SPOILER - Next move for Amir Khan

[winkveron]

One thing that worries me over Khan is the line of "he needs to move up a weight so he's stronger." Happened after Prescott, and now people are calling for it now. The higher the weight, yes he'll be stronger, but so will his opponents.

This might sound ridiculous but if the Brook fight is too high risk, what about Matthew Hatton at the Bolton Arena. A fairly easy 'homecoming' fight to build up his confidence. Especially if he's keen on 147.

Also, people were saying the idea of a Morales fight was ridiculous but now it doesn't seem so bad. Could Morales be tempted over to Bolton/Manchester?

[iamasadlittleboy]

One thing that worries me over Khan is the line of "he needs to move up a weight so he's stronger." Happened after Prescott, and now people are calling for it now. The higher the weight, yes he'll be stronger, but so will his opponents.

This might sound ridiculous but if the Brook fight is too high risk, what about Matthew Hatton at the Bolton Arena. A fairly easy 'homecoming' fight to build up his confidence. Especially if he's keen on 147.

Also, people were saying the idea of a Morales fight was ridiculous but now it doesn't seem so bad. Could Morales be tempted over to Bolton/Manchester?

Strange thing about 147 at the moment...most the top guys (Bradley, Alexander, Paulie, Bailey, Vargas, Ortiz, Holt and even Pacquiao) fought at 140 in the last 3 years or so

[safeerah]

One thing that worries me over Khan is the line of "he needs to move up a weight so he's stronger." Happened after Prescott, and now people are calling for it now. The higher the weight, yes he'll be stronger, but so will his opponents.

This might sound ridiculous but if the Brook fight is too high risk, what about Matthew Hatton at the Bolton Arena. A fairly easy 'homecoming' fight to build up his confidence. Especially if he's keen on 147.

Also, people were saying the idea of a Morales fight was ridiculous but now it doesn't seem so bad. Could Morales be tempted over to Bolton/Manchester?

Strange thing about 147 at the moment...most the top guys (Bradley, Alexander, Paulie, Bailey, Vargas, Ortiz, Holt and even Pacquiao) fought at 140 in the last 3 years or so

To be honest at times moving up in weight does not mean anything, as people like Ortiz come down from massive weights and balloon up to well over 12 and half stone on fight day, thats why Ortiz was looking to fight Alverez at around 11 stone, when not long ago he was fighting at ten stone.

[winkveron]

Agreed, but what I meant was if he's running away from a weight (as if that was the problem) then the same old problems will inevitably catch up

[iamasadlittleboy]

One thing that worries me over Khan is the line of "he needs to move up a weight so he's stronger." Happened after Prescott, and now people are calling for it now. The higher the weight, yes he'll be stronger, but so will his opponents.

This might sound ridiculous but if the Brook fight is too high risk, what about Matthew Hatton at the Bolton Arena. A fairly easy 'homecoming' fight to build up his confidence. Especially if he's keen on 147.

Also, people were saying the idea of a Morales fight was ridiculous but now it doesn't seem so bad. Could Morales be tempted over to Bolton/Manchester?

Strange thing about 147 at the moment...most the top guys (Bradley, Alexander, Paulie, Bailey, Vargas, Ortiz, Holt and even Pacquiao) fought at 140 in the last 3 years or so

To be honest at times moving up in weight does not mean anything, as people like Ortiz come down from massive weights and balloon up to well over 12 and half stone on fight day, thats why Ortiz was looking to fight Alverez at around 11 stone, when not long ago he was fighting at ten stone.

Maybe but Bradley, Paulie and Vargas were certainly not ballooning that much and yet 2 of them hold a title at 147 and one is a silver belt holder. Bailey and Alexander never looked huge at 140 either and yet they are clashing for the IBF title soonish...

Some, like Ortiz, Chavez and Rios balloon up but most of the top guys at 147 don't seem to have ballooned

[safeerah]

It's the division where the money is, I mean why else would you give up a world title, in some cases, to move up against bigger guys.

[Counter-puncher]

i belive that Team Khan will try to bring him back asap to make up for the time lost with this de-railing.

i think they will try and get Matt Hatton or someone very like him, euro-level welter without a punch.

then try for Paulie's WBA belt, if he still has it in 10 months time.

[Datsue]

i belive that Team Khan will try to bring him back asap to make up for the time lost with this de-railing.

i think they will try and get Matt Hatton or someone very like him, euro-level welter without a punch.

then try for Paulie's WBA belt, if he still has it in 10 months time.

Wotchamate. Is Khan the new Terry Norris, sans punching power, or just the new Mark Breland?

I think a Garcia rematch will tell us: if he manages to skip & flutter & jab his way to a points win, minimising contact, he is the second coming of Norris (sans power); if he gets dragged into an exchange & beheaded then, well, he's Breland-tastic.

If I sound dismissive it's 'cos I'm an awful person, but I do think the kiddie is going to be booked for a career of this: pull out a couple of big wins based on his athleticism & bravery, then someone will expose the technical flaws & his physical frailty & "Goodnight, sweet prince" again.

He's a funny guy; his athletic gifts will see him beat 85% of guys, but he's going to get brutally KO'd again at some point.

[Counter-puncher]

I'm struggling to think of an apt analogy, mate. Breland crossed with Iceskating-Bambi-on-Speed, maybe.

[johnswan1]

Did anyone else notice how slight Khan was looking? He looked off colour and seemed to have less muscle on his frame. He didn't look hungry or up for the fight either.

I also thought that as soon as he stepped up in weight, he'd get KO'd. Seems it's happened before even then. Moving up to Welterweight is pretty pointless now he's been found out. He has proven though that he can box and should still be beating people like Garcia IMO. Should be interesting to see where he goes from here.

I agree, I thought he looked great at the weigh in but small in the fight compared to Garcia.

[Datsue]

I'm struggling to think of an apt analogy, mate. Breland crossed with Iceskating-Bambi-on-Speed, maybe.

Yeah.

The thing that shocks me is that he never seems to learn. How many times is he going to be caught with his feet out of position & head stuck up in the air whilst he flurries with punches that aren't doing damage (merely scoring points), & get hurt?

Sometimes he survives (Peterson, Maidana), sometimes he gets flattened. But it's the same damn thing. He's frustrated the Hell out me forever.

I said to one of my innumerable cousins after the Gomez fight: "I like him, but why is a tall fast guy without a punch fighting like he's Tommy Hearns? Why doesn't he move & box & act defensive?"

& that was what, five years ago? & at that level, he was getting clocked & hurt. Christ.

I know he's a big draw & I certainly enjoy the spectacle of him going to war each time, but man if I see him bounce off the canvas in sections again I'm going to need a neck brace.

[Datsue]

I'm struggling to think of an apt analogy, mate. Breland crossed with Iceskating-Bambi-on-Speed, maybe.

Also, further to one of the Great Themes of our discourse:

Freddie Roach: "I don't teach these guys nothing but how to punch & to bounce around frenetically with their gods-given speed. Defence? What, like the thing demarcating my land from your land?"

[Counter-puncher]

yeah, indeed, same shit Michael Gomez was hitting him with. exactly the problem.

[iamasadlittleboy]

...Apparently it was saying Uchiyama was a future P4P star and Khan had felt the power so he knows >_>

[Scrap]

Anything can be changed, with the correct Psyhcodynamics and Bio mechanics.

[palooka]

Anything can be changed, with the correct Psyhcodynamics and Bio mechanics.

I bow to your knowledge of boxing training and principals Howard; you can't change a persons nature though. You'd have cried with frustration if you'd tried to alter Paul Ryan into a safety first jab and mover, it were't in his nature. Amir wants to be an entertaining boxer; they get the plaudits and the big bucks; though it's a dangerous game I'd sooner watch Khan go for it than see him become an out and out runner.

[Scrap]

Anything can be changed, with the correct Psyhcodynamics and Bio mechanics.

I bow to your knowledge of boxing training and principals Howard; you can't change a persons nature though. You'd have cried with frustration if you'd tried to alter Paul Ryan into a safety first jab and mover, it were't in his nature. Amir wants to be an entertaining boxer; they get the plaudits and the big bucks; though it's a dangerous game I'd sooner watch Khan go for it than see him become an out and out runner.

Actually palooka, after Hale, He left me. Didnt work out.

[Scrap]

Heres a little something http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Tzr_2xU ... e=g-user-u

[PizzaKid]

they said he caught him with a great punch, no he didn't!
he caught him with a sweet left but that shouldn't do that to a top level fighter and anyone like peterson or maidana would have walked through that punch.

I think it would be funny if you took the punch and see how you would deal with it.

[whiskey]

Heres a little something http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Tzr_2xU ... e=g-user-u

Scrap, all that taught me was to never drive a fork lift truck !

[whiskey]

Back to the thread:-

Erik Morales broke Garcia's nose in the 10th round, then got himself floored in the 11th round and eeked over the finishing line. Garcia didn't beat Morales as wide as the scores suggested, but he definitely won.

Meanwhile Khan couldn't budge Garcia in the first couple of rounds. Was sent crashing to the canvas in the 3rd and halted in the 4th.

Erik lost his belt on the scales (142lb) and was not prepared to detriment his chances by taking it off, thus paid the fine.

In light of the above, I suggest a 145lb ten round fight between Khan & Morales.

And if Khan loses that one.....

[Scrap]

Heres a little something http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Tzr_2xU ... e=g-user-u

Scrap, all that taught me was to never drive a fork lift truck !

[Scrap]

Back to the thread:-

Erik Morales broke Garcia's nose in the 10th round, then got himself floored in the 11th round and eeked over the finishing line. Garcia didn't beat Morales as wide as the scores suggested, but he definitely won.

Meanwhile Khan couldn't budge Garcia in the first couple of rounds. Was sent crashing to the canvas in the 3rd and halted in the 4th.

Erik lost his belt on the scales (142lb) and was not prepared to detriment his chances by taking it off, thus paid the fine.

In light of the above, I suggest a 145lb ten round fight between Khan & Morales.

And if Khan loses that one.....

Be a good Fight as it happens it would Sell over Here

[davie]

they said he caught him with a great punch, no he didn't!
he caught him with a sweet left but that shouldn't do that to a top level fighter and anyone like peterson or maidana would have walked through that punch.

I think it would be funny if you took the punch and see how you would deal with it.

why do people persist with arguments like that.
i'm not a trained boxer. so of course i wouldn't deal with punches from world level fighters.
it's utterly ridiculous and makes no point what so ever!

it's like me going on a football forum and saying wayne rooney should have finished that chance he had and someone saying "well do you think you would have finished it?"
no i'm not a £250k per week footballer and i have two left feet, whats your fornicating point caller?

the bottom line is, that was not a big punch for a fighter to take at that level and many top level light welter wieghts would have walked through it relatively unscathed. he will have to absorb many punches like that. and if he can't this will keep happening to him!

[lefty]

they said he caught him with a great punch, no he didn't!
he caught him with a sweet left but that shouldn't do that to a top level fighter and anyone like peterson or maidana would have walked through that punch.

I think it would be funny if you took the punch and see how you would deal with it.

why do people persist with arguments like that.
i'm not a trained boxer. so of course i wouldn't deal with punches from world level fighters.
it's utterly ridiculous and makes no point what so ever!

it's like me going on a football forum and saying wayne rooney should have finished that chance he had and someone saying "well do you think you would have finished it?"
no i'm not a £250k per week footballer and i have two left feet, whats your effing point caller?

the bottom line is, that was not a big punch for a fighter to take at that level and many top level light welter wieghts would have walked through it relatively unscathed. he will have to absorb many punches like that. and if he can't this will keep happening to him!

I have to disagree mate, that was a big shot and Garcia is heavy handed. You could tell by the fact that even when he was hitting the gloves they were thudding, heavy punches. I agree with the rest of your sentiment though, obviously if you're not a trained boxer, etc you're not going to be able to take the kind of punches and so forth that someone who has been doing it for a long time will be able to do.