German Board the latest to back the BBBoC over H v C

[dondada]

Statement from the BBBoC:

The German Boxing Board (BDB) have written to the European Boxing Union (EBU) and the British Boxing Board of Control (BBBoC) in support of the BBBoC over the proposed clash between David Haye and Dereck Chisora at West Ham on July 14, sanctioned by the Luxembourg Boxing Federation (LBF).

The BDB president Thomas Pütz has joined his WBC counterpart José Sulaimán over the controversial contest and in his letter he has urged the EBU to expel the LBF and for the sport to stand firm in condemning the July 14 show.

“Like most of the boxing world I was surprised, disappointed, upset and shocked when I heard that not only is allegedly planning to promote a fight between Dereck Chisora and David Haye in London on July 14, but that the LBF is willing to approve and sanction this fight,” wrote Pütz.

“For obvious and good reasons Dereck Chisora has lost his license with the BBBoC, is under suspension from the BDB and has been suspended indefinitely by the WBC.

“Neither Chisora nor David Haye hold a valid license with the BBBoC; still they are planning to fight each other in Great Britain. This fact alone justifies Wladimir Klitschko’s comment that we should not talk about a boxing fight but about a ‘freak show’. I have to say that even though I would choose a different wording I totally agree with our World heavyweight champion in this point.

“I think most of my colleagues from the boxing commissions and federations all over the world and the world sanctioning bodies agree that the fight between Haye and Chisora on July 14 should not take place and cannot be tolerated or even supported by the EBU or any of their affiliated commissions or federations.

“As a Union we have to respect each other and support each other for the sake of the EBU and the sport in general. Therefore I cannot understand the decision of the Luxembourg Boxing Federation (LBF) to support the ‘freak show’ against the explicit will and decision of the BBBoC, the BDB and the WBC.

“As you may have heard even big TV stations like ARD here in Germany has come to its senses after all the public outcry and criticism over the last few days. I believe that other institutions will follow ARD’s example and withdraw from their decisions to support this event in any way.

“However, if the LBF sticks to its decision and plans to actually sanction the ‘freak show’ I hereby officially request to expel the LBF from the EBU for not respecting the authority and decisions of other affiliated members of the EBU.

“In my opinion, especially in difficult times like these where promoters try all different kinds of moves to undermine the decisions made by commissions and sanctioning bodies and new unreliable and suspicious federations are founded every day, the EBU has to make a clear statement, show strength and unity and let the world know that we stay true to our ideals and values and are not the promoters, fighters or anybody’s puppets.”

[taffytoon]

One of many to come thank goodness,I am sure the EBU will make a statement today.

[cockneygymrat]

The drama continues.

People should note the German Boxing Board are not completely innocent in all this. Dr Pudtz who heads that organisation is reported to have supplied the not so excellent security when the Haye and Chisora scuffle kicked off in the first place, so it is very hard for him to establish any form of credibility.

In addition in blind panic The German boxing board forgets they allow a number of established boxers who fight in Germany to be licensed through other governing bodies, I am sure one of the knowledgable posters on this forum can verify that. For example Sauerland use their own organisation and the Klitschko's also use one, the name of which I am not sure about.

[JDC]

Has Danny Williams fought in Germany since the BBBofC revoked his licence?

erm, yes... TWICE.

Solidarity... my arse!

[JDC]

It's was spring-board for this to happen. The German board helped set a precedent that they are now condemning.

Why didn't they uphold what the BBBofC said of Williams?

[Coco]

If the board banned some officials for incompetency/corruption, would the supporters of this fight be happy if they reffed/judges/timekept a fight in Britain under a Luxembourg license?

[dondada]

Why didn't they uphold what the BBBofC said of Williams?

What did they say?

[JDC]

I think they are all correct to be showing unity though. It's going to be a very challenging time for the boards. That said, I hope the fight goes ahead.

[Coco]

I'm sure Williams was not refused a British license but just did not renew it.

[Freiheit]

BDB have licensed Maria Lindberg, even though she was medically banned in Sweden because she got a brain damage in an amateur fight.

[JDC]

Why didn't they uphold what the BBBofC said of Williams?

What did they say?

William's said he would retire if he lost, and he was stopped. They revoked his licence, and he never reapplied (similar to Haye), he applied to the LBF for a license (similar to Haye).

If this had been denounced, I doubt Haye would have applied to them. The situation with Chisora is worse, as he's suspended.

[dondada]

Why didn't they uphold what the BBBofC said of Williams?

What did they say?

William's said he would retire if he lost, and he was stopped. They revoked his licence, and he never reapplied (similar to Haye), he applied to the LBF for a license (similar to Haye).

If this had been denounced, I doubt Haye would have applied to them. The situation with Chisora is worse, as he's suspended.

Are you sure they revoked it? I really can't remember. I remember he got a Latvian licence.

[JDC]

Maybe it was Latvia

Williams had been saying his hunger had gone after the prizefighter, and before the British Title fight. With his attitude and his performances, he was a danger to himself. I understood that they had revoked it, if not he was due to reapply and was discouraged publicly. He then highlighted this loophole, which was supported by the several other boards. The BBBofC was vocal in its condemnation of what the foreign boards were allowing... and a light-bulb flashed above Fwanks head.

[stujones]

I don't think they revoked his licence as such, like I don't think they revoked David Haye's licence.

Revoke means stripped of his licence, for whatever reason, against the will of the fighter. Evander Holyfield licence was revoked, Mike Tyson's licence was revoked (after the ear bite), Muhammad Ali's licenced was revoked.

Danny's licence was taken away as he had announced his retirement, he was told that he could re-apply should he wish to make a comeback, but was also told that in his re-application they would take into account his performances and age etc. This is what Danny said when he first fought using the Latvia licence.

The BBBoC made no decision really on Danny - it was Danny's will to retire from boxing and as with David Haye, a retired fighter means his licence is revoked. Ricky Hatton had to reapply for his licence to fight after he was saying he is "likely" retired.

[stujones]

BDB have licensed Maria Lindberg, even though she was medically banned in Sweden because she got a brain damage in an amateur fight.

Now this is more of a criticism than the Danny Williams thing IMO..... I don't think Danny failed any medicals under the BBBoC..... just was told if he re-applied he would go through a battery of tests, which Danny didn't fancy.

Similar problems of course were for Edwin Valero... that didn't end up good.

[JDC]

Yes, but the proper channels were ignored and ''newer'' options were endorsed by several European boards. Claiming ''solidarity'' and ''unity'' now, is hollow. Danny is British, let his own national board be sovereign.

[stujones]

Yes, but the proper channels were ignored and ''newer'' options were endorsed by several European boards. Claiming ''solidarity'' and ''unity'' now, is hollow.

Yes, but the key difference is that Danny Williams, a British fighter, was fighting with a non-British licence ABROAD. It was one fighter on the undercard of German boxing bill. There was nothing the BBBoC could do, they did nothing wrong and technically, Danny did nothing wrong.

Is Danny fighting under a latvian licence in Germany, under GBB sanctioning (I assume) any different than Marco Antonio Barrera fighting Khan in 2009.... Barrera didn't have a British licence.

As both Main event fighters do not hold BBBoC licences..... then the whole event needs to be sanctioned by the LBF. All technically Danny was, was a latvian import in Germany... we have these on most bills in the UK.

[dondada]

Yes, but the proper channels were ignored and ''newer'' options were endorsed by several European boards. Claiming ''solidarity'' and ''unity'' now, is hollow. Danny is British, let his own national board be sovereign.

I'd agree with you if the Board pulled his licence...as you say, I'm not sure they did - he just went elsewhere after not renewing.

[JDC]

At the very least the BBBofC would be annoyed that they had been stepped over.

Protocol needs looking at from all, imo. Together the boards are a strong global force for the sport, but they have to consistent in their support of each others decisions. Maybe this statement is the start of this, and a welcome development if it pans out.

[JDC]

http://boxingaction.com/index.php?/2011 ... bof-c.html

When Danny wanted to continue his boxing career after ‘retiring,’ he was told, quite rightly, to stay retired by the BBBofC.

Robert Smith, General Secretary of the British Boxing Board, said on Thursday: “Danny wouldn’t be granted a license by the British Board. He retired and when he wanted to come back he was advised that he should retire. The next thing I heard, he was boxing as a Latvian in Germany. He could not box in the UK under a license from Latvia.”

That's what the BBBofC said of the Williams situation

[stujones]

http://boxingaction.com/index.php?/2011 ... bof-c.html

When Danny wanted to continue his boxing career after ‘retiring,’ he was told, quite rightly, to stay retired by the BBBofC.

Robert Smith, General Secretary of the British Boxing Board, said on Thursday: “Danny wouldn’t be granted a license by the British Board. He retired and when he wanted to come back he was advised that he should retire. The next thing I heard, he was boxing as a Latvian in Germany. He could not box in the UK under a license from Latvia.”

That's what the BBBofC said of the Williams situation

Thats the key quote, British fighter fighting with a licence not from the UK, cannot fight.

Had the GBB banned Williams also, then Williams could have taken them to court etc - as it is no different to a Latvian fighting with a Latvian licence in Germany. The issue is really with the Latvian federation (whatever they are called).

[dondada]

http://boxingaction.com/index.php?/2011 ... bof-c.html

When Danny wanted to continue his boxing career after ‘retiring,’ he was told, quite rightly, to stay retired by the BBBofC.

Robert Smith, General Secretary of the British Boxing Board, said on Thursday: “Danny wouldn’t be granted a license by the British Board. He retired and when he wanted to come back he was advised that he should retire. The next thing I heard, he was boxing as a Latvian in Germany. He could not box in the UK under a license from Latvia.”

That's what the BBBofC said of the Williams situation

Good find, thanks

[JDC]

http://boxingaction.com/index.php?/2011 ... bof-c.html

When Danny wanted to continue his boxing career after ‘retiring,’ he was told, quite rightly, to stay retired by the BBBofC.

Robert Smith, General Secretary of the British Boxing Board, said on Thursday: “Danny wouldn’t be granted a license by the British Board. He retired and when he wanted to come back he was advised that he should retire. The next thing I heard, he was boxing as a Latvian in Germany. He could not box in the UK under a license from Latvia.”

That's what the BBBofC said of the Williams situation

Thats the key quote, British fighter fighting with a licence not from the UK, cannot fight.

Had the GBB banned Williams also, then Williams could have taken them to court etc - as it is no different to a Latvian fighting with a Latvian licence in Germany. The issue is really with the Latvian federation (whatever they are called).

But that line is legally wrong. He could, but it wouldn't be sanctioned by the BBBofC - if he attempted to the BBBofC would have taken the same stance they have against Haye and Chisora. The German board have taken a different stance on the two similar scenarios, to suit their own ends.

It's no more of an issue with the Latvian board regards Williams, than the LBF regards Haye Chisora. Difference is one gained Continental support and the other hasn't. Williams should not have been supported, for reasons more serious imo.

[cockneygymrat]

I don't think they revoked his licence as such, like I don't think they revoked David Haye's licence.

Revoke means stripped of his licence, for whatever reason, against the will of the fighter. Evander Holyfield licence was revoked, Mike Tyson's licence was revoked (after the ear bite), Muhammad Ali's licenced was revoked.

Danny's licence was taken away as he had announced his retirement, he was told that he could re-apply should he wish to make a comeback, but was also told that in his re-application they would take into account his performances and age etc. This is what Danny said when he first fought using the Latvia licence.

The BBBoC made no decision really on Danny - it was Danny's will to retire from boxing and as with David Haye, a retired fighter means his licence is revoked. Ricky Hatton had to reapply for his licence to fight after he was saying he is "likely" retired.

???? Read your 2nd para and then your last, you are pretending in some way to be in the know, yet you contradict yourself.

[stujones]

I'll agree to disagree JDC, although you raise some good points.

Danny would still, I assume, be able to fight in the UK - but on non licenced shows only.... not going on his record etc. However, no licenced promoter is going to go down that route as they know a true unlicenced bout means many consequences for fighter and promoter.

Danny, as an imported fighter with a Latvian licence, is no different to a Latvian fighting in Germany. It IS different to a latvian fighting in the UK cause Danny was a previously a UK licence holder and was told he wouldn't be given a new licence. Having Danny fight in Germany didn't mean the bill had to be sanctioned by the Latvian federation, it just meant one of the participants was not a licence holder by the GBB (as Marco Antonio Barrera wasn't a BBBoC licence holder when he fought Khan).

If there was, say before all this fracas, a geniune talented Luxemburg fighter, with a Luxemburg licence, scheduled to fight... lets say Kell Brook, in the UK.... would the BBBoC outlaw him cause of where he boxed previously.... No they wouldn't have - but a "Luxemburg fighter" who has faught all career long in the UK, born and breed in the Uk and been rejected a UK licence - might have some problems.

Had the GBB accepted one Latvian fighter (from Latvia) to fight on the bill and rejected Danny on the grounds of what the BBBoC stated publically, then Danny would have every right to complain.... Danny might have passed the most stringent of tests to get the latvian licence, he might have declared he wanted to change nationality etc. Danny had no previous history with the GBB. One could argue that Haye and Chisora not only have previous history with the BBBoC, but with the GBB also.

Whether it is correct or not, a key difference between this case and Danny Williams is that the whole bill needs to be sanctioned by the LBF as both fighters are unable to obtain BBBoC licences.

Another example, Joe Bugner - now here we have an ex British Licence holder, he emigrated to Australia and got an Aussie Licence. Would he have got a British licence in one of his last comebacks when he faced Scott Welch? Probably not, was Germany wrong to host a fight between a British licence holder, and a Aussie Licence holding Brit? That essentially is what Danny is doing. Would Scott Welch vs Bugner happened in the UK - I would say not.

It may set a precedent that all foreign fighters, no matter how great, need mandatory checks by the BBBoC (including MRI scans) to fight here and this could become a global agreement - which would solve the Danny Williams argument somewhat.