BoxRec not listing Chisora v Haye

[Horse]

If the owner of Boxrec and the editors feel that additional validity is required then it is totally their prerogative. There are numerous shady governing bodies around the world and the editors are very careful with what fights/results are placed on Boxrec.

How many of those other fights are recognised by the likes of the WBO and WBA? And fought between two world top 15 ranked fighters?

[Finn]

If the owner of Boxrec and the editors feel that additional validity is required then it is totally their prerogative. There are numerous shady governing bodies around the world and the editors are very careful with what fights/results are placed on Boxrec.

How many of those other fights are recognised by the likes of the WBO and WBA? And fought between two world top 15 ranked fighters?

The argument would hold more weight if the fight hadnt already been put on the boxrec schedule then withdrawn once the BBBofC kicked up a fuss.

[The Law]

If the owner of Boxrec and the editors feel that additional validity is required then it is totally their prerogative. There are numerous shady governing bodies around the world and the editors are very careful with what fights/results are placed on Boxrec.

How many of those other fights are recognised by the likes of the WBO and WBA? And fought between two world top 15 ranked fighters?

Whether a fight is recognised by one of the 'ABCs' does not validate it as a sanctioned fight. It needs to be sanctioned by a governing body. If a national governing body does not recognise a fight within it's own borders then it does need to be looked in to further (i.e. further research in to the validity of the governing body which has sanctioned it).

Ultimately it is Boxrec's prerogative as to whether it wants to list a fight or not. No outside influence is involved.

[Horse]

The argument would hold more weight if the fight hadnt already been put on the boxrec schedule then withdrawn once the BBBofC kicked up a fuss.

Good point.

[Horse]

Whether a fight is recognised by one of the 'ABCs' does not validate it as a sanctioned fight. It needs to be sanctioned by a governing body. If a national governing body does not recognise a fight within it's own borders then it does need to be looked in to further (i.e. further research in to the validity of the governing body which has sanctioned it).

Ultimately it is Boxrec's prerogative as to whether it wants to list a fight or not. No outside influence is involved.

This has to be the biggest fight to not be recognised by BoxRec though, surely?

[The Law]

If the owner of Boxrec and the editors feel that additional validity is required then it is totally their prerogative. There are numerous shady governing bodies around the world and the editors are very careful with what fights/results are placed on Boxrec.

How many of those other fights are recognised by the likes of the WBO and WBA? And fought between two world top 15 ranked fighters?

The argument would hold more weight if the fight hadnt already been put on the boxrec schedule then withdrawn once the BBBofC kicked up a fuss.

The decision to remove it had nothing to do with the BBBofC kicking up a fuss. Numerous fights are put up and removed on Boxrec on a weekly basis. The site has dozens of editors and errors are occasionally made. In this case an unsanctioned fight was listed by one editor and later removed by another editor. There really is no conspiracy

[Finn]

How many of those other fights are recognised by the likes of the WBO and WBA? And fought between two world top 15 ranked fighters?

The argument would hold more weight if the fight hadnt already been put on the boxrec schedule then withdrawn once the BBBofC kicked up a fuss.

The decision to remove it had nothing to do with the BBBofC kicking up a fuss. Numerous fights are put up and removed on Boxrec on a weekly basis. The site has dozens of editors and errors are occasionally made. In this case an unsanctioned fight was listed by one editor and later removed by another editor. There really is no conspiracy

Sounds reasonable, makes little difference at this point anyway although it did come across as boxrec had bottled it after the BBBofC started complaining so thats what sprang to my mind.

[greg]

... the Boxrec should stick to its decision NOT TO LIST unsanctioned fights irrespective of how much support they get from the fans IMO...

[The Law]

Whether a fight is recognised by one of the 'ABCs' does not validate it as a sanctioned fight. It needs to be sanctioned by a governing body. If a national governing body does not recognise a fight within it's own borders then it does need to be looked in to further (i.e. further research in to the validity of the governing body which has sanctioned it).

Ultimately it is Boxrec's prerogative as to whether it wants to list a fight or not. No outside influence is involved.

This has to be the biggest fight to not be recognised by BoxRec though, surely?

There have been numerous big unlicensed fights not recognised by Boxrec. Roy Shaw v Lenny McLean, to name one

On a serious note, the size of a fight does not affect the decision making process of the editors. There have been numerous boxing fights from around the world which have not been placed on Boxrec due to shady governing bodies. The editors are volunteers and they do a lot of research in to whether a fight/result should be listed or not.

Name me one fight which has been listed on Boxrec but the national governing body (in the country it was held) refused to sanction the fight .....

[Horse]

Horse, if the EBU come out and state that the Luxembourg crew have gone rogue and they no longer recognise them as a legitimate body, or words to that effect, does the fight become unlicensed in your eyes, or not?

I would recognise it, but I am not sure my recognition matters a great deal in the grander scheme of things.

[The Law]

... the Boxrec should stick to its decision NOT TO LIST unsanctioned fights irrespective of how much support they get from the fans IMO...

Indeed. Consistency is of the utmost importance.

[Horse]

There have been numerous big unlicensed fights not recognised by Boxrec. Roy Shaw v Lenny McLean, to name one

On a serious note, the size of a fight does not affect the decision making process of the editors. There have been numerous boxing fights from around the world which have not been placed on Boxrec due to shady governing bodies. The editors are volunteers and they do a lot of research in to whether a fight/result should be listed or not.

Name me one fight which has been listed on Boxrec but the national governing body (in the country it was held) refused to sanction the fight .....

I can't name any fights listed on BoxRec that the national governing body refused to sanction.

It is the biggest fight to be considered "unsanctioned" in BoxRec history though isn't it?

This is a unique type of event, or am I overstating its unique importance?

[Finn]

... the Boxrec should stick to its decision NOT TO LIST unsanctioned fights irrespective of how much support they get from the fans IMO...

they have i agree but at this point its in debate weather the fight is sanctioned which is what The Law is saying. If the EBU confirm the lux board is allowed to license the fight then the fight is officially sanctioned, if not it isnt and should not only not be listed but also shouldnt go ahead.

However i find it hard to beleive there is a legal justification for not allowing the Lux board to sanction the fight, the fighters arent banned and luxemburg is part of the EU as is the UK.

[slapbangwhallop]

... the Boxrec should stick to its decision NOT TO LIST unsanctioned fights irrespective of how much support they get from the fans IMO...

they have i agree but at this point its in debate weather the fight is sanctioned which is what The Law is saying. If the EBU confirm the lux board is allowed to license the fight then the fight is officially sanctioned, if not it isnt and should not only not be listed but also shouldnt go ahead.

However i find it hard to beleive there is a legal justification for not allowing the Lux board to sanction the fight, the fighters arent banned and luxemburg is part of the EU as is the UK.

exactly.

[Horse]

Your recognition matters to me, mate. Forget, for a moment, the fact you think the match is a good one and you want to see it. Do you think the proposed promotion is undermining the authority of the BBBofC?

Yes, it does undermine the BBBofC and I think they deserve to be undermined when they claim to be more of an authority than they really are.

The BBBofC deserve to be humbled, then perhaps they will put more effort into being a respectable organisation that deserves respect, rather than demands it.

[greg]

... the Boxrec should stick to its decision NOT TO LIST unsanctioned fights irrespective of how much support they get from the fans IMO...

they have i agree but at this point its in debate weather the fight is sanctioned which is what The Law is saying. If the EBU confirm the lux board is allowed to license the fight then the fight is officially sanctioned, if not it isnt and should not only not be listed but also shouldnt go ahead.

However i find it hard to beleive there is a legal justification for not allowing the Lux board to sanction the fight, the fighters arent banned and luxemburg is part of the EU as is the UK.

... I understand that at this point there is no confirmation from EBU which means it's UNsanctioned which also means that at THIS point of time it may not take place in Britain. What happens next remains to be seen...

[Horse]

Okay, I get that and I don't really disagree. But if this fight falls outside the auspices of not only the BBBofC but also the EBU and the EBU come out and say "Whoa. We're not backing this, the Luxembourg Federation have acted out of line and we're expelling them from our organisation". Do you not agree that the fight has to viewed as unlicensed - at least in the eyes of what could fairly be described as convention professional boxing?

I personally believe that this pantomime has terminally damaged the tacit gentleman's agreement culture that has presided over professional boxing for so long. I think the sport needs to be gripped by the bollocks and all the Jack-the-lads cutting about the place need bringing into line by an international organisation with regional and domestic satellites that have real bite.

I don't think boxing needs more authoritarian government.

Consolidations of power are usually more easily corrupted than a more spread out power structure.

[Horse]

Not if they're hard enough. The whole world needs more authoritarian government, not just boxing.

I believe the world needs more people who have self respect and belief in their own power, who will stand up for their own interests, rather than having a consolidated power structure that will dictate to them.

[Finn]

... the Boxrec should stick to its decision NOT TO LIST unsanctioned fights irrespective of how much support they get from the fans IMO...

they have i agree but at this point its in debate weather the fight is sanctioned which is what The Law is saying. If the EBU confirm the lux board is allowed to license the fight then the fight is officially sanctioned, if not it isnt and should not only not be listed but also shouldnt go ahead.

However i find it hard to beleive there is a legal justification for not allowing the Lux board to sanction the fight, the fighters arent banned and luxemburg is part of the EU as is the UK.

... I understand that at this point there is no confirmation from EBU which means it's UNsanctioned which also means that at THIS point of time it may not take place in Britain. What happens next remains to be seen...

Its the other way round, currently the fight is sanctioned unless the EBU kick out the lux federation.

[slapbangwhallop]

they have i agree but at this point its in debate weather the fight is sanctioned which is what The Law is saying. If the EBU confirm the lux board is allowed to license the fight then the fight is officially sanctioned, if not it isnt and should not only not be listed but also shouldnt go ahead.

However i find it hard to beleive there is a legal justification for not allowing the Lux board to sanction the fight, the fighters arent banned and luxemburg is part of the EU as is the UK.

... I understand that at this point there is no confirmation from EBU which means it's UNsanctioned which also means that at THIS point of time it may not take place in Britain. What happens next remains to be seen...

Its the other way round, currently the fight is sanctioned unless the EBU kick out the lux federation.

once again, exactly!!

[the patriot]

I actually asked a similar question on the records forum....

http://boxrec.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=152185

opens a can of worms me thinks!!!!!!!!

[Freiheit]

Name me one fight which has been listed on Boxrec but the national governing body (in the country it was held) refused to sanction the fight .....

http://boxrec.com/show_display.php?show_id=624633

[The Law]

Name me one fight which has been listed on Boxrec but the national governing body (in the country it was held) refused to sanction the fight .....

http://boxrec.com/show_display.php?show_id=624633

Well done

However, did the Danish board categorically condemn that show? I think that might be the key difference here.

[Freiheit]

Not as vocally as the BBBC. But what made this show bad was it was illegal. When the promotor applied the police for a permite, they said it was sanctioned (as an amateur show). A card have to be sanctioned by either the amateur or pro federation, if not the promotor can get fined.

[The Law]

Not as vocally as the BBBC. But what made this show bad was it was illegal. When the promotor applied the police for a permite, they said it was sanctioned (as an amateur show). A card have to be sanctioned by either the amateur or pro federation, if not the promotor can get fined.

Interesting. Then why have we listed the show?