Did Ali believe Dundee was the devil?

[rrefs]

Ali has said that he believed white people were the devil on a television show once. I can't remember what show it was but probably in the 70s. He was so sure if it he stopped the show to get a bible and showed where he thought it said white people are the devil.

[The Great John L]

Dundee wasn't white. I met him in the 70's and he had a nice Mediterranian tan/olive tone skin color.

[NYDominican]

Ali has said that he believed white people were the devil on a television show once. I can't remember what show it was but probably in the 70s. He was so sure if it he stopped the show to get a bible and showed where he thought it said white people are the devil.

________________________________________________________



I'd say that no, Muhammad Ali didn't believe that Angelo Dundee was the devil.


There are different levels & degrees of prejudice & racism.


One can have friends & acquaintences from other "races". But, at the same time, still not like the other race collectively.


True, Muhammad did say that about White people. When Ali did make that comment, it was on a show back in the 1970s. He also used the Bible as a reference point.


One also has to realize the era when Muhammad made his statement against Whites. --- It was the 1970s.

The decade prior to the 1970s, the 1960s, was very tumultuous. With a tremendous degree of racial division & polarization between African-Americans & White-Americans.


In addition, in the 1960s, there were several, hardcore left wing African American organizations like the Black Panther Party (BPP --- The original one, NOT the New Black Panther Party), Nation of Islam (NOI), US Organization (Formerly known as the US Slaves Organization. -- Their founders Maulana Karenga & Hakim Jamal) & the Nation of Gods and Earths ((Aka --- 5 Percenters Organization. Their founder, Clarence Edward Smith (ClarenceX)).


I list these organzations, because Ali was totally aware of them.


At this time frame, Ali & these organizations (Which I listed in my paragraph above) were not too fond of Whites collectively.



But, it seems that throughout the 1980s, Muhammad has mellowed in his hatred for Whites.



Muhammad liked Angelo Dundee.


Ali also liked many other White people.


Another White which Muhammad liked was Jewish-American, Howard Cosell.

[NYDominican]

Dundee wasn't white. I met him in the 70's and he had a nice Mediterranian tan/olive tone skin color.

_________________________________________________________



With all due respect, Angelo Dundee was White.


Angelo was Italian-American. Regarding the United States (US) group dynamics & racial dynamics, Italian-Americans & Sicilian-Americans fall under the racial classification of "White".


I listed Sicilians separately from Italians. Because way back, Sicilians were barred from entering into the US. Due to them being stereotyped as being members &/or associates of the "Black Hand".


From 1865 till 1930, Italian-Americans & Sicilian-Americans were not viewed as being Whites by English-Americans who controlled the means of production & who made the policies in the US.


From 1865 till 1930, Jewish-Americans & Irish-Americans were also not viewed as being Whites by English-Americans who controlled the means of production & who made the policies in this nation.


Examples of this. --- 1. Italian-Americans & Sicilian-Americans were discriminated against in the areas of housing & job hiring.


In addition, many Italians & Sicilians were even lynched throughout the US. Primarily in the states of Louisiana & in Colorado. In Louisiana, many Italians & Sicilians were lynched on JUST the suspicion that they were members or associates of the Black Hand.


2. Jewish-Americans & Irish-Americans were discriminated against in the areas of housing & job hiring.


Way back, there used to be signs in windows of restaurants in Manhattan & in Boston which said. --- "No dogs, no cats, no Jews, no Irish & no rats allowed".


But, from 1910 till 1920, the English-Americans who controlled the means of production & who made the policies could see the businessses.

Also, the spending & earning power of the Italian-Americans, Sicilian-Americans, Jewish-Americans & Irish-Americans.

They could also see their potential as a vital voting bloc.


So, from 1920 till 1923, English-Americans who controlled the means of production & who made the policies decided to give Italian-Americans, Sicilian-Americans, Jewish-Americans & Irish-Americans a path to "Whiteness" in this nation.


By 1930, Italian-Americans, Sicilian-Americans, Jewish-Americans & Irish-Americans were fully accepted as being White.

[scallum]

Ali grew up in the super racist south of 1940s - 1960 ,as a youngster he prob said and did stupid things as humans to do. In his beliefs now there is no hate of any peoples

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Dundee helped make Ali money, most racists are hypocritical when it comes to that. He was also young and influenced by Malcolm X's hatred when those comments were made. He later grew into being his own man.

[scallum]

Even Malcolm broke away from the racist Nation of Islam and changed his views becoming more embraced with Orthodox Islam. I think Ali had
Genuine likeness for Dundee. I heard somewhere that he originally wanted Srr to be his trainer

[Seamus]

When his one daughter married a white man, he went to the wedding.

[man]

maybe i am too tired, but this seems to be
a really weird thread,

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Even Malcolm broke away from the racist Nation of Islam and changed his views becoming more embraced with Orthodox Islam. I think Ali had
Genuine likeness for Dundee. I heard somewhere that he originally wanted Srr to be his trainer

Malcolm was a scum bag.

[BoxBuzz]

Kentucky can not be considered part of the old "South" though the confederacy at times claimed both Kentucky and West Virgina......those states never concurred with the "draft".

History and Geography would do ya a bit of good here.

[scallum]

Malcolm went to Mecca and saw whites ,blacks and others treating each as brothers . When he came back to Usa he changed his views on how he viewed whites. In black community he is viewed by many with extreme honor for taking a fighting stance against extremely oppressive society. Malcolm changed his views even before Ali did

[SaadOffTheDeck]

He was a racist that used his charisma and intelligence to preach violence and hatred to easily influenced young blacks. I'm aware he is revered by many, that is their prerogative, I think he was shit.

[The Great John L]

Dundee wasn't white. I met him in the 70's and he had a nice Mediterranian tan/olive tone skin color.

_________________________________________________________



With all due respect, Angelo Dundee was White.


Angelo was Italian-American. Regarding the United States (US) group dynamics & racial dynamics, Italian-Americans & Sicilian-Americans fall under the racial classification of "White".


I listed Sicilians separately from Italians. Because way back, Sicilians were barred from entering into the US. Due to them being stereotyped as being members &/or associates of the "Black Hand".


From 1865 till 1930, Italian-Americans & Sicilian-Americans were not viewed as being Whites by English-Americans who controlled the means of production & who made the policies in the US.


From 1865 till 1930, Jewish-Americans & Irish-Americans were also not viewed as being Whites by English-Americans who controlled the means of production & who made the policies in this nation.


Examples of this. --- 1. Italian-Americans & Sicilian-Americans were discriminated against in the areas of housing & job hiring.


In addition, many Italians & Sicilians were even lynched throughout the US. Primarily in the states of Louisiana & in Colorado. In Louisiana, many Italians & Sicilians were lynched on JUST the suspicion that they were members or associates of the Black Hand.


2. Jewish-Americans & Irish-Americans were discriminated against in the areas of housing & job hiring.


Way back, there used to be signs in windows of restaurants in Manhattan & in Boston which said. --- "No dogs, no cats, no Jews, no Irish & no rats allowed".


But, from 1910 till 1920, the English-Americans who controlled the means of production & who made the policies could see the businessses.

Also, the spending & earning power of the Italian-Americans, Sicilian-Americans, Jewish-Americans & Irish-Americans.

They could also see their potential as a vital voting bloc.


So, from 1920 till 1923, English-Americans who controlled the means of production & who made the policies decided to give Italian-Americans, Sicilian-Americans, Jewish-Americans & Irish-Americans a path to "Whiteness" in this nation.


By 1930, Italian-Americans, Sicilian-Americans, Jewish-Americans & Irish-Americans were fully accepted as being White.

8)

That was way too easy.

[scallum]

He was a racist that used his charisma and intelligence to preach violence and hatred to easily influenced young blacks. I'm aware he is revered by many, that is their prerogative, I think he was shit.

He changed his views and believed all peoples were brothers at the time of his death. He grew up in pure hate having a few relatives lynched it is good a person like him could change his views and be peaceful with everyone. Him changing his views likely contributed to his death

[Crease]

Throughout his career, Ali made quite a few racist comments toward white people, but they are often overlooked because he was successful and popular.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

He was a racist that used his charisma and intelligence to preach violence and hatred to easily influenced young blacks. I'm aware he is revered by many, that is their prerogative, I think he was shit.

He changed his views and believed all peoples were brothers at the time of his death. He grew up in pure hate having a few relatives lynched it is good a person like him could change his views and be peaceful with everyone. Him changing his views likely contributed to his death

That's between him and God, his life was full of promoting hate and violence. Nobody is perfect but it's sad to see someone like that looked at as a hero when he was full of hate and racism. It sickens me that he is forever mentioned in the same breath as a great man like Martin Luther King.

[scallum]

He was a racist that used his charisma and intelligence to preach violence and hatred to easily influenced young blacks. I'm aware he is revered by many, that is their prerogative, I think he was shit.

He changed his views and believed all peoples were brothers at the time of his death. He grew up in pure hate having a few relatives lynched it is good a person like him could change his views and be peaceful with everyone. Him changing his views likely contributed to his death

That's between him and God, his life was full of promoting hate and violence. Nobody is perfect but it's sad to see someone like that looked at as a hero when he was full of hate and racism. It sickens me that he is forever mentioned in the same breath as a great man like Martin Luther King.

He for sure a was victim of a most oppressive society towrds him and his kind. If hate and violence is thrown at you for no reason , what would most folks throw back? Many were not down with the letting the oppressors continue to shit on them and their kids while just smile and take it that Martin promoted . The oppressed folks I mentioned were already a defeated peoples imo the real evil was the folks that continued to oppress and make life miserable for them. Luckily those are times long past away

[SaadOffTheDeck]

If you're enamored with a racist hate mongol because he had a rough upbringing, more power to you. Malcolm X was never enslaved, things were definitely difficult for blacks in those days. He made it worse while King, who you shamefully mock, made things better. Agreed that it's lucky those times are past, maybe someday the day will pass when people insinuate that a great leader like MLK was an uncle Tom.

[scallum]

I did not say I was enamored by him nor did I say I agree with him. What I'm saying is it takes more strength than most have to see your father and uncles murdered by a hate group , house burned down by same hate group, constantly terrorized as a child by hate group and at the time of his death love blacks and whites as brothers. Can you imagine what it feels like as a kid to be constantly terrorized by the Kkk? Perhaps this helped drive his mom insane? I'm just grateful I was not born until after this madness had ceased. Back to the Topic , Ali had the same views as Malcomn so he should be labeled a racist too? Ali just like Malcolm actually changed his views if most forgive Ali the same should apply to others

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Ali was a racist at the time of these comments, no doubt about it. I have nothing to forgive Muhammad or Malcolm for, neither have ever done anything to me. I just tire of reading about a man who stood for hate revered as some sort of saint and Malcolm is relevant to the topic. His racism and hatred clearly affected Ali, though Muhammad has to be held accountable for his own actions. His treatment of Frazier was as racist as it gets.

[scallum]

I am very interested in how a person like him can change his hate to views of brotherhood.

[enrique]

As one who knows all the players let me tell my side of the story. When Ali first became a Black Muslim he was very racist but as time passed he changed and the change came due to the fact that the Muslims used very much but separated themselves and did not help him when he began facing legal troubles with the draft board. As Ali went through his years of exile the people who helped him financially were white: Chris and Angelo Dundee, Ferdie Pacheco and others like Leroy Nieman. Ali is still a believer of Islam but since those days he has set himself apart from radical Islam and after 9/11 has used his influence as a moderate voice in the Islamic world.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

I don't think Malcolm ever changed a thing.

[Giancarlo]

I don't think Malcolm ever changed a thing.

apart from his name and his undies and socks?