twenty six wrote:Insider,
Where do UKAD fit in to all of this ?
I've had a bit of invlvement with them through Ryan.
They tested Ryan after the fight Saturday, but were present from well before the fight keeping an eye on things.
Could that have been an EBU arranged test ?
UK anti doping are the agency that carry out the tests. The World Anti Doping Agency supply the lists of banned substances (in steroid, PED and even over the counter cough medicines etc) If memory serves correct the EBU are one of the organisations that test post fight. To my knowledge I have never heard of a UK boxer being randomly tested (this is only to my knowledge though without trawling the net).
I've seen Darren barker tweet they tested him at 6am recently.
Unless I'm mistaken. I know Froch gets tested regular too. Even at domestic level.
twenty six wrote:Insider,
Where do UKAD fit in to all of this ?
I've had a bit of invlvement with them through Ryan.
They tested Ryan after the fight Saturday, but were present from well before the fight keeping an eye on things.
Could that have been an EBU arranged test ?
UK anti doping are the agency that carry out the tests. The World Anti Doping Agency supply the lists of banned substances (in steroid, PED and even over the counter cough medicines etc) If memory serves correct the EBU are one of the organisations that test post fight. To my knowledge I have never heard of a UK boxer being randomly tested (this is only to my knowledge though without trawling the net).
I've seen Darren barker tweet they tested him at 6am recently.
Unless I'm mistaken. I know Froch gets tested regular too. Even at domestic level.
We know title level fighters are tested, hence Larry getting nabbed. I thought we were referring more to what happens below this.
warmachine wrote:i felt i owed to the forum to say a few words when it wasnt busy as i dont wanna argue with anyone or create any bad feelings. yes i had been doping for 6 years but for most of u guys to think my opponents were not because of their physiques is quite ridiculous. i know for a fact that 3 guys i fought as a pro were on stuff although i will not mention any names and the majority of the boxers u all love so dear are on stuff, fact and this is from me talking to them, seeing them buy stuff or talking to their training personnel. Cheating is when u are the only prson doing something and since i know that i wasnt the only person doing it, it cant be defined as cheating. a large minority if not majority of boxers are doping and the naivity of the public to think that mine is an isolated case is staggering. Also i am so surprised that i get so much stick but the guys i look up to in the sport like roy jones, shane moseley and james toney who have all been caught dont get as much stick. Also lets not forget the holyfield incident with evan fields story, vargas and even mayweather using banned painkillers. if u hate me for doping fine, but then be prepared to hate all ur fav boxers and indeed athletes.
I appreciate the support I got from this forum and thats why i am coming on here and telling u this. Also i will not hide away as that is not my style and i will be back in boxing when the ban ends like it or not. Walk a mile in my shoes b4 u judge me.
This post is typical of the class of this man. Those of us who have competed in or been around the sport, know that stuff does go on, and indeed there is in some circles an almost silent gentlemans agreement about this. Larry has always been a honest, hard competitor and I hope people can cut him some slack for showing once again the integrity to come here and speak to the forum. He didnt have to do that.
As ive said elsewhere PEDs are rampant in MMA and they are also used to a lesser extent in boxing. I beleive their use is far far more dangerous for the opponent and creates less of an even field in the divisions below HW. In the HW division there isn't the cutting/draining etc that you get in the lower divisions and thus less of an uneven field. If a guy wants to be athletic in the HW division invariably he will come in lighter. Bulking up to 250 plus does not promote the gains in speed, stamina etc that lighter weight boxers can attain without the bulk whilst they are using PED's. This is and always has been a dirty sport. The promoters the managers the trainers have all been accused of that. The fighters too. Some fighters see what is going on and decide to even the playing field for themselves. Not a great situation but thats the way it is.
Ultimately its up to the board of control to introduce uniform testing.
Last edited by Bricks on 20 Jun 2012, 08:15, edited 2 times in total.
warmachine wrote:i felt i owed to the forum to say a few words when it wasnt busy as i dont wanna argue with anyone or create any bad feelings. yes i had been doping for 6 years but for most of u guys to think my opponents were not because of their physiques is quite ridiculous. i know for a fact that 3 guys i fought as a pro were on stuff although i will not mention any names and the majority of the boxers u all love so dear are on stuff, fact and this is from me talking to them, seeing them buy stuff or talking to their training personnel. Cheating is when u are the only prson doing something and since i know that i wasnt the only person doing it, it cant be defined as cheating. a large minority if not majority of boxers are doping and the naivity of the public to think that mine is an isolated case is staggering. Also i am so surprised that i get so much stick but the guys i look up to in the sport like roy jones, shane moseley and james toney who have all been caught dont get as much stick. Also lets not forget the holyfield incident with evan fields story, vargas and even mayweather using banned painkillers. if u hate me for doping fine, but then be prepared to hate all ur fav boxers and indeed athletes.
I appreciate the support I got from this forum and thats why i am coming on here and telling u this. Also i will not hide away as that is not my style and i will be back in boxing when the ban ends like it or not. Walk a mile in my shoes b4 u judge me.
Why wont you name names? You'd be more respected if you did and would help the sport as a whole.
Are you for real? So he would be more respected in your eyes if he satisfied your gossipy instincts and posted names on here, muckraked, while the people accused were not here to have their right of defence and he faced the possibility of legal action. Get real
I was pro on and off for ten years with a weight disparity in those years of 30lbs. My build changed pretty dramatically, all natural obviously. That's said the only thing I ever pissed in was a toilet. I was never tested.
warmachine wrote:i felt i owed to the forum to say a few words when it wasnt busy as i dont wanna argue with anyone or create any bad feelings. yes i had been doping for 6 years but for most of u guys to think my opponents were not because of their physiques is quite ridiculous. i know for a fact that 3 guys i fought as a pro were on stuff although i will not mention any names and the majority of the boxers u all love so dear are on stuff, fact and this is from me talking to them, seeing them buy stuff or talking to their training personnel. Cheating is when u are the only prson doing something and since i know that i wasnt the only person doing it, it cant be defined as cheating. a large minority if not majority of boxers are doping and the naivity of the public to think that mine is an isolated case is staggering. Also i am so surprised that i get so much stick but the guys i look up to in the sport like roy jones, shane moseley and james toney who have all been caught dont get as much stick. Also lets not forget the holyfield incident with evan fields story, vargas and even mayweather using banned painkillers. if u hate me for doping fine, but then be prepared to hate all ur fav boxers and indeed athletes.
I appreciate the support I got from this forum and thats why i am coming on here and telling u this. Also i will not hide away as that is not my style and i will be back in boxing when the ban ends like it or not. Walk a mile in my shoes b4 u judge me.
Why wont you name names? You'd be more respected if you did and would help the sport as a whole.
Are you for real? So he would be more respected in your eyes if he satisfied your gossipy instincts and posted names on here, muckraked, while the people accused were not here to have their right of defence and he faced the possibility of legal action. Get real
Don't you think War machine's previous oponents would have deserved to know about his drug taking before they stepped in the ring with him ? Or should we just sweep it under the carpet like they tried to with Roy Jones in America and ignore it ?
G0mez wrote:The Dwain Chambers approach of "I'll do it because everyone else is" has already been proven as an extremely bad career choice.
Telling the authority that a rival is using gear is not grassing, it should be commended. I see world champions in our gym, absolutely beasting themselves - and they deserve 100% respect for their achievements. They have boxed before puberty, they're bodies are absolutely different to those who start when they're 18+ years old.
I think taking gear is only good for quick gains. In any gym there are naturals who have lifted for years and are so strong. Yet a newbie will come along, go nuts on steroids and protein shakes and be lifting as much as them in 18 months. But long term they won't keep their strength/gains like the natural does.. Without taking steroids. And after a while they plateau and begin taking even more.
That mindset of complete confidence on account of the elevated teste in blood, becomes a complete nightmare when they stop. One of my work friend became borderline suicidal when he stopped taking them, even with post-steroid therapy like tamoxifenetc etc. Mentally and physically he crashed badly.
15 years ago, looking 'big and muscular' almost became a fashion trend. The use of sunbeds and steroids increased ten-fold. Men strutting round like peacocks in t-shirts 3-sizes too small to show of their artificial 'guns'.
I just think they have incredibly low self esteem. Sure they're is nothing wrong with looking in shape, working out is enjoyable for many. But that 20% of Fitness First members or 85% of spit-and-sawdust gyms than stack themselves up with sustinol, deca and whatever aren't ever going to be truly happy within themselves.
They're way to concerned with what people think of them, judging them etc. And taking heavy steroids will only worsen their fears in the long run. It completely warps your testosterone / serotonin levels to the point of clinical depression.
So is it all worth it? Absolutely not.
Larry - I personally think the horse has bolted with regards naming names.
"Do things sincerely, not as strategy"
If you blow the lid, people will think your doing it for yourself to claw back integrity, rather than cleanse boxing.
All true but remember steroids and PED's and the like , were all developed in medical laborotries. They have a medical purpose. If a clean athlete were to use them in controlled moderate cycles than they can have a tremendously beneficial use, but like you say it is the johhny come lately newbies who go on entire year cycles to ctach up with the long term natural trainers who abuse these things and give PEDS a bad name
Its not like Larry did what panama lewis did, the 4 year ban is a disgrace by a board of control too busy pinching pennies and not testing universally so that boxers wouldnt feel the need to do something as they know others are.
warmachine wrote:i felt i owed to the forum to say a few words when it wasnt busy as i dont wanna argue with anyone or create any bad feelings. yes i had been doping for 6 years but for most of u guys to think my opponents were not because of their physiques is quite ridiculous. i know for a fact that 3 guys i fought as a pro were on stuff although i will not mention any names and the majority of the boxers u all love so dear are on stuff, fact and this is from me talking to them, seeing them buy stuff or talking to their training personnel. Cheating is when u are the only prson doing something and since i know that i wasnt the only person doing it, it cant be defined as cheating. a large minority if not majority of boxers are doping and the naivity of the public to think that mine is an isolated case is staggering. Also i am so surprised that i get so much stick but the guys i look up to in the sport like roy jones, shane moseley and james toney who have all been caught dont get as much stick. Also lets not forget the holyfield incident with evan fields story, vargas and even mayweather using banned painkillers. if u hate me for doping fine, but then be prepared to hate all ur fav boxers and indeed athletes.
I appreciate the support I got from this forum and thats why i am coming on here and telling u this. Also i will not hide away as that is not my style and i will be back in boxing when the ban ends like it or not. Walk a mile in my shoes b4 u judge me.
This post is typical of the class of this man. Those of us who have competed in or been around the sport, know that stuff does go on, and indeed there is in some circles an almost silent gentlemans agreement about this. Larry has always been a honest, hard competitor and I hope people can cut him some slack for showing once again the integrity to come here and speak to the forum. He didnt have to do that.
As ive said elsewhere PEDs are rampant in MMA and they are also used to a lesser extent in boxing. I beleive their use is far far more dangerous for the opponent and creates less of an even field in the divisions below HW. In the HW division there isn't the cutting/draining etc that you get in the lower divisions and thus less of an uneven field. If a guy wants to be athletic in the HW division invariably he will come in lighter. Bulking up to 250 plus does not promote the gains in speed, stamina etc that lighter weight boxers can attain without the bulk whilst they are using PED's. This is and always has been a dirty sport. The promoters the managers the trainers have all been accused of that. The fighters too. Some fighters see what is going on and decide to even the playing field for themselves. Not a great situation but thats the way it is.
Ultimately its up to the board of control to introduce uniform testing.
There is surely an irony with what I bolded.... 6 years the guy has now admitted he has been on the juice. How is that honest?
curtis wood wrote:The problem is this, I've had 21 fights and been a pro for 6 years and I've never been tested for anything,people will always cheat if they think they have a chance of getting away with it, and if your a pro boxer you have a very good chance getting away with it, I have the right as a fighter to know if the man I'm fighting is clean or not,the board need to get with it and start taking my and other clean fighters safety more serious because I feel like I'm being let down by people who are in charge
My Fighter Nasser Al Harbi was tested for the first time in his career in Italy at the weekend.[/quot
warmachine wrote:i felt i owed to the forum to say a few words when it wasnt busy as i dont wanna argue with anyone or create any bad feelings. yes i had been doping for 6 years but for most of u guys to think my opponents were not because of their physiques is quite ridiculous. i know for a fact that 3 guys i fought as a pro were on stuff although i will not mention any names and the majority of the boxers u all love so dear are on stuff, fact and this is from me talking to them, seeing them buy stuff or talking to their training personnel. Cheating is when u are the only prson doing something and since i know that i wasnt the only person doing it, it cant be defined as cheating. a large minority if not majority of boxers are doping and the naivity of the public to think that mine is an isolated case is staggering. Also i am so surprised that i get so much stick but the guys i look up to in the sport like roy jones, shane moseley and james toney who have all been caught dont get as much stick. Also lets not forget the holyfield incident with evan fields story, vargas and even mayweather using banned painkillers. if u hate me for doping fine, but then be prepared to hate all ur fav boxers and indeed athletes.
I appreciate the support I got from this forum and thats why i am coming on here and telling u this. Also i will not hide away as that is not my style and i will be back in boxing when the ban ends like it or not. Walk a mile in my shoes b4 u judge me.
Larry it's a shame it had to come to this sort of statment .surely with the level of opposition that you have faced to date you can never justify taking any performance enhancing drugs? for what reason ?to help keep up with the opposition? shurley not ?
I agree that your probably not an isolated case but i beleive that the majority of british level fighters are clean, fair play comeing out with a statement for your fans but i think you should have been properly advised before making such. im sorry to say that this statment will only strengthen your critics arguments against you.
A four year ban is pretty harsh. I wonder if Larry will be able to fight elsewhere during that time or if the BBBC would shun that and extend the ban in the UK? At 33 (turning 34 this Fall), being out 4 years really cuts down on the time left in the sport.
I must admit after reading Curtis Woodhouse's recent comments since making the switch from football, a sport where testing is regular and throughers to boxing I am rather concerned that the Board of Control the governing body that runs the sport here in the UK that we all love does not have a current policy towards testing, especially when you take into account how highly regarded the Board of Control is around the World, and following the catching and banning of Larry O, I hope that Charles Giles and Robert Smith at the Board address this rather worrying hole in their regulation soon.
As for Larry's comments on here. I respect the fact he has come on here and explain himself and I do accept his argument that there maybe other fights under British licence that may also be using PEDs and I do agree it would be naive of us all as knowledgable fight fans to think he is the only one who has been using because he has been caught, and I think the time out he has as a result of his punishment the Board and other figures should get him involved in education programme to say that if you take this stuff you will get caught.
warmachine wrote:i felt i owed to the forum to say a few words when it wasnt busy as i dont wanna argue with anyone or create any bad feelings. yes i had been doping for 6 years but for most of u guys to think my opponents were not because of their physiques is quite ridiculous. i know for a fact that 3 guys i fought as a pro were on stuff although i will not mention any names and the majority of the boxers u all love so dear are on stuff, fact and this is from me talking to them, seeing them buy stuff or talking to their training personnel. Cheating is when u are the only prson doing something and since i know that i wasnt the only person doing it, it cant be defined as cheating. a large minority if not majority of boxers are doping and the naivity of the public to think that mine is an isolated case is staggering. Also i am so surprised that i get so much stick but the guys i look up to in the sport like roy jones, shane moseley and james toney who have all been caught dont get as much stick. Also lets not forget the holyfield incident with evan fields story, vargas and even mayweather using banned painkillers. if u hate me for doping fine, but then be prepared to hate all ur fav boxers and indeed athletes.
I appreciate the support I got from this forum and thats why i am coming on here and telling u this. Also i will not hide away as that is not my style and i will be back in boxing when the ban ends like it or not. Walk a mile in my shoes b4 u judge me.
Fair play to ya for coming on the forum
To be honest I'm not surprised in Larrys comments about how widespread PED's are in boxing, when the rewards are so high for making it to the top and the drug testing procedures are sooooo lax it's obvious that people will be taking advantage.
Do boxers have to cheat to compete on a level playing field these days? Possibly so
I still maintain PED's are not rife in the lower weight divisions, mainly because people are looking to cut weight.
I think it is different in the heavies, Tommy Morrison had a lot to say about it.
I never had a drug test and don't know any 6 round fighter that has.
I been tested my last 2 amature fights. Now been pro nearly 3years and never been tested. anyone could be taking drugs be good to catch everyone off guard and see who they are
credit to larry for coming on with an apology and an opinion. i cant condone drug use/abuse of any sort at all. Larry....work in conjunction with the authorities and spill the beans, why worry about being sued if you are right?
warmachine wrote:I wasn't suggesting I havn't done wrong I was just letting you guys know what my mindframe was at the time.
your mindframe was to cheat and get away with it. you knew you were cheating and you still did it without a problem. you are scum.
warmachine wrote:accept I have done wrong but also want everyone to see the reality of all sports. I accept two wrongs don't make a right and if it felt Like my two posts were made to justify my actions then I apologise for that. I accept I have done wrong and will accept my punishment accordingly.
Why are you talking about everyone seeing the reality of sports? the issue is you being a cheating c*nt, not the reality of sports. You cheated and if you didn't get caught you would still be doing it, all the while pulling the Mr. Nice Guy act on here.
warmachine wrote:I wanted u guys to realise that its one rule for one and another rule for another with the roy jones, shane moseley and james toney situations. For instance James Toney has tested positive twice for steroids and if that was me I would have been banned for life now but somehow he is or was still boxing. So until this sort of thing is addressed, it will go on. Shane moseley has been known to use and doesn't get a ban. Same thing. Again I apologise to u guys for letting u down and thank you ofr the support.
Again, stop talking about others and take full 100% responsibility for being a cheating dishonest c*nt.
warmachine wrote:i felt i owed to the forum to say a few words when it wasnt busy as i dont wanna argue with anyone or create any bad feelings. yes i had been doping for 6 years but for most of u guys to think my opponents were not because of their physiques is quite ridiculous. i know for a fact that 3 guys i fought as a pro were on stuff although i will not mention any names and the majority of the boxers u all love so dear are on stuff, fact and this is from me talking to them, seeing them buy stuff or talking to their training personnel. Cheating is when u are the only prson doing something and since i know that i wasnt the only person doing it, it cant be defined as cheating. a large minority if not majority of boxers are doping and the naivity of the public to think that mine is an isolated case is staggering. Also i am so surprised that i get so much stick but the guys i look up to in the sport like roy jones, shane moseley and james toney who have all been caught dont get as much stick. Also lets not forget the holyfield incident with evan fields story, vargas and even mayweather using banned painkillers. if u hate me for doping fine, but then be prepared to hate all ur fav boxers and indeed athletes.
I appreciate the support I got from this forum and thats why i am coming on here and telling u this. Also i will not hide away as that is not my style and i will be back in boxing when the ban ends like it or not. Walk a mile in my shoes b4 u judge me.
I actually respect that you've come on here and been honest about your PED use but i think what we're all dissapointed in is that you claimed you were no longer taking them and i was willing to overlook your past usage due to it being standard pratice in the body building world so feel a bit duped and claiming other boxers take them is a bit of a cop out if you're not willing to name them at least to the BBBofC as i can understand not naming them publically.
I personally would never work with or help any boxers that i know are using PEDS and would only represent clean athletes even if it means they never reach the top.
I think you can still try and make some good out of the situation by warning young amateur boxers and athletes not to make the same mistakes as you and to try and reach the top the clean way rather then looking for a quick fix.
Coco wrote:I still maintain PED's are not rife in the lower weight divisions, mainly because people are looking to cut weight.
I think it is different in the heavies, Tommy Morrison had a lot to say about it.
I never had a drug test and don't know any 6 round fighter that has.
I imagined that some of the more advanced PEDs helped cut redundant weight without leaving the fighter drained and weakened. Some (legal) supplements can give a boost of strength, energy and endurance. It's not difficult to think that some of the out of bounds and illegal supplements/drugs have a similar and more pronounced effect.
Coco wrote:I still maintain PED's are not rife in the lower weight divisions, mainly because people are looking to cut weight.
I think it is different in the heavies, Tommy Morrison had a lot to say about it.
I never had a drug test and don't know any 6 round fighter that has.
I imagined that some of the more advanced PEDs helped cut redundant weight without leaving the fighter drained and weakened. Some (legal) supplements can give a boost of strength, energy and endurance. It's not difficult to think that some of the out of bounds and illegal supplements/drugs have a similar and more pronounced effect.
Diuretics are used to cut water weight and also are used to mask other PEDS.
This is a strange on for me, I actually like Larry , however , he had an unfair advantage over me and some of his other opponents which is wrong especially considering my bout with him was a title elimanotor & he went on to get some big pay days while I decided to call it a day .
I've said it for awhile now that I think there's a lot of heavies on it aswell but I tried to compete man et man the way it should be.
I never once seen or heard of anyone getting tested when I boxed and I think drug testing should be a lot more common once fighters starting getting near the top of rankings as there's a lot of money involved.
To be honest I think the main page headline describing Larry as "disgraced" is pretty pathetic. Just how much of a "drug cheat" he is is open to interpretation , but again to call him "disgraced" as if he was some kind of expenses cheating MP or some kind of teacher caught dating a student, is just over the top sanctimonious crap.
This is the HW boxing division we are talking about!!!!
.surely with the level of opposition that you have faced to date you can never justify taking any performance enhancing drugs? for what reason ?to help keep up with the opposition? shurley not ?