He's used a ridiculous system that apparently only takes into account those who held titles and how many defences they made - thus excluding great fighters who a) never got a shot for being too dangerous, b) competed in eras with a very deep talent pool, and c) competed in eras that predated multiple world title belts and the opportunity to stay at home and accumulate huge numbers of defences that impress nobody except Lee Groves.
Who calls Groves a "historian"? Himself? If he is, he is clearly a deluded fool, desperate for attention. We are Boxing Einsteins if this man is a historian.
Abraham and Sturm don't even merit a mention. Hopkins 20 defences against mostly bums and back to back losses to Jermain Taylor does not place him above Robinson, Hagler, Monzon, nor many others.
I'm going to attempt to list a bunch of middles who would whip Abraham and Sturm off the top of my head- Ezzard Charles and Archie Moore at middle, Georgie Benton, Charlie Burley, Sam Langford, Tony Zale, Rocky Graziano, Jake LaMotta, Marcel Cerdan, Emile Griffith, Dick Tiger, Nino Benvenuti, Joey Giardello, Hurricane Carter, Armstrong when he jumped up an fought Garcia. Christ, can you imagine what Jimmy Ellis would have done with these guys when he was at middle? It's just embarrassing that Groves would attach such an idiotic list to his now worthless name.
Somebody should email him this thread to let him know what we think of his 'historian' status.
Dear God
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Goodnight, Irene
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Re: Dear God
loaded_gloves wrote:He's used a ridiculous system that apparently only takes into account those who held titles and how many defences they made - thus excluding great fighters who a) never got a shot for being too dangerous, b) competed in eras with a very deep talent pool, and c) competed in eras that predated multiple world title belts and the opportunity to stay at home and accumulate huge numbers of defences that impress nobody except Lee Groves.
Who calls Groves a "historian"? Himself? If he is, he is clearly a deluded fool, desperate for attention. We are Boxing Einsteins if this man is a historian.
Abraham and Sturm don't even merit a mention. Hopkins 20 defences against mostly bums and back to back losses to Jermain Taylor does not place him above Robinson, Hagler, Monzon, nor many others.
I'm going to attempt to list a bunch of middles who would whip Abraham and Sturm off the top of my head- Ezzard Charles and Archie Moore at middle, Georgie Benton, Charlie Burley, Sam Langford, Tony Zale, Rocky Graziano, Jake LaMotta, Marcel Cerdan, Emile Griffith, Dick Tiger, Nino Benvenuti, Joey Giardello, Hurricane Carter, Armstrong when he jumped up an fought Garcia. Christ, can you imagine what Jimmy Ellis would have done with these guys when he was at middle? It's just embarrassing that Groves would attach such an idiotic list to his now worthless name.
Somebody should email him this thread to let him know what we think of his 'historian' status.
Re: Dear God
Hopkins at one is as bad as Sturm and Abraham.
