Biggest Puncher at Heavy – Definitive, of all-time, ever...

[Ezzard]

I know a lot of statisticians…well maybe not a lot…but enough of them that it would be “statistically significant”. A couple of these mischievous witch doctors put a task to me.

Who is the hardest puncher at heavyweight ever…?

The criteria they gave me…

Count the number of clean KO wins they have over world class or fringe world class fighters who are heavier or equal in weight to them… (within less than a pound)

Okay… (I reserve the right to have messed it up). All the guys up to and including Dempsey do not have all weights listed so may have missed out on more as I simply didn’t count those fights…

Jack Dempsey 6
Rocky Marciano 6

Bob Fitzsimmons 3
Joe Louis 3
Earnie Shavers 3
Evander Holyfield 3

Muhammed Ali 2
Mike Tyson 2
Lennox Lewis 2

Jack Johnson 1
Sonny Liston 1
Ken Norton 1
Larry Holmes 1
Riddick Bowe 1

James Jeffries 0
Joe Frazier 0
George Foreman 0

[Jaywheel]

boilermaker, is that you?

[The Great John L]

Where do you get the 3 for Louis? Leaving out a few guys that were only slightly bigger than him, I've got 7:

Nova
Galento
Simon
B Baer
M Baer
Uzcudun
Carnera

And he beat a few of them twice.

[Ezzard]

Where do you get the 3 for Louis? Leaving out a few guys that were only slightly bigger than him, I've got 7:

Nova
Galento
Simon
B Baer
M Baer
Uzcudun
Carnera

And he beat a few of them twice.

Not clean KOs, John.

[The Great John L]

Where do you get the 3 for Louis? Leaving out a few guys that were only slightly bigger than him, I've got 7:

Nova
Galento
Simon
B Baer
M Baer
Uzcudun
Carnera

And he beat a few of them twice.

Not clean KOs, John.

Sorry, missed that.

[Ezzard]

Be 100% honest...

You're smirking at Foreman's stat, aren't you???

[HomicideHenry]

Sam Langford would have to be number one.

Dempsey and Marciano tie for second.

Bob Fitzsimmons places third in my estimation.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Louis, Foreman & Shavers are my top 3. Order can change by the day.

[SamWise72]

The way you have explained this, it's a pound for pound thing, rather than an actual hardest puncher.

[Boilermaker]

boilermaker, is that you?

NO, I would have counted more than 3 for Fitzsimmons with:

Maher, Ruhlin, Corbett, Sharkey, Bill Slavin, Dooley, Stelzner, Dunkhorst, godfrey, and leaving out a few.

Of course, a few of those might have been up for debate.

[Ezzard]

The way you have explained this, it's a pound for pound thing, rather than an actual hardest puncher.

Sam

These lads were just trying to put it to me that size is a bigger issue than people are willing to accept. This was their way of putting across their point. These are some of the hardest punchers in the history of the sport...and the numbers are quite low.

[The Great John L]

boilermaker, is that you?

NO, I would have counted more than 3 for Fitzsimmons with:

Maher, Ruhlin, Corbett, Sharkey, Bill Slavin, Dooley, Stelzner, Dunkhorst, godfrey, and leaving out a few.

Of course, a few of those might have been up for debate.

Good point about Fitz.

[Jaywheel]

boilermaker, is that you?

NO, I would have counted more than 3 for Fitzsimmons with:

Maher, Ruhlin, Corbett, Sharkey, Bill Slavin, Dooley, Stelzner, Dunkhorst, godfrey, and leaving out a few.

Of course, a few of those might have been up for debate.

I knew I could count on you.

[dempseyfire]

I think Shavers is #1. Never a great finisher, but I don't think there is any other HW who could change a whole fight's trajectory on one punch, and even seemingly not a hard punch, like Shavers. And he kept his one-punch power into his 40s.

[scallum]

Like someone else mentioned Langford would have to be #1

[Ambling Alp II]

Shavers is #1, foreman #2, then it gets more difficult. Probably Tyson at # 3.

[HomicideHenry]

Everyone is forgetting this is about smaller men beating bigger men, and this equals out to who was the biggest puncher at heavyweight pound for pound, not who the hardest puncher in heavyweight history was period. Honorable mentions: Mickey Walker (he kayoed many fringe heavyweight contenders), and Bob Satterfield.

[Ambling Alp II]

Ok, I guess we should be going by the criteria that was a the beggining, as silly as it is.

It does depend on what consitutes a world-class/fringe world class fighter? Have to be in the top 10?

[SaadOffTheDeck]

I suppose you can drop Foreman since he was large for his day. I'm still left with Joe Louis & Shavers.

[HomicideHenry]

Ok, I guess we should be going by the criteria that was a the beggining, as silly as it is.

It does depend on what consitutes a world-class/fringe world class fighter? Have to be in the top 10?

Someone on the fringe, I would classify as someone in the top 20. 20-11, round abouts.

[crusader]

Everyone is forgetting this is about smaller men beating bigger men, and this equals out to who was the biggest puncher at heavyweight pound for pound.

It doesn't equate to the biggest puncher, pound for pound, at heavyweight, because it precludes the possibility that someone who qualifies as a 'big man' actually has more power, pound for pound, than all other heavyweights.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Everyone is forgetting this is about smaller men beating bigger men, and this equals out to who was the biggest puncher at heavyweight pound for pound.

It doesn't equate to the biggest puncher, pound for pound, at heavyweight, because it precludes the possibility that someone who qualifies as a 'big man' actually has more power, pound for pound, than all other heavyweights.

I'm pretty surprised I'm the only one to mention The Brown Bomber.

[Ezzard]

The whole point was to show that size has an impact on all aspects of boxing. Earnie Shavers was probably the best signle puncher. But as my friends pointed out he didn't score many clean KOs against men who weighed more than him... He managed 3... 2 of them were against guys in their winter years.

If you don't like it, don't post. Or do post, waste your own time. It's fine by me.

Isn't anyone surprised by the results? There's nothing definitive about it but it's something to think about.

[Ambling Alp II]

I think it is somewhat interesting in a way. The biggest problem is "clean Ko's." Those have gotton harder and harder to come by over the years. The referee have stopped fights earlier and earlier as the years have gone on. Many of the "clean ko" from fighters from years ago would not have happened under more modern standards. The fight would have been stopped earlier.

It would be better to count TKos. Of course that would hurt fighters from older eras somewaht because some fights went the distance that would have stopped in more recent times. Still, it would be a somwhat more accurrate in judging someone's power.

Not surprised by Shavers not doing better. He wasn't a good finisher and could stopped himself easier than most of the fighters mentioned.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

Who were the two guys bigger than Lewis that he stopped cold? I can't think of one. If Michael Grant was bigger than Lennox, then a lot of guys should have more.