Worst officials.

[si7dog7]

sorry to harp on about Taylor v Chavez
but I did read somewhere, a long time ago, that Meldrick was severely dehydrated after the fight (I know, I know - not uncommon) but in this case, doctors/medics were genuinely concerned for his general wellfare.

Steele is still vilified for this decision to this day. Maybe it is lucky tht he wasn't clock watching and saved any further puncers from being thrown.

Should be in the Hall of Fame as far as I am concerned.

[Rover]

sorry to harp on about Taylor v Chavez
but I did read somewhere, a long time ago, that Meldrick was severely dehydrated after the fight (I know, I know - not uncommon) but in this case, doctors/medics were genuinely concerned for his general wellfare.

Steele is still vilified for this decision to this day. Maybe it is lucky tht he wasn't clock watching and saved any further puncers from being thrown.

Should be in the Hall of Fame as far as I am concerned.

They interviewed the doctor who examined Taylor after the fight for Legendary Nights on HBO. Taylor had a facial fracture and was urinating pure blood. He really took a pounding.

[keithmoonhangover]

Typical non-response. The only thing that ever came out were rumors about King and Steele. What boxers are you referring to, and what did they "know"? Try again.
It's no different than one boxer's accusing another (while providing no evidence) of the use of banned substances, like, as one example, Pascal did with B-Hop.
"Take the test! You're a fuckin cheater!"
That baseless charge doesn't have any additional credibility because Pascal's a fighter. If there were actual evidence of this Steele/King relationship, rather than rumors and paranoia, "the boxers involved" should've let the rest of us in on it.
I also love how Steele bashers conveniently ignore facts that go against their conspiracy nonsense, like how Steele took a point from King fighter Chavez (yes, the same one of Taylor fame) in the 9th round against Laporte in a very close fight, or how the same Steele took two points from Chavez that cost him his title v. Randall. Chavez was so angry after that fight that, through interpreter Gladys Rosa in the post-fight interview, he said he wanted to sue Steele.
Those are FACTS, not rumors.

Lennox Lewis refused to have Richard Steele referee any his title fights. It was documented at the time and I was told by a VERY reliable source that Lennox didn't trust Steele's decision making.

[Rover]

Ah, so fights not involving King. Is that the best you have? So the best you have is that a fighter didn't trust Steele? That's it?
Of course, Lewis trusted Steele enough to ref NONTITLE fights.

[keithmoonhangover]

Ah, so fights not involving King. Is that the best you have? So the best you have is that a fighter didn't trust Steele? That's it?
Of course, Lewis trusted Steele enough to ref NONTITLE fights.

Lewis fought plenty of fights involving King (I thought you would know that) and when Steele was allocated as referee, Lewis demanded a change.

Which non-title fights of Lewis did Steele ref?

[Rover]

Ah, so fights not involving King. Is that the best you have? So the best you have is that a fighter didn't trust Steele? That's it?
Of course, Lewis trusted Steele enough to ref NONTITLE fights.

Lewis fought plenty of fights involving King (I thought you would know that) and when Steele was allocated as referee, Lewis demanded a change.

Which non-title fights of Lewis did Steele ref?

This place is called...Boxrec. And according to you, Lewis refused to have Steele ref *any* title fight. King didn't promote all of Lewis's title opponents.

[Rover]

Lennox Lewis refused to have Richard Steele referee any his title fights. It was documented at the time and I was told by a VERY reliable source that Lennox didn't trust Steele's decision making.

That's what you said. No mention of King there.
If you'd just said you thought Steele had two bad stoppages--Chavez/Taylor and Tyson/Ruddock--that'd have been one thing. I think Tyson/Ruddock was stopped prematurely, though I don't think it changed the outcome of the fight in terms of whom the winner would've been. However, you brought up this "on the take" crap.
The only thing you've shown is that Lewis didn't think Steele was a good ref--except when it came to nontitle fights.

[keithmoonhangover]

Lewis refused Steele when he was proposed and the VERY reliable source that told me was...... Lennox Lewis.

[Rover]

Lewis refused Steele when he was proposed and the VERY reliable source that told me was...... Lennox Lewis.

And he trusted him when it came to NONTITLE fights. Yeah, makes sense to have someone ref your fight whose judgment you don't trust.
So claim whatever you like about what Lewis told you about Steele. I know for a fact that Lewis permitted Steele to ref him after Chavez/Taylor and Tyson/Ruddock.

[keithmoonhangover]

Lewis refused Steele when he was proposed and the VERY reliable source that told me was...... Lennox Lewis.

And he trusted him when it came to NONTITLE fights. Yeah, makes sense to have someone ref your fight whose judgment you don't trust.

Lewis' judgement on the matter came about after he became champion. He refused Steele for both McCall fights.... FACT. Both fights involving a King promoted fighter.... FACT.

One question for you before I go..... Who knows better on the matter, Rover or Lennox Lewis?

[Rover]

Nice try, but you claimed that Lewis refused Steele for all his title fights. Then you try to sneak King into the mix. Lewis fought non-King opponents. If Lewis refused Steele because he didn't trust his judgment, then why did Steele ref a fight of Lewis's after Chavez/Taylor and Tyson/Ruddock?
Those are documented FACTS.
Keep playing.
And you still haven't presented an iota of evidence of Steele's corruption--unless you include the beliefs of a fighter who allowed him to ref him AFTER the controversial fights had occurred.
Too easy.
Did you finally get around to looking up Lewis's record, Keith?
The best you can do is say Lewis questioned Steele's judgment after he became champion?
That makes zero sense. Steele reffed Lewis after the controversial fights. What did Lewis's becoming champion have to do with anything? If Steele's judgment was bad, then it was bad. Are you claiming Lewis didn't see Chavez/Taylor and Tyson/Ruddock I before he became champion?
Oh, that's right: you're going to go.
Adios.

[keithmoonhangover]

Nice try, but you claimed that Lewis refused Steele for all his title fights. Then you try to sneak King into the mix. Lewis fought non-King opponents. If Lewis refused Steele because he didn't trust his judgment, then why did Steele ref a fight of Lewis's after Chavez/Taylor and Tyson/Ruddock?
Those are documented FACTS.
Keep playing.
And you still haven't presented an iota of evidence of Steele's corruption--unless you include the beliefs of a fighter who allowed him to ref him AFTER the controversial fights had occurred.
Too easy.

Who knows better on the matter, Rover or Lennox Lewis?

[Rover]

Lennox Lewis refused to have Richard Steele referee any his title fights. It was documented at the time and I was told by a VERY reliable source that Lennox didn't trust Steele's decision making.

That was your claim, Keith. Nothing about King. This all started because of your "on the take" crap. So as evidence you offer something that doesn't have anything to do with corruption. Then you try to sneak King back in later on.

And if letting someone ref one of your fights is an indication of trust of judgment, Lewis trusted Steele's, and that's documented.

[Rover]

Nice try, but you claimed that Lewis refused Steele for all his title fights. Then you try to sneak King into the mix. Lewis fought non-King opponents. If Lewis refused Steele because he didn't trust his judgment, then why did Steele ref a fight of Lewis's after Chavez/Taylor and Tyson/Ruddock?
Those are documented FACTS.
Keep playing.
And you still haven't presented an iota of evidence of Steele's corruption--unless you include the beliefs of a fighter who allowed him to ref him AFTER the controversial fights had occurred.
Too easy.

Who knows better on the matter, Rover or Lennox Lewis?

Thought you were going?
You mean your claim of what Lewis told you?
And there's documented proof Steele reffed Lewis AFTER those controversial fights.
FACT.

[Rover]

Did Steele ref a Lewis fight after Chavez/Taylor?
Did he ref a Lewis fight after Tyson/Ruddock?

[keithmoonhangover]

Lennox Lewis refused to have Richard Steele referee any his title fights. It was documented at the time and I was told by a VERY reliable source that Lennox didn't trust Steele's decision making.

That was your claim, Keith. Nothing about King. This all started because of your "on the take" crap. So as evidence you offer something that doesn't have anything to do with corruption. Then you try to sneak King back in later on.

And if letting someone ref one of your fights is an indication of trust of judgment, Lewis trusted Steele's, and that's documented.

I never once said Steele was on the take. King has been there all along, but the thread is called worst officials, not worst promoters.

Now, at a party several years ago, Lennox Lewis told me, face to face, that he didn't trust Steele's decision making.... So, I will ask you one last time and then the floor is yours.....

Who knows better on the matter, Rover or Lennox Lewis?

[Rover]

Lennox Lewis refused to have Richard Steele referee any his title fights. It was documented at the time and I was told by a VERY reliable source that Lennox didn't trust Steele's decision making.

That was your claim, Keith. Nothing about King. This all started because of your "on the take" crap. So as evidence you offer something that doesn't have anything to do with corruption. Then you try to sneak King back in later on.

And if letting someone ref one of your fights is an indication of trust of judgment, Lewis trusted Steele's, and that's documented.

I never once said Steele was on the take. King has been there all along, but the thread is called worst officials, not worst promoters.

Now, at a party several years ago, Lennox Lewis told me, face to face, that he didn't trust Steele's decision making.... So, I will ask you one last time and then the floor is yours.....

Who knows better on the matter, Rover or Lennox Lewis?

I don't find you reliable, so I won't even dignify your claim.
And do I have to quote your having introduced the lie detector/King nonsense?
FACT: Steele reffed Lewis AFTER Chavez/Taylor and Tyson/Ruddock.
That's what I can confirm.

[Rover]

Back in the day, if Richard Steele was in the ring, I wasn't alone in thinking Don King fighters were at an advantage.

If Steele was the ref for Tyson - Douglas, I think he would have found a way to either a, count Douglas out or b, stop the fight when he got up.

So if you didn't think Steele was on the take, how were King fighters advantaged by his presence? Was he just helping King fighters because he liked Don's hair?
Please explain this to me. You thought Steele was corrupt; that's obvious. Was he just doing King favors for nothing, Keith?

[Rover]

I would love to put Steele on a lie detector test and ask him if he stopped the fight because he feared for Meldrick Taylor's safety, or because Chavez was King's fighter?

What exactly are you accusing Steele of? It can't be incompetence, because you're saying (in your original post about him) that you thought he favored King fighters. Now, you say you didn't accuse him of being on the take? So what are you saying--that King had a ref in his pocket for free? Steele didn't even need to be bribed?

[Rover]

My problem with that fight is that Taylor was clearly distracted by his own corner and wasn't even looking at Steele. Steele should have realized that he didn't have Taylor's attention and moved so that Taylor would be looking right at him.
However, if it was just that one fight, I would not consider him such a bad referee.

What makes you wonder about Steele is that in some fights he lets the fight go on when it should be stopped. In others, he stops the fight very easily. Whether he was "On the Take" or not is hard to say.

I am beginning to think I am the only person to have seen the Tate-Olajide fight. Have never heard anyone else ever comment on it. It was on regular network TV.
Anyway, Tate just completely dominated Olajide. It was a vicious one-sided beating. Olajide was in much worse shape that Meldrick Taylor was. It was more one-sided than Holmes-Cobb. Yet, Steele just let it go on, round after round when it was obvious that Olajide had no chance. (Olajide corner deserves a lot of criticsm for not stopping it as well.)

I'll correct one thing:
AmblingAlp introduced the phrase "on the take."
Keith undoubtedly accused Steele of corruption before that, though.

[Rover]

Now, at a party several years ago, Lennox Lewis told me, face to face, that he didn't trust Steele's decision making....

Keith,

I have to ask, did it occur to you to ask LL at this party how come he trusted Larry O'Connell's decision making after he shafted him with the draw in Holyfield 1? Indeed to the extent he was quite happy for him to ref the Botha fight, only 16 months later.

Of course, Lewis trusted Steele to ref his fights after Chavez/Taylor and Tyson/Ruddock I, and this all got started when Keith started with his Steele/King conspiracy crap (saying he thought Steele favored King's fighters), which has nothing to do with whether a fighter overall thinks a ref is a bad one with poor judgment. The charge against Steele hasn't been incompetence; it's been corruption. Even Duva conceded Steele was a competent ref.

[SenorPipino]

I should have cashed in my betting slip quickly that night. I put down $100 on Fenech as a 7-5 underdog. The fight was originally announced in the ring as a majority win for Fenech, but was changed about 30 minutes later to a draw. Boy was I pissed. Thanx "Mikey."

No, you're thinking of Leija I. Fenech I was announced as a draw right away. I am sure of this because I just rewatched Leija I a few weeks ago and have seen Nelson/Fenech I many times. There was no announcement of Fenech as the winner by MD. With respect to Leija I, I think it was originally announced as a Nelson SD.

I'm a little late with the post but you're absolutely right Rover. I have a memory block over some of those hideous DKP outcomes from the early 90s that cost me money. I lost on this fight too as my cash went on Azumah. The draw was a bad decision but admitedly not nearly as obscene as Fenech-Nelson I. I guess they needed to placate Leijas' hometown San Antonio crowd at the Alamodome.

[Rover]

I should have cashed in my betting slip quickly that night. I put down $100 on Fenech as a 7-5 underdog. The fight was originally announced in the ring as a majority win for Fenech, but was changed about 30 minutes later to a draw. Boy was I pissed. Thanx "Mikey."

No, you're thinking of Leija I. Fenech I was announced as a draw right away. I am sure of this because I just rewatched Leija I a few weeks ago and have seen Nelson/Fenech I many times. There was no announcement of Fenech as the winner by MD. With respect to Leija I, I think it was originally announced as a Nelson SD.

I'm a little late with the post but you're absolutely right Rover. I have a memory block over some of those hideous DKP outcomes from the early 90s that cost me money. I lost on this fight too as my cash went on Azumah. The draw was a bad decision but admitedly not nearly as obscene as Fenech-Nelson I. I guess they needed to placate Leijas' hometown San Antonio crowd at the Alamodome.

First bad draw of that evening.

[SenorPipino]

Yeah, that's when DK was at his dirtiest.

[Rover]

Ken Morita.
Tyson/Douglas says it all.
His card in Kudo/Gonzalez was awful also.