Anthony Joshua: Thoughts

[gobbles]

For those thinking he got a hometown decision.
Why, then, did the judges have him 3 points behind after 2 close rounds. If some sort of fix was in, surely they wold have had him at least level.

As for anyone who thinks he lacks skills, that's ridiculous. He has power, a good jab, decent left hook and if an Olympic champion after less than 4 years boxing.

How anyone could criticise him is beyond me

[NazNaci1]

As a Brit, I have to say, some of the optimism regarding Joshua's 'wins', 'Gold Medal' and 'talent', is pretty inspirational.

[Coco]

4 years is a long time though, anything could happen, possibly he could be replaced in the squad by the next young star, he might not qualify for the next olympics, he might not win gold in the next olympics, if he can financially secure his future with a big signing on cheque now he would be foolish not to take it.

[The Insider]

Fair play and Congrats to him on an amazing achievement.

I was not impressed by him though. Slow, stiff, didn't look like he could take a shot to me either. Be interesting to see what happens when the headgaurds come off. I hope to be proven wrong but I just don't think he will make an impact. I can see him knocking over the usual suspects in the pros but the first guy that comes for a fight Joshua will come unstuck. Sorry if that sounds negative but from the fights I've seen him in I just haven't been impressed.

[Andrew]

Hear that he's staying am, at least until after the Worlds next year. A wise choice.

Just saw him on BBC news and he sounded keen about winning the World Championships next year. I think this is a wise move due to his age and experience.

I'm not familiar with the amatuer score system but yesterdays result seemed dodgy to me like his 1st fight against Savon. A London born fighter in the final fight of the London Olympics. It wasn't going to end any different was it.

Did watch his fights from the Worlds on Youtube prior to the Olympics and I think he does have some skills that can be utilized in the pro ranks and when he turns over I expect the standard of KOing a lot of bums for a year or so. For me AJ just doesn't use his range anywhere near enougth which is his biggest asset and needs to move his head more. Don't know how much the head guards protect you but Cammarelle did land some pretty good shots in succession which in pro could have floored him. I'm also keen to see how powerful his right hand is at pro as well

When he turns pro I think some time spent in America with trainers such as Manny Steward and some top sparring would do him great, a lot of trainers would be very keen to work with him.

Gotta admit the inevitable Lennox Lewis comparisons from the Mail Sun etc will really annoy me. At the age Joshua started boxing Lennox was fighting in his 1st Olympics.

[jameswilson]

The Lewis comparisons are obviously gonna grate, Lewis looked supreme in beating Riddick Bowe in his final. If Joshua does turn pro he needs to have the right fights, the right trainer and the right sparring. As mentioned a trip to the USA for sparring would do him a lot of good.

[Counter-puncher]

technically i don't like the way his head leans forward over his front foot.

[ScottDetonator]

If the deal is on the table and the money ready to be banked, then I'd take the deal and turn pro. He could now write his own cheque for an amazing amount of money. Take the money now while it is on offer.

To wait longer, well, anything can happen. What if he get's a bad injury in a years time? What if things in his personal life take a turn for the worse? What if he has a poor World's in 2 years time and another young star comes along, sure he'll still get a decent amount but not the gold now that will secure his future for virtually his lifetime. If it was me, I'd play it cool but take the money while it's good and boy, will it be good

[Deserter]

As for anyone who thinks he lacks skills, that's ridiculous. He has power, a good jab, decent left hook and if an Olympic champion after less than 4 years boxing.

How anyone could criticise him is beyond me

It's all relative. Surely you can't deny that division looked weak as anything and devoid of talent?
I'm not critical of him as such, as he's done a great job in context, but I do think he lacks skills, for sure.

[stujones]

If a fighter wins gold and does have ambitions someday to turn pro, then he should turn straight after the Olympics. Strike while the iron is hot and all that.

What if he loses in the worlds or doesn't even qualify then it could jeopordise his earning power somewhat in the Pro's. He's got the ultimately accolade in amateur boxing now.

[Counter-puncher]

As for anyone who thinks he lacks skills, that's ridiculous. He has power, a good jab, decent left hook and if an Olympic champion after less than 4 years boxing.

How anyone could criticise him is beyond me

It's all relative. Surely you can't deny that division looked weak as anything and devoid of talent?
I'm not critical of him as such, as he's done a great job in context, but I do think he lacks skills, for sure.

i know what you mean deserter, i mean he might technically be able to throw a jab/hook just fine, but he seems to lack the 'natural' fluid ability to put his various skills together in the ring.

he's like Ogogo, in my opinion, in that they both have good basic athletic talent but end up appearing somewhat stiff and awkward because they have to 'think' as they go along and it stiffens them up, as opposed to being able to perform their skills intuitively because they've performed so many repetitions that they are second nature to them.

[Lenny]

He certainly doesn't look as fragile as Ogogo but I know what you mean. Surely this is one of the reasons he is thinking about staying amateur, competing at a higher level and gaining more experience will help his flow a lot more than fighting 3 times a year against crap. He is already sparing the pros and gaining experience that way. It might hurt his bank balance in the short term but could increase the likelihood of him becoming a champion

And for the people who are saying the super heavyweights were in general much poorer than the lower weight classes, of course they were, it mirrors the pro game in that respect

[Deserter]

And for the people who are saying the super heavyweights were in general much poorer than the lower weight classes, of course they were, it mirrors the pro game in that respect

And everyone knows that, but I don't think I'm alone in thinking this year was really, really bad. I'm perhaps sounding a bit harsh, but the final looked like a pair of club fighters at time in terms of the way they were just whaling away at each other.

[tear up]

I think the guys a super star in the makin uless they can give him big penny's to stay am hell turn pro was surprised how many fights he s had only 45

[tonyevs]

4 years is a long time though, anything could happen, possibly he could be replaced in the squad by the next young star, he might not qualify for the next olympics, he might not win gold in the next olympics, if he can financially secure his future with a big signing on cheque now he would be foolish not to take it.

I totally agree.

I hear he is staying amateur for another year. Much like Amir Khan did. I would imagine he will follow a similar plan too.

Amir entered the ABA`s and soon found himself on his backside as the competition heated up .. and promptly pulled out of them ASAP.
Anthony Joshua is young enough to absorb a loss or two among the amateurs. As the scoring is presently .. nobody takes it too seriously with an eye of turning pro.
But a stoppage loss would be a whole different story.
So unless a big punching young s-heavy arrives on the scene in the next year .. he may just stick to his plan.

[gobbles]

As for anyone who thinks he lacks skills, that's ridiculous. He has power, a good jab, decent left hook and if an Olympic champion after less than 4 years boxing.

How anyone could criticise him is beyond me

It's all relative. Surely you can't deny that division looked weak as anything and devoid of talent?
I'm not critical of him as such, as he's done a great job in context, but I do think he lacks skills, for sure.

The division wasn't bad at all. Cammarelle the first defending Olympic super-heavy champion ever, Savon, Ivan Dycho, Medzhidov, the Russian Omarov, who smashed up the American, was decent, so was the French guy Yoka and the German Pfeifer.
You either don't follow international amateur boxing and are just saying that as a way of slagging of Joshua. Just because a few bouts ended up with strange style clashes, or technical affairs, did not mean it was short on talent.
This lot compare very well to, for instance, the bunch Povetkin beat in 2004, or who Klitschko beat in 1996.

[Deserter]

As for anyone who thinks he lacks skills, that's ridiculous. He has power, a good jab, decent left hook and if an Olympic champion after less than 4 years boxing.

How anyone could criticise him is beyond me

It's all relative. Surely you can't deny that division looked weak as anything and devoid of talent?
I'm not critical of him as such, as he's done a great job in context, but I do think he lacks skills, for sure.

The division wasn't bad at all. Cammarelle the first defending Olympic super-heavy champion ever, Savon, Ivan Dycho, Medzhidov, the Russian Omarov, who smashed up the American, was decent, so was the French guy Yoka and the German Pfeifer.
You either don't follow international amateur boxing and are just saying that as a way of slagging of Joshua. Just because a few bouts ended up with strange style clashes, or technical affairs, did not mean it was short on talent.
This lot compare very well to, for instance, the bunch Povetkin beat in 2004, or who Klitschko beat in 1996.

Cammerelle has definitely declined in the past four years - witness the flat-footed slugging match in the semis against Medzhidov. Dycho looked shocking against Joshua... non-existent jab, leaning back with his chin in the air constantly and a complete arm puncher... I could go on. Savon was the only decent talent on display in my opinion. And just because I can be objective in the case of a British fighter doesn't mean I have an agenda against them, that's a ridiculous assertion. I guess I'm making up those lunging 'hail mary' right hands he was throwing that even an ageing Cammerelle could see coming a mile off, or the virtual lack of any lateral movement from either of them?
If you think that division had a lot of talent on display I'm genuinely lost for words...

[sendo]

SHW Division is certainly stronger now than 2008.

Desperation to write off Joshua reminds me of the bitter shite I used to read about David Haye and Carl Froch on here when they went pros, people claiming they wouldn't even win the British title in their own weightclass

[NazNaci1]

I have to agree, Deserter. The quality in the SHW Division was shocking. It really was, and for all the reasons you specify. It is laughable that some are trying to justify the shocking quality aswell as the shocking circumstances for the winner. It has nothing to do with hating or having an agenda. If something is bad, you say so, regardless of jingoistic hype and bias.

[toomanyshots]

Stay amateur.......He has just won gold!!!

Harrison made a right few quid and done okay after winning gold.....

He should stay on until next olympics.....He would never get the same education early in the pros as he would in the ams.

He would be fighting world class after world class in every tournament......

You couldn't get that education anywhere else....then turn pro and after 10 fights a world title fight....

forget bumming around for a couple years in the pros fighting journeymen......

[gobbles]

I have to agree, Deserter. The quality in the SHW Division was shocking. It really was, and for all the reasons you specify. It is laughable that some are trying to justify the shocking quality aswell as the shocking circumstances for the winner. It has nothing to do with hating or having an agenda. If something is bad, you say so, regardless of jingoistic hype and bias.

I find it shocking that people claim they are being objective by being merely negative.

How many of the super-heavyweight fights did you actually see? How many of the boxers had you ever seen before the Olympics? Yet you write it off as "shocking". If you wrote about the pros on here with such ill-placed certainty, you'd be laughed at.

The very nature of the Olympics means very few boxers are unlikely to be at their very best there, because a: they need to be prepared to have multiple fights in a few days to succeed, b: they are over quick and are often technical, so it is often as much about not giving up shots as landing them, c: the pressure.

That does not mean the quality is shocking. It's the realities of tournament boxing. Even Lomachenko and Usyk, who could beat most world class pros tomorrow, did not always look fantastic. La Cruz, the Cuban light-heavy, is a sensational fighter, because he tried to cruise his way through his quarter-final.

The nature of the fights also tends to be 2 quietish rounds, before someone has to go for it in the last, hence many fights had far bigger scores in the last round then the first 2, the biggest example of that was Berinych, who was trailing after 2 in his semi and scored something like 18 points.

Cammarelle boxed a brilliant fight to win his semi over the Azerbaijani, Joshua tried to outjab Cammarelle in the first two rounds (Cammarelle's best shot, as he showed against Price, is the southpaw right hook) but then had to go for a punch-up, which he won.

Dychko was made to look bad against Joshua. He had gambled on moving and landing hooks rather than staying with him, because Dychko (who is pretty young and growing into his size) has come of worst in punch-ups before (such as his fight against Medzhidov at the worlds). But he got outjabbed. Dychko had looked excellent beating the German and the Canadian.

The rush to do down Joshua's achievements is the most shocking thing here.

[Deserter]

That does not mean the quality is shocking. It's the realities of tournament boxing. Even Lomachenko and Usyk, who could beat most world class pros tomorrow, did not always look fantastic.

They still looked light years ahead of their Super Heavy counterparts, which has been my point all along. I'm genuinely mystified on two counts. One, why you gloss over the glaring technical deficiencies on display by most of the big men and two, why you are determined to try and portray this as some sort of campaign against Joshua? In terms of the latter I'd love nothing more than a new great British heavyweight to emerge, but just feel it's far too premature to be annointing him as the saviour given he's clearly still got a lot to work on.... you only have to look at how Audley turned out to see the danger of rushing towards premature conclusions.
There has been plenty of nuanced constructive criticism on here by a number of posters and the attempt to dismiss it all simply as negativity and bias is absurd and does you no favours.

[Gray-Fox]

The Lewis comparisons are obviously gonna grate, Lewis looked supreme in beating Riddick Bowe in his final. If Joshua does turn pro he needs to have the right fights, the right trainer and the right sparring. As mentioned a trip to the USA for sparring would do him a lot of good.

Can he enter the USA after a drug conviction?

[Scrap]

As for anyone who thinks he lacks skills, that's ridiculous. He has power, a good jab, decent left hook and if an Olympic champion after less than 4 years boxing.

How anyone could criticise him is beyond me

It's all relative. Surely you can't deny that division looked weak as anything and devoid of talent?
I'm not critical of him as such, as he's done a great job in context, but I do think he lacks skills, for sure.

The division wasn't bad at all. Cammarelle the first defending Olympic super-heavy champion ever, Savon, Ivan Dycho, Medzhidov, the Russian Omarov, who smashed up the American, was decent, so was the French guy Yoka and the German Pfeifer.
You either don't follow international amateur boxing and are just saying that as a way of slagging of Joshua. Just because a few bouts ended up with strange style clashes, or technical affairs, did not mean it was short on talent.
This lot compare very well to, for instance, the bunch Povetkin beat in 2004, or who Klitschko beat in 1996.

Correct.

[clubberlang]

I still haven’t got round to watching the final will have a look tonight.

I was impressed with AJ’s adaptability, he looked limited had a hard draw and yet was very competitive against every opponent (he got the rub of the green against Savon) which is outstanding for a guy with only 4 years worth of experience.

I think the powers there, I think the chin is there, his right hand was a fast sneaky shot, when he actually used his jab it looked good. Ok he’s lacking imagination and refinement but I will guarantee with a good pro trainer he can really make a noise as a pro.