The 3 Amigos....

[Goodnight, Irene]

Id like you to produce the list before I comment further on it.

You are always talking about this list of yours. We should see it.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Everything is a matter of opinion. You got Marquez winning the first fight? is beyond me to absorb and comprehend, but well, What can I do?

If you got dropped 3 times in one fight or in one round, there is no way, no way, that a fighter that got dropped wins the fight after round 2 when both fighters shared rounds all the way throught the 12th....No way...You gotta scored a shutout, or drop the same guy that dropped you 2 or 3 times

Marquez made it competitive in fight #1 and #2, but to me, he got whupped folks. Deal with it. There is no shame losing to Pacman twice. No shame at all. All these fighters will be some day in the Hall of Fame. They are in my hall of fame. It should be in yours also.

Now, you are bringing subjects that are way out of the question of what are we talking here. What Duran-Hearns, or Frazier-Foreman got to do with this topic? The 3 Amigos? We are discussing of who of the 3 was the best, and I said Barrera and with subjective and objective argument. To me, he was the best of the bunch.

My list of the top 100 greatest fighters is SUBJECTIVE, that means, in my own opinion, but trying to be as most OBJECTIVE as possible. It hurt me to exclude guys like Gene Fullmer, Tony Zale, Ismael Laguna, Flash Elorde, James Toney, Rocky Graziano, Harry Wills, Joe Jeannette, Luis Manuel Rodriguez, Antonio Cervantes, etc.

And I was NEVER IMPRESSED, NEVER, with guys like Lennox Lewis, Oscar De La Hoya, Shane Mosley, Marquez nor Morales in my top 100 list in my view. They never impress me.

I just brought up some of your more memorable work. No need to explain yourself, I long ago stopped taking anything you say seriously. I read you for the humor.

Luis Rodriguez is probably your worst omission yet. He might be in my top 50. Lists are subjective, you're just overwhelmed by bias and an addle mind.

Also other guys that hurt me not to include in the top 100: Jem Driscoll, Owen Moran, Ken Buchanan, Harold Johnson, Jack Delaney, Young Corbett III, Jim J. Jeffries, Tommy Burns, Nicolino Locche, Nino Benvenutti, Lloyd Marshall, Cocoa Kid and others that don't come to my mind now.

Now you see why Oscar De La Hoya cannot enter the top 100, Goodnite Irene?

Nobody sees anything, you don't have the guts to post your list.

[elmersalsa]

I just brought up some of your more memorable work. No need to explain yourself, I long ago stopped taking anything you say seriously. I read you for the humor.

Luis Rodriguez is probably your worst omission yet. He might be in my top 50. Lists are subjective, you're just overwhelmed by bias and an addle mind.

Also other guys that hurt me not to include in the top 100: Jem Driscoll, Owen Moran, Ken Buchanan, Harold Johnson, Jack Delaney, Young Corbett III, Jim J. Jeffries, Tommy Burns, Nicolino Locche, Nino Benvenutti, Lloyd Marshall, Cocoa Kid and others that don't come to my mind now.

Now you see why Oscar De La Hoya cannot enter the top 100, Goodnite Irene?

Nobody sees anything, you don't have the guts to post your list.

I will put the list...I don't have it with me right now.

[elmersalsa]

Id like you to produce the list before I comment further on it.

You are always talking about this list of yours. We should see it.

Still, I cannot do nothing to convince you...Everybody got their own mind.

[Goodnight, Irene]

They really should make a movie outta this, an espionage-type thriller, with Government agents from rival nations competing for the acquisition of Elmer's list.

[Goodnight, Irene]

Id like you to produce the list before I comment further on it.

You are always talking about this list of yours. We should see it.

Still, I cannot do nothing to convince you...Everybody got their own mind.

Where is the list? At home?

[elmersalsa]

Id like you to produce the list before I comment further on it.

You are always talking about this list of yours. We should see it.

Still, I cannot do nothing to convince you...Everybody got their own mind.

Where is the list? At home?

I am not at home right now. I am at the library.

[Goodnight, Irene]

Yes, but I was asking about the list's location.

[Borinken25]

Yes, but I was asking about the list's location.

I remember a few years back where he posted his top 10. Here it is:

1. Roberto Duran
2. Roberto Duran
3. Roberto Duran
4. Roberto Duran
5. Hands of Stone Duran
6. Manos De Piedra Duran
7. Roberto Duran
8. Roberto Duran
9. Oscar De La Hoya
10. Felix Trinidad

I think I forgot he also had in his top ten Roberto Duran.

No other fighter belongs top ten but Duran, DLH, and Trinidad

[Borinken25]

I just saw he posted in another thread that Henry Armstrong is number 1. He must have change his mind and dropped Duran to number 2.

[Jaywheel]

Yes, but I was asking about the list's location.

First rule about the list is you do not talk about the list.

Seconde rule...

[SaadOffTheDeck]

They really should make a movie outta this, an espionage-type thriller, with Government agents from rival nations competing for the acquisition of Elmer's list.

We now have about 20 names on the not 100. All of which could easily be in a Top 100, so I'm very interested in seeing the fillers and the explanations. I can't wait to hear how Ike Quartey was greater than Luis Rodriguez.

[Goodnight, Irene]

Anyone know if Elmer is back from the library yet?

[Rover]

dempsey....MAB's actions are the "down side" of an intelligent fighter lol.

They sometimes value being "safe".... and it can have a high price.

Did you see it!?

It was SO blatant, even his biggest cheerleader, Lampley, started to cannibalise him during the telecast. The type of, "effort," a man would not be paid for fifty or sixty years before.

He was fighting a defensive pot-shotting fight because that's what he had to do to win, he simply lacked the reflexes and speed by that second fight to pull it off properly, and he lacked Marquez' expert timing to pull it off despite that. He exposed some of the weaknesses in Pacquiao's attack during that fight that JMM would be able to take full advantage of when they fought the second time.

In the first fight Barrera's training camp burned down and he was recovering from brain surgery, he was in no normal shape at all for somebody like Pacquiao who was streaking like that.

MAB had a rematch clause. He didn't enforce it. That tells me all I need to know about the validity of those excuses.

[thunderfromdownunder]

I feel Barrera gets underrated a bit Nowdays, everybody worships morales for being a warrior (rightly so, too) and everyone loves JMM because everyone hates Pacquiao.
Barrera has been gone for a while now, and younger fans may never have seen him, which may hurt his standing a bit overall.

[Rover]

I feel Barrera gets underrated a bit Nowdays, everybody worships morales for being a warrior (rightly so, too) and everyone loves JMM because everyone hates Pacquiao.
Barrera has been gone for a while now, and younger fans may never have seen him, which may hurt his standing a bit overall.

I remember MAB from when he beat Daniel Jimenez for his first world title as the first fight on the Mucho Machismo PPV.
I'll never forget that night because my mother (not a boxing fan) asked just as the card was about to end, "Wait...when's Mucho Machismo fighting?"

I also remember that night because I was happy that ESPN boxing ended before the PPV began, as Kevin Kelley KO'd Ricardo Rivera in a war.
Anyway, back to MAB, I remember him well.
Absolutely no class, great fighter though he was.

[thunderfromdownunder]

I feel Barrera gets underrated a bit Nowdays, everybody worships morales for being a warrior (rightly so, too) and everyone loves JMM because everyone hates Pacquiao.
Barrera has been gone for a while now, and younger fans may never have seen him, which may hurt his standing a bit overall.

I remember MAB from when he beat Daniel Jimenez for his first world title as the first fight on the Mucho Machismo PPV.
I'll never forget that night because my mother (not a boxing fan) asked just as the card was about to end, "Wait...when's Mucho Machismo fighting?"

I also remember that night because I was happy that ESPN boxing ended before the PPV began, as Kevin Kelley KO'd Ricardo Rivera in a war.
Anyway, back to MAB, I remember him well.
Absolutely no class, great fighter though he was.

Never meet him personally , so can't comment on his class. But I have read people saying on other boards that he is a nasty person.
I couldn't care but, terrific fighter

[Rover]

I'm talking about how he hit McKinney in the press conference, how he threw water at Morales after their first fight, how he butted Pac intentionally when he was getting his ass kicked, how he slammed Hamed into the ring post.
No class.

[Counter-puncher]

I'm talking about how he hit McKinney in the press conference, how he threw water at Morales after their first fight, how he butted Pac intentionally when he was getting his ass kicked, how he slammed Hamed into the ring post.
No class.

Barrera was no angel, but Pac was far from blameless in that fight where headclashes were concerned.

[Rover]

I'm talking about how he hit McKinney in the press conference, how he threw water at Morales after their first fight, how he butted Pac intentionally when he was getting his ass kicked, how he slammed Hamed into the ring post.
No class.

Barrera was no angel, but Pac was far from blameless in that fight where headclashes were concerned.

I'm talking about one specific one where a point was deducted. I understand that butts happen as part of the sport--accidental butts, that is. This one wasn't. Obviously it had no impact on the fight, but it's just one of many examples where Barrera showed his lack of character.

[thunderfromdownunder]

slammed Hamed into the ring post..

I quite enjoyed that ;;-)

[thunderfromdownunder]

I'm talking about how he hit McKinney in the press conference, how he threw water at Morales after their first fight, how he butted Pac intentionally when he was getting his ass kicked, how he slammed Hamed into the ring post.
No class.

I think all the stuff that happened between him and Morales can't all be blamed on Marco.
I saw a video on YouTube recently were they are talking to each other, it's a new video nut it's in Spanish. I would love to see it in English, maybe they get along somewhat now?

[Rover]

slammed Hamed into the ring post..

I quite enjoyed that ;;-)

I didn't. I had no problem when he banged Hamed when Hamed wanted to touch gloves in the middle of the round, but the ring post nonsense turned me off.

[Rover]

I'm talking about how he hit McKinney in the press conference, how he threw water at Morales after their first fight, how he butted Pac intentionally when he was getting his ass kicked, how he slammed Hamed into the ring post.
No class.

I think all the stuff that happened between him and Morales can't all be blamed on Marco.
I saw a video on YouTube recently were they are talking to each other, it's a new video nut it's in Spanish. I would love to see it in English, maybe they get along somewhat now?

Before the first fight, Morales was quite respectful of Barrera.
Barrera was very antagonistic, and Morales in turn became antagonistic (and justifiably so).
Then Morales (classy of him, too) gave MAB all credit for his performance in the first fight. MAB threw the water when Morales went over (and Erik wasn't acting threatening or anything like that).
I'd be shocked if those two ever reconcile; think they'll always hate each other.

[IRLangmaid25]

Barrera, Morales & Marquez.
Who is the best off the three- all time wise. I think a legitamate case can be made for all three.nothing much really seperates them. I'll go out on a limb and say Marco. On account of two wins over Erik and his domination of Hamed.
What say you?

Lest we forget Israel Vasquez...A great fourth member of this group, with the best left-hook.
His downfall : tender skin...What a warrior ...

I agree he was a terrific fighter with a great chin, a massive pair of cajones (I amazed that they fit in his trunks) and when he was not going mano a mano he had a great jab and very quick hands.