think it's about perspective and the fact he holds a 'title' that misleads people, somewhat. I am not saying he isn't decent. he is a good fighter but 5th, in my opinion is just too high.